Week 3 - a recap and some observations

[clayton163v]

Where to begin?

Conor McDermott came into the game to replace Fant whose knee was banged up before the game.  He is a inside out backup who can play both guard and both tackle spots.  He too is coming back from a serious knee injury.  It has been a few years with McDermott and he has started Jet games at LT, RT and Guard.  The only time he has played poorly was at LT.  And he has put up plenty of decent reps there too.  Several years ago, he started several games in a row for us at guard.  Nobody remembers because he did just fine.  So he had issues at LT yesterday.  What did you expect?  He was what what we had left after Becton, Brown, and Fant went down.  Injuries are hitting too early.  But I do not blame McDermott.  He is the all purpose backup.  Of course he is going to be up to his ears at tackle.  As for Fant, kudos for playing on a sore knee.  Yeah, I saw the game too.  Too many blind side hits.  Part of this is not the OLs fault. 

While many have lamented that we did not run the ball  enough, we are facing nine man fronts.  You have to throw against them.  The Jets' response to the predictable nine man front - we have faced it all  year - was to throw from the shotgun relentlessly.  Who among us can read the first paragraph and believe that such a plan could work?  My point?  Even if you believe in Joe Cool, you have to concede that he is too immobile for such a plan.  We cannot block well enough to defend his spot long enough for him to step up and throw.  It is the old Kenny O problem. 

Many want to throw rocks at the coach and make pithy comments that his head increasingly resembles a pot roast.  I will defend him a bit.  Many complain about the poor success of the run substitutes yesterday.  Things like screens, draws, end arounds and other gadget plays.  I would argue that these are necessary because we do not block well enough.  We must attack the edges.  We must keep them from creep towards the snap.  I see the coaches trying to make the proper adjustments.  To me, the problem - again - is Joe Cool.  He is what he is.  A pocket passer with poor mobility.  If you give him time and let him step up in the pocket, he is effective.  The Ravens won the bowl with him doing it.  These plays require better ballhandling behind the line of scrimmage.  Some trickery.  Some slight of hand.  From years of practice.  This is just not Joe's game.  As for the coaching on the defense.  We are playing well enough to win.  Every team gets some blown coverages etc.  But we are playing well enough to win.  The problems are when we have the ball.  That was yesterday's game.   

While no amount of stair running will shut up this forum, I will remind everybody that firing the coach and GM all the time is THE PROBLEM.  We have remade the team in the image desired by Saleh.  We are going to have to let it ride.  Please stop with the fire the coach and GM stuff.  It does no good, ruins board discussion, brings you no joy and is beside the point.  Saleh is on a five year deal.  The coach and GM will be with us for at least two more years.  As for Douglas, best GM in 40 years.  Sooner or later the Jets will pick the lucky cards during Go Fish.  Because of Joe, we pick lots of cards.  I remember the alternative.  Don't you?  Few cards and somebody's castoff trundled out as this year's great hope?

Many guys are picking on the skill players on offense.  When Garrett Wilson went down, it took the air out of the bag all across NY.  Those ribs will hurt all season.  While I too want to whine, I know that the "Icky Woods" seasons happen once every ten years.  Rookies seldom lead you to the playoffs.  Nevertheless, we are getting younger and deeper.  I can see the personnel getting better.  When Wilson went out, we brought in Berrios.  We have five decent guys but all but one is young.  I see the potential.  Same too with Hall.  I did not want an early back.  Felt we were not good enough to splurge yet.  But he is here and he is good.  

Now here comes Zach WIlson.  Be honest.  Do any of you really believe that the things I have identified as obvious issues will be improved by the Zach's game?  Does he have decent ballhandling skills?  No.  Will the NFL cease the nine man fronts?  No.  Will Fant get healthy?  Could be rabbet.   Will Garrett Wilson's ribs magically improve?  No.  Will Zach magically begin taking snaps under center.  No, Zach - like Darnold - lives in the shotgun.  Can Zach improve the execution of run substitutes.  No.  It is not his strength.  So as for the wins and losses, I am not too optimistic.  The only way that Zach can get them off him is if he can hit downfield passes early and drive the safeties back.  Joe Cool could not do that, we became one dimensional and they teed off on us.  And not just on Joe Cool.  They began slamming receivers ten yards over the middle because we never hit anything else.  Everything is turning into a buddy pass.  

