As a fitzmagic supporter...

[56mehl56]

44 minutes ago, Jetmech said:

If they lose or he sucks it's his last game. The team needs to know this.

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Maybe his besties can suck it up and help Ryan save his job - I'm looking at you Marshall, Mangold .

[Rangers9]

I have no problem giving Geno a couple of starts. Even though I dislike his tweets and selfish behavior on the sideline yesterday. I'm not sure the Jet org feels the same way about that. It's possible they might try to trade him in a few weeks (if Petty returns). Trading Fitz would be harder because at this time other teams would not want to take on his salary considering his poor performance. I think it makes sense to give Petty starts but maybe later in the season. Fitz is starting on Sunday but if he can't generate an offense again I go to Geno. He looked yesterday like we've seen him in the past. He has athletic ability can sometimes make plays but too many errors and drive killers. 

[Jetmech]

Maybe his besties can suck it up and help Ryan save his job - I'm looking at you Marshall, Mangold .

You would think so but it could get worse before it gets better...

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[joewilly12]

Fitzpatrick face palm 

[Warfish]

6 minutes ago, j4jets said:

Doesn't matter what the odds are. At this point, I'll take what I can.

As would we all, but if the odds of an outcome are 0.000003%, I don't sacrifice 3-4 games of development for our potential 2017 starting QB.

Hence the question.

Quote

What are the odds Petty IS the real deal? I'll venture a guess and say 5% for either of the scenarios.

The odds are materially higher than Geno Smith going 8-2 with 20 TD's against 3 INT's, then being Franchise Tagged and traded for something of great value.

Quote

These last 10 games become irrelevant. Why? Cuz, again, you don't need a bunch of starts to show that you belong here.

Geno Smith got 2 full seasons as a starting QB as a tryout, and missed out on his third only due to an unplesant, yet avoidable, situation.  

He got all that to see if he belonged here.  He was the worst starting QB in the NFL over those two years.

Yet we have many fans here, today, who say he needs more of a chance. That we don't know what he is, or if he can be good, or worth keeping, or worth tagging/trading.

Yet your position is we can know if Petty is worth keeping in 1 game?  That he "doesn't need" time, not even the remaining 10 games of the lost 2016 season, to know what he is and will be?  

This position seems inherently contradictory.

 

[56mehl56]

27 minutes ago, Beerfish said:

This league is littered with guys who come in and have the excuse of no prep and do well or well enough, even this year, Cody freakin Kessler, 3rd stringer for Clev, rookie, showing things.  Prescott, raw rookie expects to do zero immediately comes in and is great, Lynch was able to tread water, Brisett as well. 

If Petty is not healthy then he doesn't play but I think he has been healthy and the jets have been playing games.  He's been here a full year plus and playing sooner, (maybe not the very next game) than later is the best way to see if he can rise to the occasion and show something.  He's far different than Hackenburg who at this point doesn't know the pointy side of the football from the fat part.

 

In any case the point is this, if the Jets lose another game or so and fail to play Petty and or Hack substantially in the 2nd half of the season they will be outright morons.  Playing truculent Geno serves no purpose, playing shot Fitz serves no purpose.

Yeah and when that early success wanes and they turn into Sanchez and Geno then the fans will be screaming we didn't let them develop. I'm fairly certain Petty will get some games this season and that is fine.

[j4jets]

Just now, Warfish said:

As would we all, but if the odds of an outcome are 0.000003%, I don't sacrifice 3-4 games of development for our potential 2017 starting QB.

Well, the odds Geno goes 5-5 is way better than Petty being the next franchise QB.

Just now, Warfish said:

The odds are materially higher than Geno Smith being Franchise Tagged and traded after going 8-2 with 20 TD's against 3 INT's.

Not really. Disagree. Materially higher odds that a QB who never beat Geno (who you think is one of the worse ever, I suppose) would be miracle. Maybe if Petty actually beat Geno.

Just now, Warfish said:

Geno Smith got 2 full seasons as a starting QB as a tryout, and missed out on his third only due to an unplesant, yet avoidable, situation.  

