If the Jets acquire _______ Prior to the draft, you’d be fine with defense at 4 and 10

[65 Toss Power Trap]

Defense at #4 and #10 is fine. I can't think of a specific offensive player we have to get to justify going heavy on defense early in the draft, the key is keep getting the right guys, and keep getting help for the QB. Legit upgrades on offense and defense will help the QB.

[More Cowbell]

4 hours ago, HawkeyeJet said:

Is there any scenario that you could realistically see unfold in FA or trades where you would be ok with the Jets using the top 2 picks on defense?

For me, if the Jets can get a starting interior OL(say James Daniels) and an upgrade at TE(Maxx Williams) and Vet WR(Chark) I’d have no problem taking Gardner at 4 and best edge at 10.

 

The could pick up Sam Ficken and I'd be ok with this. 

[JohnnyLV]

Just now, Tranquilo said:

I do agree that he does disappear and is a borderline #1 WR, but I think he will improve this offense a bit. We were so awful last year. Moving Davis and Moore down a slot will make them better. I think we should draft a WR in the 2nd round either way. 

My gut tells me that the GMs like the EDGE guys less than the analysts and the WR group more. Unless we trade up into the first we could see 

Wilson, London, Olave, Burks, Jameson, Watson all gone before we pick and maybe even guys like Dotson and Pickens too.

I could wrong Mims dropped and usually a few WR go later than expected but with maybe only 2 QBs going the first round could essentially just be OT, EDGE and WR for 24 of the picks

[Tranquilo]

3 minutes ago, johnnysd said:

My gut tells me that the GMs like the EDGE guys less than the analysts and the WR group more. Unless we trade up into the first we could see 

Wilson, London, Olave, Burks, Jameson, Watson all gone before we pick and maybe even guys like Dotson and Pickens too.

I could wrong Mims dropped and usually a few WR go later than expected but with maybe only 2 QBs going the first round could essentially just be OT, EDGE and WR for 24 of the picks

I could see us trading back up to the middle/end of the 1st round if a guy we like drops. We almost did it last year for Elijah Moore.

[Hex]

12 minutes ago, TheNuuFaaolaExperience said:

I hear you, but the Jets would vastly improve on defense with just two league average safeties and another competent LB. Nothing to write home about, but the defense would be a lot more respectable. Just one stud EDGE in the draft and we would be going in the right direction. 

Yea, I just feel like the defense needs more than just some better players. It needs leadership, and CJ Mosely is good for short term but the Jets need something more. Hopefully the draft would accomplish this

[JohnnyLV]

Just now, Tranquilo said:

I could see us trading back up to the middle/end of the 1st round if a guy we like drops. We almost did it last year for Elijah Moore.

True and had no takers and still got him. I ideally I would like us to trade out of 4 and even 10 depending on the board and try and get like 2 additional first and second rounders. To me the strength of this draft is later and we could win up with a lot of foundational players. I do not really love anyone at 4 to be honest.

[Lupz27]

4 hours ago, JoJoTownsell1 said:

you are right that none of these guys stand out as value at 10, he can just trade back about 5-10 picks and take the best one that falls into that range

**** value, if you don’t like the player at 10 you shouldn’t like the player at 15.  Take who you like don’t settle for someone you didn’t want earlier just because that’s ******* stupid.

[Jdub03]

9 minutes ago, johnnysd said:

True and had no takers and still got him. I ideally I would like us to trade out of 4 and even 10 depending on the board and try and get like 2 additional first and second rounders. To me the strength of this draft is later and we could win up with a lot of foundational players. I do not really love anyone at 4 to be honest.

Agreed, and I think strategically if we can keep converting the extra resources from the Jamal trade into future 1s and/or 2s each year, that would be a good way to invest, and be hilarious. 2022, trade down aquire 2023 1st, 2023 trade down aquire 2024 1st, etc. We could ensure a lot of flexibility for years to come and say we traded Adams for 4 1sts or more etc.., lol.

[ZachEY]

35 minutes ago, Doggin94it said:

His cap number this year would be 8.6M (for a team that acquires him by trade). 5.7M of the current 14M cap hit is prorated signing bonus and that doesn't travel with the player if he's traded. So it's just the base salary and workout bonus. Future cap hits are 12M in 23 and 24, and 12.2 in 25. 

https://overthecap.com/player/christian-mccaffrey/5592/

Yeah, I'd deal a third for that. Not a first.

Good point on the money.  I didn't look deeply enough into it.

That said, I'm still not sure about the 3rd.  I really don't have much faith he can stay on the field at this point, and even if he can, how good is he now?  Those are big numbers for IR.

