Seven Years Ago Today

[SoFlaJets]

1 minute ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Then you must be blocking out those 2-3 years of my posts, which I concede is understandable.  

No SE I'm just getting old, it's nothing personal my friend

[Sperm Edwards]

15 minutes ago, SoFlaJets said:

No SE I'm just getting old, it's nothing personal my friend

We all are, brother. 

[section314]

6 hours ago, nyjunc said:

we have missed on QBs since Namath and it's a reason we aren't consistently very good but we've also had a lot of very good years too.  Hopefully someday soon we get a true franchise QB.

Agreed.

[ZachEY]

1 hour ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Hey after getting torched for 99 yards on the Cruz TD it was a 3 point ballgame with half the game remaining. You make it sound like that was the last play of the game.

This is the argument.  If at any point in a game, Sanchez has a lead, then he has done his job, and all that is left is for the defense to blow it.  It's the 2009 Colts game extrapolated.  Sanchez throws a TD pass to a wide-open Edwards, and nothing else matters all game.

[ZachEY]

3 hours ago, nyjunc said:

they do a better job than old fashioned stats but they still are out of context stats.

It's funny that GM's and scouts across all major sports leagues are using advanced statistics, but your "it was windy that day" argument is really what they should be looking towards for true context.

[Miss Lonelyhearts]

8 hours ago, gEYno said:

Drafting Sanchez wasn't the big mistake, though there are certainly some, like @Miss Lonelyhearts who made this case strongly.  The mistake that crushed us was that miserable Tannenbaum given extension.  

DOOOOOOOOOOM

[Jet Nut]

5 hours ago, nyjunc said:

you know there are plays and moments that can change everything, that was a punch to to the gut.  we never recovered and NYG rode that momentum to a SB.

 

he was not awful against Dallas.

he threw the pick and we went down 14 but he came right back and threw a TD.

 

the TD to Burress, are you referring to that perfectly thrown back shoulder throw?

 

where did I say sanchez won that game? you know you have nothing when you have to resort to making things up to sensationalize.

 

He was not great against Buf but he was not awful either.  That is being unfair.  Our D got torched that day and our O kept coming back.

 

I am referring to signing a C off the street to start against that D who was destroyed all game long but it was Mark's fault.  Greene and LT combined for 13 carries for 20 yards but it was all Mark's fault clearly.

 

 

This as wrong and as nonsensical as a post can be

 

[The Troll]

My on this day from 2009 said "I hate the ******* Jets".

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Snell41]

I literally don't agree with a single thing you've written here. 

And I wasn't sensationalizing. You constantly refer to the team's record with him, even when they won despite his crappy play. When things don't fall just right, you are all too quick to point them out. Well if everything falls just right, we don't need him. He sucks, and that's why he was just given away for nothing despite a generally favorable 1 year contract that even I would have signed us up for as a stopgap (but only if we draft a serious QB prospect). 

I don't know how anyone can bother debating with him. He takes the absurd and argues it as fact to the death. I believe he's just messing with people. No one can possibly believe the crap he says.

[nyjunc]

14 hours ago, Mainejet said:

WTF are you talking about?! You just keep coming up with this outlandish sh*t. Is this a hobby of yours? To believe whatever you want and completely ignore facts? It's like I'm talking to a child. Richardson was at the end of the line??? He was MILES better than Tommy Bohanon even on his last day in the league. So don't give me this crap about he wouldn't have even made the team?!

And you think the OL was better in 2015 now? Dude, you're all over the map. And you're WRONG about the rushing average for those particular teams as well. The 2010 team had  4.4 YPC, the 2015 team had 4.2 YPC. So where in the world you are coming with these off the wall claims is probably just things you are pulling out of your rear end? It has ZERO basis in fact.

And the extent of big spots for Marshall was the regular season finale in 2015? Meanwhile, Edwards had HUGE catches for us many times over the multiple playoff years?

Yes, and that is the point. that's what I have been saying all along and you tried to disagree with me, but now all of a sudden you're on my side? Honestly you need to figure out what you're arguing for.

I said all along that Sanchez had WAY more talent in 2010 than Fitz did in 2015. YOU were the one that said the roster was MORE talented in 2015.

