2017

[varjet]

http://www.star-telegram.com/sports/nfl/dallas-cowboys/cowboys-corner-blog/article113350643.html

It appears that, for the second time, the Jets have misjudged the trade market for its players.

As Super Bowl quality teams like the Broncos and the Patriots let top players sign elsewhere or trade them for 2nd round picks or lower, the Jets seem to believe that their top players (with flaws) with expiring rookie contracts can in this market garner 1st round draft picks.  If the Patriots could not get a 1st round pick for Jamie Collins or Chandler Jones, why would the Jets think they could get one for Mo (who wants a big contract or tag) or SR?

This strikes me as petty Woody-ism.   The value of a player is a combination of their ability, risk and compensation.   You need positive checkmarks in all 3 to warrant a 1st round draft pick.  What the Bucs paid for Revis got the GM fired (literally).

Mac should know this given what Marshall and Ivory cost him.  SR should be moved in the off season for the highest draft pick offered that is at least 3rd round.  There is no way Woody pays him.  

[Mike135]

6 minutes ago, varjet said:

SR should be moved in the off season for the highest draft pick offered that is at least 3rd round.  There is no way Woody pays him.  

I'm hoping they trade Wilk and keep Sheldon instead.  Both are damn good players, but I like Sheldon more.

[RoadFan]

Many balked at my opinion that the Jets should take a 3rd for Sheldumb as fair value and run.  I said that a 2nd was absolute top retail price, and that nobody ever wants to pay top retail for anything.  A 1st is hallucinogenic and delusional.

Difficult to convince people that aren't wise enough to think 3-dimensionally. They can't see that a potential trade partner not only has to part with an asset such as a 2nd day pick, but would also needs to reinvest significant money into a high risk and troubled player. 

But hey, Joe Shmoe Jet fan thinks he is worth a 1st... what do I know?!?!

 

[CrazyCarl40]

10 minutes ago, Mike135 said:

I'm hoping they trade Wilk and keep Sheldon instead.  Both are damn good players, but I like Sheldon more.

I think the contract they gave Mo makes him pretty untradeable. One of them has to go in the offseason and I don't think they can invest long term money in Sheldon, even if he is more talented. I also think a full offseason without a broken leg and a move back to a 3-4 base after trading Sheldon will help Mo bounce back in 2017. 

[varjet]

12 minutes ago, CrazyCarl40 said:

I think the contract they gave Mo makes him pretty untradeable. One of them has to go in the offseason and I don't think they can invest long term money in Sheldon, even if he is more talented. I also think a full offseason without a broken leg and a move back to a 3-4 base after trading Sheldon will help Mo bounce back in 2017. 

I honestly believe that this year Mo is a combination of hurt and lazy.  He is not motivated by the team and coach, and hurts.

The Jets should have extended Mo a year or two earlier, so they basically owned the injury risk.  I think Mo underestimated the ability to cut him down the road (see Mario Williams), and he will play better in 2017.  Guys like that really should be on annual contracts.

Suh stunk post his contract too, but he picked it up this year, probably for the same reason.

My biggest concern is whether Decker is a 2017 wash given the extent of his injuries.

[Jetdawgg]

I am not for keeping the guy who loafs on plays. Then usually that is what the Jets do. Keep SR. At least he plays every down

[AFJF]

15 minutes ago, CrazyCarl40 said:

I think the contract they gave Mo makes him pretty untradeable. One of them has to go in the offseason and I don't think they can invest long term money in Sheldon, even if he is more talented. I also think a full offseason without a broken leg and a move back to a 3-4 base after trading Sheldon will help Mo bounce back in 2017. 

I think they can move him with significantly less of a cap hit after next season when Sheldon is under contract for $8 million.  Possible to keep both next season, trade Mo and extend Sheldon the following off-season.

That being said, wouldn't mind seeing them use Sheldon and the #4 or #5 pick to move up to #1.

[King P]

3 minutes ago, AFJF said:

I think they can move him with significantly less of a cap hit after next season when Sheldon is under contract for $8 million.  Possible to keep both next season, trade Mo and extend Sheldon the following off-season.

That being said, wouldn't mind seeing them use Sheldon and the #4 or #5 pick to move up to #1.

5th pick, 2017 1st round pick, and Sheldon for the #1 pick.

Would you pull the trigger?

[Mike135]

20 minutes ago, CrazyCarl40 said:

I think the contract they gave Mo makes him pretty untradeable. One of them has to go in the offseason and I don't think they can invest long term money in Sheldon, even if he is more talented. I also think a full offseason without a broken leg and a move back to a 3-4 base after trading Sheldon will help Mo bounce back in 2017. 

