Let’s talk about Zach Wilson

[Hal]

[Hal]

Throws from yesterday in one place.  

[Jetsplayer21]

8 minutes ago, Hal said:

Throws from yesterday in one place.  

Continues his rep as a great “ practice qb “ lol 

[JKlecko]

11 hours ago, jgb said:

 

Dude, you're really making yourself look ignorant.  Comparing Zach to Jamarcus Russell is insane.

[Jetsplayer21]

23 hours ago, Bowles Movement said:

Its possible what you're saying is true but Im starting to think that Douglas and Saleh believe in his underlying physical abilities, and think he still could be great with some time learning and watching Rodgers.   His contract and salary cap have some impact on the decision to keep him, but they could have brought in a better back up than Boyle if they were concerned.

The kid is young and if he ends being an upper tier QB in 2-3 yrs, who cares if we missed out on playing him during the “cheap” yrs of his contract.  If he is looking like he is figuring it out and maturing, they will keep him till Rodgers hangs em up.  If he doesnt seem to be getting it, then I could see them pivoting to a FA or draft pick when Rodgers quits.  They know how important the position is to their future and will make sure that it’s covered one way or another.

I think they want him to him to get the 2nd team reps, as opposed to they think he is the best backup we can come up with. No one is betting the season on Zach if something happens to Aaron. There is always a pivot in case of that dooms day. Would have to give up a solid draft pick if before deadline. After it would get more complicated. Luckily Aaron is old school and plays through everything. But hopefully he will be injury free completely, will need his best. 

[jgb]

34 minutes ago, JKlecko said:

Dude, you're really making yourself look ignorant.  Comparing Zach to Jamarcus Russell is insane.

I was actually mocking you for making pronouncements based on tiny sample sizes, but now that you mention it…

[JoeNamathsFurCoat]

59 minutes ago, Hal said:

Throws from yesterday in one place.  

That is good.

He’s always had the ability to look good when there’s no live pass rush and zero possibility of being hit.

[doitny]

8 hours ago, maury77 said:

I've stayed out of this thread because I had long assumed that the Zach conversation was over, but to read some of the posters in here still defending him is ...... mind blowing. 

i was listening to the "Kay show" on Thursday and Don Lagreca betted that if Zach looked good that night that Friday he would get calls that maybe we could get a 4th rd pick for Zach. and if he did well this preseason he would get calls that he will be our QB after Rodgers retires.

this thread proves him right.

[Jetsplayer21]

23 minutes ago, JoeNamathsFurCoat said:

That is good.

He’s always had the ability to look good when there’s no live pass rush and zero possibility of being hit.

Lot of homers refuse to admit this. While it’s the only logical conclusion. Zach is not stupid. He has the tools. He does very well in practice. We all heard last yr how well Zach was doing in practice, while come Sundays had some of the worst qb performances in history of NFL.” Having a pair “is one stat the math nerds haven’t figured out how to calculate yet. 

[Hal]

Why do AntiZaxers watch him practice or play in the preseason then?  Why do you guys need to reply to every post to say it means nothing?

But if you don’t like something he does in practice or the preseason it means everything? 

[jgb]

3 hours ago, Hal said:

Throws from yesterday in one place.  

His release really is lightening fast. It’s impressive from a physical capabilities perspective.

[rex-n-effect]

4 hours ago, Hal said:

Throws from yesterday in one place.  

There are some good throws in there and he looks better than he did in any of the regular games last season. Some of the throws are still over where the receiver misses or has to dive and there's no chance for YAC. Also some of those passes the rush broke through and he would have been flattened before or immediately after throwing. The practices are encouraging but still need to see him play in competitive games where the defense is real and he's really under fire.

[FidelioJet]

19 minutes ago, rex-n-effect said:

There are some good throws in there and he looks better than he did in any of the regular games last season. Some of the throws are still over where the receiver misses or has to dive and there's no chance for YAC. Also some of those passes the rush broke through and he would have been flattened before or immediately after throwing. The practices are encouraging but still need to see him play in competitive games where the defense is real and he's really under fire.