Did he really? Thrusted in to the starting lineup due to an injury and given no talent to play with. Still managed 8 wins. Same story next year except Idzik happened and we ended up saving $50mil on the cap for the following year. Yeah, that was talent not used.

Just now, Warfish said:

He got all that to see if he belonged here.  He was the worst starting QB in the NFL over those two years.

And I told you why.

Just now, Warfish said:

Yet we have many fans here, today, who say he needs more of a chance. That we don't know what he is, or if he can be good, or worth keeping, or worth tagging/trading.

Yes, there are plenty of supporters that think we can salvage the pick somewhat. Keyword: salvage. 

Just now, Warfish said:

Yet your position is we can know if Petty is worth keeping in 1 game?  That he "doesn't need" time, not even the remaining 10 games of the lost 2016 season, to know what he is and will be?  

This position seems inherently contradictory.

 

I did infer saying "after two years". Technically, Geno hasn't started a game after two years. There is a thing called development curve and Geno has demonstrated that. He flat out won the camp last year and this year. 

[56mehl56]

14 minutes ago, Rangers9 said:

I have no problem giving Geno a couple of starts. Even though I dislike his tweets and selfish behavior on the sideline yesterday. I'm not sure the Jet org feels the same way about that. It's possible they might try to trade him in a few weeks (if Petty returns). Trading Fitz would be harder because at this time other teams would not want to take on his salary considering his poor performance. I think it makes sense to give Petty starts but maybe later in the season. Fitz is starting on Sunday but if he can't generate an offense again I go to Geno. He looked yesterday like we've seen him in the past. He has athletic ability can sometimes make plays but too many errors and drive killers. 

The only thing you could get back in a trade for Fitz right now is Ebola.

[joewilly12]

6 minutes ago, 56mehl56 said:

The only thing you could get back in a trade for Fitz right now is Ebola.

Fitzpatrick isn't worth a bag of dirty jocks.

[Mike135]

22 minutes ago, Rangers9 said:

Trading Fitz would be harder because at this time other teams would not want to take on his salary considering his poor performance. 

lmfao...  

Now, only after the 1-5 start a team wouldn't want to pay his salary?  

You're killin' me man.  Teams didn't want to pay him a third of his salary when he was a FA after his "good" season.

The only bad thing about Fitz being benched or cut is that I'm going to miss your insane support for guy.  Definitely has been entertaining.

[Beerfish]

42 minutes ago, cant wait said:

You're also assuming that petty is going to show something here. that is definitely not guaranteed so basically geno is the contingency plan. hackenberg should not see the field this season... I don't care if other rookies are playing well, he needs to sit rather than trot him out there and kill whatever confidence he's got

Geno should be no plan at all unless we intend to sign him next year and let him be the starter,  I don;t see that happening.

Even if petty and hack both fell on their faces it would let us know if petty has a shot and how far away hack is.  The worst sign out of a waste season is not finding out if guys can play or have promise.  Even with Hackenburgs issues some game time would help imo, but then I am of the opinion that rarely do you ruin a player who was going to be good with some early adversity.  The good players show you something, the lousy ones have shattered confidence.

[Beerfish]

25 minutes ago, 56mehl56 said:

Yeah and when that early success wanes and they turn into Sanchez and Geno then the fans will be screaming we didn't let them develop. I'm fairly certain Petty will get some games this season and that is fine.

Sanchez and geno failed because they were failure QBs', not because they started too soon and were ruined.

[Warfish]

37 minutes ago, j4jets said:

Well, the odds Geno goes 5-5 is way better than Petty being the next franchise QB.

Agreed, because Geno would face a weak schedule, and the odds of any 4th round QB becoming a Franchise QB is generally low.

Risk vs. Reward.  There is no risk, nor reward, in starting Geno.  If he goes 5-5, he won't be resigned, won't be tagged, and will simply go on her merry way to obscurity as a 32 elsewhere.  

Petty, as with any unknown QB prospect, is 100% risk-reward.  We risk he goes 0-10, to see if he can reward us by being a Starting-calibur QB.  Notice, starter-quality, not Franchise QB.  The odds are much better that he could be adequate vs. the odds of his being a hidden being Peyton Manning.

