Matt39 Posted June 21, 2005 Share Posted June 21, 2005 Most overrated player in New York? Since its SOOO popular to bash certain Yankees for being overpaid and overrated, I'd thought I'd have some fun. Beltran's been a bum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Troll Posted June 21, 2005 Share Posted June 21, 2005 Wishful thinking, but Beltran can't come in for 3 months and steal the title that Derek Jeter has worked 10 years to earn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jet/BosoxFan Posted June 21, 2005 Share Posted June 21, 2005 DAMNIT!!! I was gonna say that 'til the Troll beat me to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
124 Posted June 21, 2005 Share Posted June 21, 2005 Beltran Sucks. Playoff hero, nothing more. Gotta love the .268 BA, gotta love it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt39 Posted June 21, 2005 Author Share Posted June 21, 2005 Wishful thinking, but Beltran can't come in for 3 months and steal the title that Derek Jeter has worked 10 years to earn. yeah, along with some pretty nice jewelry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Troll Posted June 21, 2005 Share Posted June 21, 2005 yeah, along with some pretty nice jewelry Robert Horry is about to get his sixth ring. Does that make him one of the best forwards of all-time? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt39 Posted June 21, 2005 Author Share Posted June 21, 2005 Robert Horry is about to get his sixth ring. Does that make him one of the best forwards of all-time? I don't consider Jeter one of the great short stops of all time. But Horry is easily a top 5 clutch player of all time. The best? No. Nasty when it counts? Yes. You can say the same about Jeter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Troll Posted June 21, 2005 Share Posted June 21, 2005 No, Horry actually IS clutch. I used Horry as an example because he's won so many championships, but has never even been close to being the best player on his team. Jeter is like Robert Horry, without the whole "clutchness" thing. If Jeter was actually clutch, he wouldnt always seem to make the final out against teams like the Brewers and Devil Rays. It also wouldn't have taken him a DECADE to hit a grand slam. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt39 Posted June 21, 2005 Author Share Posted June 21, 2005 No, Horry actually IS clutch. I used Horry as an example because he's won so many championships, but has never even been close to being the best player on his team. Jeter is like Robert Horry, without the whole "clutchness" thing. If Jeter was actually clutch, he wouldnt always seem to make the final out against teams like the Brewers and Devil Rays. It also wouldn't have taken him a DECADE to hit a grand slam. Please with the grand slam argument. I know you're smarter than that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Troll Posted June 21, 2005 Share Posted June 21, 2005 Please with the grand slam argument. I know you're smarter than that. Apparently, I am not smarter than that. I'd like an answer. How is it possible that the "most clutch player" in the majors was also the same person that had gotten the most number of bases loaded at bats without hitting a grand slam? Doesn't seem to make a whole lot of sense to me. Guess I'm just stupid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jet/BosoxFan Posted June 21, 2005 Share Posted June 21, 2005 Can we expect Robert Horry to host SNL anytime soon? Will he be in every G'damn commercial on every channel at any given time anytime soon? Will people call him the next Michael Jordan with the same frequency that they call Jetes the next Mickey Mantle anytime soon??? Jeter is WAY more overrated than Beltran! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomShane Posted June 21, 2005 Share Posted June 21, 2005 What were ARod's numbers 60 games in in his first season in NY? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stormshadow19 Posted June 21, 2005 Share Posted June 21, 2005 Can we expect Robert Horry to host SNL anytime soon? Who needs to host SNL? Horry was tha bomb in Men in Black! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt39 Posted June 21, 2005 Author Share Posted June 21, 2005 What were ARod's numbers 60 games in in his first season in NY? Better than Beltrans. "Deez d NEw MeSS" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GimmeShelter Posted June 21, 2005 Share Posted June 21, 2005 Beltran is hurt and it shows in his stats. That said, He'd look good in center for the Yankees. He put up numbers last year Capt overated only dreams about. He would have to go into a coma to wrestle the award away from Randy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GimmeShelter Posted June 21, 2005 Share Posted June 21, 2005 I don't consider Jeter one of the great short stops of all time. But Horry is easily a top 5 clutch player of all time. The best? No. Nasty when it counts? Yes. You can say the same about Jeter. You need to go look at the Capt clutch thread where that assumption is totally put to rest on Derek. It is simply not true and the numbers in that thread prove it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt39 Posted June 21, 2005 Author Share Posted June 21, 2005 Ah the Mets. The highest paid team in the NL, but they aren't looking to compete this year. They're still a few years away. I just don't get this logic. I'm not one to bash the Mets either. Hey, there are two crappy teams in NY. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackout Posted June 22, 2005 Share Posted June 22, 2005 beltran and randy johnson have both been major dissapointments beltrans hitting .265 with 8 hrs in well over 200 ABs randys 7-6 with an ERA over 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barton Posted June 22, 2005 Share Posted June 22, 2005 Apparently, I am not smarter than that. I'd like an answer. How is it possible that the "most clutch player" in the majors was also the same person that had gotten the most number of bases loaded at bats without hitting a grand slam? Doesn't seem to make a whole lot of sense to me. Guess I'm just stupid. Are you frickin serious with that grand slam comment? Jeter goes in full out contact mode with the bases loaded And his .340 career average with the bases loaded proves that, so stfu about this you're point makes no sense. I think you're joking, but I'm not sure. Thats how stupid you sound right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stormshadow19 Posted June 22, 2005 Share Posted June 22, 2005 Thats how stupid you sound right now. Hello pot, meet the Kettle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T-Mac Posted June 22, 2005 Share Posted June 22, 2005 Shea Stadium tends to do that to your B.A., but he is a slight disappointment. The only thing that takes our mind off this mediocre overpaid team is the doubly overpaid mediocre team across the bay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jet/BosoxFan Posted June 22, 2005 Share Posted June 22, 2005 Since his fastball is no longer intimidating, I think Randy Johnson would be better served if he grew back his late 90's skullet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barton Posted June 22, 2005 Share Posted June 22, 2005 BTW, Beltran will be fine, he'll improve. He's just struggling right now, not a big deal. That being said, his contract was a big time joke, he didn't deserve that much at all. He had a great postseason and a just solid season (batting average) He's not the games best player like john kruk and all the baseball tonight fools were saying last year. He's not even the best centerfielder in the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barton Posted June 22, 2005 Share Posted June 22, 2005 Hello pot, meet the Kettle. Hey maxman, what are you doing hacking into stormshadows account?!?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Troll Posted June 22, 2005 Share Posted June 22, 2005 Are you frickin serious with that grand slam comment? Jeter goes in full out contact mode with the bases loaded And his .340 career average with the bases loaded proves that, so stfu about this you're point makes no sense. I think you're joking, but I'm not sure. Thats how stupid you sound right now. Where do you get these stats from? Do you just make them up as you go along? I'm having a hard time wondering how it's even possible for a person to hit .340 over the course of over 130 at bats and not once leave the yard. If that is true, then it proves that BoSox has been right all along, and Jeter is nothing more than a slap singles hitter. A fraction of the talent of Ichiro, quadruple the hype!! Oh, BTW, here is a stat for you. This season, Jeter is hitting .228 with runners in scoring position. And with RISP with 2 outs...Captain Clutch STEPS IT UP to a whopping .212! YEAH!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GimmeShelter Posted June 22, 2005 Share Posted June 22, 2005 In his entire post-season career, a total of 99 games spread over eight seasons, Derek Jeter is a .210/.355/.306 hitter with runners in scoring position and a .245/.345/.329 hitter with men on base. Take that and add in the fact that, over the last four post-seasons, he is a .176/.263/.323 hitter in "close and late" situations, and I think it is safe to say that hearing Jeter constantly being hailed as "Mr. Clutch" is completely unjustified. Only in NY Kids. :wink: A good player that plays the game the right way and for that the media and Yankee PR machine has pushed his supposed rank among the games best to another level by attaching labels that don't hold up when you actually look at the stats. Don't wanna hear about intangibles either. Anyone can greet the likes of ARod-Sheff-Matsui at the dugout steps after they homer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faba Posted June 22, 2005 Share Posted June 22, 2005 Beltran- the mets were in a position to have to overpay for him- just like with Pedro to show some legimiticy to the fans and media to try to turn things around for this franchise. Beltran is a good all around player- no one I know was ever comparing him as the best in the game. Given time I am confident he will give better results- and he is here for the long term since he is still young as opposed to a 34-35 year over the hill guy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shawn306 Posted June 22, 2005 Share Posted June 22, 2005 Beltran is just another victim of the unable to adjust to NY spotlight his first year there. It is amazing when you look at the names of the guys who have come to either the Yankees or the Mets and struggled their first year. Mets Beltran Cameron Glavine Alomar Vaughn Kaz Yankees Giambi Johnson A-Rod Clemens Weaver Vazquez Some guys are able to bounce back. (Clemens, A-Rod, Cameron ?) Others end up getting eaten up. (Weaver, Alomar, Vazquez, Kaz ?) Is it the pressure of playing in New York ? Are these guys just uncomfortable going from having to talk to maybe one or two sportwriters to 15 ? Do you wonder why alot of them don't even listen to sports talk radio ? I always thought this to be hogwash but when you look at the names it starts to make you wonder. You also come to appricate more what guys like Piazza, or now Pedro have done. If anything Pedro has taken his game back up to where it was when he was the one of the if not the best pitcher in baseball in the late 90's. As far as Beltran is concerned. He may struggle this year. He is though