This isn't exactly accurate.  While yes, nothing is going to matter until he's doing it competitive game and under fire but...and he still has a VERY long way to go...but...

1st - Most said he didn't look good in practice last year.  He was constantly attacked about his performance

2nd - And most important - Why he's doing well right now is not so much the actual throws he's making but the way he's playing within the offense.  Consistent footwork and getting the ball out on time.  That's something he was never doing consistently.  That is a major change for him.  Working with the timing of the offense is the likely reason why he's been far more accurate.  

3rd - Not every throw is perfect from any QB.  You can see it, Rodgers misses throws or requires receivers to make nice catches.  it's the way it works.  Zach has been accurate.  WR's making good catches is part of the game.  As you probably realize from watching games on Sunday.

[JKlecko]

5 hours ago, jgb said:

I was actually mocking you for making pronouncements based on tiny sample sizes, but now that you mention it…

Dude, there is more to players than statistics.  There is a famous quote by Mark Twain regarding statistics.  Perhaps you should look it up. Jamarcus Russell was a dumb, lazy bum.  Zach was a victim of stupid mistakes by JD, Saleh and MLF.  If you can't understand the difference between the two, then I'm not going to waste any more time speaking with you.  You certainly don't understand anything about football.  Have a nice life.

[slimjasi]

3 minutes ago, JKlecko said:

Have a nice life.

[Jetsfan80]

52 minutes ago, JKlecko said:

Dude, there is more to players than statistics.  There is a famous quote by Mark Twain regarding statistics.  Perhaps you should look it up. Jamarcus Russell was a dumb, lazy bum.  Zach was a victim of stupid mistakes by JD, Saleh and MLF.  If you can't understand the difference between the two, then I'm not going to waste any more time speaking with you.  You certainly don't understand anything about football.  Have a nice life.

It’s never been easier to produce at QB than it is now yet JaMarcus Russell, playing in a tougher era of football, with a weaker supporting cast, and a “dumb lazy bum” in your words still out produced Zach Wilson.

What exactly does that say about Zach?  

[Dunnie]

It’s never been easier to produce at QB than it is now yet JaMarcus Russell, playing in a tougher era of football, with a weaker supporting cast, and a “dumb lazy bum” in your words still out produced Zach Wilson.
What exactly does that say about Zach?  

Tells me the Raiders had infinitely better coaching.

Sent from my Pixel 7 using Tapatalk

[Jetsfan80]

1 hour ago, Dunnie said:

Tells me the Raiders had infinitely better coaching.
 

It’s time you come to terms with the reality that no highly drafted NFL QB gets coached out of the league.

If there had been a coach out there who thought he could get something out of JaMarcus Russell, it would have happened.  

Some QBs, no matter how talented, just suck.  

[Darnold Schwarzenegger]

7 hours ago, Hal said:

Why do AntiZaxers watch him practice or play in the preseason then?  Why do you guys need to reply to every post to say it means nothing?

But if you don’t like something he does in practice or the preseason it means everything? 

I hate Zach Wilson. The sooner he’s off the team the better. He is the biggest bust in franchise history and easily a top 10 bust in nfl history. He makes Blake bortles look like Peyton manning.

[T0mShane]

2 hours ago, Dunnie said:

Tells me the Raiders had infinitely better coaching.

Sent from my Pixel 7 using Tapatalk
 

FWIW, the Athletic just did a puff piece on Mike LaFleur, and when asked about the mistakes he made with the Jets offense, he said, 

“

The Jets went into the 2021 season without a veteran who would threaten Wilson. In late October after Wilson injured his knee, they traded for Joe Flacco. Wilson eventually returned and finished the season with a 3-10 record.

“Reflecting back on it, I wish we had brought in that veteran quarterback right away so Zach could sit back and learn and not be thrown into the fire right away,” LaFleur says. “I don’t care who you are. That was a tough deal. And you know, it was the first time I was calling plays, too.

