Now Gammons is officially joining the Ortiz Sploogefest.....

[JonEJet]

Arod is truly the league MVP, but that douchebag is on the air, waiving the pom poms for the Big Gorilla

Thank god Harold Reynolds, the only real knowlegeable guy on baseball tonight, was there to douse the Gammons led MVP for Ortiz rant

Way to go Harold....shut that Beantown Bigmouth the fuuuuuck up!!!

[TaborJet]

Arod is truly the league MVP, but that douchebag is on the air, waiving the pom poms for the Big Gorilla

Thank god Harold Reynolds, the only real knowlegeable guy on baseball tonight, was there to douse the Gammons led MVP for Ortiz rant

Way to go Harold....shut that Beantown Bigmouth the fuuuuuck up!!!

You know, this isn't a Homer-ish thing for me to say, but is Ortiz a good fielder? Oh, that's right...he's a DH! He can play 1st in a pinch, but he is no fielder like Arod.

[Jetfanmack]

That's why A-Rod should get the award. Ortiz is amazing in Fenway, but no true DH is in the hall of fame, and I don't think a true DH should be the MVP unless he's far and away better than others, and the argument can be made pretty easily that he's not even the MVP of his own team.

[JonEJet]

That's why A-Rod should get the award. Ortiz is amazing in Fenway, but no true DH is in the hall of fame, and I don't think a true DH should be the MVP unless he's far and away better than others, and the argument can be made pretty easily that he's not even the MVP of his own team.

No MVP should come out of Fenway whatsoever

Playing in that sandbox is such a friggin' advantage is not even funny

Arod has to hit his bombs in possibly the most difficult park for righty;s in baseball

ARod wins in a landslide...he's the best

[JonEJet]

...............OMG

Now he picks the Sawx to go to the WS....sh*t, they might not even make the playoffs with that pen

Get this guy off the TV, pleaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaase

[Jet/BosoxFan]

...............OMG

Now he picks the Sawx to go to the WS....Sh#t, they might not even make the playoffs with that pen

Get this guy off the TV, pleaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaase

JonE, are you talking to yourself? These double posts are confusing.

[JonEJet]

JonE, are you talking to yourself? These double posts are confusing.

Shaughnessey first, now Gammons

Will you Boston pukes ever lean it took 86 years to get one.....now you want two

Bwa-hahahahahahahahahhahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

[Jet/BosoxFan]

Shaughnessey first, now Gammons

Will you Boston pukes ever lean it took 86 years to get one.....now you want two

Bwa-hahahahahahahahahhahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

I think we all see where this is going.

JonE...if the Red Sox arent going to win the AL East, if they arent going to win the World Series or even make the playoffs...

which team is????

C'mon, give us what we want!!!!!!!!

[JonEJet]

You're right....it's the Sawx

[Thor99]

You're right....it's the Sawx

He almost fell for it.

He's learning.

[Jet/BosoxFan]

He almost fell for it.

He's learning.

nah, like the expression goes, you cant teach an old, accursed dog new tricks.

The JonE we all know and love will be back. Let him milk his false sense of security for all its worth. It will just make the Yankee downfall that much harder to take.

If he hasnt learned by now that the Yankees are gonna break his black, evil-infested heart...he never will

[JonEJet]

nah, like the expression goes, you cant teach an old, accursed dog new tricks.

The JonE we all know and love will be back. Let him milk his false sense of security for all its worth. It will just make the Yankee downfall that much harder to take.

If he hasnt learned by now that the Yankees are gonna break his black, evil-infested heart...he never will

So you Guarantee the Sawx win the AL East?

C'mon Greek, let's hear it

[mbn007]

So you Guarantee the Sawx win the AL East?

C'mon Greek, let's hear it

He has all but done that already, posting countless times that the AL East race is over, the Yankees are going home after the season, blah, blah, blah.

I would love to see his face the Monday after the season ends if the BoSox are eliminated. But that would be a face that would get everyone around to start calling "911".

[GimmeShelter]

Ortiz has hit more BIG HR's.

I don't care what position he plays. When you tie or win as many games during a pennant race the way Ortiz has, you must be considered for the MVP.

Yankee fan hated ARod anyway ...remember?

[mbn007]

Ortiz has hit more BIG HR's.

I don't care what position he plays. When you tie or win as many games during a pennant race the way Ortiz has, you must be considered for the MVP.

Yankee fan hated ARod anyway ...remember?