going to be the face of the franchise and with youth on his side I think he will be fine. If he were playing in the Bronx though they would be all over him the same way they are all over Johnson right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barton Posted June 22, 2005 Share Posted June 22, 2005 Where do you get these stats from? Do you just make them up as you go along? I'm having a hard time wondering how it's even possible for a person to hit .340 over the course of over 130 at bats and not once leave the yard. If that is true, then it proves that BoSox has been right all along, and Jeter is nothing more than a slap singles hitter. A fraction of the talent of Ichiro, quadruple the hype!! Oh, BTW, here is a stat for you. This season, Jeter is hitting .228 with runners in scoring position. And with RISP with 2 outs...Captain Clutch STEPS IT UP to a whopping .212! YEAH!!! I'll take a .340 average, over a .250 average with 2 grand slams. cmon troll, you're smarter than this. And lets wait till the end of the season to talk about jeters average with RISP. And when the team is losing and there are RISP, thats when the clutch factor comes in, not when the Yankees are up by 5 and Jeters up with RISP, it doesn't even matter at that point. So find me a stat where it shows Jeters average with RISP when the team is losing and I guarantee it warrants his "clutch" label. Clutch is not all about hitting with RISP, its start rallys too and Jeter is great at doing that. Stop clinging to the "no home run in 130 at bats so he's not clutch", its really stupid when I tell you he has a top 10 MLB average with the bases loaded and you tell me thats not good and he's not clutch. Not making sense troll. And honestly, I'm sick of arguing over this bullcrap. I don't give a s*** if a cubs and a mets fan don't think he's clutch, they don't even watch him on a daily basis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Latinlawyer Posted June 22, 2005 Share Posted June 22, 2005 Most overrated player in New York? Since its SOOO popular to bash certain Yankees for being overpaid and overrated, I'd thought I'd have some fun. Beltran's been a bum. Oh Matt, young padawan...you have much to learn in regards to the Force... Beltran has been injured. He has the tools....youare probably still bitter that you have no real CF and instead your team has to rely WOE-MACK to move from 2b to LF and Matsui to patrol the CF. To say Beltran is the most over rated...you must be running out of things to deflect attention from your 200 million dollar joke. LL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MasonJet Posted June 22, 2005 Share Posted June 22, 2005 Wishful thinking, but Beltran can't come in for 3 months and steal the title that Derek Jeter has worked 10 years to earn. The same Jeter who had 5 hits last night? And when you say his title, I'm assuming you mean his title as one of the most clutch players in baseball and what every baseball player should strive to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MasonJet Posted June 22, 2005 Share Posted June 22, 2005 No, Horry actually IS clutch. I used Horry as an example because he's won so many championships, but has never even been close to being the best player on his team. Jeter is like Robert Horry, without the whole "clutchness" thing. If Jeter was actually clutch, he wouldnt always seem to make the final out against teams like the Brewers and Devil Rays. It also wouldn't have taken him a DECADE to hit a grand slam. Wow, grand slam. How incredibly lame. I have no problem with not hitting any grandslams considering he hits like .335 w/the bases juiced anyway. By the way, Jason Varitek may be on the top of that list now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MasonJet Posted June 22, 2005 Share Posted June 22, 2005 Where do you get these stats from? Do you just make them up as you go along? I'm having a hard time wondering how it's even possible for a person to hit .340 over the course of over 130 at bats and not once leave the yard. If that is true, then it proves that BoSox has been right all along, and Jeter is nothing more than a slap singles hitter. A fraction of the talent of Ichiro, quadruple the hype!! Wow. That's all I can say really. My guess is he gets those stats from every time that Jeter comes up with the bases loaded and it shows him having like a .335-.340 average. It shows he's not just looking to hit the ball into New Jersey every time he comes up with the bases loaded, and will gladly take a single which will usually drive in 2 runs. The pathetic things people come up with to bash Jeter. I'd much rather have Jose Reyes or Nomar Glassiaparra. Do you honestly think there's a GM in the world who wouldn't absolutely love to have Jeter on their team? I sure think the Cubs would, considering the "great" shortstop they got can't run to 1st without hurting his vagina. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted June 22, 2005 Share Posted June 22, 2005 The same Jeter who had 5 hits last night? It's the ******* DEVIL RAYS! I could get a couple of hits against their pitching, especially in a game like last night. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GimmeShelter Posted June 22, 2005 Share Posted June 22, 2005 The same Jeter who had 5 hits last night? And when you say his title, I'm assuming you mean his title as one of the most clutch players in baseball and what every baseball player should strive to be. Jeter is not a top clutch player. Look it up. That is a media (led by Tim McCarver) made up title. Jeter is a very good player. The notion that he hits in the clutch is bogus. Look it up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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