37 minutes ago, j4jets said:

Materially higher odds that a QB who never beat Geno (who you think is one of the worse ever, I suppose) would be miracle. Maybe if Petty actually beat Geno.

Petty outplayed Geno this preseason. 

37 minutes ago, j4jets said:

I did infer saying "after two years". Technically, Geno hasn't started a game after two years. There is a thing called development curve and Geno has demonstrated that. He flat out won the camp last year and this year. 

I have no idea what you say that makes you think Geno "flat out won the camp" this year.  He was about equal to Fitz, and had his doors blown off by Petty.

But I presume we'll have to agree to disagree.

We'll see what Bowles does.  I fear we may both wind up displeased, frankly. 

[j4jets]

2 minutes ago, Warfish said:

Agreed, because Geno would face a weak schedule, and the odds of any 4th round QB becoming a Franchise QB is generally low.

Are you gearing up an excuse? 

2 minutes ago, Warfish said:

Risk vs. Reward.  There is no risk, nor reward, in starting Geno.  If he goes 5-5, he won't be resigned, won't be tagged, and will simply go on her merry way to obscurity as a 32 elsewhere.  

I just pointed out the risk and reward. There's no risk letting a 4th round QB play 3-4 less games. 

2 minutes ago, Warfish said:

Petty, as with any unknown QB prospect, is 100% risk-reward.  We risk he goes 0-10, to see if he can reward us by being a Starting-calibur QB.  Notice, starter-quality, not Franchise QB.  The odds are much better that he could be adequate vs. the odds of his being a hidden being Peyton Manning.

I want Petty to be the guy. But Im not hanging my hat on that hope. I just don't see how 6 games worth or reps would change how his career plays out instead of 10 games in the same throw away year. 

2 minutes ago, Warfish said:

Petty outplayed Geno this preseason. 

No he didn't. 

2 minutes ago, Warfish said:

I have no idea what you say that makes you think Geno "flat out won the camp" this year.  He was about equal to Fitz, and had his doors blown off by Petty.

So if he was equal to Fitz and petty blow him off (not literally), then Petty was the unquestioned winner of the camp? Not even close. Petty hasn't faced an NFL defender yet. 

2 minutes ago, Warfish said:

But I presume we'll have to agree to disagree.

Agreed there.

2 minutes ago, Warfish said:

We'll see what Bowles does.  I fear we may both wind up displeased, frankly. 

That we will. Fitz is starting and its not even funny.

[Warfish]

9 minutes ago, j4jets said:

Are you gearing up an excuse? 

It's sad how often facts are called excuses when they refuse to align with a belief system.

No, my friend, I'm not.   The schedule after Baltimore simple is the weaker portion of our schedule.

And if Geno starts, I hope, beyond all hope, that he wins all 10.  Being wrong > Losing, always and every time, in my book.

9 minutes ago, j4jets said:

I just pointed out the risk and reward. There's no risk letting a 4th round QB play 3-4 less games.

And I disagree.  There is no reward in playing a bad QB in his fianl contract year on a team that doesn't support him in what is a lost season.

9 minutes ago, j4jets said:

I want Petty to be the guy. But Im not hanging my hat on that hope.

Agreed, and nor am I.  Hence why I want to see as many Petty starts as possible.  So if he's not the guy, he got his full, fair chance, and can be dumped if he isn't the man.

9 minutes ago, j4jets said:

I just don't see how 6 games worth or reps would change how his career plays out instead of 10 games in the same throw away year. 

The maximum number of starts provides the maximum evaluation and analytical period for our Front Office.

Conversely, I honestly do not believe there is any real world outcome by Geno that would result in him being retained by the Jets in 2017, or him being tagged and traded.

So I support the option that provides maximum potential gain, and maximum future certainty about Petty, thus driving our decisions in off season 2017.

9 minutes ago, j4jets said:

No (Petty didn't outplay Geno). 