If a guy does not play any defensive position, he does not dererve MVP. Unless he is having a season offensively that is head and shoulders above anyone else.

And Ortiz, while having a super season, is not head and shoulders above A-Rod, or others, like Manny, his own teammate.

[GimmeShelter]

That's why A-Rod should get the award. Ortiz is amazing in Fenway, but no true DH is in the hall of fame, and I don't think a true DH should be the MVP unless he's far and away better than others, and the argument can be made pretty easily that he's not even the MVP of his own team.

You need to go look at Ortiz's stat splits.

18 HR's at home...23 on the ROAD.

5HR's against the Yankees in 63 AB's.....and you have a easy argument he's not even close to the MVP on his own team?

[GimmeShelter]

If a guy does not play any defensive position, he does not dererve MVP. Unless he is having a season offensively that is head and shoulders above anyone else.

And Ortiz, while having a super season, is not head and shoulders above A-Rod, or others, like Manny, his own teammate.

Who decided that asterik....you?

Horse crap. If he was a Yankee this thread wouldn't exist.

Remember you AL guys call the NL 2nd tier because it doesn't have a Sunday beer league position called DH.

MVP = Most valuable to HIS team.

What player in MLB scares Yankee fans the most when he walks to the plate?

Nuff said.

Giambi---Mo Vaughn and Don Baylor have all won the award while playing anywhere from 30-50 games at DH.

[mbn007]

Who decided that asterik....you?

Horse crap. If he was a Yankee this thread wouldn't exist.

Remember you AL guys call the NL 2nd tier because it doesn't have a Sunday beer league position called DH.

MVP = Most valuable to HIS team.

What player in MLB scares Yankee fans the most when he walks to the plate?

Nuff said.

I don't recall putting an asterik in my post.

I call it logic. If a guy only plays half a game, how on earth could he be MVP, unless he is so outstandingly better then everyone else in that half a game, that he deserves MVP.

Ortiz is super this season, but not way above A-Rod, who is a very solid defensive player.

[GimmeShelter]

I agree ARod is in the MVP race. My point is for you guys to suddenly invoke this DH doesn't deserve consideration rule is Homerism.

Ortiz = Clutch.

[Thor99]

I agree ARod is in the MVP race. My point is for you guys to suddenly invoke this DH doesn't deserve consideration rule is Homerism.

Ortiz = Clutch.

Yankee fans are like Fox News, Fair and Balanced.

Just ask them.

[The Troll]

Would the Red Sox be anywhere near first place without Ortiz? No.

Would the Yankees be battling for the wild card even if they didn't have A-Rod? Yes.

MVP means most valuable player, not "guy with the prettiest numbers".

[mbn007]

Would the Red Sox be anywhere near first place without Ortiz? No.

Would the Yankees be battling for the wild card even if they didn't have A-Rod? Yes.

MVP means most valuable player, not "guy with the prettiest numbers".

The correct answer to both questions is NO.

Emphatically.

[Mavrik]

christ,

when you bat .297 with 41 jacks and 127 RBIs with 3 weeks left in the season. your going to warrant some MVP consideration also. Ortiz is having a helluva year and no doubt should be considered for the Cy Young. Like gimmeshelter said, MVP is the person judged most valuable to his team. Who gives a flying f*** if he's doing it as a DH.

Edgar Martinez was the glue of the Mariners offense for years, and he did most of it as a DH. Aside from Griffey, you don't think he was the most valuable and consistent player on his team?

A-Rod's batting .311 with 41 Jacks and 16 less RBIs than Ortiz. It could go either way.

And speaking of field dimensions, Yankee stadium isn't exactly the Polo Grounds either. 318 to left and 314 to right?

[Matt39]

Would the Red Sox be anywhere near first place without Ortiz? No.

Would the Yankees be battling for the wild card even if they didn't have A-Rod? Yes.

MVP means most valuable player, not "guy with the prettiest numbers".

wow.

I assume you haven't watched one Yankee game this season.

[mbn007]

christ,

when you bat .297 with 41 jacks and 127 RBIs with 3 weeks left in the season. your going to warrant some MVP consideration also. Ortiz is having a helluva year and no doubt should be considered for the Cy Young. Like gimmeshelter said, MVP is the person judged most valuable to his team. Who gives a flying f*** if he's doing it as a DH.

Edgar Martinez was the glue of the Mariners offense for years, and he did most of it as a DH. Aside from Griffey, you don't think he was the most valuable and consistent player on his team?