The offensive line is not good enough right now to run a downfield passing attack.  Because Zach and Joe cannot take snaps under center it is getting unfair to the rest of the offense - the OL included - to keep such one dimensional QBs on the field until we get our house in order.  If we send Zach out there we will not play winning football and I fear he will get hurt.  You know what?  Mike White could probably play 500 football with this team.  Everything we need he does well.  I am not saying he is the truth.  If Zach fails, we reload.  Mike gets to keep the seat warm and all of us know it.  But his polished game will cure much of what ails the offense.

The defense kept giving us multiple chances to win.  Even when the offense dumped another turnover on them.  One touchdown.  Just one more score early in the game and it goes down to the wire.  The defense played them tough.  The game plan was decent.  Joe is awful at selling run substitutes and you must use them when facing nine man fronts.  You cannot throw on every play but your run substitutes must be effective.  White makes them effective.  He should have started the season.  That is on Saleh.  But the team came ready to play yesterday.

So  to the 2022 Jets.  Keep the faith fellas.  You are better than you think.  If we had enjoyed better luck on the offensive line, the Joe Cool plan could have worked.  Zack is going to have to hit downfield passes or it is just more nine man fronts.  I cannot close without mentioning Quincy WIlliams.  He was flying around yesterday.  Best guy on the front seven until he went down with what appeared to be a season ender.  Get well.

 

 

[Greg555]

Yep

”9 man fronts” will continue to be employed

The problem is the O-Line isn’t good enough ..to open up the playbook to combat it successfully.  
Will Zach be able to elude pressure and make plays off schedule?  We won’t win if he can’t.

[Sonny Werblin]

I am most disappointed in the D line. It was supposed to be the strongest position group for the entire team. Well, at least they are being paid like they are supposed to be. They've done nothing this season thus far to distinguish themselves as being anything other than below average. It is truly disheartening.

I also think Ashtyn Davis deserves to at least be splitting time with Joyner, especially in passing situations.

If Quincy his hurt bad (he clearly appears to be) that is a huge blow. Hopefully, Sherwood can step up, finally.

Someone needs to remind the little flower that it is OK to play action pass on first down, and that he needs to stick with the run to keep the O balanced.

And, Oh yeah, Hey Q, if the font 4 did their job and pressured, sacked and/or hit (cleanly) the QB, we wouldn't need to blitz on third down. So, stop yelling at you coach and start yelling at your linemates.

There are some guys with C's on their uniforms, but there is not one leader on this team. Not one.

[Trotter]

My two cents.

we suck.

aside from Garrett Wilson and Gardner, there is not one other player or coach who has any type of impact that is not replaceable.

[LIJetsFan]

OP, I like your emphasis on run substitution plays and that the only QB we have who is capable of that is Mike White.  Later on you say not blame the CS  for losing but isn't it the CS call as to who is under center?  

Also if it's agreed that our #1 and #2 QB's are incapable of doing what need to counter 9 man fronts then how about  Chris Streveler?  If Mike White is the best we've got for this then doesn't Chris also qualify?  Further he'd add the Hail Mary factor into the equation as well.  What do you think?       

[kevinc855]

Clayton......The coach has won 5 football games out of 20. 

The games aren't exciting or close. 

Fans aren't being inpatient if they want to see competitive football. It's not the fans fault, its the Coaches and players fault. Its that simple. 

 

[Augustiniak]

One flawed underlying premise here is that flacco should be the qb.  

[T0mShane]

59 minutes ago, clayton163v said:

You know what?  Mike White could probably play 500 football with this team.  Everything we need he does well. 

[Trotter]

5 minutes ago, kevinc855 said:

Clayton......The coach has won 5 football games out of 20. 

The games aren't exciting or close. 

Fans aren't being inpatient if they want to see competitive football. It's not the fans fault, its the Coaches and players fault. Its that simple. 

 

Sums it up perfectly.

really nothing to be said after this

[Claymation]

44 minutes ago, Sonny Werblin said:

I am most disappointed in the D line. It was supposed to be the strongest position group for the entire team. Well, at least they are being paid like they are supposed to be. They've done nothing this season thus far to distinguish themselves as being anything other than below average. It is truly disheartening.

I also think Ashtyn Davis deserves to at least be splitting time with Joyner, especially in passing situations.

If Quincy his hurt bad (he clearly appears to be) that is a huge blow. Hopefully, Sherwood can step up, finally.