Well won't any team that trades for Sheldon want to get a deal done?  Chances are it'll be similar to Wilk's deal, so what's the difference money wise to the other team.

Heck, taking Wilk may be easier because the other team won't have to deal with coming up with a new contract for Sheldon.

[phill1c]

13 minutes ago, varjet said:

I honestly believe that this year Mo is a combination of hurt and lazy.  He is not motivated by the team and coach, and hurts.

The Jets should have extended Mo a year or two earlier, so they basically owned the injury risk.  I think Mo underestimated the ability to cut him down the road (see Mario Williams), and he will play better in 2017.  Guys like that really should be on annual contracts.

Suh stunk post his contract too, but he picked it up this year, probably for the same reason.

My biggest concern is whether Decker is a 2017 wash given the extent of his injuries.

I think the lack of production makes Mo untradeable. The lack of edge-rushing threat is a big factor too. But, wow, I gotta say I'm very shocked at the level of impotence of the DL. And I think that DL is becoming less of an impact position because of the reliance on the pass, the quick pass in particular.

I'm not concerned about Decker. he's a luxury at this point. I think when you have Enunwa, Marshall, Anderson, and others you have enough bodies.

[AFJF]

2 minutes ago, King P said:

5th pick, 2017 1st round pick, and Sheldon for the #1 pick.

Would you pull the trigger?

If there's a QB they like enough at 1, then absolutely.

[phill1c]

Just now, AFJF said:

If there's a QB they like enough at 1, then absolutely.

seriously, you'd choose a QB when you've already address the position three times in the last two years? And you have such deficiencies all over the OL, edge rusher, RB.

Management should be shot if they don't shore up the OL and/or choose a game-changing edge rusher.

[Jetster]

5 minutes ago, phill1c said:

I think the lack of production makes Mo untradeable. The lack of edge-rushing threat is a big factor too. But, wow, I gotta say I'm very shocked at the level of impotence of the DL. And I think that DL is becoming less of an impact position because of the reliance on the pass, the quick pass in particular.

I'm not concerned about Decker. he's a luxury at this point. I think when you have Enunwa, Marshall, Anderson, and others you have enough bodies.

Leo was fighting his azz off! Too bad we didn't have the high pick in this last draft QBs would have been gone & Bosa staring us in the face. Imagine we pass on him? OMG! The dude is a BEAST! But we have Mo, lol. Macc got so lucky in 2015. This year he was in no mans land but I believe Lee will be a great piece to a good defensive puzzle.

Jets are going to get a fine player in 2017 in the 1st. It's the top of the rest of the rounds that will tell our future story.

[AFJF]

17 minutes ago, phill1c said:

seriously, you'd choose a QB when you've already address the position three times in the last two years? And you have such deficiencies all over the OL, edge rusher, RB.

Management should be shot if they don't shore up the OL and/or choose a game-changing edge rusher.

Pardon me if I'm not sold on Petty and Hack as the future of the franchise.  I'd take a QB in round 1 every year until they get one.  Yes, seriously.  I want to seriously address the single most important position on the field.  The only position that can cover up for all of the deficiencies everywhere else on the field.

Also, what's with the number of fans who believe there is only one draft choice to be had by each team?  They get more than one pick.  Take a QB in round 1 and use all remaining picks on all of the other needs.

Seriously.

[dbatesman]

27 minutes ago, phill1c said:

seriously, you'd choose a QB when you've already address the position three times in the last two years?

lolwut

[Jet Nut]

1 hour ago, varjet said:

http://www.star-telegram.com/sports/nfl/dallas-cowboys/cowboys-corner-blog/article113350643.html

It appears that, for the second time, the Jets have misjudged the trade market for its players.

As Super Bowl quality teams like the Broncos and the Patriots let top players sign elsewhere or trade them for 2nd round picks or lower, the Jets seem to believe that their top players (with flaws) with expiring rookie contracts can in this market garner 1st round draft picks.  If the Patriots could not get a 1st round pick for Jamie Collins or Chandler Jones, why would the Jets think they could get one for Mo (who wants a big contract or tag) or SR?

This strikes me as petty Woody-ism.   The value of a player is a combination of their ability, risk and compensation.   You need positive checkmarks in all 3 to warrant a 1st round draft pick.  What the Bucs paid for Revis got the GM fired (literally).

Mac should know this given what Marshall and Ivory cost him.  SR should be moved in the off season for the highest draft pick offered that is at least 3rd round.  There is no way Woody pays him.  

Is there any part of the org that you don't find a way to blame on Woody?  WTF does he have to do with Macc trying to trade Mo, of he ever tried, or Sheldon, who they apparently were in talks for?  

And what in our past suggests that Woody doesn't want to pay a player?  

