Forte (Rather Than Ivory) Is Part of the Problem

[joewilly12]

2 minutes ago, UnitedWhofans said:

Oh so our RBs have to be leading the league in something to make you happy?

DUMB.

Listen flip flopper our RB's are the worst in the NFL we lack speed we lack the goal line punch and anything else that makes a good RB 

[hawk]

36 minutes ago, De-Jet-Erate/Duane said:

Powell played well when used yesterday. Some nice carries for good gains. I have been saying most of this short season so far he needs to get more touches.

We need to get them both in the backfield at the same time.  Two slashes capable of catching a pass with Marshall, Decker, and Quincy.  Christmas, this isnt rocket science.  WTF are these so called professionals thinking.

Get your best players in the field.

[isired]

On our first possession down on the 3-4 yard line, Forte was split left, in single coverage by a LB - we all said "TD here on a slant" - he ran the slant, was wide open in front of the LB, looked like Fitz had plenty of open passing lane, he just didn't see him. Fitz then rolls left, Forte reverses and goes in the same direction, still wide open with the LB trailing, but Fitz can't get free to get him the ball and takes the sack.

Forte isn't a goal line O between the tackles runner, but he can and has been effective in the red zone in his career.

But I don't entirely disagree with the OP, we need someone that can run between the tackles. Another detrimental result of keeping 4 QB'S I guess.

[UnitedWhofans]

2 minutes ago, joewilly12 said:

Listen flip flopper our RB's are the worst in the NFL we lack speed we lack the goal line punch and anything else that makes a good RB 

We lack speed?. Oh this is great. You obviously don't have EYES.

[joewilly12]

We lack a RB with speed and elusiveness 31 other NFL defenses know we have no running game and weak armed QB easy to game  plan for the Jets offense 

[j4jets]

10 minutes ago, JetFreak89 said:

I didn't see people complaining when he scored 3 TD's against Buf two weeks ago....

Thats because Fitz hadn't thrown 9 ints. Now that he has (and all of them in opponent territory), its Forte who can't punch it in. These Fitznutz want to blame everyone for every Fitz fault. I can swear they wanna credit Fitz for the Peake TD from yesterday.

[joewilly12]

3 minutes ago, UnitedWhofans said:

We lack speed?. Oh this is great. You obviously don't have EYES.

Yes breakaway speed elusiveness running into the pile isn't the answer being able to get around the end see an opening go for it do you really think we have speed and elusive RBs on this team? 

[phill1c]

2 minutes ago, isired said:

But I don't entirely disagree with the OP, we need someone that can run between the tackles

Forte runs between the tackles. That's really what he does well. That said, the blocking against Seattle was not very good so there were no holes.

[Dcat]

Just now, joewilly12 said:

LOL Khiry Robinson the savior for the Jets at RB LOL STOP

Hey... where did I say "savior" or imply it? Nowhere. I said he was to be the goal line thumper. And he would have been terrific at it had his leg not broke again.

Leave it to you to completely distort what I wrote in your feeble effort to defend your ridiculous contention that the Jets have "the worst RB situation in the league".  But I guess that's what you do when they lack the sound reasoning to be able to support your own point. 

[phill1c]

2 minutes ago, UnitedWhofans said:

We lack speed?. Oh this is great. You obviously don't have EYES.

Forte is not a speed back. So, yeah, you're wrong again. Powell has SOME speed and is elusive, but, not game-breaking speed.

[joewilly12]

2 minutes ago, Dcat said:

Hey... where did I say "savior" or imply it? Nowhere. I said he was to be the goal line thumper. And he would have been terrific at it had his leg not broke again.

Leave it to you to completely distort what I wrote in your feeble effort to defend your ridiculous contention that the Jets have "the worst RB situation in the league".  But I guess that's what you do when they lack the sound reasoning to be able to support your own point. 

The point is the GM and the coaching staff failed to address the teams needs in the off season all too busy held up in the Fitzptraick hostage situation other teams improved we regressed 

[Barkus]

Karlos Williams' suspension is up, worth working him out again and see how he looks. Would be helpful in goal line I would think.

[joewilly12]

2 minutes ago, Barkus said:

Karlos Williams' suspension is up, worth working him out again and see how he looks. Would be helpful in goal line I would think.

Absofriggenlutley!!!!!!!!! WHY THE HELL NOT SIGN THIS BEAST 

[phill1c]

Um, we don't actually see the Goal line from any close distance, do we? On offense that is...

And didn't Forte score 3 TDs from inside 10 yards this year?

