" Why Missing in the Second Round Has Hurt the Jets So Badly " ~ ~ ~

[kelly]

Earlier this week we took at look at recent Jets second round picks. The results were not pretty to say the least. It was probably no surprise to you to see how poorly the Jets have drafted in the second round in recent seasons. It is a frequent topic of conversation in the fanbase. I would like to talk a bit about why these poor results have been so damaging to the Jets. The failures of the second round have played no small role in the Jets' descent to the bottom of the league.

The best tool any team has to improve is the NFL Draft. There is not a steady supply of top level talent available in free agency. Even when a great player hits the open market, the Jets have to compete with other teams for that player's services.There is an additional financial component. As you probably know, there is a salary cap in the NFL. To field a 53 man roster, you can only afford so many expensive players. The Draft can be a big help for a team in bridging the financial/talent gap.

Leonard Williams, the Jets first round pick from two years ago, is a star level talent. He has already made the Pro Bowl, and he isn't even 23 years old yet. He is also a bargain.How much does it cost to have a star level 300 pound defensive lineman? The Jets gave us the answer a year ago when they agreed to a new deal with Muhammad Wilkerson. That contract costs the team over $17 million per season.How much does Williams cost the Jets? His cap number for 2017 is just over $5 million. Think about that. Williams costs less than one-third of what Wilkerson costs. That is because a player in the NFL has a limited earning power over the first four seasons of his career. He cannot hit the open market as an unrestricted free agent until after that fourth year. The fact the league has a wage scale for drafted players is the other reason for Williams' relative bargain status.

I understand Williams and Wilkerson are not the exact same player, but for the sake of our discussion let's agree there's enough overlap to justify the following statement. Having Williams essentially gives the Jets a second Wilkerson for $12 million less. You get around the same production as adding a star would, but you have an extra $12 million to spend to improve other parts of your team.There are other reasons drafting well is so important, but this is a big one. You can get top level talent for a fraction of the price it costs on the open market. That extra money can help improve other positions.As much of a bargain as Williams is, players drafted in the second round are even better value. The Jets took Devin Smith in the second round of the same Draft when they took Williams. Smith's cap number for 2017 is $1.6 million. If Williams is a discount at $5 million, what would a star be at $1.6 million ? And this is the problem. By striking out so much, the Jets have lost out on these types of savings.

Why focus on the second round? Aren't these super savings available in the third, fourth, and fifth rounds, and beyond? Sure, and the Jets' failure to hit in any round regularly has contributed to their current situation. The reason the second round is of particular focus, however, is because it is the spot in the Draft most likely to produce this type of super savings.This is a years old study, but the Cleveland Plain Dealer looked at the NFL for a decade stretch. 53% of All Pros were taken in the first round. These are bargain players for their rookie deals. 19% of All Pros were second round picks, though. That number fell to 12% in the third round and continued to go down further as the Drafts moved along.The second round is the sweet spot. It is the best chance to add special level talent at the salary level of a backup level player. I return to Devin Smith's deal. He will count less against the cap for the Jets than Josh Martin will in 2017. If Smith has a breakout year and turns into a star, think about the value. Think about the bargain the Jets would get with that type of on field value at that salary.

The flip side would be Smith having a bad training camp and joining the likes of Stephen Hill and Jace Amaro as recent second round cuts. Now think about the wasted opportunity that would be. The Jets have wasted almost all of those second round opportunities recently, and that has helped put them into the position they are in.

>     http://www.ganggreennation.com/2017/4/14/15299688/why-missing-in-the-second-round-has-hurt-the-jets-so-badly

[dbatesman]

It hasn't hurt us at all. They're 2nd round picks. The bust rate on them is higher than 50% unless you are taking guards or RTs.

[kelly]

NFL Draft : Will Mike Maccagnan snap Jets' streak of horrid 2nd-round picks ?

The Jets have been absolutely dreadful taking players in the second round of the NFL Draft. Is general manager Mike Maccagnan the guy to get them out of the rut ?

Will Maccagnan save the Jets ?

The Jets have had their issues in the NFL Draft. It's incredibly well documented. But even by their lowly standards, their second-round struggles are something else. Ever since finding linebacker David Harris in 2007, it has been one terrible selection after another. 