Richardson was CUT but b/c team leaders went to rex and Tannenbaum they brought him back.  he was 39 years old in 2010, he wasn't at the end of the line?  do you have any idea what you are typing?

where did I say the OL was better in 2015?

I used top 2 RBs, the 2010 # is skewed by trick plays from Brad Smith.  LT/Green averaged under 4.2 YPC.  last year Ivory and Powell averaged under 4.4.  

Edwards got to the playoffs b/c he QB and teammates didn't fold.  That wasn't the case for Marshall.

the weapons around mark were MUCH better than 2010, not even close, not really debatable.  The D was equally as talented in 2015 compared to 2010.

14 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said:

I literally don't agree with a single thing you've written here. 

And I wasn't sensationalizing. You constantly refer to the team's record with him, even when they won despite his crappy play. When things don't fall just right, you are all too quick to point them out. Well if everything falls just right, we don't need him. He sucks, and that's why he was just given away for nothing despite a generally favorable 1 year contract that even I would have signed us up for as a stopgap (but only if we draft a serious QB prospect). 

You are allowed to disagree and be wrong  it's hard to win in spite of the most important position on the field, again in 2008 w/ similar talent against weaker sched and no Brady they couldn't make the playoffs w/ a HOFer.

13 hours ago, gEYno said:

It's funny that GM's and scouts across all major sports leagues are using advanced statistics, but your "it was windy that day" argument is really what they should be looking towards for true context.

Yes they are using it but not as gospel, as PART of the evaluation process.

10 hours ago, Jet Nut said:

This as wrong and as nonsensical as a post can be

 

great breakdown, you are good at this.

[nyjunc]

28 minutes ago, Snell41 said:

I don't know how anyone can bother debating with him. He takes the absurd and argues it as fact to the death. I believe he's just messing with people. No one can possibly believe the crap he says.

and yet none of you guys can do a good job countering what I write.  all you guys do is make up things I didn't say and run with it b/c you can't attack the actual post.

 

It boggles my mind how our QB sucked, our HC sucked, our GM sucked, our OC sucked yet we won 4 road playoff games in 2 years and made 2 title games.  How does this happen?  maybe, just maybe, the guys weren't as bad as whiny fans want to believe b/c they are no longer here?  I've been following this team a long time and one thing that always stays the same is the way the fans turn on old players/coaches/GMs and love all the new players/coaches/GMs  AND how fans love fantasy #s.  Ryan Fitz is thought of in a better light for meaningless fantasy #s w/ most talented O we have had since the 80s while leading us to miss the playoffs but mark is bashed for helping us get closer to a SB than any QB not named Namath.  Amazing.

[Matt39]

28 minutes ago, nyjunc said:

and yet none of you guys can do a good job countering what I write.  all you guys do is make up things I didn't say and run with it b/c you can't attack the actual post.

 

It boggles my mind how our QB sucked, our HC sucked, our GM sucked, our OC sucked yet we won 4 road playoff games in 2 years and made 2 title games.  How does this happen?  maybe, just maybe, the guys weren't as bad as whiny fans want to believe b/c they are no longer here?  I've been following this team a long time and one thing that always stays the same is the way the fans turn on old players/coaches/GMs and love all the new players/coaches/GMs  AND how fans love fantasy #s.  Ryan Fitz is thought of in a better light for meaningless fantasy #s w/ most talented O we have had since the 80s while leading us to miss the playoffs but mark is bashed for helping us get closer to a SB than any QB not named Namath.  Amazing.

Because Fitzpatrick is a better player. It's simple. 

[Snell41]

1 hour ago, nyjunc said:

and yet none of you guys can do a good job countering what I write.  all you guys do is make up things I didn't say and run with it b/c you can't attack the actual post.

 

It boggles my mind how our QB sucked, our HC sucked, our GM sucked, our OC sucked yet we won 4 road playoff games in 2 years and made 2 title games.  How does this happen?  maybe, just maybe, the guys weren't as bad as whiny fans want to believe b/c they are no longer here?  I've been following this team a long time and one thing that always stays the same is the way the fans turn on old players/coaches/GMs and love all the new players/coaches/GMs  AND how fans love fantasy #s.  Ryan Fitz is thought of in a better light for meaningless fantasy #s w/ most talented O we have had since the 80s while leading us to miss the playoffs but mark is bashed for helping us get closer to a SB than any QB not named Namath.  Amazing.

