NFL QB Rankings: Jets Sanchez Lower Tier?

[JetNation]

Recently Pat Kirwan from NFL.com ranked all of the quarterbacks in the National Football League as part of his analysis of the Top 100 players.    Kirwan broke down all of the signal callers into groups of give, and listed them in alphabetical order.

New York Jets quarterback Mark Sanchez was ranked in group D (16-20) with the likes of Jay Cutler, Matt Cassel, Ryan Fitzpatrick, and Kyle Orton.  Sanchez was listed ahead of veteran players Donovan McNabb and David Garrard, but behind up and coming stars Josh Freeman, Joe Flacco, and Sam Bradford.

I found Kirwan’s assessment quite interesting as it will definitely create a variety of discussions and arguments.  In the end I think it comes down to how you evaluate a quarterback.  Is it wins and losses? Statistics?

At this point I believe that Mark Sanchez is developing into a very good quarterback, but he remains a work in progress.  Sanchez improved in year two and displayed the leadership and tenacity that is required for a franchise quarterback.  In order for Mark to get to the next level he needs to become more consistent in terms of his performance on a weekly basis.  This will be no easy task for Sanchez, especially considering that the offseason has been a wash up to this point due to the lockout (Jets West can only do so much).  In addition the Jets have some uncertainty at the wide receiver position as Santonio Holmes, Brad Smith, and Braylon Edwards could be lost to free agency based on the new collective bargaining agreement.

In the end I think Kirwan’s ranking was fair as Sanchez has made progress, but still has some work to do to become a top 15 quarterback.

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[T0mShane]

As soon as he gave his first conscious thought as to where to rank Andy Dalton on the list of the NFL's best QB's, he should have just shut his computer off.

Super Bowl-winning QBs top list of game’s best signal-callers

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d81ffd82d/article/super-bowlwinning-qbs-top-list-of-games-best-signalcallers

There has been a lot of discussion about the quarterbacks who made the Top 100 Players of 2011 and those who were left off.

Lists are great for debate. With that in mind, I prefer to group players in segments of five with little debate about one player being better than the next in his particular group.

Here are the quarterback groupings in alphabetical order.

Group A (1-5)

1. Tom Brady, Patriots: Three Super Bowl rings and four appearances in the big game to go along with the most touchdown passes in 2010 (36).

2. Drew Brees, Saints: Tied for second in TD passes (33) and one of the great leaders in the NFL.

3. Peyton Manning, Colts: Tied for second in TD passes (33) and the guy who will probably break Brett Favre's passing records.

4. Philip Rivers, Chargers: Led the league in passing yards with 138 fewer throws than the next closest QB in passing yards.

5. Aaron Rodgers, Packers: The Super Bowl MVP and someone who made Packers fans forget Favre.

Group B (6-10)

1. Eli Manning, Giants: Underrated with 4,000-plus passing yards and fourth in touchdown passes (31).

2. Ben Roethlisberger, Steelers: A two-time Super Bowl champion and three appearances on Super Sunday during his seven-year career. The essence of a winner.

3. Tony Romo, Cowboys: He has to stay healthy this year and improve on his 1-3 postseason record or he will fall from this group.

4. Matt Ryan, Falcons: A rising star with 66 touchdown passes and just 34 interceptions in his first three years.

5. Michael Vick, Eagles: Turned his life around, and not only recaptured his career but has improved as a quarterback.

Group C (11-15)

1. Sam Bradford, Rams: He averaged 39 pass plays a game as a rookie, completed 60 percent of his passes and threw more touchdowns (18) than interceptions (15) without a top wide receiver.

2. Joe Flacco, Ravens: All he's done is lead his team to the playoffs in his first three seasons. He has 60 touchdown passes and just 34 interceptions to go along with a 4-3 postseason mark.

3. Josh Freeman, Buccaneers: A rising star who reminds me of a young Warren Moon. Cool under pressure with a big arm. He led his team to 10 wins in his first full season as a starter.

