Rex wants to simplify the Offense vs. Pats

[serphnx]

Our offense is like a woman. People that just suck at dealing with women/understanding a Schotty offense think it's just too complex and high level so it's just a matter of learning it, although they think nobody can learn it. People that are great with women or understand offenses know that women talk a lot about nothing and you can safely ignore everything up until the very last sentence, then make a response directed only at that very last state. This is exactly what Favre thought, and what every defense in the NFL has figured out. Gruden perfectly understands the offense, hell, he has designed far more complex in terms of effectiveness offenses himself, and he was thoroughly unimpressed with the offense and dismissive of the shifts.

Hell, Chad Pennington blamed the offense, although I give him credit he did it subtly. I don't like him much but he does in general try not to completely openly destroy a team. That's more of a TO thing.

[PatsFanTX]

Our offense is like a woman. People that just suck at dealing with women/understanding a Schotty offense think it's just too complex and high level so it's just a matter of learning it, although they think nobody can learn it. People that are great with women or understand offenses know that women talk a lot about nothing and you can safely ignore everything up until the very last sentence, then make a response directed only at that very last state. This is exactly what Favre thought, and what every defense in the NFL has figured out. Gruden perfectly understands the offense, hell, he has designed far more complex in terms of effectiveness offenses himself, and he was thoroughly unimpressed with the offense and dismissive of the shifts.

Hell, Chad Pennington blamed the offense, although I give him credit he did it subtly. I don't like him much but he does in general try not to completely openly destroy a team. That's more of a TO thing.

Did you just compare the Jets offense to the ratio of getting laid?

[Sperm Edwards]

In other words, you're hoping the Jets improve on their post-snap activities because their pre-snap doesn't help post-snap.

Yeah, is it that obvious I'm reaching? I should just say this offense sucks and end it there. But we all know I won't.

There's your problem right there...Sanchez isn't very good right now.

You guys want the reigns taken off of him, no? Then let the motion be.

Also...believe it or not...they're probably working on running crisper routes AND those pre-snap motions...An offense needs pre-snap motions against a really good D...that's how you throw them off and force them to show coverages and all that...It's going to be there...I suggest you get over it and let them work.

When Sanchez can execute the offense then all this whining will cease...not anytime sooner. Handing around blame as cheaply as you guys do is part of why this organization had to do so much just to be taken seriously just by their fanbase...Now they're working on the rest of the league.

6 first downs? The excessive motion is not helping him or anyone else on offense. Or is it your suggestion that without the stupid amount of pre-snap garbage we would have had even fewer?

The Ravens have an outstanding defense. Meanwhile they don't hold even the Clowns to 6 first downs. Ever.

[THE ILK]

So we are going to go from run/check down, run/check down, run/check down, punt, to kneel, kneel, kneel, punt?

[SMC]

Yeah, is it that obvious I'm reaching? I should just say this offense sucks and end it there. But we all know I won't.

Yeah, you're reaching.

Besides, we all know that what happens pre-snap is more important than what happens post-snap.

[Integrity28]

Excellent story chap.

Now I just have one observation to make from that story:

You keep ignoring the big picture of what I'm saying so you can have these moments. I enjoy them too.

No, I hear what you are saying... I just don't agree with it. There's a distinct difference.

You think Schotty is great, and Sanchez sucks and Rex is too popular.

I think you are delusional, defending Schotty just because its the unpopular thing to do and altogether full of bologna.

And.. me? I just keep responding to see what kind of reaction I get, maybe.

[KSJets]

Brett Favre is a Grade A douchebag.

No argument there, but if the only QB's that can run this offense are the cerebral, brainy types like Pennington, then what does that say about this offense? The fact is, no QB has ever thrived under this offensive system with Schotty calling the plays. The system that Brett was running was tailored to fit him because of his bitching, so it's not even the same system we used before and after Brett.

[Don Draper]

All that pre-snap motion is there, to help Sanchez read the defense. If motion is confusing him, then he's doomed.

Also doesn't help, that he was extraordinarily bad throwing the ball to his left last season. So much so, that it will likely be exploited until he can prove he can do it.