[Mogglez]

1 hour ago, RoadFan said:

Many balked at my opinion that the Jets should take a 3rd for Sheldumb as fair value and run.  I said that a 2nd was absolute top retail price, and that nobody ever wants to pay top retail for anything.  A 1st is hallucinogenic and delusional.

Difficult to convince people that aren't wise enough to think 3-dimensionally. They can't see that a potential trade partner not only has to part with an asset such as a 2nd day pick, but would also needs to reinvest significant money into a high risk and troubled player. 

But hey, Joe Shmoe Jet fan thinks he is worth a 1st... what do I know?!?!

 

No, your notion that they should take a third was ridiculous because if he signs somewhere else when his contract is up, we get a 3rd back regardless...so it's f*cking stupid. This was pointed out multiple times the last time you said it and it still rings true.

But hey, the guy that wouldn't take Bruce Arians cause he hurt his fee fee's over some comments on kids playing football says he knows better...what do we know?!?!

[Jet Nut]

33 minutes ago, phill1c said:

seriously, you'd choose a QB when you've already address the position three times in the last two years? And you have such deficiencies all over the OL, edge rusher, RB.

Management should be shot if they don't shore up the OL and/or choose a game-changing edge rusher.

If there's a QB that can be our answer and you pass him over for any other position you get shot.  Especially for a DL or god forbid a RB.

[Mogglez]

43 minutes ago, King P said:

5th pick, 2017 1st round pick, and Sheldon for the #1 pick.

Would you pull the trigger?

I would.  Personally, I'd draft Myles Garrett with that pick because I'm not a fan of any of these QBs right now and that kid is going to be a savage pass rusher, but that's just me.

[Jet Nut]

1 hour ago, RoadFan said:

Many balked at my opinion that the Jets should take a 3rd for Sheldumb as fair value and run.  I said that a 2nd was absolute top retail price, and that nobody ever wants to pay top retail for anything.  A 1st is hallucinogenic and delusional.

Difficult to convince people that aren't wise enough to think 3-dimensionally. They can't see that a potential trade partner not only has to part with an asset such as a 2nd day pick, but would also needs to reinvest significant money into a high risk and troubled player. 

But hey, Joe Shmoe Jet fan thinks he is worth a 1st... what do I know?!?!

 

Other than we're in position to get a 3rd letting him walk, it's a stupid trade.  But hey, you told Joe Shmoe Jets fan, you know better. 

[RoadFan]

6 hours ago, Mogglez said:

No, your notion that they should take a third was ridiculous because if he signs somewhere else when his contract is up, we get a 3rd back regardless...so it's f*cking stupid. This was pointed out multiple times the last time you said it and it still rings true.

But hey, the guy that wouldn't take Bruce Arians cause he hurt his fee fee's over some comments on kids playing football says he knows better...what do we know?!?!

 

I recall your notion about a compensatory pick.  That 3-dimensional thing comes into play again. 

First, a compensatory third round pick is more like a 4th.  It also assumes a team believes him to be worthy of a large contract.  Certainly a reasonable assumption.  There are stupid GMs out there.

And second, the Jets are running the risk that Sheldumb does something stupid, again, and gets himself suspended for an entire year.  In which case, they'll get nothing.  And for what did they get for that risk? To squeeze another season out of an overrated, malcontent that misses meetings on a team going nowhere in 2016 and 2017 anyway?

We'll see what happens in the off-season...

[Stark]

10 hours ago, Mike135 said:

I'm hoping they trade Wilk and keep Sheldon instead.  Both are damn good players, but I like Sheldon more.

Anyone that disagrees with this needs to have their head examined. Sheldon is a baller, a boneheaded one in the past, but he is legit... Mo is just an above average D-end that we pumped up more than his on the field play.

[heymangold]

11 hours ago, Mike135 said:

I'm hoping they trade Wilk and keep Sheldon instead.  Both are damn good players, but I like Sheldon more.

hoping this too.  at least sheldon seems to be making a couple plays out there.  all i remember of Mo from yesterday was jumping on that 4th down.

[Beerfish]

ZERO chance any team would give us anything for Wilkerson,. huge underachiever,  character concerns emerging coming off a bad injury and loafing around with a huge contract.  I think Shel rich is the better player but he is also a huge character risk that might flop once he is paid.

This team is a huge mess.

 

[Tinstar]

I like Wilkerson , but there's no way I was paying him that contract if I had to talk to him about his professionalism .  That said, it's done, and it's quite obvious the guy is not healthy . He has zero strength at the POA and can't run worth a lick .  I give him this yr as a pass due to recovering from his surgery, but if he looks like this next yr,  he's as good as done here. 

I'm not giving Sheldon Richardson a big contract .  His off the field is worst than his on the field .