Irish Jet Posted February 23, 2008 Share Posted February 23, 2008 The scenario sounds good. We need an every down NT though and Rogers would be a question mark in his current shape. I'm just saying we can't get him, pay him and let him get all fat. Pouha and Mosley? They blow. According to you guys DRob is the source of all that is evil on the Jets yet their two sorry asses barely make the field. When the do they rarely produce. I have yet to see Mosley play one successful snap as a 2 gap NT. Mosley has only shown promise shooting the gap. Pouha? The guy has done nothing but suck ass and/or sit on the IR since he got here. He spent about three games not completely sucking at the end of last year and we are all excited. The nose is by himself every play. How good the starting NT has no bearing on the backups. Unless it means he could be out there extra snaps. Neither of them is giving DRob a decent break and he's the one who is supposedly undersized and getting worn down. Rogers will have to perform for well more than half the snaps on the Jets to be of any real value. I don't have anything against getting the guy, I just feel that if he lets himself go and tub up he'll end up being useless to us. It's nice to say that blubber is an advantage for a nose, but if that were he case there would be more successful NTs. Lord knows there are enough fat people. The guy will have to perform and have some endurance or we'll be in a worse situation than with DRob. LOL, not all of the 360lbs is fat you know. Even if he's not in great physical condition he would still be incredibly useful on running downs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raffyD Posted February 23, 2008 Share Posted February 23, 2008 That is the type of guy I want playing nose for the Jets. 6' 4", 340 lbs and 28 years old. I don't have any reservations about this guy at all. Let's get him, have him play first and second downs with a breather for 3rd and passing situations. He can be the fat plug in the middle for 5-10 years if he takes care of himself properly. I realize that last thing I said is the reason some don't want him but I think he would help out our defense immensely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted February 23, 2008 Share Posted February 23, 2008 LOL, not all of the 360lbs is fat you know. Even if he's not in great physical condition he would still be incredibly useful on running downs. I understand he doesn't have to be all muscle. I'm not that worried about doing this kind of deal. Vilma and our #2 is probably too steep for me though. I'm just saying that the guy carries the rap of being fat and lazy. It's something they'll have to deal with. Saying he could get as fat as he wants because he's at NT is not correct. A part time nose that can only play on select downs is not going to help us that much because we don't have anything else. Maybe if we could pull Red or Rubin in the draft, but we have lots of other needs too. If we get this guy we need him all in and working hard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InstantClassic Posted February 23, 2008 Share Posted February 23, 2008 Per King..he could be had for a 4th! I think it'll be interesting to see what, if anything, the Lions will be able to get in trade for Shaun Rogers, the defensive tackle who plays at a high level when he feels like it. The Lions want him gone; he's not a Rod Marinelli high-motor kind of guy. He'll probably be fire-sold for a fourth-rounder, or something in that neighborhood, around draft day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greenseed3 Posted February 23, 2008 Share Posted February 23, 2008 Per King..he could be had for a 4th! Well, we would have one of the best 4th round picks available. Still, I like the idea of trading a player for him. That way we don't lose a potential player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetfan4hire Posted February 23, 2008 Share Posted February 23, 2008 rotoworld is reporting that the Broncos have strong interest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irish Jet Posted February 23, 2008 Share Posted February 23, 2008 I'm starting to think that this trade just make waaaaaayyy too much sense for the Jets to do anything about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irish Jet Posted February 23, 2008 Share Posted February 23, 2008 rotoworld is reporting that the Broncos have strong interest That's just ****ing great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drago Posted February 23, 2008 Share Posted February 23, 2008 I understand he doesn't have to be all muscle. I'm not that worried about doing this kind of deal. Vilma and our #2 is probably too steep for me though. I'm just saying that the guy carries the rap of being fat and lazy. It's something they'll have to deal with. Saying he could get as fat as he wants because he's at NT is not correct. A part time nose that can only play on select downs is not going to help us that much because we don't have anything else. Maybe if we could pull Red or Rubin in the draft, but we have lots of other needs too. If we get this guy we need him all in and working hard. Actually, i think a part time NT would be very beneficial for us. Play him on most of the