Pretty much everyone here knows by now that you're running a schtick.  You've been playing this game as far back as this forum goes.  I remember you planting your flag in the Herm Edwards defense camp and we've even discussed it.  It's not that people don't counter it, it's that you refuse to see the logic of the counterpoint because you have no interest in the debate, you just like to ruffle feathers and troll people into a frothy are you *^&$ing kidding me response.  Don't get me wrong, I think it's funny you've been pulling this for so long.  I mean geez this forum started what, 10-15 years ago now (god I'm getting old!).  You'll keep getting noobs that sign up and fall for it, I just scratch my head how a guy like @Sperm Edwards who's been here since day one gets sucked in.  He should know better. 

[nyjunc]

40 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

Because Fitzpatrick is a better player. It's simple. 

fans are impressed w/ meaningless fantasy #s.  I understand that.

3 minutes ago, Snell41 said:

Pretty much everyone here knows by now that you're running a schtick.  You've been playing this game as far back as this forum goes.  I remember you planting your flag in the Herm Edwards defense camp and we've even discussed it.  It's not that people don't counter it, it's that you refuse to see the logic of the counterpoint because you have no interest in the debate, you just like to ruffle feathers and troll people into a frothy are you *^&$ing kidding me response.  Don't get me wrong, I think it's funny you've been pulling this for so long.  I mean geez this forum started what, 10-15 years ago now (god I'm getting old!).  You'll keep getting noobs that sign up and fall for it, I just scratch my head how a guy like @Sperm Edwards who's been here since day one gets sucked in.  He should know better. 

you don't remember, you perceive and I was here briefly about a decade or so ago and just came back to this forum last season so clearly your memory is foggy.  To someone like you if I defend Herm, if I defend mark, if I defend rex that must mean I think they are great but the reality is I discuss them realistically.  None of them were horrible like whiny Jet fans try to pretend they were.  I get it, the new guy is always the best.  in a few years Bowles will be bashed like Herm or rex, Fitz will be bashed liked Mark or Chad.  it's what typical fans do, I am not a typical fan.

 

 

[Irish Jet]

Meaningless Fantasy Stats, such as Touchdowns. 

[Sperm Edwards]

1 hour ago, Snell41 said:

I don't know how anyone can bother debating with him. He takes the absurd and argues it as fact to the death. I believe he's just messing with people. No one can possibly believe the crap he says.

Oh, he believes it. I know the difference because I have often argued with people just for the sport of it.  

[Sperm Edwards]

Quote

 

none of you guys can do a good job countering what I write

 

[nyjunc]

4 minutes ago, Irish Jet said:

Meaningless Fantasy Stats, such as Touchdowns. 

so week 17 against a dead team that had quit what did he do?

if mark was in this QB friendly system and mark had the same talent around him we could compare stats.  

 

By the way, the 2010 Jets D allowed 297 pts(18.6 PPG), the 2015 Jets allowed 279 pts(17.4 PPG) and w/ all those impressive stats and all the weapons still couldn't get us to the playoffs w/ that creampuff schedule.

[nyjunc]

4 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Oh, he believes it. I know the difference because I have often argued with people just for the sport of it.  

I don't believe, I KNOW it and so do you guys.  You have to when you counter my arguments by making things up that I never said.

[Sperm Edwards]

Just now, nyjunc said:

I don't believe, I KNOW it and so do you guys.  You have to when you counter my arguments by making things up that I never said.

Yes, yes. That's why we think Sanchez was a sh*tty QB, along with everyone else (except maybe you, Ryan, Tannenbaum, and the Sanchez family). Because we secretly know he was really good. A top 10 QB even. Nobody made things up you never said. You credit him with team wins. When I mocked it in his nearly blowing the Dallas game, then you say "I never said HE won the game." Please.

You can go on with your fantasy. That and a warm blanket should keep you warm at night.

Funny thing is, your other favorite QB (Pennington, or the younger version of him anyway) would have been a far better QB for those 2009-2011 teams. 

[Bleedin Green]

14 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Funny thing is, your other favorite QB (Pennington, or the younger version of him anyway) would have been a far better QB for those 2009-2011 teams. 