Someone needs to remind the little flower that it is OK to play action pass on first down, and that he needs to stick with the run to keep the O balanced.

And, Oh yeah, Hey Q, if the font 4 did their job and pressured, sacked and/or hit (cleanly) the QB, we wouldn't need to blitz on third down. So, stop yelling at you coach and start yelling at your linemates.

There are some guys with C's on their uniforms, but there is not one leader on this team. Not one.

Harris was playing instead of Sherwood.

[kdels62]

1 hour ago, clayton163v said:

Where to begin?

Conor McDermott came into the game to replace Fant whose knee was banged up before the game.  He is a inside out backup who can play both guard and both tackle spots.  He too is coming back from a serious knee injury.  It has been a few years with McDermott and he has started Jet games at LT, RT and Guard.  The only time he has played poorly was at LT.  And he has put up plenty of decent reps there too.  Several years ago, he started several games in a row for us at guard.  Nobody remembers because he did just fine.  So he had issues at LT yesterday.  What did you expect?  He was what what we had left after Becton, Brown, and Fant went down.  Injuries are hitting too early.  But I do not blame McDermott.  He is the all purpose backup.  Of course he is going to be up to his ears at tackle.  As for Fant, kudos for playing on a sore knee.  Yeah, I saw the game too.  Too many blind side hits.  Part of this is not the OLs fault. 

While many have lamented that we did not run the ball  enough, we are facing nine man fronts.  You have to throw against them.  The Jets' response to the predictable nine man front - we have faced it all  year - was to throw from the shotgun relentlessly.  Who among us can read the first paragraph and believe that such a plan could work?  My point?  Even if you believe in Joe Cool, you have to concede that he is too immobile for such a plan.  We cannot block well enough to defend his spot long enough for him to step up and throw.  It is the old Kenny O problem. 

Many want to throw rocks at the coach and make pithy comments that his head increasingly resembles a pot roast.  I will defend him a bit.  Many complain about the poor success of the run substitutes yesterday.  Things like screens, draws, end arounds and other gadget plays.  I would argue that these are necessary because we do not block well enough.  We must attack the edges.  We must keep them from creep towards the snap.  I see the coaches trying to make the proper adjustments.  To me, the problem - again - is Joe Cool.  He is what he is.  A pocket passer with poor mobility.  If you give him time and let him step up in the pocket, he is effective.  The Ravens won the bowl with him doing it.  These plays require better ballhandling behind the line of scrimmage.  Some trickery.  Some slight of hand.  From years of practice.  This is just not Joe's game.  As for the coaching on the defense.  We are playing well enough to win.  Every team gets some blown coverages etc.  But we are playing well enough to win.  The problems are when we have the ball.  That was yesterday's game.   

While no amount of stair running will shut up this forum, I will remind everybody that firing the coach and GM all the time is THE PROBLEM.  We have remade the team in the image desired by Saleh.  We are going to have to let it ride.  Please stop with the fire the coach and GM stuff.  It does no good, ruins board discussion, brings you no joy and is beside the point.  Saleh is on a five year deal.  The coach and GM will be with us for at least two more years.  As for Douglas, best GM in 40 years.  Sooner or later the Jets will pick the lucky cards during Go Fish.  Because of Joe, we pick lots of cards.  I remember the alternative.  Don't you?  Few cards and somebody's castoff trundled out as this year's great hope?

Many guys are picking on the skill players on offense.  When Garrett Wilson went down, it took the air out of the bag all across NY.  Those ribs will hurt all season.  While I too want to whine, I know that the "Icky Woods" seasons happen once every ten years.  Rookies seldom lead you to the playoffs.  Nevertheless, we are getting younger and deeper.  I can see the personnel getting better.  When Wilson went out, we brought in Berrios.  We have five decent guys but all but one is young.  I see the potential.  Same too with Hall.  I did not want an early back.  Felt we were not good enough to splurge yet.  But he is here and he is good.  

Now here comes Zach WIlson.  Be honest.  Do any of you really believe that the things I have identified as obvious issues will be improved by the Zach's game?  Does he have decent ballhandling skills?  No.  Will the NFL cease the nine man fronts?  No.  Will Fant get healthy?  Could be rabbet.   Will Garrett Wilson's ribs magically improve?  No.  Will Zach magically begin taking snaps under center.  No, Zach - like Darnold - lives in the shotgun.  Can Zach improve the execution of run substitutes.  No.  It is not his strength.  So as for the wins and losses, I am not too optimistic.  The only way that Zach can get them off him is if he can hit downfield passes early and drive the safeties back.  Joe Cool could not do that, we became one dimensional and they teed off on us.  And not just on Joe Cool.  They began slamming receivers ten yards over the middle because we never hit anything else.  Everything is turning into a buddy pass.  

