Our current situation started on Nov 8 2015

[SOJ]

28 minutes ago, BigRy56 said:

He's a stop gap quarterback while we look for a long term solution. I really don't see how he set us back years... Geno wouldn't be starting and neither would Petty as Geno is surely not and Petty is probably not a long term option. Our quarterback would be Hoyer or McCown instead because a stopgap is as good as it's going to get until we find a young franchise qb.. and we don't have one on the roster.

You really do not know if Petty is or isn't but he did out play all QB on the roster in PS didn't he.

[BigRy56]

Just now, SOJ said:

You really do not know if Petty is or isn't but he did out play all QB on the roster in PS didn't he.

The raw truth is if Petty was good enough, he would start.

A lot of back up quarterbacks look good in preseason. I'm not saying he isn't the answer but it's at least an 85% shot that he's not.

[jack48]

1 hour ago, JiF said:

Your conquering hero and the unwavering support from this jackass Head Coach has made this team a stick in the mud going absolutely nowhere.

 

Frankly when i watch Fitz display his physical "tools" out there, I am embarassed for this franchise.  He also does not show a lot of smart, Harvard or no Harvard.

[jack48]

6 minutes ago, BigRy56 said:

The raw truth is if Petty was good enough, he would start.

A lot of back up quarterbacks look good in preseason. I'm not saying he isn't the answer but it's at least an 85% shot that he's not.

You are probably right.  But I am pretty sure he can throw the kind of INTs Fitz is throwing with ease.  And he can also throw it down the  field a lot better, and keep Robby Andersen and Charon Peake alive a little longer.

[j4jets]

22 minutes ago, Integrity28 said:

lol, nah... I am routinely pulled aside and asked to stop stringing the dumb posters along. it makes the site unreadable at times. 

I don't doubt that one bit. Except, it's your own intelligence that makes it unreadable. 

22 minutes ago, Integrity28 said:

you go ahead and convince yourself of whatever you need to... you started this back up, and once again end up looking foolish.

Always the chicken-out fall back when you can't add anything useful to the debate. 

[BigRy56]

5 minutes ago, jack48 said:

You are probably right.  But I am pretty sure he can throw the kind of INTs Fitz is throwing with ease.  And he can also throw it down the  field a lot better, and keep Robby Andersen and Charon Peake alive a little longer.

This is a fair point and Petty may get his chance this year... but he wouldn't have gotten his shot at the start of the season, it doesn't matter if Fitz was on the roster or not.

Therefore I really don't think Fitz set this team back at all.

[Integrity28]

7 minutes ago, j4jets said:

I don't doubt that one bit. Except, it's your own intelligence that makes it unreadable. 

Always the chicken-out fall back when you can't add anything useful to the debate. 

Well yes, for those with a reading level like yours, sure. 

There is no debate here. There's you saying a bunch of stupid things, and me pointing and laughing. 

You are a living, breathing meatball pitch.

[Integrity28]

So, he still hasn't figured out the math problem yet?

[j4jets]

Just now, Integrity28 said:

Well yes, for those with a reading level like yours, sure. 

There is no debate here. There's you saying a bunch of stupid things, and me pointing and laughing. 

You are a living, breathing meatball pitch.

And I keep poking holes in your fantasy world. 

[Integrity28]

Just now, j4jets said:

And I keep poking holes in your fantasy world. 

Actually, that is my pant leg, needle dick.

[j4jets]

1 minute ago, Integrity28 said:

So, he still hasn't figured out the math problem yet?

Like the one where I suggested we don't sign Fitz and save $12mil? I thought that was your shortcoming? Well, there you have it. Try hard next time. 

[Ken Schroy]

1 hour ago, 56mehl56 said:

Don't worry you guys will get your chance if Geno ever starts a game. The funny thing is his supporters have been constantly attacked and he hasn't even started a game this season. Now that Fitz is hopefully being rightfully put in his place (bench) its the Fitznuts turn to get piled on .

Newsflash.....