[SenorGato]

No, I hear what you are saying... I just don't agree with it. There's a distinct difference.

You think Schotty is great, and Sanchez sucks and Rex is too popular.

I think you are delusional, defending Schotty just because its the unpopular thing to do and altogether full of bologna.

And.. me? I just keep responding to see what kind of reaction I get, maybe.

Wtf were we talking about again?

[CTM]

Hell, Chad Pennington blamed the offense, although I give him credit he did it subtly. I don't like him much but he does in general try not to completely openly destroy a team. That's more of a TO thing.

Yes, much more character shown by being sneaky about it....

at the end of the day, if Sanchez doesn't get better he'll take the whole thing down with him. A shame cause Tanny's done a pretty good job but Sanchez may be his colossal mistake that he never recovers from.

How good this team is now, we'd have been better served keeping our picks and trading for a McNabb type in the near term. Lets hope Sanchex pulls it together a bit..

[SenorGato]

No argument there, but if the only QB's that can run this offense are the cerebral, brainy types like Pennington, then what does that say about this offense? The fact is, no QB has ever thrived under this offensive system with Schotty calling the plays. The system that Brett was running was tailored to fit him because of his bitching, so it's not even the same system we used before and after Brett.

That all a QB has to do to QB this offense is be a good QB? No? You kept going? Damn.

It is not Brian Schottenheimer's fault that a QB was allowed to pimp smack the coaches whenever he wanted. It is not Brian Schottenheimer's fault that Brett Favre brought his offensive system with him. It is not Brett Favre's fault that the Jets agreed to allow this. It is to his credit that Brett Favre was ready to play in a month. It is to his credit that the new offense worked very well with Favre in the beginning. It is not his fault that Favre then took a sh*t at the finish line. Or that Brett Favre had a considerable amount of power while he was here. That is Brett Favre's fault. Until I get to ask him "hey Mr. Favre, what happened in 2008?" I've chosen to consider him a douche and the reason that season tanked. Favre was gone in 2009. Schotty was here in 2009. That seems like a logical way to look at the Brett Favre situation just based on what I know.

No QB has thrived in this system because the best QB at the helm has been Chad Pennington. Chad Pennington is a mediocre QB. He can play a regular season, and on a truly well built offense he can make a playoff run. In 2006 the starting running back for much of the season was Kevin Barlow. The other RB and starter was a 5-8 195 pound rookie named Leon Washington. Solid player, not someone to build a high scoring run D around. That already tells you that this was not a talented offense. The LT was a rookie. The C was a rookie. The best starting WR was a guy who sat on the bench during his first two years. That is not an offense built to compile monster statistics. They were a creative, ambitious bunch who played well enough for 10 wins and a playoff run. We were using the Wildcat to steal games before the Dolphins were.

2007's offensive roster was even worse than '06. We added Jones and lost Kendall. Add a RB...lose a lineman...Not a great idea IMO. They sh*t the bed. Chad Pennington played terribly, and probably was injured at some point. No amount of Playcall Power could save it. Not even if you fed them all Rare Candies.

Peyton Manning and Tom Brady would not thrive with those rosters. No system in sports is so self sufficient that it can survive with mediocre level talent. I have no idea wtf you guys expected over the last 4 years, but he's done a decent enough job winning with these guys the Jets have had and not the ones you've come to imagine/remember over the years.

Watch over the next 15 games the offense will do what it's got to do to win games. Whatever that is, hopefully they become better at doing it so that winning will be easier. That's how it gets done with an early career QB. Not firing someone because you f*cking lost a game. That would be dumb.

[Larz]

I just with they would all just STFU already

enough telling everybody everything !!!

hard knocks is ******* over !!!!!

I don't think a team has ever made it so easy for belicheat*

ever

the offense is clearly going to try to pass more and go downfield more

might as well put the plays on the jumbotrons ahead of time

defense is so worried about penalties, I'd quick snap them or go no huddle.

[serphnx]

Did you just compare the Jets offense to the ratio of getting laid?

Well, the Jets offense makes me give up and look at porn, if that means anything.

[Aten]

I think you are delusional, defending Schotty just because its the unpopular thing to do and altogether full of bologna.