obvious running plays, put in mosley or a Dre Moore type guy in on passing downs. If they happen to run we would have another NT in there, they just wouldn't be as good as Rogers. With rogers not having to pass rush, and only concentrate on his job, it would probably keep him fresher as the game goes on. NT is not like WR where we need him to be out there for every down of the offensive series, he could be a spot player and still be highly effetive. I don't think we'll end up getting him, but if we did, and he only played 60% of the downs, but all at a high level, we received a great deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irish Jet Posted February 23, 2008 Share Posted February 23, 2008 Actually, i think a part time NT would be very beneficial for us. Play him on most of the obvious running plays, put in mosley or a Dre Moore type guy in on passing downs. If they happen to run we would have another NT in there, they just wouldn't be as good as Rogers. With rogers not having to pass rush, and only concentrate on his job, it would probably keep him fresher as the game goes on. NT is not like WR where we need him to be out there for every down of the offensive series, he could be a spot player and still be highly effetive. I don't think we'll end up getting him, but if we did, and he only played 60% of the downs, but all at a high level, we received a great deal. Considering Rogers is actually a very good pass rusher (or at least has been with Detroit) I'd really prefer it if he just got himself into his best physical condition. He's very athletic for a big guy and although like you said he'd still be a useful pickup if he was a run situational player he'd be a great pickup if he could be an every down player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greenseed3 Posted February 23, 2008 Share Posted February 23, 2008 If only we had something that Detroit wants... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drago Posted February 23, 2008 Share Posted February 23, 2008 Considering Rogers is actually a very good pass rusher (or at least has been with Detroit) I'd really prefer it if he just got himself into his best physical condition. He's very athletic for a big guy and although like you said he'd still be a useful pickup if he was a run situational player he'd be a great pickup if he could be an every down player. It's almost expecting too much for a man of that size to keep his energy up enough to be an every down player. 360 pounds is ridiculous for a human being, i'm surprised he can even walk. I bet he was a good pass rusher, it's almost a situation where you take one or the other...both just aint happening....IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irish Jet Posted February 23, 2008 Share Posted February 23, 2008 It's almost expecting too much for a man of that size to keep his energy up enough to be an every down player. 360 pounds is ridiculous for a human being, i'm surprised he can even walk. I bet he was a good pass rusher, it's almost a situation where you take one or the other...both just aint happening....IMO. Well in detroit he's maintained that weight (there or there about) and has been that type of player. I honestly do feel that if he can get under 350 he could be just as effective as he once was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted February 23, 2008 Share Posted February 23, 2008 I'm with Irish. Rogers is a good pass rusher. You don't give up what the Lions are going to ask for to get a part time player and then cut your starter. Pouha the rest of the time? Not a fan of the idea. If he's really going for a fourth maybe you can use him part time, but he's a moody dude and isn't going to want to sit for a lesser player, particularly on passing downs. Also, remember, this guy makes about $5M a year and may well want more $$ to be a happy camper. I was just responding to a throwaway line. I think Rogers could be a decent upgrade, but I'm not sure he's 2 gapped before and I'm not sure he'll want to. He doesn't seem like the type of guy to do something he doesn't want to do. If he's on board and the price isn't too steep I'm all for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greenseed3 Posted February 23, 2008 Share Posted February 23, 2008 I'm with Irish. Rogers is a good pass rusher. You don't give up what the Lions are going to ask for to get a part time player and then cut your starter. Pouha the rest of the time? Not a fan of the idea. If he's really going for a fourth maybe you can use him part time, but he's a moody dude and isn't going to want to sit for a lesser player, particularly on passing downs. Also, remember, this guy makes about $5M a year and may well want more $$ to be a happy camper. I was just responding to a throwaway line. I think Rogers could be a decent upgrade, but I'm not sure he's 2 gapped before and I'm not sure he'll want to. He doesn't seem like the type of guy to do something he doesn't want to do. If he's on board and the price isn't too steep I'm all for it. good post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drago Posted February 23, 2008 Share Posted February 23, 2008 I guess my only point is that even at 60% of the defensive snaps that is worth 5 million to the