We'll have to agree to disagree, it would appear we watched two totally different preseasons.

9 minutes ago, j4jets said:

So if he was equal to Fitz and petty blow him off (not literally), then Petty was the unquestioned winner of the camp?

IMO, yes.

9 minutes ago, j4jets said:

Not even close. Petty hasn't faced an NFL defender yet.

I look forward to when he does.

9 minutes ago, j4jets said:

Agreed there.

That we will. Fitz is starting and its not even funny.

Failure rarely is.

[southparkcpa]

2 hours ago, jetsfan719 said:

 

I was one of the many calling for the resign of fitzpatrick. I was excited after last season and thought he brought something good to this team.

Still think he is a great team leader, and has a great personality, and is a stand up player but...

After what i have been watching i think it is sadly say it is time to move on.

We are now 1-5. Playoffs pretty much long gone. No decker. Sloppy play. No secondary, no oline, just piss poor all around. Safe to say this year we aren't going to be making any noise.

Why not just let petty and hackenberg get their reps. Forget about "it will destroy then throwing them into the fire". We have 10 games. We should split 5 per game for each and see what each has. Rather then waiting till next year draft time guess whether we need to draft a QB high. Frankly iv seen more then enough of geno to realize hes not the answer. For the geno supporters, If u wana start him next week jus to confirm he doesnt have it, im fine with that.

But the rest of the season should be about finding out what we have in hackenberg, petty, and the young talent on roster. Come next season we cut the "fat" and build on the younger guys.

Like i said i love fitz despite what these last games have said. But fitz is not answer for future of the jets. Neither is geno. So lets not waste a loss season continuing down the same path.

What do u guys think?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

5 NFL teams released him yet many fans were emotional. AS is Woody.  HE got a Woody watching us almost make the playoffs.

Yet @EXREX has posted that Woody has yet to recognize we need a real rebuild. I think he is right. 

I was against the FITZ deal. HE has never been to the playoffs.  

I think short term thinking as you had has to end. I would sit FITZ, start Geno. IF after 3 games he is the old Geno, I'd cut him.

 

[southparkcpa]

1 hour ago, joewilly12 said:

Ryan Fitzpatrick is who I knew he was all along a bum. 

Nice to see others realize they made a mistake. 

We all want whats best for the Jets when the smoke from this dumpster fire clears out. 

There is a LOT of grease in this dumpster......  the smoke may clear but the stench will take 2 years to go away if done right. 

[joewilly12]

QB tryouts at Florham Park 

Dont stop until we find one 

[Rangers9]

1 hour ago, 56mehl56 said:

The only thing you could get back in a trade for Fitz right now is Ebola.

That's a nice positive thought. 

[jeremy2020]

You'd be better off as an athletic supporter than a fitz supporter

[The Crusher]

Personally I don't think we should let Geno in a game until we are down by at least 21 points.  

[Villain The Foe]

3 hours ago, jetsfan719 said:

 

I was one of the many calling for the resign of fitzpatrick. I was excited after last season and thought he brought something good to this team.

Still think he is a great team leader, and has a great personality, and is a stand up player but...

After what i have been watching i think it is sadly say it is time to move on.

We are now 1-5. Playoffs pretty much long gone. No decker. Sloppy play. No secondary, no oline, just piss poor all around. Safe to say this year we aren't going to be making any noise.

Why not just let petty and hackenberg get their reps. Forget about "it will destroy then throwing them into the fire". We have 10 games. We should split 5 per game for each and see what each has. Rather then waiting till next year draft time guess whether we need to draft a QB high. Frankly iv seen more then enough of geno to realize hes not the answer. For the geno supporters, If u wana start him next week jus to confirm he doesnt have it, im fine with that.

But the rest of the season should be about finding out what we have in hackenberg, petty, and the young talent on roster. Come next season we cut the "fat" and build on the younger guys.

Like i said i love fitz despite what these last games have said. But fitz is not answer for future of the jets. Neither is geno. So lets not waste a loss season continuing down the same path.

What do u guys think?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

That's the most mature statement I've heard from someone not in support of Geno. 