[cant wait]

Ivory really was phenomenal for most of last season, the issue with him is durability though so letting him go in favor of forte was a good move for this year. This upcoming draft class is loaded with RB talent so I'd like to see the jets come away with his replacement by day 2 

[Dcat]

4 minutes ago, Barkus said:

Karlos Williams' suspension is up, worth working him out again and see how he looks. Would be helpful in goal line I would think.

Provided he is not still out of shape (fat) the way he was when he showed up at Buffalo this spring.

[phill1c]

Just now, cant wait said:

Ivory really was phenomenal for most of last season

Phenomenal?! Sorry, no he wasn't. He was OK, until Colon went down. Then he was mostly 1st and 10 to 2nd and 8.

[joewilly12]

3 minutes ago, Dcat said:

Provided he not still out of shape (fat) the way he was when he showed up at Buffalo this spring.

Sadly in that condition he might actually improve our running game. 

[Sperm Edwards]

IIRC Forte was open in the EZ on that non-PI call against Marshall to the left. On replay they showed Marshall blanketed and commentator(s) were in the usual covering for the QB speak, saying there was nowhere to go with it, but then the replay then cut to Forte running right to left with over a yard separation on his man, looking at Fitz to throw it to him. The problem was his QB either didn't see him, or saw him but was gunshy. I tend to think the former given how often it happens, but in terms of results it matters not which. We came away with just a FG. (Think that's the drive but I'm going off the top of my head). 

There's no guarantee Ivory would have punched it in, or that if re-signed that he'd even be on the field with his unreliable health. He was great value while we had him. A 4th rd pick and cheap for a starter. 

They signed Khiry but made no arrangements for his absence. I don't know if that's because they initially expected him back earlier or what, but the RB they showed the most interest in recently was Spiller (no bruiser himself). 

Though he's hardly awesome, they could/should have at least temporarily brought back Bohanon for short yardage and backfield blocking (and catching the occasional checkdown). Even more so in light of the lack of a regular/starting TE on the team, and his familiarity with the offense. 

[phill1c]

if you have to be a battering ram to gain yardage, you're just going be like Ivory, injured in a few weeks and no good to anyone.

[De-Jet-Erate/Duane]

14 minutes ago, hawk said:

We need to get them both in the backfield at the same time.  Two slashes capable of catching a pass with Marshall, Decker, and Quincy.  Christmas, this isnt rocket science.  WTF are these so called professionals thinking.

Get your best players in the field.

I agree completely. One of my big concerns(beside QB play) is the formations and the play calling. Very bland for the talent on the field. I know they can't stretch the field but how about a little something creative? 

[phill1c]

the problem is, everyone is running around in the same 20 yard area.

[j4jets]

58 minutes ago, Warfish said:

Specifically in the Red Zone.

Like where Fitz likes to throw ints?

58 minutes ago, Warfish said:

No one respects Forte as a red zone RB, least of all Chan Gailey.

Like where Fitz likes to throw ints?

58 minutes ago, Warfish said:

Ivory, a pounder, demanded coverage, run-stopping fronts in the Red Zone.  Forte simply doesn't.

Like where Fitz likes to throw ints?

58 minutes ago, Warfish said:

Forte is perfectly adequate between the 20's, he's shown that.  But where we're having our biggest problem, in the Red Zone, Forte has been all but useless.  

Like where Fitz likes to throw ints?

58 minutes ago, Warfish said:

He's not strong enough to bull his way for 3-5 yards.  He's not a good enough reciever to get open in that close-coverage area.

Thats because Fitz has been busy finding CBs to throw to.

58 minutes ago, Warfish said:

The loss of this option has been painful.  Fitz has to force passes from the 3-5 yard line that should be easy running TD's.  Instead, Forte gets stuffed, Powell not used (?) and Fitz gets INT'ed or we kick FG's.

Like where Fitz likes to throw ints?

58 minutes ago, Warfish said:

This isn't a defense of Fitz, he's the QB and if the playcall is pass, he must do so and do so successfully.  He hasn't.

Agreed.

58 minutes ago, Warfish said:

But the obvious limited nature and weakness of our running game in the Red Zone is TOO obvious.  

Like where Fitz likes to throw ints?

58 minutes ago, Warfish said:

Chan could do the whole team a favor and figure out how to get more on the ground in close, because we desperately need it.

Chan can't throw. Bowles can do the favor and bench the garbage we have behind center.

58 minutes ago, Warfish said:

Don't let the numbers fool you, Forte's 3 TD's all came vs. Buffalo (where everyone did great).  

So lets ignore the 3 RZ TDs because it nulls your OP.

58 minutes ago, Warfish said:

Despite all those trips in the Red Zone in the other three games, Forte doesn't have a single rushing or receiving TD to his name.

Ctrl+V

[Kleckineau]

At this point in his career Forte's running style reminds me of Blair Thomas.