Fitz was ok last year, shouldn't have been resigned. IMHO

Geno sux. IMHO

[Integrity28]

37 minutes ago, JiF said:

It's not about Geno.  And the Fitz fiasco absolutely has set the franchise back.  Especially considering our bozo head coach is still behind him and plans on trotting him out again. It was a mistake from day 1 to stick with Fitz.  We're learning nothing about this team and that's what these past 2 years were supposed to be about. See what you have so you can plan for the future.  You cant assess what you have when you're QB is the worst in the league.  It impacts everything and now you're left with unanswered questions because you committed to Ryan Fitzpatrick as your savior.

I read a stat today that Fitz would be better of grounding the ball/dirting the ball instead of attempting a pass in the face of pressure.  That's how bad he's been.  You cant make any assumptions on this roster (other than the CB's can cover) that is helpful for the future of the team when your QB play is that bad. 

"Under pressure this season, Fitzpatrick has completed only 42.6 percent of his passes, for an average of 4.8 yards per attempt and a passer rating of 35.7. To be clear, his passer rating under pressure is worse than if he had just thrown the ball to the turf every snap, and that doesn’t even factor in the yards lost due to sacks."

 

 

I don't think you understand what I'm saying. Find the post where I spell it out fully. Geno has cost us more "years" than Fitz, by a long shot. 

[j4jets]

47 minutes ago, Integrity28 said:

Only time I ever rooted for us to lose out on the season was in the last couple weeks of 2013. You aren't making a point, and you certainly don't have the chutzpah to get under my skin. If you want to keep slamming your hand in the door, I'm happy to point and laugh.

 

 

1 minute ago, Integrity28 said:

Actually, that is my pant leg, needle dick.

Wait, I wasn't even trying yet. 

 

[Warfish]

39 minutes ago, JiF said:

And the Fitz fiasco absolutely has set the franchise back.

In what way?

What is your "if we hadn't signed Fitz, we'd have....." belief that we did not achieve?

Where do you see this franchise today had we never signed Fitz?

[UnitedWhofans]

Impatient franchise leads to impatient things

[Integrity28]

2 minutes ago, j4jets said:

Like the one where I suggested we don't sign Fitz and save $12mil? I thought that was your shortcoming? Well, there you have it. Try hard next time. 

Apparently not.

Do you blame educated people for all  your problems in life, or do you simply restrict it to football?

[Integrity28]

Just now, Warfish said:

In what way?

What is your "if we hadn't signed Fitz, we'd have....." belief that we did not achieve?

Where do you see this franchise today had we never signed Fitz?

If we hadn't signed Fitz, and say started Geno. We might have 1-2 more wins. The defense is losing us games too. Nobody wants to talk about that, because it's more complicated than blabbering about the QB. 

Drafting Geno took us out of the QB market for Bridgewater, Carr, Garrapolo. If we'd taken one of them, then we aren't trading for Fitz to compete with Geno, and neither of them ends up starting for us again. We're also not in a situation where we're wondering what we have in Petty and Hack. 

Fitz never prevented us from taking another QB. We've drafted a QB in both years that Fitz has been here, and even considered trading up for Goff/Wentz. Next year, we have 2 QBs on the roster and they are both QBs drafted while Fitz is here. That's not a setback. That's a transition. Every year since we've drafted Geno has been a setback, becasue everything we've done since drafting him is a reaction to him not being good at football.

[j4jets]

12 minutes ago, Integrity28 said:

Apparently not.

Do you blame educated people for all  your problems in life, or do you simply restrict it to football?

Try harder. Im sure you're used to hearing that pretty often. 

[FTL Jet Fan]

Truth be told Mac is to blame for Fitz. 

[southparkcpa]

1 hour ago, Integrity28 said:

The difference between me and the lot of you. I never wanted the chance. Geno playing football means the season is over. I don't root for that.

I would add that Fitz failing in no way whatsoever ratifies any of the pro-Geno arguments that have been made. Everything about Geno's history, plus his limited snaps last night, point to him being awful. 

So, when it's all said and done. You guys rooted for the season to go to sh*t, so you could spin it as being right about Fitz, while still being wrong about Geno.

This is what you call lose/lose. At the end of the day, I argued on behalf of sound logic. I'll always stand by that, regardless as to whether circumstances produced "broken clock" outcomes. 

GEno win 8 games his rookie year with basically no weapons.    HE was thrown under the bus.