A-Rod's batting .311 with 41 Jacks and 16 less RBIs than Ortiz. It could go either way.

And speaking of field dimensions, Yankee stadium isn't exactly the Polo Grounds either. 318 to left and 314 to right?

A-Rod is batting .321, I believe. That's almost 25 points better. And yes, he is 16 rbis behind. He is ahead in OBP by some 20 points, and I think they are dead even in slugging (.600 each).

It is not one sided, as some would like to believe, that is my point in this entire thread. But by not playing the field, Ortiz is not helping his team defensively. A-Rod had 10 errors on July 1. He has 11 now. And if you have watched Yankee games on a regular basis, you will see that he excels at the hot corner. Excels. Few are better today. Nettles and Brooks, as well as Schmidt were better, but A-Rod is up there with today's best. Ortiz is among the worst 1B in the game today.

[Barton]

Would the Yankees be battling for the wild card even if they didn't have A-Rod? Yes.

um................NO

With all the injuries this year to our team, Arod has been our most valuable player. We would not even be close to contention for the wild card win without Arod. Dumb post, troll.

[Mavrik]

A-Rod is batting .321, I believe. That's almost 25 points better. And yes, he is 16 rbis behind. He is ahead in OBP by some 20 points, and I think they are dead even in slugging (.600 each).

It is not one sided, as some would like to believe, that is my point in this entire thread. But by not playing the field, Ortiz is not helping his team defensively. A-Rod had 10 errors on July 1. He has 11 now. And if you have watched Yankee games on a regular basis, you will see that he excels at the hot corner. Excels. Few are better today. Nettles and Brooks, as well as Schmidt were better, but A-Rod is up there with today's best. Ortiz is among the worst 1B in the game today.

MBN, that's not my point. Some People on here are basically saying any designated hitter should be disregarded in terms of MVP consideration, and I disagree. If you can help out your team enough on the offensive side, why should i care whether you do it as a DH or a garbage first baseman.

I can think of MVPs that were not great defensively. Sammy Sosa is arguably and has been the worst outfielder in the game for years. Yet in 98 he put up 66 HRs and 158 RBIs. He wasn't a game-changing performer for that team defensively, but did it matter?

Dennis Eckersley, Willie Hernandez, and Roger Clemens have both won MVP awards without so much as contributing anything to the offensive side of the game, should they have not been considered for an MVP award?

A-Rod is having a great season, and by all means I think should get serious consideration, if not receive the AL MVP, but all I'm saying is that a player should not be discouraged from MVP voting because he plays in a league where A Designated Hitter exists and is encouraged.

[MasonJet]

I agree ARod is in the MVP race. My point is for you guys to suddenly invoke this DH doesn't deserve consideration rule is Homerism.

Ortiz = Clutch.

And A-Rod=Clutch as well. If you don't think that's true, that you're kidding yourself. While many say that A-Rod is not clutch and doesn't get big hits, this is nothing more than an urban myth. He has come up huge in countless situations this year.

Remember this one?

http://www.nydailynews.com/front/story/328403p-280687c.html

A-Rod's two-run home run off Schilling in the top of the ninth inning was the difference in the Yankees' 8-6 victory over the Red Sox

[MasonJet]

christ,

when you bat .297 with 41 jacks and 127 RBIs with 3 weeks left in the season. your going to warrant some MVP consideration also. Ortiz is having a helluva year and no doubt should be considered for the Cy Young. Like gimmeshelter said, MVP is the person judged most valuable to his team. Who gives a flying f*** if he's doing it as a DH.

Edgar Martinez was the glue of the Mariners offense for years, and he did most of it as a DH. Aside from Griffey, you don't think he was the most valuable and consistent player on his team?

A-Rod's batting .311 with 41 Jacks and 16 less RBIs than Ortiz. It could go either way.

And speaking of field dimensions, Yankee stadium isn't exactly the Polo Grounds either. 318 to left and 314 to right?

Well it's 318 down the left field LINE and 314 down the LINE. That short porch in right field is much more beneficial to lefty hitters, DUH. The gaps in left and right center, where A-Rod frequently hits the ball are like 399 and 385. And oh yeah, there's a reason the left-center gap in Yankee Stadium is called Death Valley. It's where homeruns go to die.

[GimmeShelter]

And A-Rod=Clutch as well. If you don't think that's true, that you're kidding yourself. While many say that A-Rod is not clutch and doesn't get big hits, this is nothing more than an urban myth. He has come up huge in countless situations this year.