Ok, now you're just screwing with everyone.  What a cruel, mean, terrible thing to say.  Talk about the ultimate "lesser of two evils" situation right there.

[nyjunc]

25 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Yes, yes. That's why we think Sanchez was a sh*tty QB, along with everyone else (except maybe you, Ryan, Tannenbaum, and the Sanchez family). Because we secretly know he was really good. A top 10 QB even. Nobody made things up you never said. You credit him with team wins. When I mocked it in his nearly blowing the Dallas game, then you say "I never said HE won the game." Please.

You can go on with your fantasy. That and a warm blanket should keep you warm at night.

Funny thing is, your other favorite QB (Pennington, or the younger version of him anyway) would have been a far better QB for those 2009-2011 teams. 

You struggle reading what I write.  I didn't credit HIM w/ wins, I credit him HELPING us win.  it's hard to win w/o a QB in this league which is something peopel do no understand and to win 4 road playoff games w/ a QB supposedly along for the ride- that just doesn't and cannot happen.

my fantasy is reality, your reality is fantasy.

Chad sucked too, Herm sucked, everyone sucks except Fitz, Bowles, etc... until in 2 years they will suck too.

[ZachEY]

2 hours ago, nyjunc said:

Yes they are using it but not as gospel, as PART of the evaluation process.

No one said it's the gospel.  But it's a pretty good indication of where a player stands, so, perhaps an argument can be made that Sanchez was somewhat better than his advanced metrics, but that's not the argument you're making.  You are making the argument that he was a top 10ish QB, when the metrics all put him as consistently one of the bottom 10 or even 5.  That leap isn't a leap of the metrics aren't gospel, that's a leap of completely ignoring any objective measure of performance, pre-asserting the conclusion, and then figuring out ways to support one's bias.

[Mainejet]

3 hours ago, nyjunc said:

and yet none of you guys can do a good job countering what I write.  all you guys do is make up things I didn't say and run with it b/c you can't attack the actual post.

 

It boggles my mind how our QB sucked, our HC sucked, our GM sucked, our OC sucked yet we won 4 road playoff games in 2 years and made 2 title games.  How does this happen?  maybe, just maybe, the guys weren't as bad as whiny fans want to believe b/c they are no longer here?  I've been following this team a long time and one thing that always stays the same is the way the fans turn on old players/coaches/GMs and love all the new players/coaches/GMs  AND how fans love fantasy #s.  Ryan Fitz is thought of in a better light for meaningless fantasy #s w/ most talented O we have had since the 80s while leading us to miss the playoffs but mark is bashed for helping us get closer to a SB than any QB not named Namath.  Amazing.

Make up things my A$$. I have presented you fact after fact after fact, then you think because you mouth some lame statement that has no basis in fact (just what you think) suddenly you are correct. Like I said, you must be a legend in your own mind. But I'm done dealing with children. So if you want to accept that as victory then go right ahead. I can tell you I am done discussing anything with you, but it amazes how anyone else would want to debate with you again?

[ZachEY]

2 hours ago, nyjunc said:

and yet none of you guys can do a good job countering what I write.

It's impossible to counter your points successfully, because at the heart of your point isn't any actual objectivity, it's just your notion that you are correct and smarter than anyone else.  So, nothing anyone actually says and no mountain of objective proof is going to get past that.  You argue with circular logic in which you're right because you say you are right and the important things are what your say are important and they're important because you think you're important.  It's an unbeatable strategy on your part, the "I WIN" strategy.

[Irish Jet]

1 hour ago, nyjunc said:

You struggle reading what I write.  I didn't credit HIM w/ wins, I credit him HELPING us win.  it's hard to win w/o a QB in this league which is something peopel do no understand and to win 4 road playoff games w/ a QB supposedly along for the ride- that just doesn't and cannot happen.

my fantasy is reality, your reality is fantasy.

Chad sucked too, Herm sucked, everyone sucks except Fitz, Bowles, etc... until in 2 years they will suck too.

Best ignore Sperm. He's a crazy Fitz fanboy.

[Sperm Edwards]

2 hours ago, Bleedin Green said:

Ok, now you're just screwing with everyone.  What a cruel, mean, terrible thing to say.  Talk about the ultimate "lesser of two evils" situation right there.

When the choice is between 2 evils, the lesser one is preferable.