The offensive line is not good enough right now to run a downfield passing attack.  Because Zach and Joe cannot take snaps under center it is getting unfair to the rest of the offense - the OL included - to keep such one dimensional QBs on the field until we get our house in order.  If we send Zach out there we will not play winning football and I fear he will get hurt.  You know what?  Mike White could probably play 500 football with this team.  Everything we need he does well.  I am not saying he is the truth.  If Zach fails, we reload.  Mike gets to keep the seat warm and all of us know it.  But his polished game will cure much of what ails the offense.

The defense kept giving us multiple chances to win.  Even when the offense dumped another turnover on them.  One touchdown.  Just one more score early in the game and it goes down to the wire.  The defense played them tough.  The game plan was decent.  Joe is awful at selling run substitutes and you must use them when facing nine man fronts.  You cannot throw on every play but your run substitutes must be effective.  White makes them effective.  He should have started the season.  That is on Saleh.  But the team came ready to play yesterday.

So  to the 2022 Jets.  Keep the faith fellas.  You are better than you think.  If we had enjoyed better luck on the offensive line, the Joe Cool plan could have worked.  Zack is going to have to hit downfield passes or it is just more nine man fronts.  I cannot close without mentioning Quincy WIlliams.  He was flying around yesterday.  Best guy on the front seven until he went down with what appeared to be a season ender.  Get well.

 

 

Hard disagree on basically everything 

[JoeNamathsFurCoat]

LOL Saleh "I've won Super Bowls [and I've lost Super Bowls]"

Dude was a "defensive quality control" coach on the 2013 Seattle team that won it all

Pete Carroll and Dan Quinn ran that defense

[PS17]

17 minutes ago, kevinc855 said:

Clayton......The coach has won 5 football games out of 20. 

The games aren't exciting or close. 

Fans aren't being inpatient if they want to see competitive football. It's not the fans fault, its the Coaches and players fault. Its that simple. 

 

In the Premier League in England, coaches get sacked if they have a brutal 1-2 month stretch. Four years for Saleh? Give me a break. I said it yesterday: 20 games into his regime there is not one positive thing he can point to re: his coaching, particularly on the defensive side. 

[clayton163v]

2 hours ago, Greg555 said:

Yep

”9 man fronts” will continue to be employed

The problem is the O-Line isn’t good enough ..to open up the playbook to combat it successfully.  
Will Zach be able to elude pressure and make plays off schedule?  We won’t win if he can’t.

I agree.  The nine man fronts will not disappear until we connect downtown.  Garrett Wilson had begun to scare them.  Sigh. 

2 hours ago, Sonny Werblin said:

I am most disappointed in the D line. It was supposed to be the strongest position group for the entire team. Well, at least they are being paid like they are supposed to be. They've done nothing this season thus far to distinguish themselves as being anything other than below average. It is truly disheartening.

I TOO WANTED THEM TO GET THERE EARLY AND OFTEN.  IT HAS NOT HAPPENED.  NEVERTHELESS, WE  WERE  IN YESTERDAY'S GAME AND HAD OUR CHANCES.  UNLIKE LAST WEEK, THE D-LINE HELD ITS OWN.  BUT I AGREE, I HAD HOPED FOR BETTER.  I THINK THAT IS WHAT IS REALLY BEHIND YESTERDAY'S SIDELINE BLOWUP.  I THINK THEY HAD HOPED FOR BETTER TOO.  AT LEAST JOHNSON FLASHED FOR A PLAY WITH A NICE TACKLE FOR LOSS WITH TWO BEATEN BLOCKERS. 

SINCE WE ARE BEING CRITICAL, I THINK THAT CLEMONS DOES NOT GET ENOUGH SNAPS.

I also think Ashtyn Davis deserves to at least be splitting time with Joyner, especially in passing situations.

I PREFER TO PLAY YOUNG PLAYERS WHEN THE TEAM IS LOSING.  I WOULD TOSS IN DAVIS AND ADAMS. 

If Quincy his hurt bad (he clearly appears to be) that is a huge blow. Hopefully, Sherwood can step up, finally.

