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Ryan Fitzpatrick: MERGED

kelly

By kelly
in NY Jets Forum

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Mike135

Mike135

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Posted

I know a personal trainer at that Giants gym on route 3.  Supposedly players go in there all the time.  Let's put together a fund raiser to bribe the trainer to drop a 45lb weight on Eli's toe or something.  Nothing crazy.  Eli is a good guy.

Then maybe the midgets would sign Fitz and end this crap.

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Villain The Foe

Villain The Foe

Posted
Posted
3 minutes ago, Mike135 said:

I know a personal trainer at that Giants gym on route 3.  Supposedly players go in there all the time.  Let's put together a fund raiser to bribe the trainer to drop a 45lb weight on Eli's toe or something.  Nothing crazy.  Eli is a good guy.

Then maybe the midgets would sign Fitz and end this crap.

The only Ryan they'd put in Ryan Nassib and probably end up winning the SB. And it would be your fault. ;)

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joewilly12

joewilly12

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25 minutes ago, Larz said:

june 1st macc will get more bang for his buck cutting guys to make room for fitz, so they may have an agreement in place they will not announce it until then

maybe fitz is just trying to avoid the first week of camp and he signs in august

maybe fitz is just waiting for an injury to happen so he can decide if he wants to go there

maybe he really is just trying to force the jets hand to a better offer or he will just retire

no matter what, I think this goes well into july

 

So if the Jets already have a deal in place with Fitzpatrick what makes them any different from the Patriots cheating with salaries and other stuff? 

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Sperm Edwards

Sperm Edwards

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Posted
6 hours ago, Warfish said:

Because Ryan Fitzpatrick does not exist in a vacuum.  No Fitz = Geno Starts.  Any analysis that does not include this in it's calculations is partial and faulty.

No Fitz = an actual competition. If Geno starts, it will be for a short period of time. With Fitz = no competition. 

Quote

Which is why the argument is flawed.  It's not Fitz vs. the Universe, it's very specific, Fitz or Geno.

I'm not arguing Smith is a better QB. I'm arguing Fitzpatrick isn't good enough, hence he isn't worth all the whining should we fail to bring him back. 

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That's not going to happen.  

Actually, while it's anyone's guess how this gets resolved, it might very well happen. It is in no way far-fetched that Fitzpatrick doesn't return, Geno gets the initial starting nod, screws up again, and then they hand the job to one of the other two. It's as likely a thing to happen as anything else, as of today. If Fitz doesn't eventually sign, I think it's the most likely outcome, actually, since it seems Geno has a huge edge on the week 1 starting job. Hopefully Petty comes back and shows the FO and coaching staff how wrong they were about him being nothing but a multi-year project whose upside they view is as a solid #2 QB.

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It's ignored because he's almost assuredly not coming back for $7M, so wanting it is like wanting Namath to go through a time machine, come back out age 24, and be signed to be QB for the 2016 Jets.

It is nothing like Namath coming back through a time machine. It is nearly on par with the Jets' current offer, which is also the only offer he's received from anyone. He may sit it out if that's his choice, but him returning for $7M or so is a good deal more than something that is actually impossible.

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Unless their is some news of a major shift, Fitz isn't coming back.  So Geno is the starter.  He is who we should be worried about right now.

I'm not worried about anyone starting week 1 because, barring Petty or Hackenberg showing surprising growth, we don't have a QB (or have access to a QB) who can lead the team to a winning record against the teams on our schedule. Fitz can QB a team to wins against weaklings and severely weakened teams, provided they don't put points on the board. Geno can QB a team to beat...well I'll let you finish that one. So the only true chance we would have, slim as it is, would be with the unknown. 

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Mike135

Mike135

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3 minutes ago, joewilly12 said:

So if the Jets already have a deal in place with Fitzpatrick what makes them any different from the Patriots cheating with salaries and other stuff? 

Not that I'm for re-signing Fitz, but don't think there's anything wrong with having a deal in place and waiting for the appropriate time to sign it.