Do you really believe that? Do you think that you can accurately apportion credit and/or blame for the offense's performance to the coordinator just because you watch the games? Do you think that Gato can too, and that his insistence that he can't is just him being contrarian? He knows enough to know that he doesn't know anything, which is frankly the only nondelusional position being espoused here.

[NJ]

Pot, kettle.

I can appreciate the "contrarian" routine to an extent. Now you are just being a jackass, and not in the "shenanigans" capacity, but in the "something tells me this guy got swirlies in high school" sorta way.

At the very least, stuffed into garbage cans. And high school was just a couple years ago so he's still healing. Reasonable debate is a good part of what the board is all about, being the contrarian on every issue to get attention is a tiring act.

[SenorGato]

At the very least, stuffed into garbage cans. And high school was just a couple years ago so he's still healing. Reasonable debate is a good part of what the board is all about, being the contrarian on every issue to get attention is a tiring act.

All I read was "WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH! WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH! WAAAAAAAAAAAAAH! Gato dares disagree! WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH! WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH!"

I'm debating reasonably. I haven't said sh*t to you guys to get sh*t replies like that one. Suck my balls.

I'm not disagreeing with you because I think it's fun to disagree with you. I'm disagreeing with you because most of your premises are weak, flimsy, and easily retorted. When you can explain to me exactly what a better coordinator does and how one improves gameplanning and playcalling (based on the nothing you know of the Jets' actual offensive gameplans), then and only then will I see the err of my ways. Until that day good sir see the last sentence in that middle portion of my post.

[Biggs]

That all a QB has to do to QB this offense is be a good QB? No? You kept going? Damn.

It is not Brian Schottenheimer's fault that a QB was allowed to pimp smack the coaches whenever he wanted. It is not Brian Schottenheimer's fault that Brett Favre brought his offensive system with him. It is not Brett Favre's fault that the Jets agreed to allow this. It is to his credit that Brett Favre was ready to play in a month. It is to his credit that the new offense worked very well with Favre in the beginning. It is not his fault that Favre then took a sh*t at the finish line. Or that Brett Favre had a considerable amount of power while he was here. That is Brett Favre's fault. Until I get to ask him "hey Mr. Favre, what happened in 2008?" I've chosen to consider him a douche and the reason that season tanked. Favre was gone in 2009. Schotty was here in 2009. That seems like a logical way to look at the Brett Favre situation just based on what I know.

No QB has thrived in this system because the best QB at the helm has been Chad Pennington. Chad Pennington is a mediocre QB. He can play a regular season, and on a truly well built offense he can make a playoff run. In 2006 the starting running back for much of the season was Kevin Barlow. The other RB and starter was a 5-8 195 pound rookie named Leon Washington. Solid player, not someone to build a high scoring run D around. That already tells you that this was not a talented offense. The LT was a rookie. The C was a rookie. The best starting WR was a guy who sat on the bench during his first two years. That is not an offense built to compile monster statistics. They were a creative, ambitious bunch who played well enough for 10 wins and a playoff run. We were using the Wildcat to steal games before the Dolphins were.

2007's offensive roster was even worse than '06. We added Jones and lost Kendall. Add a RB...lose a lineman...Not a great idea IMO. They sh*t the bed. Chad Pennington played terribly, and probably was injured at some point. No amount of Playcall Power could save it. Not even if you fed them all Rare Candies.

Peyton Manning and Tom Brady would not thrive with those rosters. No system in sports is so self sufficient that it can survive with mediocre level talent. I have no idea wtf you guys expected over the last 4 years, but he's done a decent enough job winning with these guys the Jets have had and not the ones you've come to imagine/remember over the years.

Watch over the next 15 games the offense will do what it's got to do to win games. Whatever that is, hopefully they become better at doing it so that winning will be easier. That's how it gets done with an early career QB. Not firing someone because you f*cking lost a game. That would be dumb.

I agree with you that its tough to judge Shotty fully with the QB we have and the HC basically telling the QB and the OC not to lose games. Tough hand.

At the end of the day Sanchez is much more important than Shotty and while learning and growth isn't linear, if the backsliding we have seen all preseason and the first real game continues than Shotty simply has to go at the end of this year or if we are out of the hunt later in the season.