LET'S HOPE SO.

Someone needs to remind the little flower that it is OK to play action pass on first down, and that he needs to stick with the run to keep the O balanced.

I THINK JOE'S PLAY ACTION FOOLS FEW.

And, Oh yeah, Hey Q, if the font 4 did their job and pressured, sacked and/or hit (cleanly) the QB, we wouldn't need to blitz on third down. So, stop yelling at you coach and start yelling at your linemates.

TWAS UGLY.

There are some guys with C's on their uniforms, but there is not one leader on this team. Not one.

WE ARE A VERY YOUNG TEAM.  I LIKE THAT BUT SOME THINGS COME WITH THE YOUTH.

 

2 hours ago, Trotter said:

My two cents.

we suck.

aside from Garrett Wilson and Gardner, there is not one other player or coach who has any type of impact that is not replaceable.

As Parcell's liked to say: "you are what your record says you are".  Yet we really should be 0-3.  My forecast before the season was 5-8 wins.  Given the injuries, it may be the lower end.  Unless Zack has some magic in his bag. 

2 hours ago, LIJetsFan said:

OP, I like your emphasis on run substitution plays and that the only QB we have who is capable of that is Mike White.  Later on you say not blame the CS  for losing but isn't it the CS call as to who is under center?  

SO TRUE.  AS I WROTE:

"You cannot throw on every play but your run substitutes must be effective.  White makes them effective.  He should have started the season.  That is on Saleh.  But the team came ready to play yesterday."

SO I AGREE.  SALEH PICKED A QB POORLY SUITED TO THE OL'S WEAKNESSES.  STILL, I PREFER TO LEAVE HIM TO HIS WORK RATHER THAN START OVER AGAIN.  WE HAVE TO STOP FIRING EVERYBODY.  I LIKED THE SWITCH TO THE 4-3. 

Also if it's agreed that our #1 and #2 QB's are incapable of doing what need to counter 9 man fronts then how about  Chris Streveler?  If Mike White is the best we've got for this then doesn't Chris also qualify?  Further he'd add the Hail Mary factor into the equation as well.  What do you think?       

LIKE ZACH AND JOE, WHITE AND STREVELER EACH PRESENT DIFFERENT TYPES OF QBS.  AS I HAVE WRITTEN, WHITE OFFERS AN NFL READY TECHNIQUE AND BALL HANDLING SKILLS.  IT MAKES HIM ADEPT AT SCREENS, END AROUNDS ETC.  BEHIND THE LINE, HE REALLY IS QUITE GOOD.  MOREOVER, HE IS RUNNING THE LAFLEUR OFFENSE.  MIKE WILL RUN OUR SCHEME AND COME WHAT MAY, NEXT SEASON THE ENTIRE CLUB WILL BE SCHOOLED ON THE ENTIRE PLAYBOOK.  WHITE WILL GET TO THE LAST PAGES BECAUSE WE WILL ACTUALLY RUN IT.  LATELY, THE QB RUNS FOR HIS LIFE AND THE BACK CHALLENGES NFL LINEBACKERS STRAIGHT UP ALL BECAUSE WE DO NOT SCARE THEM DEEP.  WE NEVER REALLY  RUN THE PLAYBOOK, NOT LIKE THE PACKERS RUN THAT OFFENSE.

STREVELER IS VERY DIFFERENT.  THE CLASSIC CANADIAN QB, HE RUNS AROUND TO EXTEND EVERY PLAY, SELDOM THROWING FROM THE POCKET.  DENIED EVEN A SINGLE PRACTICE SNAP, THE STRV CAME IN AND WINGED IT LIKE A PUBLIC SPEAKER WITHOUT SO MUCH AS AN INDEX CARD.  IT LOOKS GREAT WHEN IT WORKS BUT WITH THE EXCEPTION OF DOUG FLUTIE, I DO NOT RECALL ANYONE EVER SUCCEEDING WITH IT IN THE NFL.  BUT LAMAR JACKSON AND MAHOMES HAVE SUNK THE POCKET PASSER IMO.  SO WHY NOT THE STRV?  STRANGER THINGS HAVE HAPPENED BUT THE ODDS THAT A NON SCHEME PLAYER WILL STEP IN, WING IT AND EXCEL - WELL, IT IS HARD TO BELIEVE.  BUT HE DID SHOW ONE UNERRING SKILL- BESIDES WINNING FOOTBALL- AND THAT WAS AN ACCURATE CATCHABLE BALL.  WHICH IS WHAT IT IS ALL ABOUT.  SO WHO KNOWS?