We never developed him.  I think he sucks.... but we failed him too.

[JiFtheOracle]

42 minutes ago, Integrity28 said:

I don't think you understand what I'm saying. Find the post where I spell it out fully. Geno has cost us more "years" than Fitz, by a long shot. 

The very first sentence in that post was, "This isnt about Geno."

[Integrity28]

34 minutes ago, JiF said:

The very first sentence in that post was, "This isnt about Geno."

Which is what prompted my reply. 

[DRJETS]

To be fair to Geno, he was beating Fitz fair and square during training camp b4 the jaw incident. So this notion that Fitz was the better QB is ridiculous.  The team was relying on tough defense beating crappy teams as last year schedule was very favorable to our team and Bowles decided to go with the hot hand at the moment.  Fitz is a fraud journeyman who took the Bills and Jets to the bank. 

[Mike135]

46 weeks until the next meaningful Jet game.  Can't wait!

[Jetsfan80]

13 hours ago, southparkcpa said:

GEno win 8 games his rookie year with basically no weapons.    HE was thrown under the bus.

That season was a farce.  We were outscored by 97 points that season.  We had no business being 8-8, and Geno deserves no credit for that.  We had the look of a 5-11 team that year, and that was cemented even more by the fact that basically the same team went 4-12 the following season. 

Argue all you want that we never gave Geno the tools to succeed.  But let's stop pretending like his rookie year performance was a smashing success. 

[Jet Nut]

16 hours ago, Beerfish said:

Don't make yourself look any stupider than you have looked over the past year or so.  I know it will be hard but you should try harder.

 

15 hours ago, j4jets said:

He's got a point. Cut your nonsense and face the reality. Fitz was NEVER the answer and he proved it.

Somehow being right about Fitz makes people stupid.  And being wrong about Fitz gives some reason to question another's intelligence? 

[Jet Nut]

12 hours ago, DRJETS said:

To be fair to Geno, he was beating Fitz fair and square during training camp b4 the jaw incident. So this notion that Fitz was the better QB is ridiculous.  The team was relying on tough defense beating crappy teams as last year schedule was very favorable to our team and Bowles decided to go with the hot hand at the moment.  Fitz is a fraud journeyman who took the Bills and Jets to the bank. 

Mike Weshoff and others will tell you that nothing change this year.  That in every practice Geno is the better QB.  The national guys mentioned it Monday night.  Weshoff went further and has said that watching Fitz in practice he sees how easy it would be to play defense against him. 

For all the bullshlt Fitz fans pile on Geno the problem isn't that Geno isn't that good, the problem is they're too busy piling on Geno to realize that Fitz sucks even more.  

[j4jets]

4 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

 

Somehow being right about Fitz makes people stupid.  And being wrong about Fitz gives some reason to question another's intelligence? 

Yeah, not sure what's up with that. It's like if you support the Harvard dude, you're smart, otherwise you're not. These Fitznut huggers...

[Jet Nut]

29 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

That season was a farce.  We were outscored by 97 points that season.  We had no business being 8-8, and Geno deserves no credit for that.  We had the look of a 5-11 team that year, and that was cemented even more by the fact that basically the same team went 4-12 the following season. 

Argue all you want that we never gave Geno the tools to succeed.  But let's stop pretending like his rookie year performance was a smashing success. 

You missed his point.  He said he sucks but wasn't developed and was thrown under the bus.  

Hes 100% right.  He was thrown into the starting position when he was nowhere near ready, without any tools. The rest is on Geno 

[southparkcpa]

47 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

That season was a farce.  We were outscored by 97 points that season.  We had no business being 8-8, and Geno deserves no credit for that.  We had the look of a 5-11 team that year, and that was cemented even more by the fact that basically the same team went 4-12 the following season. 

Argue all you want that we never gave Geno the tools to succeed.  But let's stop pretending like his rookie year performance was a smashing success. 

No one is anointing him...  he was simply given a shilty team, no support and he did , IMO, a better than expected job. His regression in the next year was troubling. To deny that we the JETS dont develop players well is simple denial of facts.

