Zach Wilson Highlights - Week 5 - Every Pass vs Dolphins

[LAD_Brooklyn]

Dolphins were without the best CB duel in the NFL. So I wouldn't be too excited and was expecting him to actually do better. 

I would like for him to target Garret Wilson more like Flacco did. Also the guy doesn't turn the football over. Last week I'll give him a break as he was in week 1, while everyone else was in week 4 mode. 

 

[maury77]

He managed the game well, hit the passes that were there most of the time and had no turnover worthy plays. Jets can win like that as long as the defense and running game hold up their end.

[Bowles Movement]

2 hours ago, batman10023 said:

folks were upset at his short throw game.  seems to be much improved.

Absolutely  All his short throws to running backs were perfect

 Meant to add that to my post but forgot.   Thanks!

[Dax89]

I'm not a ZW hater by any means but the majority of the issues I see with him right now are:

 

(1) Inconsistent ball placement.  He throws a lot of balls that are in theory "catchable" but makes it a tough catch frequently.  This is often worse on short passes, which is why "in theory" high percentage passes like screens and swing passes not super high percentage.  He did better on the short throws this game then in the Cincy game.

 

(2) He still needs to know when to take the heat off the ball and make touch throws.  This combined with his inconsistent ball placement is a huge contributor to the drop problems our receivers have had the last two years.

 

(3) Sometimes Zach tries to go for the big play when what we really need is to convert.  While you do need your QB to take chances sometimes and not just be "Check down Charlie" you also can't kill your offensive efficiency always going for low percentage shots, especially on 3rd down.

 

That being said while he has a lot to work on he's showing a lot to like.  Particularly when he has time to see the field he can be deadly, hopefully we can see more of that if/when the OL stabilizes

[FidelioJet]

19 hours ago, hawk said:

All in all, he looked much improved.  

He looked much better on the short passes.  He missed Moore on the toe tapper, which was a great catch albeit out of bounds.  He was open.

I don't understand the non calls on both Conklin Deep and that pass to Davis along the sideline.  Crazy.

The Moore on the toe tapper was a perfect throw.  Wilson put the ball EXACTLY where he should have.  That ball was meant to be throw where it was.  WR plants his toes just inside the white - then the throw comes., reaches up and grabs it.  Moore planted his toes on the white.  That's on Moore, not Wilson.  He was already on the sideline when Zach threw it.  all Moore had to do was have his toes an inch or so more inside and it's a complete pass.

[kdels62]

6 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

The Moore on the toe tapper was a perfect throw.  Wilson put the ball EXACTLY where he should have.  That ball was meant to be throw where it was.  WR plants his toes just inside the white - then the throw comes., reaches up and grabs it.  Moore planted his toes on the white.  That's on Moore, not Wilson.  He was already on the sideline when Zach threw it.  all Moore had to do was have his toes an inch or so more inside and it's a complete pass.

Zach was a little late on it but Moore should’ve done better that’s for sure. Moore feels like a guy that spent all summer believing all the hype about him. He’ll have a breakout game soon. 

[jvill 51]

Just now, FidelioJet said:

The Moore on the toe tapper was a perfect throw.  Wilson put the ball EXACTLY where he should have.  That ball was meant to be throw where it was.  WR plants his toes just inside the white - then the throw comes., reaches up and grabs it.  Moore planted his toes on the white.  That's on Moore, not Wilson.  He was already on the sideline when Zach threw it.  all Moore had to do was have his toes an inch or so more inside and it's a complete pass.

That ball should have been on Moore as soon as he came out of his break. Location was fine, but if he pulls the trigger earlier he doesn't have to throw nearly as safe of a ball. I wouldn't say its a miss, but that was on Zach. One of the few mistakes I thought he made in an otherwise clean and efficient game.

[SomebodytoAnybody47]

Can someone explain this play to me? It was the first quarter. I have no idea what the thought was.

Moore and Davis are basically jogging towards the endzone. Garrett Wilson is...a decoy? Just floats off to the side. WTF is this lol

[SomebodytoAnybody47]

22 minutes ago, kdels62 said:

Zach was a little late on it but Moore should’ve done better that’s for sure. Moore feels like a guy that spent all summer believing all the hype about him. He’ll have a breakout game soon. 

This honestly is another weird one....Moore is running 25 yards downfield and barely turns around, like he's not expecting anything. 

[kdels62]

35 minutes ago, Zachtomims47 said:

Can someone explain this play to me? It was the first quarter. I have no idea what the thought was.