 

 

1 hour ago, kevinc855 said:

Clayton......The coach has won 5 football games out of 20. 

The games aren't exciting or close. 

Fans aren't being inpatient if they want to see competitive football. It's not the fans fault, its the Coaches and players fault. Its that simple. 

 

THE GAMES ARE NOT EXCITING OR CLOSE BECAUSE THE OFFENSIVE LINE COLLAPSED.  WE ARE DOWN TO AN INSIDE OUT RESERVE AT LT AND A PROMISING ROOKIE AT RT WHOSE SCOUTING REPORT WARNED HE WAS NOT STRONG ENOUGH AND NEEDED A YEAR IN THE PROGRAM. 

THIS STUFF IS NOT SALEH'S FAULT.  NOR DID I ONCE SAY WE WERE GONG PLACES.  WE ARE NOT WINNING THE BATTLE UP FRONT.  THE BENGALS WERE ABLE TO DISRUPT WHAT WE WERE TRYING TO DO. 

 

1 hour ago, Augustiniak said:

One flawed underlying premise here is that flacco should be the qb.  

I WOULD PLAY MIKE WHITE.  NOT BECAUSE I THINK HE IS BETTER THAN JOE OR ZACH, I DO NOT KNOW.  BUT BECAUSE HE ADDS SOMETHING TO THE OFFENSE AND DOES NOT NEED AS MUCH PROTECTION.  NOT BECAUSE HE IS MOBILE, BUT BECAUSE HE CAN RUN THE ENTIRE PLAYBOOK.  HE REALLY SELLS PLAYS IN THE BACKFIELD. 

1 hour ago, Claymation said:

Harris was playing instead of Sherwood.

YES. 

1 hour ago, JoeNamathsFurCoat said:

LOL Saleh "I've won Super Bowls [and I've lost Super Bowls]"

Dude was a "defensive quality control" coach on the 2013 Seattle team that won it all

Pete Carroll and Dan Quinn ran that defense

YES.   I THINK ALL OF US AGREE THAT SALEH TALKS TOO MUCH.  HE ALSO TELLS THE PRESS THINGS THAT HE SHOULD SAY ONLY TO HIS TEAM.  HERM'S CLUBS WERE VIOLENT NASTY TEAMS (THE GIANTS ONLY FORGAVE US THIS SEASON) BUT HERM SAID LITTLE (EXCEPT FOR THE "YOU PLAY TO WIN THE GAME" OUTBURST - WHICH i LIKED).

1 hour ago, PS17 said:

In the Premier League in England, coaches get sacked if they have a brutal 1-2 month stretch. Four years for Saleh? Give me a break. I said it yesterday: 20 games into his regime there is not one positive thing he can point to re: his coaching, particularly on the defensive side. 

THEY GAVE HIM A FIVE YEAR CONTRACT.  I THINK DOUGLAS GOT SEVEN YEARS?  THESE ARE LONG TERM DEALS WITH LOTS OF GUARANTEED MONEY.  LIKE IT OR NOT WE HAVE JUMPED OFF THE PIER. 

NOW, WAS THIS WISE?  I DUNNO. 

[PS17]

Sir why are you screaming 

[92ShaunEllis92]

2 hours ago, kevinc855 said:

Clayton......The coach has won 5 football games out of 20. 

The games aren't exciting or close. 

Fans aren't being inpatient if they want to see competitive football. It's not the fans fault, its the Coaches and players fault. Its that simple. 

 

CORRECTION! 4 games! 
 

Coach Ron has as 25% of the victories  in ONE GAME as opposed to Saleh’s total of 4 wins in 19 games. 
 

GIVE this MAN HIS PROPS! He actually WINS GAMES AS NYJHC!

[Green Truth]

3 hours ago, clayton163v said:

Where to begin?

Conor McDermott came into the game to replace Fant whose knee was banged up before the game.  He is a inside out backup who can play both guard and both tackle spots.  He too is coming back from a serious knee injury.  It has been a few years with McDermott and he has started Jet games at LT, RT and Guard.  The only time he has played poorly was at LT.  And he has put up plenty of decent reps there too.  Several years ago, he started several games in a row for us at guard.  Nobody remembers because he did just fine.  So he had issues at LT yesterday.  What did you expect?  He was what what we had left after Becton, Brown, and Fant went down.  Injuries are hitting too early.  But I do not blame McDermott.  He is the all purpose backup.  Of course he is going to be up to his ears at tackle.  As for Fant, kudos for playing on a sore knee.  Yeah, I saw the game too.  Too many blind side hits.  Part of this is not the OLs fault. 