[…]
 

In hindsight, LaFleur says, he would have made fewer adjustments for the missing players and stressed the foundation of the offense, much like McVay did with the Rams late last season.

The experience did not detract from his confidence in Wilson.

“He’s made of the right stuff,” LaFleur says. “I wish I could have done more for him to set him up for success, and that’s something I have to figure out so the next time I have a young quarterback, I don’t let that happen again.”

[jgb]

4 hours ago, JKlecko said:

Dude, there is more to players than statistics.  There is a famous quote by Mark Twain regarding statistics.  Perhaps you should look it up.

You should attribute a quote correctly before attempting to use it as a cugel.

4 hours ago, JKlecko said:

Jamarcus Russell was a dumb, lazy bum.  Zach was a victim of stupid mistakes by JD, Saleh and MLF.  If you can't understand the difference between the two, then I'm not going to waste any more time speaking with you.  You certainly don't understand anything about football.  Have a nice life.

A cat and a bear both have 4 legs.

”OMG you dOnTT nOe DAh diffErNtZ bEtwEEn kAt and BaRE.”

There is a reason it is called “a comparison” and not “an exact.”

[jgb]

3 hours ago, Dunnie said:

Tells me the Raiders had infinitely better coaching.

Sent from my Pixel 7 using Tapatalk
 

If QBs are mere vessels for their environments, why pay the good ones $50M a year? Andy Reid should just cycle through rookies and “coach ‘em up” and have a giant cap advantage

[jgb]

1 hour ago, T0mShane said:

FWIW, the Athletic just did a puff piece on Mike LaFleur, and when asked about the mistakes he made with the Jets offense, he said, 

“

The Jets went into the 2021 season without a veteran who would threaten Wilson. In late October after Wilson injured his knee, they traded for Joe Flacco. Wilson eventually returned and finished the season with a 3-10 record.

“Reflecting back on it, I wish we had brought in that veteran quarterback right away so Zach could sit back and learn and not be thrown into the fire right away,” LaFleur says. “I don’t care who you are. That was a tough deal. And you know, it was the first time I was calling plays, too.

[…]
 

In hindsight, LaFleur says, he would have made fewer adjustments for the missing players and stressed the foundation of the offense, much like McVay did with the Rams late last season.

The experience did not detract from his confidence in Wilson.

“He’s made of the right stuff,” LaFleur says. “I wish I could have done more for him to set him up for success, and that’s something I have to figure out so the next time I have a young quarterback, I don’t let that happen again.”

Gee, a vet QB. Who would’ve thunk it?

Sometimes we really know better than the professionals.

[T0mShane]

18 minutes ago, jgb said:

Gee, a vet QB. Who would’ve thunk it?

Sometimes we really know better than the professionals.

1. “We shouldn’t have played him right away, and 2. “Even when we lost our best OL and RB, we should have kept running the ball instead of emphasizing the short passing game.” Taken together, LaFleur is saying “We thought Zach Wilson could play quarterback at the median level, but we were wrong.” 

[jgb]

33 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

1. “We shouldn’t have played him right away, and 2. “Even when we lost our best OL and RB, we should have kept running the ball instead of emphasizing the short passing game.” Taken together, LaFleur is saying “We thought Zach Wilson could play quarterback at the median level, but we were wrong.” 

I don’t see how any GM could look at the successful QBs across the league, then at Zach, and think “that’s my guy.”

[LockeJET]

Zach has 0 future here barring an injury. Especially if AR plays more than 2 seasons. They aren’t picking up his 5 year option. 

[T0mShane]

2 hours ago, jgb said:

I don’t see how any GM could look at the successful QBs across the league, then at Zach, and think “that’s my guy.”

Many poor hiring decisions were made over Zoom during the lockdowns. 
 

[Rich Thornburgh]

21 hours ago, elvispookie said:

Haha.. ummm... no.

Are you sure?

[maury77]

3 hours ago, jgb said:

I don’t see how any GM could look at the successful QBs across the league, then at Zach, and think “that’s my guy.”

