Jetscode1 Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Not to derail the screaming-at-Smash, but what do you do with Sanchez if* the Jets acquire Manning? *please God please Trade him for a 3. A 2 if you get a miracle. Just like Chad, you cut him...Tanny already set precedent...be lucky to get a 5 for him... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbatesman Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 My point...although there is plenty of room to criticze Mark Sanchez...there is also the fact he has played considerably better than both Brad Johnson and Jim Plunkett did in their first three seasons. Be still my heart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleedin Green Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 why is anyone assuming Payton manning will ever play in the NFL again? his neck is all sorts of f--ked up. this isn't a knee or a hand you kinda need your neck. he's won a ring, he owns all the records, why would he come back? To help the NY Jets? a place he didn't want to play 20 years ago? Cmon. What are you talking about? The truth could not possibly be the more exact opposite of that. The whole reason Manning didn't come out the year the Jets had the #1 overall pick was because Parcells refused to guarantee that they would take him and wouldn't trade out of the spot. The injury point is certainly legitimate, and most have expressed as much that these circumstances are all pending his health, but there's no reason to believe he wouldn't want to come to the Jets if healthy and wanting to play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetscode1 Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 At this point, my offseason hopes for the QB position rank like this: 1. Trade for a proven healthy Peyton Manning. My only concern here is health, otherwise it's a move the Jets have to find a way to make work. If they want to keep Sanchez around as his backup than great, if not then draft a late-round QB and deal Sanchez. otherwise, 2. Retain Sanchez, sign Matt Flynn in FA, and draft another QB on day 2 or 3. Let Sanchez and Flynn fight it out for the starting job while grooming the rook and McElroy. Almost forgot to comment on this...but if we are serious about competition for Sanchez at the QB position I'd take option #2...I liked Flynn coming out of LSU and think he could either win the job or at least force Mark to earn his job (unlike the current backup). Pretty sure Matt looks elsewhere though...money wise he'd expect a payday similar to Kolb's deal with the Cards... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleedin Green Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Just like Chad, you cut him...Tanny already set precedent...be lucky to get a 5 for him... Completely different set of circumstances. Chad was an established veteran who had been on the team for 9 years and beyond that, the Jets had no choice but to cut him as they couldn't fit both of their salaries under the cap and teams knew it, so nobody was going offer the Jets a damn thing. Not to mention, this all took place in the middle of training camp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZachEY Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Just like Chad, you cut him...Tanny already set precedent...be lucky to get a 5 for him... He's a lot younger than Chad. Might get a team to throw something your way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleedin Green Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 He's a lot younger than Chad. Might get a team to throw something your way. Exactly, I would imagine the Jets could probably get at least a mid-rounder in return for him. The Redskins got a 4th for Campbell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyHector Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 My point...although there is plenty of room to criticze Mark Sanchez...there is also the fact he has played considerably better than both Brad Johnson and Jim Plunkett did in their first three seasons. That doesn't guarantee a championship but it does suggest QB play can improve.. Johnson sat behind Moon for basically his first 2.5 years in Minnesota and had a solid first year as their primary starter in '97. He broke his leg the following year, which opened the door for Randall Cunningham to have an MVP-caliber season. After being traded to Washington that offseason, he had a Pro Bowl year his first season there - a year he went into with roughly half the career starts Mark Sanchez has right now. He had thrown 964 passes in the NFL prior to that year... Sanchez came into this year with 1028 career attempts. Plunkett was still pretty brutal his first 3 years with the Raiders, so if you want to make the argument that the Jets could conceivably win without Sanchez improving, I guess he would be the right example to cite, but the league has changed so much since then, it's probably moot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Crusher Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 why is anyone assuming Payton manning will ever play in the NFL again? his neck is all sorts of f--ked up. this isn't a knee or a hand you kinda need your neck. he's won a ring, he owns all the records, why would he come back? To help the NY Jets? a place he didn't want to play 20 years ago? Cmon. Boo!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smashmouth Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Should I follow your tact and come up with a laundry list of excuses blaming everyone but Manning for the Colts playoff failures? Johnny I know it was not just Manning, the reason I make those type of posts is because some think its ALL about the QB Im fully aware the Colts had some issues BUT in the same respect look at the Bradshaw comparison the guy somehow pulled amazing games out of his a$$ VS great Dallas defenses when His defense was not playing well. We can go back and forth forever on the subject But i think you see where Im comming from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SenorGato Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 He's a lot younger than Chad. Might get a team to throw something your way. Also his shoulders are attached as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smashmouth Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Yeah, that guy sucks. His teams were just stacked. I mean, look at the way they are playing now without him. They are right there in the thick of things. You see JIF this is exactly the Type of exaggeration that pisses me off. The first half Of Mannings career was littered with "can he win the big one " talk and you know it so cut the crap man and lets have a normal conversation without the nonsense. The Colts did a piss poor job having a viable back up for Manning in painter and their solution was to drag Collins in with 2 weeks preperation and thats just stupid a$$ football unless of course your going for Luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smashmouth Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Too funny. As I said in the other thread. When we lose, it's everyone elses fault. When other teams lose, it's their QB's fault. Sometimes I wonder what it would be like to be dumb. Life would be so simple without having to think. You dont have to wonder much . Your examples claiming I think Sanchez is better than Manning are idiotic and have one purpose and thats to piss me off .You offer nothing to debates other than smart a$$ remarks and assumptions as to what everyone else is thinking. In your life there are no such things as examples everything is black and white. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jet27 Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Not to derail the screaming-at-Smash, but what do you do with Sanchez if* the Jets acquire Manning? *please God please He sits on the Bench and learns from the Maseter....many other better QB's have had to do the same thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbatesman Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Your examples claiming I think Sanchez is better than Manning are idiotic and have one purpose and thats to piss me off . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bitonti Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 The injury point is certainly legitimate, and most have expressed as much that these circumstances are all pending his health, it's a huge question mark. he's had 2 surgeries already and perhaps a 3rd... he was in Europe getting stem cell treatment and all of that might leave him 1 hard hit away from being Stephen Hawking I'd say there's a better than 50% chance he never plays football again, for anyone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 He sits on the Bench and learns from the Maseter....many other better QB's have had to do the same thing. After they shred his contract in front of his sulky lil face? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jet27 Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 After they shred his contract in front of his sulky lil face? That would be up to Sanchez and how he behaves......all kidding aside I think in the end Sanchez would be a better QB because of Manning being here..But I truly don't know if Mark's ego would allow that to happen, and if not...Bye-Bye Sanchez.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CTM Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Guys smash isn't dumb, he just hasn't kept up with advancements in the league . The league has rather purposely made the qb position even more important cause they want more scoring. He's on VHS and the league is blue ray, when I read his post they sound very knowledgeable about the game as it existed 20 years ago Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smashmouth Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 He sits on the Bench and learns from the Maseter....many other better QB's have had to do the same thing. how we going to pay them and fill the holes that need filling ? The way this team has declined the past 2 years and as bad as we have played this year on both sides of the ball I cant see how Manning at 36 is a good move for us or him for that matter. Serious question if we bring in Manning how do we fill serious holes at Safety, O-Line, and possibly RB..... Would we be able to pay for that ? I dont know the full cap situation next year so I cant say. Even if your fine with the RB situation how do we fix o-line and Safety is there enough money available ? Also if you bring in Manning you almost have to bring in a deep threat which we need in any scenario Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damaged89 Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 how we going to pay them and fill the holes that need filling ? The way this team has declined the past 2 years and as bad as we have played this year on both sides of the ball I cant see how Manning at 36 is a good move for us or him for that matter. Serious question if we bring in Manning how do we fill serious holes at Safety, O-Line, and possibly RB..... Would we be able to pay for that ? I dont know the full cap situation next year so I cant say. Even if your fine with the RB situation how do we fix o-line and Safety is there enough money available ? Also if you bring in Manning you almost have to bring in a deep threat which we need in any scenario A healthy Manning makes our current receiving group look great. Holmes will magically become a deep threat again if he has Peyton Manning throwing to him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aten Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Guys smash isn't dumb That's only a marginally better debate than this one is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Crusher Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Guys smash isn't dumb, he just hasn't kept up with advancements in the league . The league has rather purposely made the qb position even more important cause they want more scoring. He's on VHS and the league is blue ray, when I read his post they sound very knowledgeable about the game as it existed 20 years ago Smash is an old school sexy beast. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smashmouth Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Guys smash isn't dumb, he just hasn't kept up with advancements in the league . The league has rather purposely made the qb position even more important cause they want more scoring. He's on VHS and the league is blue ray, when I read his post they sound very knowledgeable about the game as it existed 20 years ago Chan if you look at all the top QB's in this league right now they all are loaded down with skill players at every position. We are decent at WR good at TE an our RB;s compared to most teams in the passing game are a hot mess. In todays NFL its the short high percentage passing game that wins thats why QB's have these insane comp percentages and guys from the past have percentages in the mid to upper fifties. Our offense is old and outdated just like you claim its a time Im stuck in. You watch guys like brady and brees short passing teams to death yet our offense trying to win with a running game our OC gives up on too early and an intermidiate passing game which is not well suited to our personnel or a high comp percentage. The Jets are the team suck in the 20 years ago example you make not me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleedin Green Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Almost forgot to comment on this...but if we are serious about competition for Sanchez at the QB position I'd take option #2...I liked Flynn coming out of LSU and think he could either win the job or at least force Mark to earn his job (unlike the current backup). Pretty sure Matt looks elsewhere though...money wise he'd expect a payday similar to Kolb's deal with the Cards... If there's a team out there willing to lay out a lot of cash for Flynn then I agree it's unlikely to happen, but I'm not so sure there is. He's had very limited opportunities to play, so I don't think you'll see teams out there rushing to hand him a starting job and Kolb's lack of success this season isn't exactly going to make teams feel any better about it. If anything, I think he's probably looking for a place where he can at least compete for a starting job and if they're willing, I think the Jets could certainly fit the bill there. I agree that if the Jets plan on keeping Sanchez around, they need to have someone around who's at least a real threat to him. As long as Brunell is this team's backup, Sanchez has no reason to fear for his job in the slightest, no matter how many mind-games Rex thinks he's playing by giving Brunell some practice reps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Crusher Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 That's only a marginally better debate than this one is. Dudes not dumb he just has the balls to disagree with the masses. I think he's wrong but far from dumb. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetscode1 Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Guys smash isn't dumb, he just hasn't kept up with advancements in the league . The league has rather purposely made the qb position even more important cause they want more scoring. He's on VHS and the league is blue ray, when I read his post they sound very knowledgeable about the game as it existed 20 years ago Really? The NFL moving to a more QB-driven league does not change the injury/age risks posed by Peyton Manning...yes there is a premium at the position that may or may not lead to Mark Sanchez as the answer for this franchise but in no way does justify a short term gamble on a known injury/age risk at that position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smashmouth Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Really? The NFL moving to a more QB-driven league does not change the injury/age risks posed by Peyton Manning...yes there is a premium at the position that may or may not lead to Mark Sanchez as the answer for this franchise but in no way does justify a short term gamble on a known injury/age risk at that position. Well I would like them to explain how our O-Line is going to magicly protect Peyton Manning who is much less mobile than Sanchez vs teams like the Ravens and Steelers ? From what I remember Sanchez was getting totally destroyed vs the Ravens a game getting hit like that would have ended Mannings career. And that was just one game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smashmouth Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Dudes not dumb he just has the balls to disagree with the masses. I think he's wrong but far from dumb. Hey big guy I took it on the chin with Matt Moore last year I can take it from a few that act like children. Although Im not sure if calling people dumb or stupid for an opinion is whats good for this messgae board. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetscode1 Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 If there's a team out there willing to lay out a lot of cash for Flynn then I agree it's unlikely to happen, but I'm not so sure there is. He's had very limited opportunities to play, so I don't think you'll see teams out there rushing to hand him a starting job and Kolb's lack of success this season isn't exactly going to make teams feel any better about it. If anything, I think he's probably looking for a place where he can at least compete for a starting job and if they're willing, I think the Jets could certainly fit the bill there. I agree that if the Jets plan on keeping Sanchez around, they need to have someone around who's at least a real threat to him. As long as Brunell is this team's backup, Sanchez has no reason to fear for his job in the slightest, no matter how many mind-games Rex thinks he's playing by giving Brunell some practice reps. I'd like to see Flynn get here...agree he is the best available to come here and challenge Mark...the biggest mistake the Jets made was crowning Mark the new face of the franchise without even a serious competition for the QB position. Maybe there was something to the argument that Woody had to make a splash to move tickets in light of the splash Favre made in his one season here. Either way, the Jets needed him to earn the position and although Kellen gave it his best it was not enough to put any fear into Sanchez. Hate when short term entertainment issues cloud the football decisions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CTM Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Chan if you look at all the top QB's in this league right now they all are loaded down with skill players at every position. We are decent at WR good at TE an our RB;s compared to most teams in the passing game are a hot mess. In todays NFL its the short high percentage passing game that wins thats why QB's have these insane comp percentages and guys from the past have percentages in the mid to upper fifties. Our offense is old and outdated just like you claim its a time Im stuck in. You watch guys like brady and brees short passing teams to death yet our offense trying to win with a running game our OC gives up on too early and an intermidiate passing game which is not well suited to our personnel or a high comp percentage. The Jets are the team suck in the 20 years ago example you make not me. I just think you undervalue QB's and probably were weened on an era where they weren't as important as they are now. . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CTM Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Really? The NFL moving to a more QB-driven league does not change the injury/age risks posed by Peyton Manning...yes there is a premium at the position that may or may not lead to Mark Sanchez as the answer for this franchise but in no way does justify a short term gamble on a known injury/age risk at that position. yo.. i'm not disagreeing with you about the injury risk.. Not at all.. The debate some of us seem to be having is the effect a 2009/2010 level Manning would have on this jets team, and imo, we're elite.. winning probably 14 games and hosting playoff games Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Crusher Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Hey big guy I took it on the chin with Matt Moore last year I can take it from a few that act like children. Although Im not sure if calling people dumb or stupid for an opinion is whats good for this messgae board. It's not and it won't be tolerated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyHector Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Really? The NFL moving to a more QB-driven league does not change the injury/age risks posed by Peyton Manning...yes there is a premium at the position that may or may not lead to Mark Sanchez as the answer for this franchise but in no way does justify a short term gamble on a known injury/age risk at that position. No, that's precisely what it does. A veteran team with a rapidly closing window cannot wait for a light that may never go off in Sanchez's head if they have the opportunity to take a shot on Manning still being able to perform at a higher level than Sanchez is today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CTM Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Well I would like them to explain how our O-Line is going to magicly protect Peyton Manning who is much less mobile than Sanchez vs teams like the Ravens and Steelers ? From what I remember Sanchez was getting totally destroyed vs the Ravens a game getting hit like that would have ended Mannings career. And that was just one game. Quicker decision making, blitz recognition and adjusting protection schemes... done Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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