Here's quick trip down memory lane : 

• 2010: Vlad Ducasse, OT
• 2012: Stephen Hill, WR
• 2013: Geno Smith, QB
• 2014: Jace Amaro, TE
• 2015: Devin Smith, WR
• 2016: Christian Hackenberg, QB

The two most recent -- Smith and Hackenberg -- were selected by new-GM Mike Maccagnan. The early return on both hasn't been great. Smith, plagued by injuries, has 10 receptions in two seasons. Hackenberg didn't play last year, and the Jets are (apparently) looking for his replacement already.Maccagnan has been a professional scout his entire career -- beginning as an intern with the Redskins in 1990. From 2002 through 2014, he held prominent roles (coordinator of college scouting, assistant director of college scouting, director of college scouting) with the Texans. 

While Maccagnan didn't have the final say on who Houston drafted, his voice was undoubtedly heard. So we went back and looked at his history finding (or not finding) studs in the second round. 

Could this be the year the Jets finally don't screw it up ? History says ...

Saed Hindash

 

2002: Jabar Gaffney, Receiver

YEARS IN NFL: 11 (2002-2012)
MACCAGNAN POSITION: Coordinator of College Scouting
CAREER STATS: 447 catches | 5,690 yards | 24 TDs
BEST SEASON: 68 catches | 947 yards | 5 TDs (2011)

ANALYSIS: Jabar Gaffney had a long, relatively successful career in the NFL. He was a bit of a journeyman, though. He spent four years with the Texans, three with the Patriots, two with the Broncos, then one each with the Redskins and Dolphins. He was never an elite-level wideout, but a quality player. 

 

2002: Chester Pitts, Offensive tackle

YEARS IN NFL: 9 (2002-2009)
MACCAGNAN POSITION: Coordinator of College Scouting

ANALYSIS: Chester Pitts wasn't a bad player for the Texans. He started every game at guard from 2002 through 2008. He was never a Pro Bowler, but a quality guy for quite awhile. 

2003: Bennie Joppru, Tight end

YEARS IN NFL: 5 (2003-2007)
MACCAGNAN POSITION: Coordinator of College Scouting
CAREER STATS: 4 tackles
BEST SEASON: 3 tackles (2007)

ANALYSIS: A bit of a bust, Bennie Joppru never did much during his five-year NFL career. He was a solid special teams player, which kept him on rosters. But for a second-round pick, you expect more. 

2006: DeMeco Ryans, ILB

YEARS IN NFL: 10 (2006-2015)
MACCAGNAN POSITION: Coordinator of College Scouting
CAREER STATS: 971 tackles | 13.5 sacks | 7 FF | 10 FR | 7 INTs
BEST SEASON: 156 tackles, 3.5 sacks, FF, FR, INT (2006)
ACCOMPLISHMENTS: Defensive Rookie of the Year (2006), Pro Bowl (2007, 2009), All-Pro (2007)

ANALYSIS: DeMeco Ryans was a tremendous player in the NFL for quite some time, and one of the game's best linebackers. He spent the first six seasons of his career with the Texans. They traded him to the Eagles in 2012 after switching to a 3-4 defense. 

 

2009: Connor Barwin, OLB

YEARS IN NFL: 9 (2009-present)
MACCAGNAN POSITION: Coordinator of College Scouting
CAREER STATS: 320 tackles | 49.5 sacks | 6 FF | 3 FR
BEST SEASON: 64 tackles, 14.5 sacks, 2 FF (2014)
ACCOMPLISHMENTS: Pro Bowl (2014), second-team All-Pro (2014)

ANALYSIS: There's a reason Connor Barwin is still in the NFL. He's a great, all-around linebacker. He spent the first three years of his career with the Texans, then signed with the Eagles as a free agent in 2013. He's now with the Rams.

2010: Ben Tate, RB

YEARS IN NFL: 5 (2011-2014)
MACCAGNAN POSITION: Assistant Director of College Scouting
CAREER STATS: 540 carries | 2,363 yards | 14 TDs | 
BEST SEASON: 175 carries, 942 yards, 4 TDs (2011)

ANALYSIS: Ben Tate is a bit of an interesting player. He had serious success for three years as the complement to Arian Foster. When he got a chance to be the lead back after signing with the Browns as a free agent in 2014, he struggled. Immensely.Tate started the season as the No. 1 back, lost playing time, grew frustrated and was then released. He was claimed by the Vikings, but then they cut him after three games. He then spent a hot minute with the Steelers after they lost Le'Veon Bell to injury. 