I know, I've been asking the same thing since Wilson's draft hype started, but I've mostly stayed out of this thread and I've avoided the Justin Fields thread like the plague. I'm just happy to have Rodgers and I'm hoping the team makes the playoffs. 

[Sammybighead]

10 hours ago, JKlecko said:

Dude, there is more to players than statistics.  There is a famous quote by Mark Twain regarding statistics.  Perhaps you should look it up. Jamarcus Russell was a dumb, lazy bum.  Zach was a victim of stupid mistakes by JD, Saleh and MLF.  If you can't understand the difference between the two, then I'm not going to waste any more time speaking with you.  You certainly don't understand anything about football.  Have a nice life.

Correct. If you gonna post a graphic comparing the 2, then you have to add “work ethic” to the graphic. Zach works hard, is a football junkie and stays in shape. Jamarcus ate himself out of the league and did not work hard. The desire to be better is like 50% of the battle.

Not saying Zach will ever amount to anything, but I agree the comparison is terribly unfair to Zach simply based on work ethic alone.

[Joe W. Namath]

2 hours ago, LockeJET said:

Zach has 0 future here barring an injury. Especially if AR plays more than 2 seasons. They aren’t picking up his 5 year option. 

Nope.  They are developing Zach to be the qb of the future and he is off to  fantastic start.

Be happy jet fans!  Its a little late, but its happening!

[Jetsfan80]

51 minutes ago, Sammybighead said:

Correct. If you gonna post a graphic comparing the 2, then you have to add “work ethic” to the graphic. Zach works hard, is a football junkie and stays in shape. Jamarcus ate himself out of the league and did not work hard. The desire to be better is like 50% of the battle.

Not saying Zach will ever amount to anything, but I agree the comparison is terribly unfair to Zach simply based on work ethic alone.

How did poor work ethic JaMarcus out-produce terrific work-ethic Zach?

Doesn't that HURT Zach's case more than help it?  At least when it comes to his performance the first 2 years?  Obviously a stronger work ethic helps his chances of turning things around better than JaMarcus but it doesn't help the analysis of the first 2 seasons.

[Jetsfan80]

9 hours ago, Dunnie said:

Tells me the Raiders had infinitely better coaching.

 

 

8 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

It’s time you come to terms with the reality that no highly drafted NFL QB gets coached out of the league.

If there had been a coach out there who thought he could get something out of JaMarcus Russell, it would have happened.  

Some QBs, no matter how talented, just suck.  

 

Also for the record:  The Raiders HC in 2007 (Russell's rookie year) was first (and only)-time HC Lane Kiffin, who never coached in the NFL again after his brief stint as Raider HC.

He was fired midseason of 2008 and replaced with OL coach Tom Cable in 2008.

What else you got?

[FidelioJet]

42 minutes ago, Joe W. Namath said:

Nope.  They are developing Zach to be the qb of the future and he is off to  fantastic start.

Be happy jet fans!  Its a little late, but its happening!

The thing is - is Zach's going to want to have to stay here?  Jets aren't going to franchise him or pick up his option - re signing him for less it was will have to be done.  Which will give him options to look elsewhere.

Have the Jets and their fan base done enough to chase him away?  If he looks good and continues to get better he'll definitely  have options.

 

[Joe W. Namath]

1 minute ago, FidelioJet said:

The thing is - is Zach's going to want to have to stay here?  Jets aren't going to franchise him or pick up his option - re signing him for less it was will have to be done.  Which will give him options to look elsewhere.

Have the Jets and their fan base done enough to chase him away?  If he looks good and continues to get better he'll definitely  have options.

 

If he is smart he is going to want to stay here.  He is developing in this system under hackett.  To put in 2 to 3 years of mastering it only to be traded to the Cardinals would be stupid on his part.

Zach's best chance of being a star qb and making a ton of money in the long term is replacing Rodgers and flourishing under hackett.

I believe him and his family know this.  There is a long game being played here with Zac Wilson.  I believe everyone understands this.