4. Carson Palmer, Bengals: He might retire, but he still threw for 3,970 yards and 26 touchdowns in 2010. If the Bengals ever change their mind about trading him, we will all see what the rest of the league thinks of his ability.

5. Matt Schaub, Texans: Probably belongs in Group B but winning has to be part of the equation to move up. He threw for 4,370 yards and 24 touchdowns last season.

Group D (16-20)

1. Matt Cassel, Chiefs: The trade for Cassel proved to be a great move by the Chiefs. Very efficient quarterback in 2010 with 27 touchdowns and just seven picks. He gets a new receiving weapon in Jonathan Baldwin this season and is probably headed to Group B or C next year.

2. Jay Cutler, Bears: He takes too much criticism for his "body language." The accusations after his knee injury in the NFC title game are just an example of his bad image. Another year under offensive coordinator Mike Martz and he's headed up from Group D.

3. Ryan Fitzpatrick, Bills: The Bills know what they have in Fitzpatrick and passed on adding a quarterback in the draft. Get him some more protection and targets, and he will improve on his stellar 2010 production.

4. Kyle Orton, Broncos: Played in 13 games and still threw for 3,653 yards. He might get traded when the lockout is over since a number of teams will want a QB with a 32-29 career record and 12,000-plus passing yards.

5. Mark Sanchez, Jets: Impressive start to career with a 23-14 record, including the playoffs, but needs to improve on his passing with only 29 touchdowns in 33 regular-season games.

Group E (21-25)

1. David Garrard, Jaguars: While he will probably be replaced sooner or later, he will not go down without a fight. He has a winning record in the NFL and has thrown 35 more touchdowns than interceptions.

2. Matt Hasselbeck, Seahawks: He had seven touchdowns to one interception in the playoffs and still has some tread left on the tires. He's a free agent and hopefully he stays in Seattle. His 11 postseason games, including a trip to the Super Bowl, is the kind of experience a team will need if the lockout goes deep into the summer.

3. Chad Henne, Dolphins: He is another quarterback in a long line trying to erase the memory of Dan Marino. This could be his last chance to keep a starting job and 27 touchdown passes in 27 starts isn't going to cut it.

4. Donovan McNabb, Redskins: His best years are behind him and the 2010 stop in Washington was a bad experience. He can still play, but needs another change of scenery.

5. Matthew Stafford, Lions: He has to stay healthy to move up a few groups. He looks like he's stronger and healthy, which means he could ascend next season.

Group F (26-30)

1. Jason Campbell, Raiders: He threw 13 touchdowns in 13 games last year and really needs a big season to step out of the obscurity he seems to be floating along in his five-year career. Let's see if a new coach, Hue Jackson, takes him to the next level.

2. Jon Kitna, Cowboys: Even though he might be a backup, did you notice how well he played last year when he had to start for Romo? Kitna's going back to the bench in Dallas, but he has a better chance of winning games in 2011 than a number of starters.

3. Kevin Kolb, Eagles: He'll be a hot item if we ever get to where trades can happen. The West Coast coaches believe he's the next Hasselbeck or Schaub. A backup with limited experience who can come in and be the face of the organization.

4. Colt McCoy, Browns: The West Coast system is perfect for McCoy. Between Pat Shurmur and Mike Holmgren, McCoy should be productive this year.

5. Vince Young, Titans: He is 30-17 as a starter and has to find a new place to play in 2011. If he cleans up his reputation as a worker, he still has a bright future.

Group G (31-35)

1. Andy Dalton, Bengals: With Palmer probably retired or gone, Dalton will get a chance to play, and with A.J. Green at the end of his passes to go with a solid running game, he should have a promising rookie season.

2. Shaun Hill, Lions: Another backup who played better than some starters around the league a year ago. He led the Lions to two late wins.

3. Cam Newton, Panthers: If he doesn't get into camp soon and get some coaching, he will not have a chance to win as a rookie. He has the talent, but it will be a tough year with a weak supporting cast.