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joewilly12

joewilly12

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4 minutes ago, Villain The Foe said:

And to do that for Ryan Fitzpatrick of all people. lol. sh*t, I can understand Tom Brady. 

Imagine that ladies and gentleman you're NY Jets

2 minutes ago, Mike135 said:

Not that I'm for re-signing Fitz, but don't think there's anything wrong with having a deal in place and waiting for the appropriate time to sign it.

Its cheating 

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Villain The Foe

Villain The Foe

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9 minutes ago, Mike135 said:

Not that I'm for re-signing Fitz, but don't think there's anything wrong with having a deal in place and waiting for the appropriate time to sign it.

You should though. having that type of contract distorts the free agency market. A team could be trying to sign a player but the player isnt accepting because behind the scenes he has a handshake agreement no one outside of that agreement is aware about. Furthermore, you can have a guy on the market on a handshake agreement and just waiting for the right time to sign and unexpectedly a player is released (kinda like Chip Kelly just releasing guys like Desean Jackson into free agency) and now that team you had a handshake deal with feels like they can spend that money much more wisely by picking up this new option. Now you just sat back and denied offers because of a handshake agreement that wasnt an agreement once that new player became an option. 

Players making those deals take 100% of the risk every time. You'd have to be an idiot to do it and actually honor it by declining real offers on the table. 

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Mike135

Mike135

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1 minute ago, Villain The Foe said:

You should though. having that type of contract distorts the free agency market. A team could be trying to sign a player but if the player isnt accepting because behind the scenes he has a handshake agreement. Furthermore, you can have a guy on the market one a handshake agreement and just waiting for the right time to sign and unexpectedly a player is released (kinda like Chip Kelly just releasing guys like Desean Jackson into free agency) and now that team you had a handshake deal with feels like they can spend that money much more wisely by picking up this new option. Now you just sat back and denied offers because of a handshake agreement that wasnt an agreement once that new player became an option. 

Players making those deals take 100% of the risk ever time. You'd have to be an idiot to do it and actually honor it by declining real offers on the table. 

Well if the Jets really do want Fitz back and they do have a deal in place, lucky for us and Fitz that there aren't any other offers to decline because NO ONE wants him.

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Villain The Foe

Villain The Foe

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Just now, Mike135 said:

Well if the Jets really do want Fitz back and they do have a deal in place, lucky for us and Fitz that there aren't any other offers to decline because NO ONE wants him.

If no one wants him, then there's no need for the handshake deal to begin with. Just sign him when you feel like it. No one wants him. 

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Sperm Edwards

Sperm Edwards

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Posted
45 minutes ago, Larz said:

june 1st macc will get more bang for his buck cutting guys to make room for fitz, so they may have an agreement in place they will not announce it until then

Any heavy hitter can be cut before June 1 with no difference in cap repercussions. The biggest hitter is Breno, but the team could wait until the end of August to be 100% sure of cutting him first.

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maybe fitz is just trying to avoid the first week of camp and he signs in august

I had thought of the camp thing as well, and it's not illegitimate. Favre did that for years. He's in no rush, unless he's afraid the whole team and coaching staff is going to start cooing over Geno. Why would he want to sign on for less than he wants and subject himself to fines if he wants to stay off the field as long as possible to avoid summer injuries. They happen.

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maybe fitz is just waiting for an injury to happen so he can decide if he wants to go there

Waiting for an injury to another team's starter is another thing that could happen. But he's going to have to hope for an injury from a team who isn't QB-heavy, who is pretty good even without the injured QB, who has the kind of cap room for the $ Fitz is seeking, AND who's willing to pay that kind of $ to Fitz instead of the next guy up on their roster. It's a lot to cross his fingers on. Seems unlikely that would yield more $ to him than the Jets already have on the table.

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maybe he really is just trying to force the jets hand to a better offer or he will just retire

Again I agree. I think he's made enough that it isn't worth signing one last 1-year deal for $5M in after-tax dollars, when he's sustained significant injuries the last 2 seasons. More to life and all that, even if fans dismiss he could want to do anything but be a QB.