jets. Even in limited snaps he can single handely be the difference between a 3 and out and 3 points. Think about all those drives the jets gave up a 5 or 8 yard run on first down, it seemed like every series. Turning those plays into 2nd and long are invaluable, and that should be worth it. I guess i'm not saying stick with Pouha. In my mock, i had us grabbing Dre Moore in round two, and a NT in the 4th (weather it's bryant or someone else). Those guys are so big that they should be platooned to keep their energy high. You may be right though, it might be too much to give up for a part time player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoFlaJets Posted February 23, 2008 Share Posted February 23, 2008 come on we all know this guy won't end up a Jet-why should the Jets actually do something that will make the team better? You guys know we NEVER make the deals for impact players that could help-besides he isn't "Mangini type player" which if I hear one more time I'm gonna puke. We should have never let Jason Ferguson go Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irish Jet Posted February 23, 2008 Share Posted February 23, 2008 come on we all know this guy won't end up a Jet-why should the Jets actually do something that will make the team better? You guys know we NEVER make the deals for impact players that could help-besides he isn't "Mangini type player" which if I hear one more time I'm gonna puke. We should have never let Jason Ferguson go If we don't at least make an attempt to sign him I am giving up totally on this coaching staff/Front office. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetfan4hire Posted February 23, 2008 Share Posted February 23, 2008 If only we had something that Detroit wants... I have a tough time believing they wouldnt have a strong interest in Vilma. While Lenon played ok at MLB, they want to slide him over to the strong side to play the SAM position Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoFlaJets Posted February 23, 2008 Share Posted February 23, 2008 If we don't at least make an attempt to sign him I am giving up totally on this coaching staff/Front office. they are on a short leash with me IJ-I need to see bold moves made or at least attempted and I want to see them moving with a sense of urgency-for instance-not that i wanted him or anything but Zach just went to Dallas after reading last week that the Jets were possibly interested. This is the **** that pisses me off about this team-no sense of urgency, while team after team and player after player goes to the other guys-every year Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greenseed3 Posted February 23, 2008 Share Posted February 23, 2008 We talked about Vilma for Rogers straight up. I think that'd be a great move. But if either side needed a little encouragement, I could see: [Jets splashing the pot] Vilma + 3rd round pick : Rogers + 3rd round pick (let them move up 15 spots or so) [Detroit splashing the pot] Vilma + 3rd round pick : Rogers + 2nd round pick (lets us move back up into the 2nd) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmike1 Posted February 23, 2008 Share Posted February 23, 2008 This guy is EXACLTY what the Jets need. Of course they won't get him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L.S. Dylan Posted February 23, 2008 Share Posted February 23, 2008 I doubt the FO has the balls to pull the trigger on something like this. Too good to be true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobbyjet69 Posted February 23, 2008 Share Posted February 23, 2008 LOL, yeah just saw that. He just needs to maintain a weight of about 350 - 360, anything over that is a problem. He's surprisingly quick though for a big guy, remember this?? K2vks25u-r4 Maybe we should trade him for Thomas Jones and play him at Running Back. What an amazing "stiff arm" !!! Screw DMC let's play Rogers at tailback!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmike1 Posted February 23, 2008 Share Posted February 23, 2008 The fact that this guy is on a block just makes me angry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irish Jet Posted February 23, 2008 Share Posted February 23, 2008 What an amazing "stiff arm" !!! Screw DMC let's play Rogers at tailback!!! I loved the dive too. Also after the play he was sucking on oxygen for like the rest of the game. That was one of my favourite plays of the season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetfan4hire Posted February 24, 2008 Share Posted February 24, 2008 No, Sims plays WLB. If Vilma was to go to Detroit he would likely play the Mike position(MLB) displacing Paris Lenon to SLB. HTH Coach Rod Marinelli acknowledged at the NFL Combine that the Lions have interest in Jonathan Vilma. The Jets have given Vilma, 25, permission to seek a trade. "He's a heck of a player," Marinelli said. Vilma would likely work well as a middle linebacker in Marinell's Tampa 2 scheme. Source: Detroit News Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted February 24, 2008 Share Posted February 24, 2008 Coach Rod Marinelli acknowledged at the NFL Combine that the Lions have interest in Jonathan Vilma. The Jets have given Vilma, 25, permission to seek a trade. "He's a heck of a player," Marinelli