4. Tim Tebow, Broncos: He didn't play poorly when he got his chance last year. As one general manger said, "I should have known he would do a decent job on the field the way he competes." This is a deciding season for his future in Denver.

5. Alex Smith, 49ers: He was starting to come around when Norv Turner was his offensive coordinator back in 2006 and I'm hoping Jim Harbaugh can do the same thing for Smith now. His 19-31 record with more interceptions (53) than touchdowns (51) is a heavy burden to carry around.

[slats]

I think he's overrated Eli, Bradford, and Cassel.

Sanchez is about where he should be on the list, although I'd take him above everyone else in his grouping, and probably Palmer and Bradford, too. Sanchez get penalized for his lack of TD's, but I think that has a lot to do with the Jets focus on the ol' ground & pound. Where Sanchez really needs to improve is in his accuracy. If he can get from 55% to above 60%, all of his numbers will be better. I think his coordinator can help with that, too. Mark needs more easy passes in his repertoire. Tom Brady is a great QB, but the vast majority of his passes are easy throws.

Thing is I like Sanchez, and at the same time I recognize I make excuses for him all the time: lack of college experience, the G&P, Schottenheimer, etc. People who hated him from the start may get to tell me they told me so. Oh well.

I think he's been pretty money late in games, and in the playoffs. That's the big key for me. He's no shrinking violet. The pressure's on, and he's generally better - in stark contrast to -say- a Phil Rivers. I definitely still think Mark can be a very good QB in this league.

[Kleckineau]

Sanchez was the highest draft pick of the QB's in group D but unfortunately has the weakest arm in the group.

Coupling that with the fact that he is a sub 60% completion pctg passer doesnt bode well.

His fans like to say he is a 4th quarter qb but I think its more a case of the O line wearing down oponents late in games.

[Larz]

evaluating QB's is so tough, but the thing sanchez has to overcome is he is driving a lexus and can't get in the endzone.

When the offense is the problem, the QB gets the blame. Continuity is huge in the NFL, and if the jets can keep it for another year, I think we will see mark take a big step forward this year

[DMaynard]

Sanchez was the highest draft pick of the QB's in group D but unfortunately has the weakest arm in the group.

Coupling that with the fact that he is a sub 60% completion pctg passer doesnt bode well.

His fans like to say he is a 4th quarter qb but I think its more a case of the O line wearing down oponents late in games.

That is one way to look at it. I think it is more of a matter of Schotty realizing time is running out to be able to win the game continuing his run, run, pass offense and letting Sanchez throw, GOD forbid, on 1st and 2nd downs. After Mark delievers and wins the game, Schotty goes right back to his same predictable offense for the next game's first 3 quarters. It is like ground hog's day.

Memo to Sh#tenheimer, you are allowed to throw the ball on first down in the first half.

[Larz]

That is one way to look at it. I think it is more of a matter of Schotty realizing time is running out to be able to win the game continuing his run, run, pass offense and letting Sanchez throw, GOD forbid, on 1st and 2nd downs. After Mark delievers and wins the game, Schotty goes right back to his same predictable offense for the next game's first 3 quarters. It is like ground hog's day.

Memo to Sh#tenheimer, you are allowed to throw the ball on first down in the first half.

you have to include rex in your assesment in my opinion. shotty is no genius, but he is smart enough to know what his boss wants.

[greeniemeanie]

I think he's overrated Eli, Bradford, and Cassel.

Sanchez is about where he should be on the list, although I'd take him above everyone else in his grouping, and probably Palmer and Bradford, too. Sanchez get penalized for his lack of TD's, but I think that has a lot to do with the Jets focus on the ol' ground & pound. Where Sanchez really needs to improve is in his accuracy. If he can get from 55% to above 60%, all of his numbers will be better. I think his coordinator can help with that, too. Mark needs more easy passes in his repertoire. Tom Brady is a great QB, but the vast majority of his passes are easy throws.