Forte is old, slow and now fragile.

He blew his load in Chicago.

Macc got fleeced and would have been better off taking a runner in the draft.

[phill1c]

More like Johnny Hector or Curtis Martin, the later years.

Newsflash: when you get stopped at the LOS, it's not the RB's fault.

[Snell41]

Our QB is wildly inaccurate and reckless on intermediate to deep throws. Good defenses will stack the box and stuff the run until the QB proves he can make you pay for that.


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[Kleckineau]

10 minutes ago, phill1c said:

More like Johnny Hector or Curtis Martin, the later years.

Newsflash: when you get stopped at the LOS, it's not the RB's fault.

Of course ^ but do you recall his slow plodding tries for the edge and then the easy tackle?

 

[Dcat]

Just now, Snell41 said:

Our QB is wildly inaccurate and reckless on intermediate to deep throws. Good defenses will stack the box and stuff the run until the QB proves he can make you pay for that.


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good point.  People often forget how an ineffective, weak armed QB like Fitz can basically be the catalyst to a terrible running game.

[isired]

Forte runs between the tackles. That's really what he does well. That said, the blocking against Seattle was not very good so there were no holes.

Was adding on to my statement in the paragraph above that - running between the tackles on the goal line. Not something Forte has been asked to do a lot I his career, and he hasn't been terribly effective between the tackles at all this year. Not all on him though, for sure. I loved the signing then, love it now. He's a big plus.

[Mecca]

Khiry Robinson was a devastating blow for us. People failed to realize how important he was going to be in the RZ. Our offense isn't the same without a power back. Bad move by Bowles playing him in final pre-season game. 

[phill1c]

26 minutes ago, Kleckineau said:

Of course ^ but do you recall his slow plodding tries for the edge and then the easy tackle?

 

Well, if there's nothing open inside, what is he supposed to do, quit? He's not a speed back and wasn't signed because of his outside speed. So, not surprising that he was 'plodding' trying for the edge. The same would likely be said if Ivory were running.

[phill1c]

1 minute ago, Mecca said:

Khiry Robinson was a devastating blow for us. People failed to realize how important he was going to be in the RZ. Our offense isn't the same without a power back. Bad move by Bowles playing him in final pre-season game. 

IMO, you're not going to win many battles asking your RB to run over people. Forte has gained yards after first contact, though I only have my eyes to verify at the moment. Ours is not a power-blocking OL yet. It's a finesse OL. So, just like Ivory wasn't effective after Colon went down, I think having a power back really isn't the answer to issues we're having in the red zone.

[Kleckineau]

Just now, phill1c said:

Well, if there's nothing open inside, what is he supposed to do, quit? He's not a speed back and wasn't signed because of his outside speed. So, not surprising that he was 'plodding' trying for the edge. The same would likely be said if Ivory were running.

 Ivory would make the first tackler pay and most times get positive yardage. Forte goes down. Stick a fork in him he is done.

[jeremy2020]

2 hours ago, joewilly12 said:

Our entire RB situation is a mess. Worst in the NFL 

The RBs look as bad as the QBs and Secondary. The situations mirror themselves. All 3 look like tire fires.

[Warfish]

1 hour ago, j4jets said:

Thats because Fitz hadn't thrown 9 ints. Now that he has (and all of them in opponent territory), its Forte who can't punch it in. These Fitznutz want to blame everyone for every Fitz fault. I can swear they wanna credit Fitz for the Peake TD from yesterday.

No.  I want to analyse the problems we face, and assign appropriate responsibility to all parties that have some.

You, on the other hand, seem to really believe it's just a matter of "cut Fitz, play Geno" and we'd be 4-0 because everything else is perfect.

Sorry, everything else is not perfect.

Forte, as I've said, has been fine between the 20's.  He's just the wrong type of Back for a Fitz-led offense in the Red Zone.  And he lack of Red-Zone production outside the Buffalo game shows that, despite having plenty of opportunities.

There are other, major, issues.  The Pass D is amongst the worst int he NFL.  The Specials have given up 14 points and produced very little.  Running backs have multiple fumbles.  WR's are dropping catchable balls off their hands and chests more regularly than last year.

And, absolutely, Fitz is playing like sh*t.  Stinky, wet, slimy puppy sh*t after the puppy ate too many chocolate bars.

And he's earned being benched.  If Bowles chose to play Geno Sunday, I'd not like it, but I'd certainly understand it.  

If that's being a "Fitznutz", lol, ok. 

But we ignore the multi-faceting failings of 2016 so far at our own peril.  Because we've been very bad, at a LOT fo spots this year, and some of our moves have simply not gelled with what we're designed to do, or how Chan chooses to call it.