[JoJoTownsell1]

10 minutes ago, Lupz27 said:

**** value, if you don’t like the player at 10 you shouldn’t like the player at 15.  Take who you like don’t settle for someone you didn’t want earlier just because that’s ******* stupid.

That's not how the draft works. You don't just take players you like regardless of the draft position. 

If you like a guy 10 but you know that other teams have him ranked in the 30s,  you would be an idiot to take him at 10 when you can trade down, get picks and still get that player at 15. 

[FidelioJet]

3 minutes ago, ZachEY said:

Good point on the money.  I didn't look deeply enough into it.

That said, I'm still not sure about the 3rd.  I really don't have much faith he can stay on the field at this point, and even if he can, how good is he now?  Those are big numbers for IR.

I think if you have a McCaffery - you have to limit his touches.  As tempting as it is to give him the ball 20+ times a game, it's clear his body can't handle it. 

10 touches max a game and maybe 40 total offensive plays.  

it's tricky but no way he can stay healthy the way he was being used.

[Beerfish]

53 minutes ago, ZachEY said:

He's played 10 games in the past 2 seasons and will have a cap number of 14M.

Not only would I not give up a 1st round pick for him, I'm not sure I'd give up a 3rd round pick for him.

Is missed games in the past always a causation for missed games in the future if the injuries were not shredded achilles, destroyed knees and such?

We are talking about paying a guy like berrios 9 million, amari cooper 20 million.

You do not get chances at mvp calibre players unless they have an issue or so.

Sam Darnold looked like an nfl starting QB last year when mccaffery played to start the year.

 

[ZachEY]

8 minutes ago, Beerfish said:

Is missed games in the past always a causation for missed games in the future if the injuries were not shredded achilles, destroyed knees and such?

We are talking about paying a guy like berrios 9 million, amari cooper 20 million.

You do not get chances at mvp calibre players unless they have an issue or so.

Sam Darnold looked like an nfl starting QB last year when mccaffery played to start the year.

 

I mean, I don't have the data, but I would say that when your last full season was 3 years ago, and you played 10 games in the prior 2, that's a pretty good indicator there's a strong injury risk.

[ZachEY]

9 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

I think if you have a McCaffery - you have to limit his touches.  As tempting as it is to give him the ball 20+ times a game, it's clear his body can't handle it. 

10 touches max a game and maybe 40 total offensive plays.  

it's tricky but no way he can stay healthy the way he was being used.

What is the value of a guy you have to put on such a small pitch count?

[Beerfish]

5 minutes ago, ZachEY said:

I mean, I don't have the data, but I would say that when your last full season was 3 years ago, and you played 10 games in the prior 2, that's a pretty good indicator there's a strong injury risk.

Thats fine I can accept that view.  For me unless there is a lingering issue as i stated before, getting injured before is no more of a risk the coming years.  Guys that never get hurt (Russel Wilson) then get hurt.

Is Derrick Henry on the outs in Tennessee?  Lost lots of games to injury last year.

[FidelioJet]

30 minutes ago, ZachEY said:

What is the value of a guy you have to put on such a small pitch count?

Yeah, tough to quantify because when he's healthy he's one of the best offensive playmakers in the league. 

What would I pay him? $10mm a year? 

[Hal N of Provo]

27 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

Yeah, tough to quantify because when he's healthy he's one of the best offensive playmakers in the league. 

What would I pay him? $10mm a year? 

I think you are right about his usage but would he accept that plan?  
 

I’d add an “injury” next to a bye week and the last weeks before the playoff if you were in.  

[FidelioJet]

8 minutes ago, Hal N of Provo said:

I think you are right about his usage but would he accept that plan?  
 

I’d add an “injury” next to a bye week and the last weeks before the playoff if you were in.  

I'm not sure he'd have a choice - but I think yes.  If someone came to him and said - look, we need to keep you healthy - etc.

He might not be happy about it at first but at least he'll be on the field.

[Lupz27]

4 hours ago, JoJoTownsell1 said:

That's not how the draft works. You don't just take players you like regardless of the draft position. 

If you like a guy 10 but you know that other teams have him ranked in the 30s,  you would be an idiot to take him at 10 when you can trade down, get picks and still get that player at 15. 

You must give the Jets draft advice because they draft as bad as you think here.

[Lupz27]

4 hours ago, JoJoTownsell1 said:

That's not how the draft works. You don't just take players you like regardless of the draft position. 

If you like a guy 10 but you know that other teams have him ranked in the 30s,  you would be an idiot to take him at 10 when you can trade down, get picks and still get that player at 15. 

You also spun this the conversation was about NOT liking a guy at 10 but all of a sudden liking him at 15.  It’s STUPID!