Surprisingly, Tate hasn't caught on with a team since. 

 

2011: Brooks Reed, OLB

YEARS IN NFL: 7 (2011-present)
MACCAGNAN POSITION: Director of College Scouting
CAREER STATS: 211 tackles | 16.5 sacks | 2 FF | 2 FR
BEST SEASON: 56 tackles, 3 sacks (2013)

ANALYSIS: Brooks Reed is a solid player in the NFL. After four years in Houston, he signed a five-year, $22 million contract with the Falcons in 2015. He's a rotational linebacker on Dan Quinn's defense. 

2011: Brandon Harris, CB

YEARS IN NFL: 4 (2011-2014)
MACCAGNAN POSITION: Director of College Scouting
CAREER STATS: 48 tackles
BEST SEASON: 20 tackles (2013)

 ANALYSIS: Brandon Harris never really developed for the Texans, and they let him go after the 2013 season. He spent one year with the Titans, but hasn't played since 2014. In 42 career games, he doesn't have an interception. 

2013: D.J. Swearinger, S

YEARS IN NFL: 5 (2013-present)
MACCAGNAN POSITION: Director of College Scouting
CAREER STATS: 230 tackles | 3 sacks | 6 INTs
BEST SEASON: 74 tackles, 1 sack, 3 FF, 2 INTs (2014)

ANALYSIS: Swearinger is still in the NFL, but has bounced around quite a bit. He spent the first two years of his career with the Texans, then 2015 with the Bucs and Cardinals. He's currently with the Redskins.Swearinger's biggest issue has been playing within the rules. He has been involved in some dirty hits during his career. 

2014: Xavier Su'a-Filo, OG

YEARS IN NFL: 4 (2014-present)
MACCAGNAN POSITION: Director of College Scouting

ANALYSIS: Xavier Su'a-Filo hasn't really panned out for the Texans yet. He started one game as a rookie, nine in 2015 and 15 last season ... but hasn't made an impact. He had a PFF rating of 57 last year, 57th among qualifying guards. 

>      http://www.nj.com/jets/index.ssf/2017/04/nfl_draft_will_mike_maccagnan_snap_jets_horrid_str.html#incart_river_index

[T0mShane]

Quote

Now think about the wasted opportunity that would be

yes just think about it

[joewilly12]

Missing in the first round has hurt us more. 

[j4jets]

35 minutes ago, dbatesman said:

It hasn't hurt us at all. They're 2nd round picks. The bust rate on them is higher than 50% unless you are taking guards or RTs.

Our bust rate in last 10 years? 90%. Im putting Hack n devin in the bust column until proven otherwise. And all that with the Jets generally picking in the top half of 2nd rounds. The main problem is, we haven't had a 2nd rounder that has had even average play in the last 9 years. I'm not talking Pro bowl. I'm talking maybe even just good depth player. None. That's very shocking to go 9 years in a row on such a drought for high 2nd round picks. And what's worse is we spent those picks on positions you'd expect some return in. WRs, TE, G. Stephen Hill peaked his career in his first career game. Devin Smith? So far he's worse than Hill. Amaro? Ducasse? Meh. I'd give them a pass on 2nd round QBs though. 

[j4jets]

22 minutes ago, joewilly12 said:

Missing in the first round has hurt us more. 

Our first rounds haven't been that bad at all. Kyle Wilson, Ghost and Dee Milliner were the worst. Others have contributed plenty

[j4jets]

45 minutes ago, kelly said:

NFL Draft : Will Mike Maccagnan snap Jets' streak of horrid 2nd-round picks ?

The Jets have been absolutely dreadful taking players in the second round of the NFL Draft. Is general manager Mike Maccagnan the guy to get them out of the rut ?

Will Maccagnan save the Jets ?

The Jets have had their issues in the NFL Draft. It's incredibly well documented. But even by their lowly standards, their second-round struggles are something else. Ever since finding linebacker David Harris in 2007, it has been one terrible selection after another. 