Moore and Davis are basically jogging towards the endzone. Garrett Wilson is...a decoy? Just floats off to the side. WTF is this lol

 

24 minutes ago, Zachtomims47 said:

This honestly is another weird one....Moore is running 25 yards downfield and barely turns around, like he's not expecting anything. 

Corey Davis’s shrug and look at the coaching staff after the throwaway in the end zone tells me that someone ran the wrong route. Considering Moore’s route running on the bootleg, im gonna assume Moore messed up both those times. Moore also halfassed a clear out route in the game against Pitt that led to the Int. 

[SomebodytoAnybody47]

1 minute ago, kdels62 said:

Corey Davis’s shrug and look at the coaching staff after the throwaway in the end zone tells me that someone ran the wrong route. Considering Moore’s route running on the bootleg, im gonna assume Moore messed up both those times. Moore also halfassed a clear out route in the game against Pitt that led to the Int. 

Hoping to get another breakdown video from that QB Guru guy on youtube. And hear what he thinks. They need to clean that up. Also, don't waste Garrett Wilson like that. 

[Jimmy 2 Times]

I hate to say it because I love the guy, but Moore acts like he’s quitting on plays where he’s not the primary.

Its alarming.

[FidelioJet]

On 10/10/2022 at 4:15 PM, Augustiniak said:

Only throw I’d like to redo is the one that was short to moore. 

I agree.  But one thing I wonder, was Moore supposed to come back for it?  Was it a curl and their timing was off?  Those are things we just don't know.  And things that will naturally get resolved the more they play together.

[FidelioJet]

2 hours ago, Jimmy 2 Times said:

I hate to say it because I love the guy, but Moore acts like he’s quitting on plays where he’s not the primary.

Its alarming.

He does seem to be playing with figurative slumped shoulders.  Almost like he's beaten down.  I wonder if the press GW has gotten has deflated him a bit.

[JiFtheOracle]

19-17, start of the 4th, starts the drive with a 25 yards out to Davis, clinical drive w/ no incompletions finishing w/ Hall falling on the 1 yards line on a little swing route.  Dude is balling when it matters so far.  Great to see.

[JiFtheOracle]

4 hours ago, kdels62 said:

 

Corey Davis’s shrug and look at the coaching staff after the throwaway in the end zone tells me that someone ran the wrong route. Considering Moore’s route running on the bootleg, im gonna assume Moore messed up both those times. Moore also halfassed a clear out route in the game against Pitt that led to the Int. 

 

4 hours ago, Zachtomims47 said:

Hoping to get another breakdown video from that QB Guru guy on youtube. And hear what he thinks. They need to clean that up. Also, don't waste Garrett Wilson like that. 

Total guess here but it looked like they called man beaters and it ended up being a zone and it kind of threw everyone off and were running directly into the danger areas.  

[T0mShane]

5 hours ago, Zachtomims47 said:

Moore is running 25 yards downfield and barely turns around, like he's not expecting anything. 

[T0mShane]

5 minutes ago, JiFapono said:

man beaters

cc: @joewilly12

[SomebodytoAnybody47]

9 minutes ago, JiFapono said:

 

Total guess here but it looked like they called man beaters and it ended up being a zone and it kind of threw everyone off and were running directly into the danger areas.  

Maybe. The whole play just looks wacky. 

[Mogglez]

Boy, the season is young and I don’t want to jump the gun here, but Elijah Moore’s effort through 5 weeks has not been it.  This isn’t even a last two weeks thing, this has been happening since week 1.

[JiFtheOracle]

1 hour ago, T0mShane said:

cc: @joewilly12

Man eaters

@CTM

[SuicidalSince98]

47 minutes ago, Mogglez said:

Boy, the season is young and I don’t want to jump the gun here, but Elijah Moore’s effort through 5 weeks has not been it.  This isn’t even a last two weeks thing, this has been happening since week 1.

Happened last year as well. So many plays where he just almost but not quite makes the play. I like him but he needs to start making the difficult plays instead of missing on medium difficulty ones. 

[JiFtheOracle]

49 minutes ago, Mogglez said:

Boy, the season is young and I don’t want to jump the gun here, but Elijah Moore’s effort through 5 weeks has not been it.  This isn’t even a last two weeks thing, this has been happening since week 1.