Remember this one?

http://www.nydailynews.com/front/story/328403p-280687c.html

A-Rod's two-run home run off Schilling in the top of the ninth inning was the difference in the Yankees' 8-6 victory over the Red Sox

Actually Mike and the Dog are having this very discussion today and agree that Ortiz has more big HR's than ARod.

I agree ARod is clutch. The Yankeee fan in April were the ones trying to say Jeter was more clutch.

I have NO problem with ARod winning the MVP.

I do have a problem with someone saying Ortiz doesn't deserve it because he's a DH.

The DH is a AL rule. AL fans call the NL a AAAA league because they don't have one.

You can't have it both ways.

[GimmeShelter]

um................NO

With all the injuries this year to our team, Arod has been our most valuable player. We would not even be close to contention for the wild card win without Arod. Dumb post, troll.

LOL. If no ARod you have Sheff-Matsui-Giambi and in some peoples opinion, Jeter....All high priced superstars.

If no Ortiz, the Sox have Manny and a bunch of good role players with Damon the only one who would consider star consideration.

[MasonJet]

Actually Mike and the Dog are having this very discussion today and agree that Ortiz has more big HR's than ARod.

I agree ARod is clutch. The Yankeee fan in April were the ones trying to say Jeter was more clutch.

I have NO problem with ARod winning the MVP.

I do have a problem with someone saying Ortiz doesn't deserve it because he's a DH.

The DH is a AL rule. AL fans call the NL a AAAA league because they don't have one.

You can't have it both ways.

Well I personally have never called the NL a 2nd-rate league. And I've never said you can't win MVP just because you're a DH. However, if you do win it as DH, that person's offensive numbers should be off-the-charts better than anybody else's. Ortiz's are not so much better than A-Rods, infact A-Rod has a higher BA and OBP. And when you take into account his fantastic fielding, that really hurts Ortiz. Both players mean a ton to their teams. A-Rod means more because he does such a great job in the field. Fielding is also a reason Ramirez will never win it.

[The Troll]

LOL. If no ARod you have Sheff-Matsui-Giambi and in some peoples opinion, Jeter....All high priced superstars.

If no Ortiz, the Sox have Manny and a bunch of good role players with Damon the only one who would consider star consideration.

Exactly. If you take away A-Rod, if the Yankees were not still in the wild card race, it would be a complete joke. Without A-Rod, the Yankees payroll would still be $190 million. I'm sure they would have found a way to keep floundering below Cleveland with or without A-Rod's garbage time homers.

[Barton]

LOL. If no ARod you have Sheff-Matsui-Giambi and in some peoples opinion, Jeter....All high priced superstars.

If no Ortiz, the Sox have Manny and a bunch of good role players with Damon the only one who would consider star consideration.

Mueller is a .300 hitter, Damon is right there for the batting title, Renteria is a pretty decent hitter. Nixon is pretty good as well.

Lets not try to fit BS into our agendas by saying the sox lineup is better or worse without Ortiz than the Yankees lineup with or without Arod. Both have great hitters infront of them and behind them in the batting order. And I'd go out on a limb and guess that Ortiz has had more ABs with men on base than Arod has.

Yankees without Arod arent in the playoff hunt, end of story. He has been clutch this team despite not hitting as many walkoffs as king kong in fenway, but he is still a better hitter, and a goldglove worthy 3rd baseman.

[PFSIKH]

Mueller is a .300 hitter, Damon is right there for the batting title, Renteria is a pretty decent hitter. Nixon is pretty good as well.

Lets not try to fit BS into our agendas by saying the sox lineup is better or worse without Ortiz than the Yankees lineup with or without Arod. Both have great hitters infront of them and behind them in the batting order. And I'd go out on a limb and guess that Ortiz has had more ABs with men on base than Arod has.

Yankees without Arod arent in the playoff hunt, end of story. He has been clutch this team despite not hitting as many walkoffs as king kong in fenway, but he is still a better hitter, and a goldglove worthy 3rd baseman.

Now the Yankees minus A-Rod would be Sisters of Mary Community College?

Minus our respective star players, both MVP worthy, the Yankees have three other players with 20+ HRs and another three on the cusp of 20. The Sox have an additional 30+ and one 20+ HR hitters.

To borrow Reggie's quote, "Big Papi is the straw that stirs the drink."