said. Vilma would likely work well as a middle linebacker in Marinell's Tampa 2 scheme. Source: Detroit News Fine. Done with Sperm's blessing. Vilma's value has dropped so much I don't even care anymore if it's even-up for Rogers who no one is bidding more than a 4th-rounder for yet. Replacing a player like Vilma who is a known-quantity in suckiness in the 3-4 with someone who can be a major difference-maker (even with some bust-factor) clogging the middle is fine by me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irish Jet Posted February 24, 2008 Share Posted February 24, 2008 Coach Rod Marinelli acknowledged at the NFL Combine that the Lions have interest in Jonathan Vilma. The Jets have given Vilma, 25, permission to seek a trade. "He's a heck of a player," Marinelli said. Vilma would likely work well as a middle linebacker in Marinell's Tampa 2 scheme. Source: Detroit News Please God make Vilma for Rogers a possibilty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damaged89 Posted February 24, 2008 Share Posted February 24, 2008 Coach Rod Marinelli acknowledged at the NFL Combine that the Lions have interest in Jonathan Vilma. The Jets have given Vilma, 25, permission to seek a trade. "He's a heck of a player," Marinelli said. Vilma would likely work well as a middle linebacker in Marinell's Tampa 2 scheme. Source: Detroit News The Lions might be waiting on Vilma's knee to make any potential deal involving Rodgers. Hopefully (if the rumors are true) no one makes a better offer for Rodgers before Vilma's rehab is done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted February 24, 2008 Share Posted February 24, 2008 The Lions might be waiting on Vilma's knee to make any potential deal involving Rodgers. Hopefully (if the rumors are true) no one makes a better offer for Rodgers before Vilma's rehab is done. There are two holdups. 1) Vilma's injury 2) Reaching a new contract agreement with him before the trade goes through. I'd throw in a 5th or 6th rounder with our 4th before waiting on a deal that requires agents to get involved on Jon Vilma's big cash-in. Could end up taking enough time that someone comes in with a mid-high 3rd round offer instead while we're dillydallying with Vilma's agent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hairless_Mets_Fan Posted February 24, 2008 Share Posted February 24, 2008 Shaun Rogers looks like a hippo!! And hippos eat cats!!! Just say no to Shaun Rogers!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irish Jet Posted February 24, 2008 Share Posted February 24, 2008 Shaun Rogers looks like a hippo!! And hippos eat cats!!! Just say no to Shaun Rogers!!! Please. Go. Away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterNorth09 Posted February 24, 2008 Share Posted February 24, 2008 I understand he doesn't have to be all muscle. I'm not that worried about doing this kind of deal. Vilma and our #2 is probably too steep for me though. I'm just saying that the guy carries the rap of being fat and lazy. It's something they'll have to deal with. Saying he could get as fat as he wants because he's at NT is not correct. A part time nose that can only play on select downs is not going to help us that much because we don't have anything else. Maybe if we could pull Red or Rubin in the draft, but we have lots of other needs too. If we get this guy we need him all in and working hard. What is your obsession with Nose Tackles being heavy? This is the same bs argument you used two years ago with Gabe Watson. Nose Tackles are supposed to be big and heavy, that's how they command double teams and make a 3-4 defense work. Who do you want playing NT for the Jets? Kate Moss? But hey you're right, the Jets should pass up on the Gabe Watsons and Shaun Rogers of the world b/c they might have one milkshake too many and we don't want the Jets defensive line to be decent anytime soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted February 24, 2008 Share Posted February 24, 2008 What is your obsession with Nose Tackles being heavy? This is the same bs argument you used two years ago with Gabe Watson. Nose Tackles are supposed to be big and heavy, that's how they command double teams and make a 3-4 defense work. Who do you want playing NT for the Jets? Kate Moss? But hey you're right, the Jets should pass up on the Gabe Watsons and Shaun Rogers of the world b/c they might have one milkshake too many and we don't want the Jets defensive line to be decent anytime soon. Me? What are talking about? I in favor of this deal, I was just replying to somebody saying he could get as fat as he wants to here. Plenty of guys have eaten themselves out of the league. I didn't say he'd have to slim down. In my opinion the biggest problem with a potential deal for Rogers is that he may not be happy going from the 4-3 to the 3-4 nose where he won't have any happy time stats. Something tells me that he is not going to take Tangini's word for it that if he sacrifices his sacks and tackles and takes on the double teams that they will take care of him. He gets paid plenty so it might not be an issue, but I'm sure he'd rather go to the Raiders or Broncos. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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