Kind of agree though their usage is weird and they definitely use a ton of dummy routes where they really have no chance of getting the ball but it really has to make you wonder, wtf Mims did to be perma placed in the dog house.  They run a ton of near formations, even out of shotgun, shortening the field, you would think a big physical receiver who is willing to block and can create a better "pick" and can use his body to shield would help being out there in all those formations. 

[65 Toss Power Trap]

On 10/10/2022 at 2:51 PM, Darnold's Forehead said:

Forgot to say something negative about him.  That 2nd sack was horrendous.  Have our coaches told him to stop running backwards?

Flacco (or a quarterback not as mobile) would not have lost as many yards on that play as Zach (he was obviously running backwards to get away thinking he could make something out of nothing). HOWEVER, Flacco (or a quarterback not as mobile) would have been sacked multiple times the last two games in situations where Zach's mobility has avoided the negative play.

So,on balance, the Jets are way better with Zach having plays like that because of how many more negative plays he is going to avoid, and because of how many off schedule plays he will create, as opposed to other quarterbacks.

[65 Toss Power Trap]

On 10/10/2022 at 3:00 PM, Alentador31 said:

Honestly, he quietly put on a clinic. 

No doubt. Completion rate in the high 60s. No turnovers. Some timely passes. Making changes at the line. Letting the running game take over. Leading a balanced attack. Willing that touchdown he scrambled for when nothing was available. Etc.

[65 Toss Power Trap]

On 10/10/2022 at 3:33 PM, Zachtomims47 said:

Looks elite. 

Posters on JN will disregard, or laugh at, that comment. But:

- How could he have finished the Pittsburgh game any stronger?

- How could he managed the Miami game better? He did what he needed to while the offense got the running game going. 

[65 Toss Power Trap]

On 10/10/2022 at 4:30 PM, maury77 said:

He managed the game well, hit the passes that were there most of the time and had no turnover worthy plays. Jets can win like that as long as the defense and running game hold up their end.

I wish your fellow posters would pay attention to how you analyze Zach. You have never been a fan of drafting him, and you worry about him working out, but your takes are reasonable and it's clear you have no problems as long as the team is heading in the right direction.

Props.

[SomebodytoAnybody47]

17 minutes ago, JiFapono said:

Kind of agree though their usage is weird and they definitely use a ton of dummy routes where they really have no chance of getting the ball but it really has to make you wonder, wtf Mims did to be perma placed in the dog house.  They run a ton of near formations, even out of shotgun, shortening the field, you would think a big physical receiver who is willing to block and can create a better "pick" and can use his body to shield would help being out there in all those formations. 

My only guess is that Mims can’t even line up right, causing a penalty and messing up the drive. 
But like, if you’re gonna loaf..f off. We have Mimsy for that. Grinds my gears he’s just sitting on the bench. 

[65 Toss Power Trap]

20 hours ago, Dax89 said:

I'm not a ZW hater by any means but the majority of the issues I see with him right now are:

 

(1) Inconsistent ball placement.  He throws a lot of balls that are in theory "catchable" but makes it a tough catch frequently . . . 

(2) He still needs to know when to take the heat off the ball and make touch throws.  This combined with his inconsistent ball placement is a huge contributor to the drop problems our receivers have had the last two years.

(3) Sometimes Zach tries to go for the big play when what we really need is to convert . . . 

Good thoughts. His short passed (excepting the shoe ball he threw Moore) looked better this last game. The 3rd down throw to Wilson seemed to fast and in the wrong place, but GW17 did what he's paid to and made the play. 

His short stuff and touch passes just have to improve. Period. I think he's working on it, but it got to be a focus. Throw 500 per day if you need to Zach, clean it up.

To your point #3, that interception before the half in the Pittsburg game was ridiculous. Jets had a guarantee 3 points. Instead, Pittsburg got point before the half. As long as he is improving piece by piece, he'll keep cleaning stuff up.

[FidelioJet]

20 hours ago, Dax89 said:

I'm not a ZW hater by any means but the majority of the issues I see with him right now are:

 

(1) Inconsistent ball placement.  He throws a lot of balls that are in theory "catchable" but makes it a tough catch frequently.  This is often worse on short passes, which is why "in theory" high percentage passes like screens and swing passes not super high percentage.  He did better on the short throws this game then in the Cincy game.

 

(2) He still needs to know when to take the heat off the ball and make touch throws.  This combined with his inconsistent ball placement is a huge contributor to the drop problems our receivers have had the last two years.