Here's quick trip down memory lane : 

• 2010: Vlad Ducasse, OT
• 2012: Stephen Hill, WR
• 2013: Geno Smith, QB
• 2014: Jace Amaro, TE
• 2015: Devin Smith, WR
• 2016: Christian Hackenberg, QB

The two most recent -- Smith and Hackenberg -- were selected by new-GM Mike Maccagnan. The early return on both hasn't been great. Smith, plagued by injuries, has 10 receptions in two seasons. Hackenberg didn't play last year, and the Jets are (apparently) looking for his replacement already.Maccagnan has been a professional scout his entire career -- beginning as an intern with the Redskins in 1990. From 2002 through 2014, he held prominent roles (coordinator of college scouting, assistant director of college scouting, director of college scouting) with the Texans. 

While Maccagnan didn't have the final say on who Houston drafted, his voice was undoubtedly heard. So we went back and looked at his history finding (or not finding) studs in the second round. 

Could this be the year the Jets finally don't screw it up ? History says ...

Saed Hindash

 

2002: Jabar Gaffney, Receiver

YEARS IN NFL: 11 (2002-2012)
MACCAGNAN POSITION: Coordinator of College Scouting
CAREER STATS: 447 catches | 5,690 yards | 24 TDs
BEST SEASON: 68 catches | 947 yards | 5 TDs (2011)

ANALYSIS: Jabar Gaffney had a long, relatively successful career in the NFL. He was a bit of a journeyman, though. He spent four years with the Texans, three with the Patriots, two with the Broncos, then one each with the Redskins and Dolphins. He was never an elite-level wideout, but a quality player. 

 

2002: Chester Pitts, Offensive tackle

YEARS IN NFL: 9 (2002-2009)
MACCAGNAN POSITION: Coordinator of College Scouting

ANALYSIS: Chester Pitts wasn't a bad player for the Texans. He started every game at guard from 2002 through 2008. He was never a Pro Bowler, but a quality guy for quite awhile. 

2003: Bennie Joppru, Tight end

YEARS IN NFL: 5 (2003-2007)
MACCAGNAN POSITION: Coordinator of College Scouting
CAREER STATS: 4 tackles
BEST SEASON: 3 tackles (2007)

ANALYSIS: A bit of a bust, Bennie Joppru never did much during his five-year NFL career. He was a solid special teams player, which kept him on rosters. But for a second-round pick, you expect more. 

2006: DeMeco Ryans, ILB

YEARS IN NFL: 10 (2006-2015)
MACCAGNAN POSITION: Coordinator of College Scouting
CAREER STATS: 971 tackles | 13.5 sacks | 7 FF | 10 FR | 7 INTs
BEST SEASON: 156 tackles, 3.5 sacks, FF, FR, INT (2006)
ACCOMPLISHMENTS: Defensive Rookie of the Year (2006), Pro Bowl (2007, 2009), All-Pro (2007)

ANALYSIS: DeMeco Ryans was a tremendous player in the NFL for quite some time, and one of the game's best linebackers. He spent the first six seasons of his career with the Texans. They traded him to the Eagles in 2012 after switching to a 3-4 defense. 

 

2009: Connor Barwin, OLB

YEARS IN NFL: 9 (2009-present)
MACCAGNAN POSITION: Coordinator of College Scouting
CAREER STATS: 320 tackles | 49.5 sacks | 6 FF | 3 FR
BEST SEASON: 64 tackles, 14.5 sacks, 2 FF (2014)
ACCOMPLISHMENTS: Pro Bowl (2014), second-team All-Pro (2014)

ANALYSIS: There's a reason Connor Barwin is still in the NFL. He's a great, all-around linebacker. He spent the first three years of his career with the Texans, then signed with the Eagles as a free agent in 2013. He's now with the Rams.

2010: Ben Tate, RB

YEARS IN NFL: 5 (2011-2014)
MACCAGNAN POSITION: Assistant Director of College Scouting
CAREER STATS: 540 carries | 2,363 yards | 14 TDs | 
BEST SEASON: 175 carries, 942 yards, 4 TDs (2011)

ANALYSIS: Ben Tate is a bit of an interesting player. He had serious success for three years as the complement to Arian Foster. When he got a chance to be the lead back after signing with the Browns as a free agent in 2014, he struggled. Immensely.Tate started the season as the No. 1 back, lost playing time, grew frustrated and was then released. He was claimed by the Vikings, but then they cut him after three games. He then spent a hot minute with the Steelers after they lost Le'Veon Bell to injury. 