While many have lamented that we did not run the ball  enough, we are facing nine man fronts.  You have to throw against them.  The Jets' response to the predictable nine man front - we have faced it all  year - was to throw from the shotgun relentlessly.  Who among us can read the first paragraph and believe that such a plan could work?  My point?  Even if you believe in Joe Cool, you have to concede that he is too immobile for such a plan.  We cannot block well enough to defend his spot long enough for him to step up and throw.  It is the old Kenny O problem. 

Many want to throw rocks at the coach and make pithy comments that his head increasingly resembles a pot roast.  I will defend him a bit.  Many complain about the poor success of the run substitutes yesterday.  Things like screens, draws, end arounds and other gadget plays.  I would argue that these are necessary because we do not block well enough.  We must attack the edges.  We must keep them from creep towards the snap.  I see the coaches trying to make the proper adjustments.  To me, the problem - again - is Joe Cool.  He is what he is.  A pocket passer with poor mobility.  If you give him time and let him step up in the pocket, he is effective.  The Ravens won the bowl with him doing it.  These plays require better ballhandling behind the line of scrimmage.  Some trickery.  Some slight of hand.  From years of practice.  This is just not Joe's game.  As for the coaching on the defense.  We are playing well enough to win.  Every team gets some blown coverages etc.  But we are playing well enough to win.  The problems are when we have the ball.  That was yesterday's game.   

While no amount of stair running will shut up this forum, I will remind everybody that firing the coach and GM all the time is THE PROBLEM.  We have remade the team in the image desired by Saleh.  We are going to have to let it ride.  Please stop with the fire the coach and GM stuff.  It does no good, ruins board discussion, brings you no joy and is beside the point.  Saleh is on a five year deal.  The coach and GM will be with us for at least two more years.  As for Douglas, best GM in 40 years.  Sooner or later the Jets will pick the lucky cards during Go Fish.  Because of Joe, we pick lots of cards.  I remember the alternative.  Don't you?  Few cards and somebody's castoff trundled out as this year's great hope?

Many guys are picking on the skill players on offense.  When Garrett Wilson went down, it took the air out of the bag all across NY.  Those ribs will hurt all season.  While I too want to whine, I know that the "Icky Woods" seasons happen once every ten years.  Rookies seldom lead you to the playoffs.  Nevertheless, we are getting younger and deeper.  I can see the personnel getting better.  When Wilson went out, we brought in Berrios.  We have five decent guys but all but one is young.  I see the potential.  Same too with Hall.  I did not want an early back.  Felt we were not good enough to splurge yet.  But he is here and he is good.  

Now here comes Zach WIlson.  Be honest.  Do any of you really believe that the things I have identified as obvious issues will be improved by the Zach's game?  Does he have decent ballhandling skills?  No.  Will the NFL cease the nine man fronts?  No.  Will Fant get healthy?  Could be rabbet.   Will Garrett Wilson's ribs magically improve?  No.  Will Zach magically begin taking snaps under center.  No, Zach - like Darnold - lives in the shotgun.  Can Zach improve the execution of run substitutes.  No.  It is not his strength.  So as for the wins and losses, I am not too optimistic.  The only way that Zach can get them off him is if he can hit downfield passes early and drive the safeties back.  Joe Cool could not do that, we became one dimensional and they teed off on us.  And not just on Joe Cool.  They began slamming receivers ten yards over the middle because we never hit anything else.  Everything is turning into a buddy pass.  

The offensive line is not good enough right now to run a downfield passing attack.  Because Zach and Joe cannot take snaps under center it is getting unfair to the rest of the offense - the OL included - to keep such one dimensional QBs on the field until we get our house in order.  If we send Zach out there we will not play winning football and I fear he will get hurt.  You know what?  Mike White could probably play 500 football with this team.  Everything we need he does well.  I am not saying he is the truth.  If Zach fails, we reload.  Mike gets to keep the seat warm and all of us know it.  But his polished game will cure much of what ails the offense.