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no matter what, I think this goes well into july

Could be, but it only goes into July if he severely comes off his unrealistic demands and it's not too big a hit on his ego to put his tail between his legs. A middle-ground would be a lower amount guaranteed with significant incentives to get near where he wants if he repeats/exceeds last year's numbers. I don't think he thinks he will do so this year, and on a fan level I don't want Bowles to be put into that situation where he has to be the bad guy. If we're eliminated with a month left, and he thinks Hackenberg or Petty can handle snaps without embarrassing himself, I don't want personal affinity for Fitz to get in the way of that team-first decision. Even Mangini, despite being a 1st class douchebag nobody liked, still wouldn't bench a shoulder-less Favre who was throwing the season into the garbage (and Mangini's Jets career with it).

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Larz

Larz

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So if the Jets already have a deal in place with Fitzpatrick what makes them any different from the Patriots cheating with salaries and other stuff? 

An agreement in principle is different than a deal filed with the league

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Larz

Larz

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Could be, but it only goes into July if he severely comes off his unrealistic demands and it's not too big a hit on his ego to put his tail between his legs. A middle-ground would be a lower amount guaranteed with significant incentives to get near where he wants if he repeats/exceeds last year's numbers. I don't think he thinks he will do so this year, and on a fan level I don't want Bowles to be put into that situation where he has to be the bad guy. If we're eliminated with a month left, and he thinks Hackenberg or Petty can handle snaps without embarrassing himself, I don't want personal affinity for Fitz to get in the way of that team-first decision. Even Mangini, despite being a 1st class douchebag nobody liked, still wouldn't bench a shoulder-less Favre who was throwing the season into the garbage (and Mangini's Jets career with it).

Meh

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Sperm Edwards

Sperm Edwards

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Just now, Larz said:

Meh

Sent from my E6782 using Tapatalk

Which part is meh? 

If he's got $ incentives based on repeating his 2015 stats, and we're eliminated with a month left (or whatever time left where Fitz is shy of those numbers), you want Bowles to be set up to be the villain if he gives one of the kids some live reps instead? 

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Larz

Larz

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A back room deal is CHEATING we destroy the Patriots for cheating ......

The jets did it multiple times this off-season. At least one of the deals wasn't filed for at least a week

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Colgateman

Colgateman

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6 hours ago, ylekram said:

 a little late and a little slow. nobody was comparing NFL MVP rich gannon to ryan fitzpatrick

Your buddy boy who ran out of the thread as soon as I posted the stats tried to.

too bad I had to debunk that garbage

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FTL Jet Fan

FTL Jet Fan

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Posted

Given the QB's we have on our roster at this moment we all better hope there is a hand shake wing wink kingd of deal with Fitz. I am not advocating for Fitz as our starter for more than this year or until hopefully Hack or Petty is ready. If anyone thinks Geno or any other QB on our roster is going to come in and win games especially the first half of the season is wishful thinking  in my opinion. Hackenberg dosent even have his basic footwork where it should be and was more concerned about the rush than where his WR's were due to his horrid OL. I hope he makes a miraculous transformation and is able to start this season. I just don't see that happening, he will need time To develop and get his mechanics and head in the right place to face NFL completion.

Petty is still an unknown at this point, but I would not put money on him. Geno Smith would be the obvious starter if we don't sign Fitz, then we will be picking high in the draft next year as I have zero faith in Smith. I hope I am wrong and one of these guys pulls a Russel W but the odds of that happening are pretty low, at least Fitz will be able to come in and start where he left off not have to develop chemistry with a whole new offensive system and players. Hopefully he is not holding out for more money because if he is then F him. I just think he gives us the best chance have a decent season next year compared to the alternatives.

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Rangers9

Rangers9

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You don't have to have a howitzer to be a good Qb. As a matter of fact some guys like Mark Sanchez can throw hard but usually to opponents. And can't read defenses or lead a team. I mean I'd take CP over a lot of these guys and I'd bet that the same guys who are throwing Fitz over the bus (for being good) were calling Chad "noodle arm" and rejoiced when he got tossed out of town. The funny thing is he went to the Fins and outplayed the guy they brought in. Now that really backfired, didn't it. And if we let Ryan walk that would backfire too. 

