CanadaSteve Posted December 31, 2023 Share Posted December 31, 2023 1 hour ago, FidelioJet said: I think you're overestimating the talent of some of these guys. Sauce and Garrett and pro-bowl talent. Hall, as much as people don't want to accept, is a + player for sure but not special. JJ is closer to JAG than special...Clemmons is full on JAG...AVT is another injury away from being a full-on unmitigated bust. This is a team with a lot of holes...When JD and Saleh get fired after next year the new GM will be coming in having to "rebuild" not add on to an already talented team. My guess would be of everyone you named up there - only Sauce and Garrett will be re-signed by the Jets (maybe Tippman but I don't know what he is yet) I think you are undervaluing how much talent this team has. So, I guess that pretty much ends that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Rico Posted December 31, 2023 Share Posted December 31, 2023 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FidelioJet Posted December 31, 2023 Share Posted December 31, 2023 11 minutes ago, CanadaSteve said: I think you are undervaluing how much talent this team has. So, I guess that pretty much ends that. Agreed. It happens. We view things differently on this one. Should be interesting to see what the new GM is '25 does with the talent though - we can revisit this one then Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sonny Werblin Posted December 31, 2023 Share Posted December 31, 2023 4 hours ago, 68JET11 said: @Sonny Werblin and I have been saying this for years only to get beat down by people thinking we don't need to build from the ground up first. Now that we have a defensive line that can stay, we need the OL. Without it this team fails even with Rodgers as QB. He stated correctly, the 2 mistakes that this team, and JD for that matter have made which will take another 2 years to correct. If he doesn't get the LT of the future and 3 other OL in 2024 either via draft and/or FA, then we are screwed. The only way I'm not picking LT in this upcoming draft is if somehow Marvin Harrison Jr. falls which I highly doubt. The other would be if we beat PATS, which would push us out of the hunt for the top 2 LT's. Look at the Ravens. They consistently use high draft picks on O line and NEVER reach for a QB. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunnie Posted December 31, 2023 Share Posted December 31, 2023 I think you are undervaluing how much talent this team has. So, I guess that pretty much ends that. Not so sure ... Watching Baltimore dismantle the same Miami team that destroyed the NYJ leads me to believe the roster is no elite.Sent from my Pixel 7 using Tapatalk 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunnie Posted December 31, 2023 Share Posted December 31, 2023 Look at the Ravens. They consistently use high draft picks on O line and NEVER reach for a QB. Bingo.Sent from my Pixel 7 using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadaSteve Posted January 1 Share Posted January 1 On 12/31/2023 at 3:41 PM, Dunnie said: Not so sure ... Watching Baltimore dismantle the same Miami team that destroyed the NYJ leads me to believe the roster is no elite. Sent from my Pixel 7 using Tapatalk I wouldn't say elite either Dunnie. But constant losing has a toll. Not to mention, feeling like you have no chance to win when you don't have, at the very least, a top 15 QB. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadaSteve Posted January 1 Share Posted January 1 On 12/31/2023 at 3:11 PM, Sonny Werblin said: Look at the Ravens. They consistently use high draft picks on O line and NEVER reach for a QB. Forgive me....it was my previous career in journalism that makes me do this . . . . but half that statement isn't true. Since 2000, Baltimore has had 26 first-round picks, including a first-round supplemental pick. Of those 26 picks, only 5 of them were used on O-Line in the first round (three tackles, a guard, and a centre). They have drafted 6 WR's, 5 DB's, 2 TE'S, 2 DE/DT, 2 LB's, and 1 RB to with 3 QB's and 5 O-linemen. Out of there three QB's however, they got a Super Bowl with one (Joe Flacco), and look pretty good with Lamar Jackson. Kyle Boller.....maybe not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sonny Werblin Posted January 2 Share Posted January 2 4 hours ago, CanadaSteve said: Forgive me....it was my previous career in journalism that makes me do this . . . . but half that statement isn't true. Since 2000, Baltimore has had 26 first-round picks, including a first-round supplemental pick. Of those 26 picks, only 5 of them were used on O-Line in the first round (three tackles, a guard, and a centre). They have drafted 6 WR's, 5 DB's, 2 TE'S, 2 DE/DT, 2 LB's, and 1 RB to with 3 QB's and 5 O-linemen. Out of there three QB's however, they got a Super Bowl with one (Joe Flacco), and look pretty good with Lamar Jackson. Kyle Boller.....maybe not. I said high, not first. Compare how often the Ravens take O linemen in rounds 1, 2 and 3 to the rest of the leagues to QB, Flacco was pick 19 and Jackson 32 (even Boller was 19), They NEVER reach for a QB. They take a QB that falls to them. And Jackson and Boller were not even the first player taken by the Ravens in their draft, they were the second player behind Hayden Hurst and Tyrell Suggs, respectively. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted January 2 Share Posted January 2 **** the cap and **** this rebuilding sh*t. This team is set to compete. I am not some a$$hole that thinks they are a super bowl favorite roster or anything, it is just simply not that hard to overturn a roster. If they fail in 2024, the new guy will have some minor issues, but should be able to put a playoff team together almost immediately. It's not that ******* hard. The Giants did it last year and they ******* blow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeNamathsFurCoat Posted January 2 Share Posted January 2 The worst OL in football after 5 years on the job What an OL guru Joe Douglas is The guy only scouts run blocking, gets overhyped about a few pancake blocks vs 150 lbs DBs, and doesn’t give a sh-t about what the actual tape says about pass pro I believe Laken Tomlinson actually had bad / suspect pass pro grades from PFF when the genius decided to pay him a boatload in FA to come and suck at LG 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeNamathsFurCoat Posted January 2 Share Posted January 2 We should name Ulbrich our #1 “scout” when it comes to OL Couldn’t hurt Dude was super high on Sauce and JJ as evidenced by the 1JD vids and he was right Don’t recall seeing any celebrations by Ulbrich on Will McD, so I’ll choose to believe that was a Saleh / JD idiot special 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadaSteve Posted January 3 Share Posted January 3 23 hours ago, JoeNamathsFurCoat said: The worst OL in football after 5 years on the job What an OL guru Joe Douglas is The guy only scouts run blocking, gets overhyped about a few pancake blocks vs 150 lbs DBs, and doesn’t give a sh-t about what the actual tape says about pass pro I believe Laken Tomlinson actually had bad / suspect pass pro grades from PFF when the genius decided to pay him a boatload in FA to come and suck at LG 21 different starters in two years. No OL guru could overcome that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadaSteve Posted January 3 Share Posted January 3 On 1/1/2024 at 10:20 PM, Sonny Werblin said: I said high, not first. Compare how often the Ravens take O linemen in rounds 1, 2 and 3 to the rest of the leagues to QB, Flacco was pick 19 and Jackson 32 (even Boller was 19), They NEVER reach for a QB. They take a QB that falls to them. And Jackson and Boller were not even the first player taken by the Ravens in their draft, they were the second player behind Hayden Hurst and Tyrell Suggs, respectively. Interestingly, they pick Olinemen ALL the time everywhere in the draft Again, going back to 2000, they have used 3-2nds, 7-3rds, 8-4ths, 5-5ths, 4-6ths, and 2-7ths. They constantly bring a pipeline of players into the OL. 12 Tackles, 12 Guards, 5 centers. Great way to always have depth and develop players so you can let high ticket items go without constantly investing millions across the line. JD has picked 6 OL in 4 years. Not quite as high a rate. I think he would have followed the model, but 21 starters in two years....he had guys playing that should have developed (like Max Mitchell). I think Cameron Clark would have been a great guard. He was a solid player in college. Not much you can do about a severe neck injury. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
varjet Posted January 3 Share Posted January 3 On 1/1/2024 at 11:23 PM, JoeNamathsFurCoat said: We should name Ulbrich our #1 “scout” when it comes to OL Couldn’t hurt Dude was super high on Sauce and JJ as evidenced by the 1JD vids and he was right Don’t recall seeing any celebrations by Ulbrich on Will McD, so I’ll choose to believe that was a Saleh / JD idiot special Aha! This is how the Jets draft well-when coaches watch tape and get involved. What offensive coaches are watching tape and getting involved? Zippo. Ulbrich is the real deal and will go places. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dcat Posted January 3 Share Posted January 3 On 1/1/2024 at 5:15 PM, CanadaSteve said: Forgive me....it was my previous career in journalism that makes me do this . . . . but half that statement isn't true. Since 2000, Baltimore has had 26 first-round picks, including a first-round supplemental pick. Of those 26 picks, only 5 of them were used on O-Line in the first round (three tackles, a guard, and a centre). They have drafted 6 WR's, 5 DB's, 2 TE'S, 2 DE/DT, 2 LB's, and 1 RB to with 3 QB's and 5 O-linemen. Out of there three QB's however, they got a Super Bowl with one (Joe Flacco), and look pretty good with Lamar Jackson. Kyle Boller.....maybe not. Want to get a chuckle? Now count the number of 1st round DE/DT drafted by the Jets since 2000 and compare. Pretty funny stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadaSteve Posted January 3 Share Posted January 3 13 hours ago, Dcat said: Want to get a chuckle? Now count the number of 1st round DE/DT drafted by the Jets since 2000 and compare. Pretty funny stuff. If you count John Abraham as a DE/DT (he was drafted as a LB), that number is 10. With DB's and LB's on top of that. Out of the 30 Number one picks we have had since 2000 (thank you the four in 2000 and the three last year), we used 19 on defense. Almost 2/3 of the picks on defense in 23 years. And we wonder why our offense continually sucks. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Integrity28 Posted January 3 Share Posted January 3 On 12/29/2023 at 11:24 AM, Joe W. Namath said: QB2 is irrelevant. Rypien is fine. I’m convinced you watch zero football. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted January 3 Share Posted January 3 1 hour ago, CanadaSteve said: If you count John Abraham as a DE/DT (he was drafted as a LB), that number is 10. With DB's and LB's on top of that. Out of the 30 Number one picks we have had since 2000 (thank you the four in 2000 and the three last year), we used 19 on defense. Almost 2/3 of the picks on defense in 23 years. And we wonder why our offense continually sucks. I think your numbers are off. I think they had more picks than that. I know there were more than eleven 1st rounders on O. Becht, Pennington, Moss, D'Brick, Mangold, Keller, Sanchez, Darnold, Becton, Wilson, AVT, Wilson. Twelve first rounders on O in 23 years isn't a reason, excuse or explanation for having a sh*tty O. That is more than a 1st rounder every other year on O. Two top 5 picks in the last 5 years and they can't complete a pass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SAM SAM HE'S OUR MAN Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 On 12/29/2023 at 9:15 AM, kmnj said: can joe fan boys tell me at what stage we are at in the "rebuild" We have to be getting close right or is it a 10 year plan? Joe has had years of built in excuses and failures. We are supposed to be set with Zach Becton and Mimms - they were to be the "franchise" Joe has had his guys and his coach and his record for his tenure is beyond abysmal .... He builds in excuses every year to keep his job-now this year was the arod year so we cant tear it down now-next year is also the arod year again and the sequels always are worse than the original but no worries they have a plan and are taking receipts. Joe-he literally conned Woody (an easy task) into two more years of having a job by bringing in a 40 year old QB-wins and losses literally did not matter this year -Joe and Saleh got their extra years. During Joes tenure, we have watched trash organizations rebuild in 2 years-I am jealous of the browns.... they are winning without their franchise RB , they are on their 4th QB and last night their best WR was out and they dominated us in every aspect of the game. If there are any Joe D fanboys left at this point? When are we going to see actual wins ? Don't you mean " THE TEAR DOWN " ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biggs Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 The rebuild is in the phase where the hole for the foundation has been dug and were just waiting for enough illegal immigrants to form a work crew to start pouring the foundation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biggs Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 On 12/29/2023 at 11:23 AM, Jet_Engine1 said: The Browns were also down to OTs #4 and 5 and lost their only effective WR on the active roster when Moore went down. They had the exact same scenario of problems the Jets did, the difference is in how they recognized the problem and found capable solutions. That is beyond Saleh and JD. Switch coaching staffs the Jets are in the playoffs instead of playing meaningless games. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flashlite80 Posted January 5 Share Posted January 5 On 12/29/2023 at 10:34 AM, DonCorleone said: I couldn't disagree more. Rodgers makes everyone else better. He has Wilson, Allen and Conklin, Warren, Abanikanda and Ruckert. He would make a decent #2 WR into a dangerous weapon. :Lazard is Rodgers guy. Gipson and Brownlee could be depth We need 2 tackles, a right guard, a #2 receiver, a backup QB and a safety to replace Whitehead. With all the dead wood we have to discard, there should be able to must enough cap to fill several holes. They don't all have to be stars Maybe a good LT, and a couple of decent guys on the other spots will be enough. Rodgers will be great with decent protection. Garrett and Breece will put up gaudy numbers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerfish Posted January 5 Share Posted January 5 On 1/1/2024 at 9:19 PM, JoeNamathsFurCoat said: The worst OL in football after 5 years on the job What an OL guru Joe Douglas is The guy only scouts run blocking, gets overhyped about a few pancake blocks vs 150 lbs DBs, and doesn’t give a sh-t about what the actual tape says about pass pro I believe Laken Tomlinson actually had bad / suspect pass pro grades from PFF when the genius decided to pay him a boatload in FA to come and suck at LG Also 'drafting and FA for scheme' Each year we list off the best olineman from college and FA and I get told that half of them 'do not fit our scheme' Fck that, get the best players, change your scheme. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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