[Sperm Edwards]

26 minutes ago, Irish Jet said:

Best ignore Sperm. He's a crazy Fitz fanboy.

Is it that obvious?

[Mainejet]

1 hour ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Is it that obvious?

For me it is.....

[southparkcpa]

47 minutes ago, Irish Jet said:

Best ignore Sperm. 

Please keep your sexual parade to yourself....

[Bleedin Green]

26 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

When the choice is between 2 evils, the lesser one is preferable.

Exorcism is the most preferable.

 

[southparkcpa]

1 hour ago, gEYno said:

It's impossible to counter your points successfully, because at the heart of your point isn't any actual objectivity, it's just your notion that you are correct and smarter than anyone else.  So, nothing anyone actually says and no mountain of objective proof is going to get past that.  You argue with circular logic in which you're right because you say you are right and the important things are what your say are important and they're important because you think you're important.  It's an unbeatable strategy on your part, the "I WIN" strategy.

THIS is perfect.   

[nyjunc]

1 hour ago, gEYno said:

No one said it's the gospel.  But it's a pretty good indication of where a player stands, so, perhaps an argument can be made that Sanchez was somewhat better than his advanced metrics, but that's not the argument you're making.  You are making the argument that he was a top 10ish QB, when the metrics all put him as consistently one of the bottom 10 or even 5.  That leap isn't a leap of the metrics aren't gospel, that's a leap of completely ignoring any objective measure of performance, pre-asserting the conclusion, and then figuring out ways to support one's bias.

I said he was top 10 ONE season not a top 10 QB for his career.  when those "advanced metrics" show Tony Romo w/ 6 games played ahead of him that tells you something.  Stats are a useful part of evaluation not the be all end all.

1 hour ago, Mainejet said:

Make up things my A$$. I have presented you fact after fact after fact, then you think because you mouth some lame statement that has no basis in fact (just what you think) suddenly you are correct. Like I said, you must be a legend in your own mind. But I'm done dealing with children. So if you want to accept that as victory then go right ahead. I can tell you I am done discussing anything with you, but it amazes how anyone else would want to debate with you again?

where are these facts you present? please show them to me again.  you are presenting OPINION that is being torn apart.  your big thing is tony Richardson, that should tell you something.

1 hour ago, gEYno said:

It's impossible to counter your points successfully, because at the heart of your point isn't any actual objectivity, it's just your notion that you are correct and smarter than anyone else.  So, nothing anyone actually says and no mountain of objective proof is going to get past that.  You argue with circular logic in which you're right because you say you are right and the important things are what your say are important and they're important because you think you're important.  It's an unbeatable strategy on your part, the "I WIN" strategy.

It's impossible when you make things up that I didn't say.  I don't care if "I win" or not, I have fun with this stuff.  I believe I win, sometimes I may be right(most of the time) and sometimes I may be wrong(every once in a blue moon).

1 hour ago, Irish Jet said:

Best ignore Sperm. He's a crazy Fitz fanboy.

 

13 minutes ago, southparkcpa said:

THIS is perfect.   

do you ever contribute anything to a discussion?

[ZachEY]

8 minutes ago, nyjunc said:

I said he was top 10 ONE season not a top 10 QB for his career.  when those "advanced metrics" show Tony Romo w/ 6 games played ahead of him that tells you something.  Stats are a useful part of evaluation not the be all end all.

The point is that when he was on the field, he was a better player.  But yes, overall, you wouldn't want to compare the two's season.  The stats control for amount of passes, which Romo threw enough to be considered, but in this case, you could remove him, which still leaves Mark Sanchez at the bottom of the list.

[nyjunc]

5 minutes ago, gEYno said:

The point is that when he was on the field, he was a better player.  But yes, overall, you wouldn't want to compare the two's season.  The stats control for amount of passes, which Romo threw enough to be considered, but in this case, you could remove him, which still leaves Mark Sanchez at the bottom of the list.

it doesn't put him at the bottom of the list, how could anyone have Eli Manning and his 25 INts ahead of him?  playing in a weaker division w/ SB talent around him.  In the biggest game of the year at GB he throws FOUR INts and they miss the playoffs but advanced metrics tell us his 25 INts were better.  Please.  we can go on and on.There were not 10 better QBs in 2010.