jgb Posted July 20, 2022 Share Posted July 20, 2022 16 minutes ago, Warfish said: What's most amazing is Zach was still this bad despite his very obvious concerted effort to play spineless risk-free football when he came back after his injury. It was clear his (and the team's) primary goal was not to score or win games, but to limit Zach's INT's during that 2nd phase of his season last year. Yet his completion percentage was higher before the injury (57%) than after (54%). Not sure what to make of that, but it surprised me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hal N of Provo Posted July 20, 2022 Share Posted July 20, 2022 5 hours ago, Warfish said: MW is definitely bad in this regard, as that Buffalo game definitely skews his rates given the very small sample size overall. I'm sure you are aware that Zach was also one of the worst QB's in the NFL at his rate of throwing INT's. In fact, Zach was 7th worst last year, with a rate of 2.9%. The QB's worse than him were JAG Heinike at 3.0%, Hurt Mayfield at 3.1%, Bust Darnold at 3.2%, Runner Jackson at 3.4%, Pending Bust Fields at 3.7% and Very Old Man Dalton at 3.8%. Not exactly the company you'd expect a truly elite young franchise QB to be in...although Super Bowl winner Stafford was pretty close to Zach, actually. But Stafford was a close to 5K yard, 40+ TD QB, so he gets a little benefit of the doubt, lol. What's most amazing is Zach was still this bad despite his very obvious concerted effort to play spineless risk-free football when he came back after his injury. It was clear his (and the team's) primary goal was not to score or win games, but to limit Zach's INT's during that 2nd phase of his season last year. This will be one of Zach's biggest tests in 2022. His INT rate. If it's anywhere close to last year, it'll be a sign he may not in fact have developed as much as we hoped. And hopefully we play a lot less scared than we did in the 2nd half of 2022. No one wants to watch another game like Zach's closer against Buffalo with that complete lack of confidence and effort to try and compete or win. It’s not just the Buffalo game, although that didn't help. He also did not posses a complete game last season. Mike White showed some potential, but he’s got a lot to prove in camp. If he doesn’t look like a + long term backup, he’s getting cut to save his roster spot. Those roster spots are min higher demand this season. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warfish Posted July 20, 2022 Share Posted July 20, 2022 19 minutes ago, Hal N of Provo said: It’s not just the Buffalo game, although that didn't help. He also did not posses a complete game last season. Not quite sure what you mean by "complete game", I thought White looked much better and more complete than Zach generally. Faster, smarter, quicker release, better decision making. The weakness of White, and it IS glaring, is his lack of arm strength. IMO the INT's were more a result of actually trying to score and win in a way I honestly don't feel Zach was doing for most of the 2nd half of the season (hence the reduced INT's as well as reduced production). 19 minutes ago, Hal N of Provo said: Mike White showed some potential, but he’s got a lot to prove in camp. Unquestionably. 19 minutes ago, Hal N of Provo said: If he doesn’t look like a + long term backup, he’s getting cut to save his roster spot. Those roster spots are min higher demand this season. Definitely. And the staff appears to be almost as in love with Old Man Flacco as @The Crusher is. I freely admit it, I don't see any value in Flacco, on the contrary, he's a loser who will almost assuredly lose any game he is forced to play in if Zach misses time, and I continue to find the idea that Zach requires an old man to baby sit him to be a ridiculous waste of a roster spot. If we need some old worn out QB to hold Zach's cock for him, hire one as a Coach, don't waste an active roster spot on him, plain and simple. As as I said elsewhere, all I care about is having the best QB's on the roster as is humanly possible, no matter who (fans or Zach) it may pressure or offend. If Zach (who unquestionably is the starter and will get all the reps) goes down, again, to injury, I want someone hungry, younger and able to fill that gap in the interim. A developmental QB > a worn out old check cashing "mentor" QB. Doesn;t need to be White, guy was a nobody before his flash of fame last year, he means nothing to me. But I want someone who cares to be the #2, someone hungry, someone who at least thinks he is a competitor for Zach, or can pressure Zach to be better, and who doesn;t see himself as some backup, but sees himself as a QB and a competitor. Thats who I want filling in if/when Zach goes down again. I want to win, or have a chance to win, even if Zach gets hurt. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PorP Posted July 20, 2022 Share Posted July 20, 2022 6 hours ago, jgb said: Yet his completion percentage was higher before the injury (57%) than after (54%). Not sure what to make of that, but it surprised me. The food lion bag boys we brought in for WRs in the last 1/3 of the season? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hal N of Provo Posted July 20, 2022 Share Posted July 20, 2022 8 minutes ago, Warfish said: Not quite sure what you mean by "complete game", I thought White looked much better and more complete than Zach generally. Faster, smarter, quicker release, better decision making. The weakness of White, and it IS glaring, is his lack of arm strength. IMO the INT's were more a result of actually trying to score and win in a way I honestly don't feel Zach was doing for most of the 2nd half of the season (hence the reduced INT's as well as reduced production). Unquestionably. Definitely. And the staff appears to be almost as in love with Old Man Flacco as @The Crusher is. I freely admit it, I don't see any value in Flacco, on the contrary, he's a loser who will almost assuredly lose any game he is forced to play in if Zach misses time, and I continue to find the idea that Zach requires an old man to baby sit him to be a ridiculous waste of a roster spot. If we need some old worn out QB to hold Zach's cock for him, hire one as a Coach, don't waste an active roster spot on him, plain and simple. As as I said elsewhere, all I care about is having the best QB's on the roster as is humanly possible, no matter who (fans or Zach) it may pressure or offend. If Zach (who unquestionably is the starter and will get all the reps) goes down, again, to injury, I want someone hungry, younger and able to fill that gap in the interim. A developmental QB > a worn out old check cashing "mentor" QB. Doesn;t need to be White, guy was a nobody before his flash of fame last year, he means nothing to me. But I want someone who cares to be the #2, someone hungry, someone who at least thinks he is a competitor for Zach, or can pressure Zach to be better, and who doesn;t see himself as some backup, but sees himself as a QB and a competitor. Thats who I want filling in if/when Zach goes down again. I want to win, or have a chance to win, even if Zach gets hurt. Flacco played well enough to win last season but the Jets sucked IMO. He’s a good backup to me. Mike White was amazing in the short game - great timing and ball placement. But down the field even a little and it got scary. He’s arms plenty strong so hopefully that gets better. Zach can do all the things you can’t coach. That’s why they threw him out there to learn on the field. Hopefully it pays off this season. We need new info to have a reason to debate it more at this point lol. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warfish Posted July 20, 2022 Share Posted July 20, 2022 10 minutes ago, Hal N of Provo said: Zach can do all the things you can’t coach. I didn't see that last year at all. But many of you think you did, so.... 10 minutes ago, Hal N of Provo said: We need new info to have a reason to debate it more at this point lol. Agreed. I'll repeat, Preseason cannot get here soon enough. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PorP Posted July 20, 2022 Share Posted July 20, 2022 14 minutes ago, Warfish said: Agreed. I'll repeat, Preseason cannot get here soon enough. Agreed man. Just not looking forward to the weekly injury updates. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgb Posted July 20, 2022 Share Posted July 20, 2022 2 hours ago, PorP said: The food lion bag boys we brought in for WRs in the last 1/3 of the season? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hal N of Provo Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 6 hours ago, Warfish said: I didn't see that last year at all. But many of you think you did, so.... Agreed. I'll repeat, Preseason cannot get here soon enough. There are some traits that should give you some hope and I think most if not all are verifiable: In a game with pads he threw a pass as fast as the record at the combine - strong arm. His release is clockably very fast. He can throw “off platform” and on the move. Being sick of hearing it doesn’t make it less unusual or desirable. He is elusive avoiding pressure - elite IMO but saying he’s less than + is wrong. He ran faster than 19mph in a game on a knee that probably wasn’t 100%. Overall a + athlete at QB. He seemed to be able to block outside noise - an uncommon trait the Jets curse breaker will need. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunnie Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 There will.be a day ... and god let that day be soon ... where threads about backup QBs will contain about as much action as a dried up saloon in a desolated ghost town somewhere in Nevada.Sent from my SM-G950U1 using Tapatalk 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgb Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 4 hours ago, Dunnie said: There will.be a day ... and god let that day be soon ... where threads about backup QBs will contain about as much action as a dried up saloon in a desolated ghost town somewhere in Nevada. Sent from my SM-G950U1 using Tapatalk My dream for this season is the same as it has now been for over a decade — that next off season there is no debate or uncertainty surrounding the QB1. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
More Cowbell Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 On 7/19/2022 at 10:13 AM, Joe W. Namath said: Mike White is the 3rd string qb. If any team thought he was any good he could have been had for a 5th round pick this offseason. The Jets are about to start the most exciting season in 10 plus years. Leave it to Jets fans to try and drum up some qb controversy. The disease....................... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jet Nut Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 22 hours ago, Dwight Englewood said: Name me all the games Zach Wilson has 3 or more touchdown passes. Name the years that Mike White started and finished 3 or more games Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dwight Englewood Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 6 hours ago, Jet Nut said: Name the years that Mike White started and finished 3 or more games Both qbs have small sample sizes. White’s looks better Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jet Nut Posted July 21, 2022 Share Posted July 21, 2022 3 minutes ago, Dwight Englewood said: Both qbs have small sample sizes. White’s looks better Sure he does. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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