Give him a shot, that's all. 

[Villain The Foe]

3 hours ago, j4jets said:

This season was over after the third loss. The 4th and 5th were just confirmations. So now you need to see what you have in the young ones and Geno is next. He deserves more than 6 passing attempts. Petty will get his turn in due time. But Bowles still want Fitztragic. 

You're right about that. You have a 6% chance of making the playoffs at 1-4. At 1-5? Virtually impossible. Since the merger only 2 teams have ever done it. Thanks Idzik lol. 

[FlaJetsFan]

2 hours ago, Paradis said:

There's 7000 million posts about this topic, but i'm choosing this one to point out blind impatience and or intentional stupidity. 

how many snaps, practices, reps, whatever - has Petty had in the last 2-3 weeks with 1st team or 2nd team? None?... and you want him to START next week?

How about no. How about we give Bryce Petty 2-3 weeks to actually prepare properly so it's not slaughter. I think we all want to move on From Fitz/Geno, but starting Geno for a couple weeks is absolutely the smart thing to do - if you want to see Petty succeed. 

Unless the coaches already know something we dont about Petty, starting him against the Browns is the way to go, any way you look at it.

 

 

 

[Jet_Engine1]

4 hours ago, j4jets said:

There was no chance Fitz was getting resigned. He still played 6 games. Starting petty isn't the worst idea. Im ok with. I still want Geno to get 3-4 games. If he bombs, we don't lose anything. If he plays well, we have plenty to gain. As for the reps argument for Petty, if he's any good, he wouldn't need those reps. He'll be in year 3. If you can't take the field in the 3rd year, you're useless. 

Geno Smith could come in but unless  he somehow blends the maturity and professionalism of Peyton Manning, the arm and accuracy of Aaron Rodgers, the poise and fire of Brady, and the overall greatness of Marino, goes undefeated while posting a perfect QB rating....he will not be a Jet next year. 

 

They obviously do not like him as a player, want to move on from him, and are not invested in playing him.

[j4jets]

11 hours ago, Jet_Engine1 said:

Geno Smith could come in but unless  he somehow blends the maturity and professionalism of Peyton Manning, the arm and accuracy of Aaron Rodgers, the poise and fire of Brady, and the overall greatness of Marino, goes undefeated while posting a perfect QB rating....he will not be a Jet next year. 

 

They obviously do not like him as a player, want to move on from him, and are not invested in playing him.

Yet, here he is, still on the team while they carry 4QBs. 

[Jet_Engine1]

18 minutes ago, j4jets said:

Yet, here he is, still on the team while they carry 4QBs. 

Because he is cheap, under contract, and while I believe he would be addition by subtraction, the Petty injury forced them to hold on to him. And while they are carrying 4 QBs, you can't realistically count Hackenberg as more than a roster spot , not a game ready QB. 

Starting Geno until Petty gets a week or two more of significant practices is one thing, beyond that is pointless 

[Stark]

16 hours ago, j4jets said:

Geno plays well, gets a good one year deal and we get a 5th round comp pick for him (goes 5-5, 15 TDs, 5-7 ints in the last 10 games.)

Geno plays great, we get to tag him and trade him (Goes 8-2, 20TDs, 3-5 ints in the last 10 games)

Geno plays bad and Petty gets a shot after 3-4 games. Not much lost. Hack can not take the field this year. He'll be comical. 

 

I really can't say it any better. I am not even a Whitlock fan, but everyone knows what Geno is. There is no chance Geno could play well enough to warrant us franchise tagging him and then getting lucky enough to have a team trade for him. The best predictor for the future is past behavior. Geno's wreaks of poor decision making, lack of pocket presence, not being well prepared and poor decision making... yes I said it twice because thats what Geno does.

 

Just give Petty the rest of the season, if we're going to make a change. That will give the best chance of a full evaluation, yes the schedule gets easier, but If Petty doesn't show that he can play with the rest of the schedule then we know that this offseason is "QB search" like never before because we basically will have Hackenburg and thats it, Petty would become the emergency QB when Geno and Fitz are gone after this season.