Surprisingly, Tate hasn't caught on with a team since. 

 

2011: Brooks Reed, OLB

YEARS IN NFL: 7 (2011-present)
MACCAGNAN POSITION: Director of College Scouting
CAREER STATS: 211 tackles | 16.5 sacks | 2 FF | 2 FR
BEST SEASON: 56 tackles, 3 sacks (2013)

ANALYSIS: Brooks Reed is a solid player in the NFL. After four years in Houston, he signed a five-year, $22 million contract with the Falcons in 2015. He's a rotational linebacker on Dan Quinn's defense. 

2011: Brandon Harris, CB

YEARS IN NFL: 4 (2011-2014)
MACCAGNAN POSITION: Director of College Scouting
CAREER STATS: 48 tackles
BEST SEASON: 20 tackles (2013)

 ANALYSIS: Brandon Harris never really developed for the Texans, and they let him go after the 2013 season. He spent one year with the Titans, but hasn't played since 2014. In 42 career games, he doesn't have an interception. 

2013: D.J. Swearinger, S

YEARS IN NFL: 5 (2013-present)
MACCAGNAN POSITION: Director of College Scouting
CAREER STATS: 230 tackles | 3 sacks | 6 INTs
BEST SEASON: 74 tackles, 1 sack, 3 FF, 2 INTs (2014)

ANALYSIS: Swearinger is still in the NFL, but has bounced around quite a bit. He spent the first two years of his career with the Texans, then 2015 with the Bucs and Cardinals. He's currently with the Redskins.Swearinger's biggest issue has been playing within the rules. He has been involved in some dirty hits during his career. 

2014: Xavier Su'a-Filo, OG

YEARS IN NFL: 4 (2014-present)
MACCAGNAN POSITION: Director of College Scouting

ANALYSIS: Xavier Su'a-Filo hasn't really panned out for the Texans yet. He started one game as a rookie, nine in 2015 and 15 last season ... but hasn't made an impact. He had a PFF rating of 57 last year, 57th among qualifying guards. 

>      http://www.nj.com/jets/index.ssf/2017/04/nfl_draft_will_mike_maccagnan_snap_jets_horrid_str.html#incart_river_index

In short, Mac hasn't found a solid talent in the 2nd round as a director of scouting. Great. We haven't missed a beat then. 

[ASH1962]

So we sucked last year because he picked a QB who nobody on this Earth knows can play or not, but not because the HC plays players out of position constantly, cannot game plan to save his shrimp boat ass, never ever takes advantage of opponents weaknesses, oh, lol, and kicks FG's behind by 60 points.

I get you.

[joewilly12]

18 minutes ago, j4jets said:

union Our first rounds haven't been that bad at all. Kyle Wilson, Ghost and Dee Milliner were the worst. Others have contributed plenty

Quinton Coples,Russell Carter,Dewayne Robertson,Dave Cadigan,Ron Faurot,Johny Mitchell,Kyle brady,Roger Vick,Lam Jones and Blair Thomas all say hello. 

[T0mShane]

15 minutes ago, ASH1962 said:

So we sucked last year because he picked a QB who nobody on this Earth knows can play or not, but not because the HC plays players out of position constantly, cannot game plan to save his shrimp boat ass, never ever takes advantage of opponents weaknesses, oh, lol, and kicks FG's behind by 60 points.

I get you.

Bowles sucks, but that's got nothing to do with Hack and Devin Smith being bad picks. Maccagnan is reeeeeally close to being up there on the griddle.

[dbatesman]

47 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

Bowles sucks, but that's got nothing to do with Hack and Devin Smith being bad picks. Maccagnan is reeeeeally close to being up there on the griddle.

He was on the griddle the second Goodell said got to the R in "Christian." He's a complete boob.

[thadude]

A blind 5 year old girl picking at random would have a better track record than our last 3 General Managers

[Lil Woody]

50 minutes ago, thadude said:

A blind 5 year old girl picking at random would have a better track record than our last 3 General Managers

That's the issue. It's not one pick or what round it's the fact that our scouting department has been horrible for so long and misses so often. Just more evidence that our owner has no idea how to run an organization. 

 

4 hours ago, dbatesman said:

It hasn't hurt us at all. They're 2nd round picks. The bust rate on them is higher than 50% unless you are taking guards or RTs.

