HessStation Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 I think the Texans take Clowney anyway. Stoned is the way of the walk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BroadwayJoe12 Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 People are assuming that O'Brien wants a big, tall, white QB. After coaching Hackenburg this year and being with Brady for four years, it's the easy assumption to make. I personally thinks he just wants someone who can stand in the pocket, be accurate in his system and be able to grasp the complexities that it has, which is why Teddy and Blake seem to make more sense than Manziel. I think the Texans take Clowney anyway. Bold prediction. I'm not sure of O'Brien or the Texans' feelings on Schaub, if they're completely soured or not, but I would have a hard time seeing them passing on a QB in round one. It's possible O'Brien likes Schaub and feels Clowney could pay more immediate dividends playing opposite Watt, I just personally feel that he goes QB round one for the long-term game and potentially start Schaub in the short-term. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BroadwayJoe12 Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 Agreed, he will have to adapt and become more of a pocket passer but his ability to extend plays and make throws down the field is what makes him special and I dont see any reason why he wouldnt be able to at the next level. If other players can, why cant he? I'm worried about his size. He looks under 6ft at about 190 lbs, which is a solid build for the average guy, but it's all going to depend on how he can avoid those hits. If he's capable of avoiding the hits, then it'll be different, but he strikes me as someone who will need to learn, possibly the hard way, that you can't take the same type of beating that he did in college. He's definitely a polarizing figure to follow the next few years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted January 10, 2014 Author Share Posted January 10, 2014 After coaching Hackenburg this year and being with Brady for four years, it's the easy assumption to make. I personally thinks he just wants someone who can stand in the pocket, be accurate in his system and be able to grasp the complexities that it has, which is why Teddy and Blake seem to make more sense than Manziel. That's the thing--Teddy is 6'3 and is far and away the best passer in the draft. Bold prediction. I'm not sure of O'Brien or the Texans' feelings on Schaub, if they're completely soured or not, but I would have a hard time seeing them passing on a QB in round one. It's possible O'Brien likes Schaub and feels Clowney could pay more immediate dividends playing opposite Watt, I just personally feel that he goes QB round one for the long-term game and potentially start Schaub in the short-term. The great thing about hiring the QB guru coach is that you don't necessarily need the most pro-ready QB. IMO, they can pair Clowney with Watt for ten years and still grab Mettenberger at the top of the 2nd if they want. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HessStation Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 The great thing about hiring the QB guru coach is that you don't necessarily need the most pro-ready QB. IMO, they can pair Clowney with Watt for ten years and still grab Mettenberger at the top of the 2nd if they want. Like Louie Armstrong played the trumpet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted January 10, 2014 Author Share Posted January 10, 2014 Like Louie Armstrong played the trumpet. Wearing pants or no? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joewillie78 Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 I think the Texans take Clowney anyway. Wow, I hope you are right. Thats one less team picking a QB that the Jets would have to worry about. They may not have to trade up as far as I thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BroadwayJoe12 Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 That's the thing--Teddy is 6'3 and is far and away the best passer in the draft. The great thing about hiring the QB guru coach is that you don't necessarily need the most pro-ready QB. IMO, they can pair Clowney with Watt for ten years and still grab Mettenberger at the top of the 2nd if they want. Possibly. Although I never understood how he or some of these guys become known as QB gurus. They play linebacker or defensive end in college, become a linebacker or dline coach at the college level and then bam, someone just tosses them on the other side of the ball to coach WRs or QBs and that's where the need is and that's where they stay. He's obviously been doing it for about a decade now, but I always found it funny how a QB coach or OC was a former defensive player in the NFL or college and just was thrust into the job. Talk about on the job training. