T0mShane Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 Eli wasn't doing the 4, 5 wides, option routes, no run game, in 2004, 05, and 06. In fact, he had the benefit of all-purpose yardage leader in Tiki Barber back then and still sucked. How in the hell can you ignore that???? I meant, can you imagine Sanchez ever doing what Eli does now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RutgersJetFan Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 Stats help us quantify things, but they're not the end all be all. Eli's skillset were always better than Sanchez's. Stats help quantify plenty when it comes to this retarded discussion. Eli was way better his 3rd year. DVOA and DYAR favors Eli heavily as it is, and they aren't going to be remotely close once today's game gets added into the 2011 set. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SMC Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 All true, Eli was a debacle (and he's still not elite imo) .... But it is true that Eli had a much better college pedigree, Sanchez has a pedigree much more akin to Akili Smith and Joey Harrington and any number of 1 year wonders who fled to the draft to cash in after thier big season.. I completely agree with you. Just because Eli sucked early and turned it around has absolutely NO bearing on Sanchez' career arc. BUT, it is something to hang your hat on along with the fact that, unlike Smith and Harrington, Sanchez has remained healthy and has improved (albeit incrementally) in his first 3 years. All I'm saying is that Sanchez should be given his rookie deal, no more, no less to prove himself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SMC Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 I meant, can you imagine Sanchez ever doing what Eli does now? Yes. It's called the NFL. Eli is nearly freakin' SIX YEARS OLDER than Sanchez. If Sanchez continues to improve, even if incrementally, he'll be way better in 6 years than he is now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CTM Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 I completely agree with you. Just because Eli sucked early and turned it around has absolutely NO bearing on Sanchez' career arc. BUT, it is something to hang your hat on along with the fact that, unlike Smith and Harrington, Sanchez has remained healthy and has improved (albeit incrementally) in his first 3 years. All I'm saying is that Sanchez should be given his rookie deal, no more, no less to prove himself. it really doesn't matter, the only way we cut bait with Sanchez is if Manning becomes a realistic option. I have no problem giving sanchez another year or two, I don't agree that he can never be good. I don't think we've got an elite QB on our hands, but we could have an above average one who doesn't crumble under pressure.. which is pretty much what eli is , btw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klecko73isGod Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 it really doesn't matter, the only way we cut bait with Sanchez is if Manning becomes a realistic option. I have no problem giving sanchez another year or two, I don't agree that he can never be good. I don't think we've got an elite QB on our hands, but we could have an above average one who doesn't crumble under pressure.. which is pretty much what eli is , btw Ahh, the voice of reason. Pretty stunning that its coming from you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CTM Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 Yes. It's called the NFL. Eli is nearly freakin' SIX YEARS OLDER than Sanchez. If Sanchez continues to improve, even if incrementally, he'll be way better in 6 years than he is now. Eli was a disaster in last weeks game, I' not sure what people think Eli does that so unapproachable for Sanchez btw.. Sanchez really hasn't gotten better this year, after the last few weeks in particular. His passing td's are up, but we're throwing more within the 10. If you look at a stat that includes all of his passes, he's actually gotten worse (dvoa, y/a) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 Yes. It's called the NFL. Eli is nearly freakin' SIX YEARS OLDER than Sanchez. If Sanchez continues to improve, even if incrementally, he'll be way better in 6 years than he is now. Well, I disagree with you. I think he gets six starts next season, then gets buried and re-emerges in five years as an injury replacement for the Rams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RutgersJetFan Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 Yes. It's called the NFL. Eli is nearly freakin' SIX YEARS OLDER than Sanchez. If Sanchez continues to improve, even if incrementally, he'll be way better in 6 years than he is now. 6 years from now? In the NFL? Sanchez? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CTM Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 Ahh, the voice of reason. Pretty stunning that its coming from you. lol, fwiw, after the last few weeks it's looking more and more unlikely.. they certainly aren't going out to far on a limb predicting failure Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SMC Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 it really doesn't matter, the only way we cut bait with Sanchez is if Manning becomes a realistic option. I have no problem giving sanchez another year or two, I don't agree that he can never be good. I don't think we've got an elite QB on our hands, but we could have an above average one who doesn't crumble under pressure.. which is pretty much what eli is , btw I've consistently agreed with you on this Sanchez issue, except when you go on your contrarian Schitty defense kick. BTW, the Eli parallels may get even more uncanny if the Jets dump locker room cancer Holmes this offseason, similar to what happened with the Giants in Tiki and Shockey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 6 years from now? In the NFL? Sanchez? What's Cade McNown doing these days, anyway? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SMC Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 6 years from now? In the NFL? Sanchez? I would make a nice charity bet with you, but I don't know if I'll be alive in 6 years and wouldn't want to saddle my estate with an internet bet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SMC Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 What's Cade McNown doing these days, anyway? McNown? With his career 3-12 record? Yep, that's a perfect parallel to Sanchez. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 McNown? With his career 3-12 record? Yep, that's a perfect parallel to Sanchez. It was a joke, Sensitive Sally. I can't believe you went and Googled McNown's record. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RutgersJetFan Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 What's Cade McNown doing these days, anyway? McNown is probably scrubbing barnacles like Shane Falco or something. That level of a meltdown I witnessed today was a man that's destined to be turning tricks eventually like Dirk Diggler in the 3rd act of Boogie Nights. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SMC Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 It was a joke, Sensitive Sally. I can't believe you went and Googled McNown's record. Pro-football Reference is better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbatesman Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 McNown? With his career 3-12 record? Yep, that's a perfect parallel to Sanchez. THIS SANCHEZ KID IS A WINNER Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RutgersJetFan Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 I would make a nice charity bet with you, but I don't know if I'll be alive in 6 years and wouldn't want to saddle my estate with an internet bet. I will bet you 1 hundred billion dollars that Sanchez does not have a career that resembles Eli Manning's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klecko73isGod Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 I think Sanchez should get a gigantic, oversized, Great Gazoo helmet like Eli has. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smashmouth Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 I think Sanchez should get a gigantic, oversized, Great Gazoo helmet like Eli has. Yeah he should the way he threw the ball today I think he got his brains wracked one to many times this year. Im not sure wtf he was thinking with those short passes to the DL men guess maybe he thought they had their heads down rushing but my god those were bad news. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SMC Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 I will bet you 1 hundred billion dollars that Sanchez does not have a career that resembles Eli Manning's. I agree. It could be better. It could be worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleedin Green Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 it really doesn't matter, the only way we cut bait with Sanchez is if Manning becomes a realistic option. I have no problem giving sanchez another year or two, I don't agree that he can never be good. I don't think we've got an elite QB on our hands, but we could have an above average one who doesn't crumble under pressure.. which is pretty much what eli is , btw This is pretty much exactly how I feel. The only problem is that the more time goes by, the less optimistic I feel about that possibility truly existing. Which is why at the very least, I think the Jets need to come up with someone to put Sanchez up against and make the kid earn his starting job. Before today I thought Flynn might be that guy, but he likely just earned himself a starting job somewhere, so that's not going to happen. If they can get their hands on a guy like Manning, Sanchez sure as hell isn't enough reason not to make the move, but until they have themselves a new proven starter, there's no reason to let Sanchez keep competing to keep his job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RutgersJetFan Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 I agree. It could be better. It could be worse. I will bet another 100 billion that it is worse. And another 100 billion that the narrative of Wayne Hunter ruining the amazing potential that he showed on such a consistent basis for 3 years grows in epic proportions as the years go on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CTM Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 This is pretty much exactly how I feel. The only problem is that the more time goes by, the less optimistic I feel about that possibility truly existing. Which is why at the very least, I think the Jets need to come up with someone to put Sanchez up against and make the kid earn his starting job. Before today I thought Flynn might be that guy, but he likely just earned himself a starting job somewhere, so that's not going to happen. If they can get their hands on a guy like Manning, Sanchez sure as hell isn't enough reason not to make the move, but until they have themselves a new proven starter, there's no reason to let Sanchez keep competing to keep his job. I think it's Manning or we end up with a backup like Jason Cambell Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kleckineau Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 I will bet another 100 billion that it is worse. And another 100 billion that the narrative of Wayne Hunter ruining the amazing potential that he showed on such a consistent basis for 3 years grows in epic proportions as the years go on. If it wasnt for Wayne Hunter and Schottenheimer nobody would be talking about this Rodgers guy in GB I ♥ Mark Sanchez. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleedin Green Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 I think it's Manning or we end up with a backup like Jason Cambell Agreed. Like you said, Manning is the one way that Sanchez's Jets career comes to an end. Campbell is a guy I think is a likely option as well, but the only problem is the Jets might hurt their chances of getting a guy like that if they aren't willing to concede a training camp competition by the time FA hits, because there's enough teams with bad QB situations out there that a guy like Campbell could easily get that offer from somewhere else. Either way, I'm guessing they'll address QB again come the middle to late rounds of the draft for a potential future QB to develop. Basically letting the new OC pick his own future guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugg Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 Statistically in thier 3rd years they are very comparable in Yds./Att., TD/INT and Comp%. What I think seperates them going forward is Eli was a student of the game and had much better awareness of the field, the ball protection and his limitations. he didn't throw a mess of pointless dumpoff crap. And he hit receivers in stride, something Sanchez NEVER does. http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/M/MannEl00.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZachEY Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 Their career arcs are similar. They have put up very similar numbers in each of their first three years. Of course the fact that Eli turned it around doesn't mean that Sanchez will. But the starts to their career have been similar and Eli turned it around with a new OC. By the way, SMC is completely destroying you in this thread, much worse than I have been. And you can claim victory all you want but all I know is the first guy to resort to personal insults is usually the loser of the debate. First off, I'm not making personal attacks. You're just sensitive because the overarching argument, the one you've made that Sanchez is a good QB, has been an abomination. Sanchez sucks, and you were wrong. Sorry if that hurts your feelings. CTM came in with his FO stats that show Eli was better than Sanchez, and honestly, the only point that really matters is that the fact that 1 QB had improved doesn't mean that Sanchez win. Sanchez is THE reason we're not in the playoffs. He sucks at football right now. Maybe he'll get better, but unlike some other QBs, there's really nothing he does especially well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CTM Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 First off, I'm not making personal attacks. You're just sensitive because the overarching argument, the one you've made that Sanchez is a good QB, has been an abomination. Sanchez sucks, and you were wrong. Sorry if that hurts your feelings. CTM came in with his FO stats that show Eli was better than Sanchez, and honestly, the only point that really matters is that the fact that 1 QB had improved doesn't mean that Sanchez win. Sanchez is THE reason we're not in the playoffs. He sucks at football right now. Maybe he'll get better, but unlike some other QBs, there's really nothing he does especially well. wow.. was just lurking at JI and what an echo chamber of stupid the main forum is over there.. it's unbearable.. every other post is about schotty.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SMC Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 wow.. was just lurking at JI and what an echo chamber of stupid the main forum is over there.. it's unbearable.. every other post is about schotty.. And every other post here is about Sanchez. What the **** is the difference? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JetsFanInDenver Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 I did not watch the game. But even the highlights made me sick! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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