Are you missing the point on purpose, just so you can be a snarky twitter style douche - or - do you really not see the difference between failing consistently year over year vs using a single 2nd rounder on a QB and then complaining about the pick being wasted? 

[JetsFanatic]

We don't know if Devin Smith & Chistian Hackenberg are bad picks yet.

[joewilly12]

[sourceworx]

4 hours ago, j4jets said:

Our first rounds haven't been that bad at all. Kyle Wilson, Ghost and Dee Milliner were the worst. Others have contributed plenty

Add Calvin Pryor to that list. The guy sucks. 

[joewilly12]

7 minutes ago, sourceworx said:

Add Calvin Pryor to that list. The guy sucks. 

Not yet....Gilchrist is the one who sucks let Pryor play his natural position and he improves if only Bowles and Rodgers had a clue. 

[sourceworx]

8 minutes ago, joewilly12 said:

Not yet....Gilchrist is the one who sucks let Pryor play his natural position and he improves if only Bowles and Rodgers had a clue. 

Calvin Pryor: The defense's version of Geno Smith. 

[Lil Woody]

3 minutes ago, joewilly12 said:

Not yet....Gilchrist is the one who sucks let Pryor play his natural position and he improves if only Bowles and Rodgers had a clue. 

Pryor doesn't suck. He was just way overdrafted. Kid can play well in a very specific role, but he's not a great player by any stretch. Certainly not what you would expect from a 1st rounder. We took a box SS in the 1st round in an era that requires 2 safeties with range to be able to flip responsibilities and now the fans are blaming the player for not being a rangy ballhawking FS. Well duh. But let's make the exact same mistake with Adams.  He'll be very good, he'll be a great upgrade over Pryor.  But he more than likely won't become our version of Earl Thomas. And then all the people demanding we take him will be the ones damning him and everyone else involved in the pick for picking a SS at 6 overall.

 

[rangerous]

4 hours ago, joewilly12 said:

Quinton Coples,Russell Carter,Dewayne Robertson,Dave Cadigan,Ron Faurot,Johny Mitchell,Kyle brady,Roger Vick,Lam Jones and Blair Thomas all say hello. 

in all fairness we really need to stick with the most recent 10 years or so. they have probably been around average in the first round but positively putrid in the 2nd. if smith and hack (or actually either one for that matter) mac will have reversed the second round jinx.

[rangerous]

1 minute ago, Lil Woody said:

Pryor doesn't suck. He was just way overdrafted. Kid can play well in a very specific role, but he's not a great player by any stretch. Certainly not what you would expect from a 1st rounder. We took a box SS in the 1st round in an era that requires 2 safeties with range to be able to flip responsibilities and now the fans are blaming the player for not being a rangy ballhawking FS. Well duh. But let's make the exact same mistake with Adams.  He'll be very good, he'll be a great upgrade over Pryor.  But he more than likely won't become our version of Earl Thomas. And then all the people demanding we take him will be the ones damning him and everyone else involved in the pick for picking a SS at 6 overall.

 

i tend to agree that pryor has been misused.  in 2015 you could argue that pryor really helped the defense run.  when he was out there was a noticeable let down.  last season? man where do you start.  imo pryor was one of the malcontents in shelly's camp and it affected his play. enough to the point where the jets probably won't exercise their 5th year option.

[Lil Woody]

14 minutes ago, rangerous said:

i tend to agree that pryor has been misused.  in 2015 you could argue that pryor really helped the defense run.  when he was out there was a noticeable let down.  last season? man where do you start.  imo pryor was one of the malcontents in shelly's camp and it affected his play. enough to the point where the jets probably won't exercise their 5th year option.

Yeah I find it hard to say players lacked talent from what we saw during last years games. They quit on the field. It's not a question of talent, it's a question of heart and leadership. Our franchise stopped worrying about if the players they were selecting have the guts to play the game.  Our players are a sad pathetic group with zero heart. That's institutional at this point. Without an ownership change, I don't see that ever changing for us.  I can't stand Bowles and I fault him greatly for his inability to manage his own lockerroom, but I also recognize that we don't have any real leaders on this team and there is very little pride on display. Even if we had General Patton out there I doubt it would result in much better results.