[Jetsfan80]

3 minutes ago, southparkcpa said:

No one is anointing him...  he was simply given a shilty team, no support and he did , IMO, a better than expected job. His regression in the next year was troubling. To deny that we the JETS dont develop players well is simple denial of facts.

We certainly don't.  But we also don't EVALUATE players well before we draft them either.  Hence how this organization hasn't drafted a good QB since Ken O'Brien (and even then passed on Dan Marino to take him). 

Drafting sh*tty QB's and then doing nothing to help them does nobody any good.  But both are true.  Geno was both sh*tty AND given little help. 

And there really wasn't much of a "regression" for Geno, just like Sanchez didn't "regress" from 2010 to 2011.  They were never really any good to begin with.  There was always hope for both QB's that the lightbulb would "flip on" but it's not like either went from good to bad.  They were already bad and got worse. 

[southparkcpa]

2 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

We certainly don't.  But we also don't EVALUATE players well before we draft them either.  Hence how this organization hasn't drafted a good QB since Ken O'Brien (and even then passed on Dan Marino to take him). 

Drafting sh*tty QB's and then doing nothing to help them does nobody any good.  But both are true.  Geno was both sh*tty AND given little help. 

And there really wasn't much of a "regression" for Geno, just like Sanchez didn't "regress" from 2010 to 2011.  They were never really any good to begin with. 

I wont argue your point as I agree with it  generally but look at Alex Smith in KC. He was all but toast after 2-3 years as he wasn't put in a situation to be successful.

I heard a very good argument that he is the most reliable QB in the AFC west.  You would put him in the he sucks and Jets cant draft category.

Sanchez was the number 1 QB in the country as a HS senior.  Whether its him or another player, they need to be developed. Taught to respect the ball, limit turnovers, read a defense.

They still might fail but I think we both agree that Alex Smith, if drafted by the JETS would be coaching at UNCC and Flacco would have a cigar ring, not a SB ring.

[slats]

A lot of fans and the local media were completely duped by a journeyman QB playing the easiest schedule in the league. And I don't know which is worse when it comes to the GM and head coach - were they also duped? Or did they succumb to pressure from the fans and media? Either way, my confidence in these guys was significantly reduced when they opted to cave to Fitzpatrick and give him his $12M. Since then, my opinion has only dropped further. 

I can't recall a football season in which I've been less interested than this one. I went to bed at halftime on Monday, and was rewarded in the morning when I found out I missed nothing but more crap from this team. 

I agree with most of the original post in this thread. I'd've liked to've seen Geno last year playing for these coaches, with Marshall and Decker to throw to. Doesn't mean that I expected anything great to come of that, but I continue to be more certain that Fitzpatrick isn't a franchise QB than I am that Geno isn't. And I'm pretty sure Geno isn't. 

Whether or not this team is set back years depends upon how soon they're willing to admit their mistake with Fitz and tie him to the bench. I don't care if Geno gets another snap -he's not gonna be here next year, either- but they really need to get a taste of Petty and/or Hackenberg in real game action heading into the offseason so they know for certain just how dire the QB situation is (or perhaps, miraculously, isn't) before they make their offseason/draft plans. 

[Jetsfan80]

11 minutes ago, southparkcpa said:

I wont argue your point as I agree with it  generally but look at Alex Smith in KC. He was all but toast after 2-3 years as he wasn't put in a situation to be successful.

I heard a very good argument that he is the most reliable QB in the AFC west.  You would put him in the he sucks and Jets cant draft category.

Sanchez was the number 1 QB in the country as a HS senior.  Whether its him or another player, they need to be developed. Taught to respect the ball, limit turnovers, read a defense.

They still might fail but I think we both agree that Alex Smith, if drafted by the JETS would be coaching at UNCC and Flacco would have a cigar ring, not a SB ring.

 

Alex Smith will never take a franchise to the next level because of his aversion to taking risks.  I get that he's the posterboy for QB's left for dead who eventually made a nice career out of it, but that does NOT mean he's ever been the "right" QB for a franchise.  He can't win put a team on his back in the playoffs.  He just can't.  Even Harbaugh recognized this when he made the switch from Smith to Kaepernick.

For every Alex Smith there are 100 Joey Harrington's who just can't cut it as an NFL QB.