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Mike135

Mike135

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2 minutes ago, Rangers9 said:

You don't have to have a howitzer to be a good Qb. As a matter of fact some guys like Mark Sanchez can throw hard but usually to opponents. And can't read defenses or lead a team. I mean I'd take CP over a lot of these guys and I'd bet that the same guys who are throwing Fitz over the bridge (for being good) were calling Chad "noodle arm" and rejoiced when he got tossed out of town. The funny thing is he went to the Fins and outplayed the guy they brought in. Now that really backfired, didn't it. And if we let Ryan walk that would backfire too. 

I loved Pennington.  Sure he had a weak arm, but he was smart.  Not just "hey, I went to Harvard" smart, but actually football smart.  He could read a defense and work through progressions.  

You don't have to have a rocket-arm to be a good QB.  You also don't have to be smart to be a good QB.  It sure helps to have at least one of those qualities though.

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Savage69

Savage69

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3 minutes ago, Mike135 said:

I loved Pennington.  Sure he had a weak arm, but he was smart.  Not just "hey, I went to Harvard" smart, but actually football smart.  He could read a defense and work through progressions.  

You don't have to have a rocket-arm to be a good QB.  You also don't have to be smart to be a good QB.  It sure helps to have at least one of those qualities though.

But could Chaddy cakes take a power shot from IK and survive?? :)

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Rangers9

Rangers9

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8 minutes ago, Mike135 said:

I loved Pennington.  Sure he had a weak arm, but he was smart.  Not just "hey, I went to Harvard" smart, but actually football smart.  He could read a defense and work through progressions.  

You don't have to have a rocket-arm to be a good QB.  You also don't have to be smart to be a good QB.  It sure helps to have at least one of those qualities though.

I disagree with you about Fitz. He is smart on and off the field. And was a good leader and commanded the respect of his teammates. They were thinking and talking football and plays all season long. Even in the wee hours of the morning. To not re-sign him is a step back when we should take a step forward. The arguments against him don't stand up to the basic and most important stat we have to evaluate him: we were 10-6 after a disastrous 4-12. To make excuses for winning games to me isn't logical. I enjoyed the ride we had last season even the last game. Because we were in the game until the last moments. And losing to Buff wasn't a crime because on paper they were a better team than we were. Of course we had better coaching than the Bills :lol:. Rex took a 9-7 team and finished the season at 8-8. Not a good job esp compared to our new HC. 

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joewilly12

joewilly12

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9 minutes ago, Savage69 said:

But could Chaddy cakes take a power shot from IK and survive?? :)

What about those 3 INTs in a row in the final game against Buffalo that would have sent us to the playoffs if we won. You guys want to beat a dead horse about Geno and IK I can do the same damn thing. 6 teams in 11 years 0 playoff appearances..........the beat goes on. 

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Mike135

Mike135

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10 minutes ago, Rangers9 said:

I disagree with you about Fitz. He is smart on and off the field. And was a good leader and commanded the respect of his teammates. They were thinking and talking football and plays all season long. Even in the wee hours of the morning. To not re-sign him is a step back when we should take a step forward. The arguments against him don't stand up to the basic and most important stat we have to evaluate him: we were 10-6 after a disastrous 4-12. To make excuses for winning games to me isn't logical. I enjoyed the ride we had last season even the last game. Because we were in the game until the last moments. And losing to Buff wasn't a crime because on paper they were a better team than we are. Of course we had better coaching then the Bills :lol:.

It was a fun ride.  But ultimately a failure.  In my opinion, to double-down (or more like triple or quadruple-down) on Fitz is a huge step in the wrong direction.

Take a look at that highlight vid of all the 2016 touchdowns and really look at the Marshall TDs.  They guy is insane.  A QB only needs to place the ball somewhere in a 12' radius and it's a completion/TD.  Decker is great too, but not quite as freakish.

Geno will light up the scoreboard with those two.  Plus be able to involve some of the speedsters too.  

Hell with Marshall to throw to, you or I could probably be pretty good red zone QBs.

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