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HessStation Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 Wow, I hope you are right. Thats one less team picking a QB that the Jets would have to worry about. They may not have to trade up as far as I thought.pick it, pack it, fire it up, come along and take hits with TOm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JiFtheOracle Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 I'm worried about his size. He looks under 6ft at about 190 lbs, which is a solid build for the average guy, but it's all going to depend on how he can avoid those hits. If he's capable of avoiding the hits, then it'll be different, but he strikes me as someone who will need to learn, possibly the hard way, that you can't take the same type of beating that he did in college. He's definitely a polarizing figure to follow the next few years. Did he take a beating in college? Any time I've ever seen him play he does an incredible job at avoiding the big hits. His size doesnt bother me, the only concern I have is his off field antics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joewillie78 Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 Did he take a beating in college? Any time I've ever seen him play he does an incredible job at avoiding the big hits. His size doesnt bother me, the only concern I have is his off field antics. Again, he reminds me of a modern day Fran Tarkenton, only faster and a much stronger arm. Tarkenton used to scramble around , like the cops were chasing him, and he never seemed to ever get injured, and seemed to always make his best plays after avoiding being sacked 4 or 5 times. Now people argue that LB's etc are faster, stronger, SURE, but Johnny is much faster and stronger than Tarkenton, so its all relative. His on field antics really dont bother me EXCEPT that it may incite a defensive player to just cheap shot Johnnie, just because they find his antics degrading. But like you said, he has done it in college, and how many times has he been injured? Not often, and nothing major. If Houston doesnt take a QB as TOm surmised, maybe we do have a shot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BroadwayJoe12 Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 Again, he reminds me of a modern day Fran Tarkenton, only faster and a much stronger arm. Tarkenton used to scramble around , like the cops were chasing him, and he never seemed to ever get injured, and seemed to always make his best plays after avoiding being sacked 4 or 5 times. Now people argue that LB's etc are faster, stronger, SURE, but Johnny is much faster and stronger than Tarkenton, so its all relative. His on field antics really dont bother me EXCEPT that it may incite a defensive player to just cheap shot Johnnie, just because they find his antics degrading. But like you said, he has done it in college, and how many times has he been injured? Not often, and nothing major. If Houston doesnt take a QB as TOm surmised, maybe we do have a shot. Even if Houston doesn't, which would be surprising, you'd still have Jacksonville (3), Cleveland(4), Oakland(5) and Minnesota(8) drafting ahead of you. Unless Teddy, Blake, Carr and Fales all get drafted before Johnny, I just don't see how there's any way the Jets would be able to land him. Having five QBs go before we pick would be highly advantageous, as there's likely to be a few DEs (Clowney and Barr) and a few OTs in the top 15 that would help drop someone like Watkins to us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HessStation Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 Even if Houston doesn't, which would be surprising, you'd still have Jacksonville (3), Cleveland(4), Oakland(5) and Minnesota(8) drafting ahead of you. Unless Teddy, Blake, Carr and Fales all get drafted before Johnny, I just don't see how there's any way the Jets would be able to land him. Having five QBs go before we pick would be highly advantageous, as there's likely to be a few DEs (Clowney and Barr) and a few OTs in the top 15 that would help drop someone like Watkins to us. i think at least one of the big 3 WRs will drop due to combine or pro day metrics. Question is will the metrics drop them even further in value to a late first or even 2nd round. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joewillie78 Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 Even if Houston doesn't, which would be surprising, you'd still have Jacksonville (3), Cleveland(4), Oakland(5) and Minnesota(8) drafting ahead of you. Unless Teddy, Blake, Carr and Fales all get drafted before Johnny, I just don't see how there's any way the Jets would be able to land him. Having five QBs go before we pick would be highly advantageous, as there's likely to be a few DEs (Clowney and Barr) and a few OTs in the top 15 that would help drop someone like Watkins to us. I agree, If Houston is not taking a QB, then I think they trade out. Yes, they could stay there and take Clowney, Like they did with Mario Williams 5 or so years back, but I still believe that they would rather have the extra picks, although I could not fault them if they stayed and took Clowney. That is one bad dude. If Manziel is there for Cleveland, with the way the owner is ga-ga (could be a smoke screen?) over him, then I have to believe they grab him and pair him up with Gordon. Like I said, I will need a 30 pack for this draft, as it will be great to watch with all these QB's in play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bitonti Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 clowney didn't have the type of season required to go 1 overall Teddy did and so did Johnny as for the McNair/Obrien discussion this goes back to the fire Rex Ryan arguments. the HC doesn't get to make the first pick of the draft. The GM (Rick Smith) doesn't even really make _that_ pick. It's ownership level decision all the way. This guy OBrien has no juice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joewillie78 Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 clowney didn't have the type of season required to go 1 overall Teddy did and so did Johnny as for the McNair/Obrien discussion this goes back to the fire Rex Ryan arguments. the HC doesn't get to make the first pick of the draft. The GM (Rick Smith) doesn't even really make _that_ pick. It's ownership level decision all the way. This guy OBrien has no juice. I agree on Clowney to certain extent about his season, But lets face it, This dude took games off and many plays off to avoid injury. His physical skills are freakish. He is the closest I have seen in a long time that I could even put in the same sentence as Lawrence Taylor. He is just as fast as Taylor, but is bigger, and stronger. Now Lawrence Taylor in my opinion was the best FOOTBALL PLAYER I have ever seen, and I would never say that Clowney is the "next" LT, but the dudes skills are definitely worth a #1 pick, much more so that Mario Williams a few years agao. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BroadwayJoe12 Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 clowney didn't have the type of season required to go 1 overall Teddy did and so did Johnny as for the McNair/Obrien discussion this goes back to the fire Rex Ryan arguments. the HC doesn't get to make the first pick of the draft. The GM (Rick Smith) doesn't even really make _that_ pick. It's ownership level decision all the way. This guy OBrien has no juice. I see where you're coming from, but I just find it hard to grasp that you bring in someone who's known to be the QB guy, who runs a complex offensive system and then not allow him to make his decision on what QB he needs to run the same system you brought him in there to implement. If reports are that they differ on who they want, it makes no sense that O'Brien signed on for it or McNair signed on for him, unless they're both okay with either. With the amount of suitors that O'Brien had, I have to imagine he's either okay with McNair's choice or he's the one having a large say in the decision making of the QB, if they go QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joewillie78 Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 I see where you're coming from, but I just find it hard to grasp that you bring in someone who's known to be the QB guy, who runs a complex offensive system and then not allow him to make his decision on what QB he needs to run the same system you brought him in there to implement. If reports are that they differ on who they want, it makes no sense that O'Brien signed on for it or McNair signed on for him, unless they're both okay with either. With the amount of suitors that O'Brien had, I have to imagine he's either okay with McNair's choice or he's the one having a large say in the decision making of the QB, if they go QB. I agree. They have to agree on the QB, and if they dont, then maybe they trade out or take Clowney, but I still think you have it 100% correct. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bitonti Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 I see where you're coming from, but I just find it hard to grasp that you bring in someone who's known to be the QB guy, who runs a complex offensive system and then not allow him to make his decision on what QB he needs to run the same system you brought him in there to implement. If reports are that they differ on who they want, it makes no sense that O'Brien signed on for it or McNair signed on for him, unless they're both okay with either. With the amount of suitors that O'Brien had, I have to imagine he's either okay with McNair's choice or he's the one having a large say in the decision making of the QB, if they go QB. yes OBrien and McNair might be okay with either. We spend all this time building up one guy and tearing down another, it's possible that they are all different levels of good. OBrien's large amount of suitors means he's a mercenary. there's no loyalty to Penn State and no loyalty to Houston either. And vice versa. SMith has been there almost a decade and Mcnair will be owner for life. The new guy isn't going to be able to veto Teddy or Johnny for Bortles. JMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BroadwayJoe12 Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 yes OBrien and McNair might be okay with either. We spend all this time building up one guy and tearing down another, it's possible that they are all different levels of good. OBrien's large amount of suitors means he's a mercenary. there's no loyalty to Penn State and no loyalty to Houston either. And vice versa. SMith has been there almost a decade and Mcnair will be owner for life. The new guy isn't going to be able to veto Teddy or Johnny for Bortles. JMO. I would have to imagine there's one of these guys that is jumping off the board to real scouts/GMs/coaches that hasn't made its way to the draftniks and reporters of the world yet. Once the combine, senior bowl and pro-days roll around, I'm gonna bet there's going to be a clear cut heirarchy of QBs that isn't that apparent yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HessStation Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 I was under the impression that Sanchez was quoting Pauline when he was discussing how O'Brien prefers Bortles as a passer to Teddy and Manziel, even though McNair favors Manziel? Totally my bad. I was on my phone before so harder to look up but you were right. It was Pauline's mock. My bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kleckineau Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 I agree on Clowney to certain extent about his season, But lets face it, This dude took games off and many plays off to avoid injury. His physical skills are freakish. He is the closest I have seen in a long time that I could even put in the same sentence as Lawrence Taylor. He is just as fast as Taylor, but is bigger, and stronger. Now Lawrence Taylor in my opinion was the best FOOTBALL PLAYER I have ever seen, and I would never say that Clowney is the "next" LT, but the dudes skills are definitely worth a #1 pick, much more so that Mario Williams a few years agao. A lot of guys have come through the league that were faster, bigger, stronger but............... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greenseed4 Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 A lot of guys have come through the league that were faster, bigger, stronger but............... ....don't have cocaine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slats Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 clowney didn't have the type of season required to go 1 overall Teddy did and so did Johnny as for the McNair/Obrien discussion this goes back to the fire Rex Ryan arguments. the HC doesn't get to make the first pick of the draft. The GM (Rick Smith) doesn't even really make _that_ pick. It's ownership level decision all the way. This guy OBrien has no juice. The combine is gonna shuffle these guys around. Clowney can put up workout numbers and measurables that could easily propel him to the number one spot. Conversely, Johnny Football could weigh in at 5'10", 185lbs, and start to drop. One of the big WRs running a 4.6 could drop them, too (I hope). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bitonti Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 The combine is gonna shuffle these guys around. Clowney can put up workout numbers and measurables that could easily propel him to the number one spot. Conversely, Johnny Football could weigh in at 5'10", 185lbs, and start to drop. One of the big WRs running a 4.6 could drop them, too (I hope). The short list for 1 is Teddy, football and maybe clowney. I don't believe Blake Bortles gets that high. His name is like a french explorer or something. And he threw 2 picks in his bowl game. With 2 QBs it's not gonna be the DE. (Clowney doesn't have the heart. BTW if David Carr can hurt Derek's stock than David Clowney can hurt Jadeveon's.) Teddy should be the pick, but Houston is a city in Texas. This whole hurricane of Johnny Football hype is just getting started. He's a real life Ricky Bobby and the powers that be would love to sell him in that market. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smashmouth Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 Did he take a beating in college? Any time I've ever seen him play he does an incredible job at avoiding the big hits. His size doesnt bother me, the only concern I have is his off field antics. You Didn't Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joewillie78 Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 A lot of guys have come through the league that were faster, bigger, stronger but............... Completely agree. Lawrence Taylor was just a freak of nature. I remember when I first starting watching Taylor and hearing the "hype", and thinking to myself, NO ONE, has ever played the OLB position like that dude. NO ONE ever rushed the passer and literrally dove at the QB, horizontal to the ground knocking the ball loose, NO ONE could stand at the line like they were blitzing, and then retreat into coverage, make a pick, run down a back etc. No one could speed rush, or bull rush with the same ferocity. We hear the "changed the game " Euphamism thrown around alot, but if anyone changed the linebacker position forever, it was that guy. As I said, best FOOTBALLL player I ever saw. Now CLOWNEY has the skills to be like Taylor, even probably more physical skills, but Taylor had that amazing killer instinct, the dude literally wanted to tear your head off on EVERY play, never took plays off. Now did he drive Parcells crazy? SURE, Parcells talks about it all the time, that Taylor would ignore the "play call" and do his own thing, like rush when he was supposed to be in coverage or vice-a-versa, but Parcells always used to say that even when he "did his own thing" he still was such a disruptive force, that it really didnt matter. Clowney I believe can be that type of player if he WANTS to be. He is definitely worth the #1 pick however. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larz Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 I have had a premonition of sorts for months that the jets wind up with McCarron really hope I'm wrong Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazyCarl40 Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 I have had a premonition of sorts for months that the jets wind up with McCarron really hope I'm wrong It makes sense. Jets love to bring in QBs that pose zero threat of winning the starting job or games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbatesman Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 The short list for 1 is Teddy, football and maybe clowney. I don't believe Blake Bortles gets that high. His name is like a french explorer or something. Oh, well in that case Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted January 11, 2014 Author Share Posted January 11, 2014 Oh, well in that case I wouldn't draft him if his name was Teddy Lacan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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