 

(3) Sometimes Zach tries to go for the big play when what we really need is to convert.  While you do need your QB to take chances sometimes and not just be "Check down Charlie" you also can't kill your offensive efficiency always going for low percentage shots, especially on 3rd down.

 

That being said while he has a lot to work on he's showing a lot to like.  Particularly when he has time to see the field he can be deadly, hopefully we can see more of that if/when the OL stabilizes

I'm going to try and say this without being obnoxious about it...So I apologize in advance.  

You've listed the issues he had the first 10 weeks of last year - much of which was true - but he mostly has not done any of those three things the last month or so of last year and the two games this year.  

Again, I apologize but what you wrote it old news.  Simply not the case anymore.  If you expect perfection then you're not watching the rest of the NFL.  

He has consistently been very accurate, he's been checking down, if anything more than he should be (as you're hearing people here calling him a game manager) - he's mostly made good choices to push the ball downfield when necessary and take what's there otherwise.  and his pace of balls have been just fine.  This is the NFL and these guys need to put their big boy pants on - I haven't seen drops because the ball was thrown too hard.  If they don't like it, get on the Jugs machine.  He clearly controls speeds well, this is a non-issue....

You're welcome to say what you want - but it's simply a narrative thrown around here that sounds nice - but it's just not true

[FidelioJet]

29 minutes ago, 65 Toss Power Trap said:

Flacco (or a quarterback not as mobile) would not have lost as many yards on that play as Zach (he was obviously running backwards to get away thinking he could make something out of nothing). HOWEVER, Flacco (or a quarterback not as mobile) would have been sacked multiple times the last two games in situations where Zach's mobility has avoided the negative play.

So,on balance, the Jets are way better with Zach having plays like that because of how many more negative plays he is going to avoid, and because of how many off schedule plays he will create, as opposed to other quarterbacks.

Exactly.  It really is just silly how people overreact.  You have to take the good with the bad sometimes.  Zach's mobility has FAAAAAAR outweighed the occasional sack that is worse than it could have been.  We're talking about one of those in 2 games.  How many sacks has he saved? How much has his mobility kept plays and drives alive?

Also, I ask others to go back and watch that play again - he wasn't trying to run around - he made one move - and turned the wrong way.  Little he could have really done.  

He hasn't been doing that chicken without a head thing this year (like he did a lot of last year) even this play, wasn't that.  Go watch it.

[FidelioJet]

19 minutes ago, 65 Toss Power Trap said:

Good thoughts. His short passed (excepting the shoe ball he threw Moore) looked better this last game. The 3rd down throw to Wilson seemed to fast and in the wrong place, but GW17 did what he's paid to and made the play. 

His short stuff and touch passes just have to improve. Period. I think he's working on it, but it got to be a focus. Throw 500 per day if you need to Zach, clean it up.

To your point #3, that interception before the half in the Pittsburg game was ridiculous. Jets had a guarantee 3 points. Instead, Pittsburg got point before the half. As long as he is improving piece by piece, he'll keep cleaning stuff up.

I'm curious.  What short stuff and touch passes are you referencing that have to improve?  It's only been two games - where are all of these passes that need to be improved upon? Period.

[FidelioJet]

44 minutes ago, JiFapono said:

Kind of agree though their usage is weird and they definitely use a ton of dummy routes where they really have no chance of getting the ball but it really has to make you wonder, wtf Mims did to be perma placed in the dog house.  They run a ton of near formations, even out of shotgun, shortening the field, you would think a big physical receiver who is willing to block and can create a better "pick" and can use his body to shield would help being out there in all those formations. 

My best guess.  This is a very precision based, timing offense with a lot of nuance. 

And, not based on any knowledge - but I get the sense Mims just isn't the brightest guy in the world.

[65 Toss Power Trap]

8 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

I'm curious.  What short stuff and touch passes are you referencing that have to improve?  It's only been two games - where are all of these passes that need to be improved upon? Period.

He had some speedballs last week. If I wasn't being lazy, I'd go look them up right now. The shoe throw to Moore is no good. He had a throw or to his right side last week that was bad. I don't know what it is, but short/screen/quick passes to his right can be problematic. 

However, I was very happy with his short passes against Miami in general. 

[JohnnyLV]

Zach has thrown a couple of swing passes to the inside shoulder where the receiver has to turn his body back to the middle and it looks like poor placement but on those shallow outs it can be good placement depending on CB leverage since it leads to more YAC and is actually an easier ball to catch then the one to the outside shoulder where both your body momentum and ball momentum work against you