[bealeb319]

Our bust rate in last 10 years? 90%. Im putting Hack n devin in the bust column until proven otherwise. And all that with the Jets generally picking in the top half of 2nd rounds. The main problem is, we haven't had a 2nd rounder that has had even average play in the last 9 years. I'm not talking Pro bowl. I'm talking maybe even just good depth player. None. That's very shocking to go 9 years in a row on such a drought for high 2nd round picks. And what's worse is we spent those picks on positions you'd expect some return in. WRs, TE, G. Stephen Hill peaked his career in his first career game. Devin Smith? So far he's worse than Hill. Amaro? Ducasse? Meh. I'd give them a pass on 2nd round QBs though. 

Hack and smith busts already...do you have whoever we take in the second round this year and next year there? Hack hasn't even seen an NFL snap we know what one preseason quarter and what a media the hates our team has fabricated about him? Rediculous.

Sent from my LG-D850 using Tapatalk

[joewilly12]

2 hours ago, rangerous said:

in all fairness we really need to stick with the most recent 10 years or so. they have probably been around average in the first round but positively putrid in the 2nd. if smith and hack (or actually either one for that matter) mac will have reversed the second round jinx.

No fairness we haven't we won Jack sh*t since 1968................

[Warfish]

9 hours ago, dbatesman said:

It hasn't hurt us at all. They're 2nd round picks. The bust rate on them is higher than 50% unless you are taking guards or RTs.

If the bust rate is ~50%, then our bust rate of 100% IS in fact a factor in our flailing talent pool.

• 2010: Vlad Ducasse, OT Bust
• 2012: Stephen Hill, WR Bust
• 2013: Geno Smith, QB Bust
• 2014: Jace Amaro, TE Bust
• 2015: Devin Smith, WR Bust so Far
• 2016: Christian Hackenberg, QB Bust so Far
•  
•  
•  
• Thats a goodly portion of years and not one decent starter int he group as yet.

[tuffhand]

5 hours ago, joewilly12 said:

Not yet....Gilchrist is the one who sucks let Pryor play his natural position and he improves if only Bowles and Rodgers had a clue. 

So you're saying that there is no chance Pryor improves.

[phill1c]

Yeah, I see improvement in Pryor. I also believe that if you don't have a good FS your whole back end is compromised. I'd like to see the Jets get a good FS to see how Pryor plays.

I definitely think he has the talent to improve.

[rangerous]

22 hours ago, joewilly12 said:

No fairness we haven't we won Jack sh*t since 1968................

well yeah, but there are different eras and the biggest reason is that any really good drafted players could still be on the team and playing at a high level.

[joewilly12]

58 minutes ago, rangerous said:

well yeah, but there are different eras and the biggest reason is that any really good drafted players could still be on the team and playing at a high level.

Many picks should be winning us games this season, but they are no longer in the NFL. 

[RoadFan]

On 04/15/2017 at 9:29 AM, dbatesman said:

It hasn't hurt us at all. They're 2nd round picks. The bust rate on them is higher than 50% unless you are taking guards or RTs.

I haven't been around much lately.   But now my last two post have been quoting you;  and how vehemently I disagree with your opinions.

Who in their right mind believes missing badly on basically every 2nd round pick except for David Harris doesn't hurt a franchise? 

The Jets haven't even drafted serviceable players in the 2nd round.  Virtually all were useless stiffs that should have been out of the league by year two or three...

Devin Smith and Hackenberg are next...

 

[RoadFan]

21 hours ago, phill1c said:

Yeah, I see improvement in Pryor. I also believe that if you don't have a good FS your whole back end is compromised. I'd like to see the Jets get a good FS to see how Pryor plays.

I definitely think he has the talent to improve.

Pryor is worthless. 

[j4jets]

On 4/15/2017 at 1:56 PM, sourceworx said:

Calvin Pryor: The defense's version of Geno Smith. 

That got a few people hard

[j4jets]

On 4/15/2017 at 9:37 AM, joewilly12 said:

Quinton Coples,Russell Carter,Dewayne Robertson,Dave Cadigan,Ron Faurot,Johny Mitchell,Kyle brady,Roger Vick,Lam Jones and Blair Thomas all say hello. 

In the last decade? Im sure you can compile that list for every single NFL team. 

[joewilly12]

1 hour ago, j4jets said:

In the last decade? Im sure you can compile that list for every single NFL team. 

I dont care what other teams do or dont do I only care about the Jets this is about the Jets.