[SenorGato]

I agree with you that its tough to judge Shotty fully with the QB we have and the HC basically telling the QB and the OC not to lose games. Tough hand.

At the end of the day Sanchez is much more important than Shotty and while learning and growth isn't linear, if the backsliding we have seen all preseason and the first real game continues than Shotty simply has to go at the end of this year or if we are out of the hunt later in the season.

If the team/offense disappoints this year then I'll be happy to see Schottenheimer go. I even have a small list of guys I'd like to see replace him already. I think it'd be the perfect time for someone in this league to start raiding the Cardinals coaching staff.

[NJ]

All I read was "WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH! WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH! WAAAAAAAAAAAAAH! Gato dares disagree! WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH! WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH!"

I'm debating reasonably. I haven't said sh*t to you guys to get sh*t replies like that one. Suck my balls.

Thanks for the offering Gattomon, but want nothing to do with your "privates". Got to catch a plane - but I'll be back to your post in a bit.

[Integrity28]

If the team/offense disappoints this year then I'll be happy to see Schottenheimer go. I even have a small list of guys I'd like to see replace him already. I think it'd be the perfect time for someone in this league to start raiding the Cardinals coaching staff.

Just so we know... what does "disappoints" mean to you?

You've made it perfectly clear that finishing in the bottom half of the league in total offense is OKAY. So... elaborate.

[SenorGato]

Just so we know... what does "disappoints" mean to you?

You've made it perfectly clear that finishing in the bottom half of the league in total offense is OKAY. So... elaborate.

They play like they did on Monday...all the time.

Also, that second part is bullsh*t and you know it. Which offense between '06 and '09 should have been expected to finish in the top 10? Please note that in '08 the Jets finished 9th in points scored...despite the offense tanking in the last 5 games.

Why must we play these games, my love?

[Jetsfan80]

They play like they did on Monday...all the time.

So the Jets would need to have the worst offensive output in franchise history.....for 16 games....for you to want to fire Schottenheimer. Got it.

[SenorGato]

So the Jets would need to have the worst offensive output in franchise history.....for 16 games....for you to want to fire Schottenheimer. Got it.

As usual you're right on it.

[BP]

Maybe more play action pass on 1st down. more slants and more screens? maybe just maybe try and keep the defense guessing? it's ok to be conservative, you just cant be predictable. the Ravens knew what was coming on each play it seemed. if the offense is unpredictable at least Sanchez will have a chance to succeed.

[Biggs]

Just so we know... what does "disappoints" mean to you?

You've made it perfectly clear that finishing in the bottom half of the league in total offense is OKAY. So... elaborate.

I would be happy if in year 2 with an unproven lead back a second year QB that we finish in the middle of the pack, have decent TOP, win the turnover battle week to week that might actually win us the division.

What would be wrong with that this year? The problem isn't being in the middle of the pack, the problem is being in the middle of the pack with a bad turnover ration, low TOP and losses because of it. The problem is if we play like we did on Monday night we aren't going to be in the middle of the pack on O we are going to be bottom 4.

[Bleedin Green]

Do you really believe that? Do you think that you can accurately apportion credit and/or blame for the offense's performance to the coordinator just because you watch the games? Do you think that Gato can too, and that his insistence that he can't is just him being contrarian? He knows enough to know that he doesn't know anything, which is frankly the only nondelusional position being espoused here.

Ah, but this is where you're mistaken. Gato is not saying he can't, he is simply saying he won't. In his mind, Schotty is completely blameless, he's made that point excessively clear. Did you not read his last post prior to yours? He went through to specifically credit Schotty for every bit of success that was had while completely absolving him of any and all blame for any time the Jets offense struggled in his four seasons with the team.

Any and all arguments defending Schotty from anyone have been all filled with a list of excuses a mile long why things aren't his fault. The only problem is, any time you're spending so much time in an argument making excuses, a hell of a lot more often than not, you're wrong. There's zero evidence to actually support a theory that Schotty is a good OC, all I've seen are some pretty weak justifications of why it's possible that he might not be completely god awful. That doesn't say so much for him now does it?