Thing is I like Sanchez, and at the same time I recognize I make excuses for him all the time: lack of college experience, the G&P, Schottenheimer, etc. People who hated him from the start may get to tell me they told me so. Oh well.

I think he's been pretty money late in games, and in the playoffs. That's the big key for me. He's no shrinking violet. The pressure's on, and he's generally better - in stark contrast to -say- a Phil Rivers. I definitely still think Mark can be a very good QB in this league.

My thoughts exactly.

Mark is going to get better I believe. I think he needs to really step it up this year, or my opinion (which is on par with Slats) will probably change after this year.

[TheSage]

I have little dispute with most of the rankings but it appears he looks more at pure statistics rather than when the number were put up and fails, at least in Sanchez' case to put emphasis on when the numbers were put up and on overall success. It has to be recognized that Mark has talent around him on both sides of the ball but he performs in crunch time and big games. four playoff wins in a two year career "aint half bad"

[dbatesman]

needs to improve on his passing

Oh, is that all?

[jetfan4hire]

I'm sold on Sanchez. He's getting better and still 24. He already has more playoff wins than any Jets QB ever. I'm not going to give Ryan and the defense 100% credit for the Jets wins. Sanchez came through a few times when the defense wasn't playing too well. Been very good in the playoffs and 4th qtr. QBs usually take a little while to develop. What more do you want within reason? I think we should be happy we have Sanchez. He's beaten NE 3 out 5. I don't think that should be overlooked either

[jason423]

All in all I dont see anything wrong with where he has Sanchez. Sanchez did some nice things last season and had some great last minute drives, but for the most part he has simply been along for the ride for the last two years. I do think there are a number he overrates, mainly in that group C tier. Flacco is similar to Sanchez in that he has been along for the ride. Both have been in a similar spot in which the coaches have pulled back his responsibilities in favor of running the ball because he is too inconsistent in big spots. Bradford is too high simply because the sample is so small. He was pretty good but he didnt light the world on fire to where you would call him a sure thing. Carson Palmer is a joke. Guy hasnt been good in years.

[Bleedin Green]

All in all I dont see anything wrong with where he has Sanchez. Sanchez did some nice things last season and had some great last minute drives, but for the most part he has simply been along for the ride for the last two years. I do think there are a number he overrates, mainly in that group C tier. Flacco is similar to Sanchez in that he has been along for the ride. Both have been in a similar spot in which the coaches have pulled back his responsibilities in favor of running the ball because he is too inconsistent in big spots. Bradford is too high simply because the sample is so small. He was pretty good but he didnt light the world on fire to where you would call him a sure thing. Carson Palmer is a joke. Guy hasnt been good in years.

Funny thing is these are the three names that jumped out to me as well. Flacco is no different than Sanchez except for the fact that he puts up better numbers in normal game time but has been significantly worse with the pressure on. His playoff performances have been a complete joke. For me, his difference in analysis of Flacco and Sanchez showed an inconsistency in how he rated QBs throughout, giving credit to some QBs for one thing but not the same to others.

Bradford played extremely well for a rookie under the circumstances, but that's really the beginning and end of it. He gets a lot of credit given the situation, but there's not much to go on beyond that. Palmer I've been wondering all offseason why he's been talked about so much. I have no idea why the Bengals are so against trading him or why anyone would give up anything of significance to get him to begin with, and that's coming from someone who was a big fan of his during his first few years starting. He had the look of the NFL's next bigtime gunslinger, but has been a shell of that player for years and years now. At this point in his career he has the look of one of those old washed up vets who you have as a backup and occasionally start out of desperation (e.g., Kerry Collins).

[jason423]

Palmer I've been wondering all offseason why he's been talked about so much. I have no idea why the Bengals are so against trading him or why anyone would give up anything of significance to get him to begin with, and that's coming from someone who was a big fan of his during his first few years starting. He had the look of the NFL's next bigtime gunslinger, but has been a shell of that player for years and years now. At this point in his career he has the look of one of those old washed up vets who you have as a backup and occasionally start out of desperation (e.g., Kerry Collins).

Just a guess but the Bengals refuse because they are cheap. Im sure they feel that they paid him 25 million in bonus money to play a certain amount of years and they are not letting another team essentially get him for free when the Bengals paid the money up front.

[stoicsentry]

If it was "who would you pick to win one game" then I think Sanchez should be rated even lower.

If it's "who would you like to have for the rest of his career", he's easily top 10.

[slats]

Just a guess but the Bengals refuse because they are cheap. Im sure they feel that they paid him 25 million in bonus money to play a certain amount of years and they are not letting another team essentially get him for free when the Bengals paid the money up front.

Probably lockout related, too. Breaking in a new starting QB this year -especially a rookie- is gonna be tough. If I were the Bengals, I'd want break Dalton in over the course of the season, not throw him to the wolves week one.

Despite their well known cheapness, I think that has a lot to do with why Marvin Lewis still works there, too.

[Kleckineau]

Keep hearing how bad Carson Palmer is but honestly how many years has he played on a very good team.

I remember my all time favorite QB #12 looking like sh!t when the NYJ were too cheap and or stupid to pay for good players around him.

Pass attempts 3,217

Pass completions 2,024

Percentage 62.9

TD-INT 154–100

Passing yards 22,694

QB Rating 86.

Anyone here think MS will be playing in 10 yrs and have have stats comparable to these ?

I dont.

[Damaged89]

Keep hearing how bad Carson Palmer is but honestly how many years has he played on a very good team.

I remember my all time favorite QB #12 looking like sh!t when the NYJ were too cheap and or stupid to pay for good players around him.

Pass attempts 3,217

Pass completions 2,024

Percentage 62.9

TD-INT 154–100

Passing yards 22,694

QB Rating 86.

Anyone here think MS will be playing in 10 yrs and have have stats comparable to these ?

I dont.

meh, those are skewed by those two outstanding years he had early. he's been middling ever since.

[Kleckineau]

meh, those are skewed by those two outstanding years he had early. he's been middling ever since.

2003 CIN 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0

2004 CIN 13 13 432 263 60.9 2897 6.7 18 18 77.3 18 47 2.6 1 25 178 2 2

2005 CIN 16 16 509 345 67.8 3836 7.5 32 12 101.1 34 41 1.2 1 19 105 5 2

2006 CIN 16 16 520 324 62.3 4035 7.8 28 13 93.9 26 37 1.4 0 36 233 15 7

2007 CIN 16 16 575 373 64.9 4131 7.2 26 20 86.7 24 10 0.4 0 17 119 5 1

2008 CIN 4 4 129 75 58.1 731 5.7 3 4 69.0 6 38 6.3 0 11 67 2 0

2009 CIN 16 16 466 282 60.5 3094 6.6 21 13 83.6 39 93 2.4 3 26 213 6 2

2010 CIN 16 16 586 362 61.8 3970 6.8 26 20 82.4 32 50 1.6 0 26 201 7 3

Total 97 97 3217 2024 62.9 22694 7.1 144 110 86.9 179 316 1.8 5 160 1116 42 17

Meh?

It could also be argued that if it wasnt for the knee re-construction costing him starts he would be nearing 30,000 yds in 7yrs as a starter.

I think alot of folks here are judging him based on how Rex and the Jets defense made him look horrible recently. Hell, they made Brady look crummy last year also.

Still the best USC QB ever.

[The Crusher]

If it was "who would you pick to win one game" then I think Sanchez should be rated even lower.

If it's "who would you like to have for the rest of his career", he's easily top 10.

Change it to "who would you pick to win one playoff game" and Sanchez would be top 5.

[JetsFanInDenver]

Phillip Rivers at #4 ?

I think top 5 spots should only go to QBs that have been to a Super Bowl. The only exceptions being when QB has played whole career without a good offensive unit.

Mark Sanchez is being brought down in rankings by the genius of Schotty!