The defense kept giving us multiple chances to win.  Even when the offense dumped another turnover on them.  One touchdown.  Just one more score early in the game and it goes down to the wire.  The defense played them tough.  The game plan was decent.  Joe is awful at selling run substitutes and you must use them when facing nine man fronts.  You cannot throw on every play but your run substitutes must be effective.  White makes them effective.  He should have started the season.  That is on Saleh.  But the team came ready to play yesterday.

So  to the 2022 Jets.  Keep the faith fellas.  You are better than you think.  If we had enjoyed better luck on the offensive line, the Joe Cool plan could have worked.  Zack is going to have to hit downfield passes or it is just more nine man fronts.  I cannot close without mentioning Quincy WIlliams.  He was flying around yesterday.  Best guy on the front seven until he went down with what appeared to be a season ender.  Get well.

 

 

Blah Blah Blah, this team is terribly coached and unless Wilson is the second coming of Aaron Rodgers, this team will stink all year. They can't overcome the terrible coaching and terrible penalties. They will be down 14-0 before the end of the 2nd quarter next week and I am hoping I am wrong. They should be 0-3 but they won against a team that decided to sleepwalk through 1 minute and 55 seconds. Their schedule is very tough and don't consider the games against JAX, Detroit and Seattle as possible wins. Those teams are better coached and The Jets will lose all 3.

They scored 1 garbage time touchdown in 2 home games. Let that sink in for a minute. The next home game against Miami, the place will be swamped with Miami fans.

It is all about Zachary "Milf-man" Wilson going forward.

Now I am ready for all the down votes, but the people that have been here for many years know that I am correct.

[CanadienJetsFan]

4 hours ago, clayton163v said:

Where to begin?

Conor McDermott came into the game to replace Fant whose knee was banged up before the game.  He is a inside out backup who can play both guard and both tackle spots.  He too is coming back from a serious knee injury.  It has been a few years with McDermott and he has started Jet games at LT, RT and Guard.  The only time he has played poorly was at LT.  And he has put up plenty of decent reps there too.  Several years ago, he started several games in a row for us at guard.  Nobody remembers because he did just fine.  So he had issues at LT yesterday.  What did you expect?  He was what what we had left after Becton, Brown, and Fant went down.  Injuries are hitting too early.  But I do not blame McDermott.  He is the all purpose backup.  Of course he is going to be up to his ears at tackle.  As for Fant, kudos for playing on a sore knee.  Yeah, I saw the game too.  Too many blind side hits.  Part of this is not the OLs fault. 

While many have lamented that we did not run the ball  enough, we are facing nine man fronts.  You have to throw against them.  The Jets' response to the predictable nine man front - we have faced it all  year - was to throw from the shotgun relentlessly.  Who among us can read the first paragraph and believe that such a plan could work?  My point?  Even if you believe in Joe Cool, you have to concede that he is too immobile for such a plan.  We cannot block well enough to defend his spot long enough for him to step up and throw.  It is the old Kenny O problem. 

Many want to throw rocks at the coach and make pithy comments that his head increasingly resembles a pot roast.  I will defend him a bit.  Many complain about the poor success of the run substitutes yesterday.  Things like screens, draws, end arounds and other gadget plays.  I would argue that these are necessary because we do not block well enough.  We must attack the edges.  We must keep them from creep towards the snap.  I see the coaches trying to make the proper adjustments.  To me, the problem - again - is Joe Cool.  He is what he is.  A pocket passer with poor mobility.  If you give him time and let him step up in the pocket, he is effective.  The Ravens won the bowl with him doing it.  These plays require better ballhandling behind the line of scrimmage.  Some trickery.  Some slight of hand.  From years of practice.  This is just not Joe's game.  As for the coaching on the defense.  We are playing well enough to win.  Every team gets some blown coverages etc.  But we are playing well enough to win.  The problems are when we have the ball.  That was yesterday's game.   

While no amount of stair running will shut up this forum, I will remind everybody that firing the coach and GM all the time is THE PROBLEM.  We have remade the team in the image desired by Saleh.  We are going to have to let it ride.  Please stop with the fire the coach and GM stuff.  It does no good, ruins board discussion, brings you no joy and is beside the point.  Saleh is on a five year deal.  The coach and GM will be with us for at least two more years.  As for Douglas, best GM in 40 years.  Sooner or later the Jets will pick the lucky cards during Go Fish.  Because of Joe, we pick lots of cards.  I remember the alternative.  Don't you?  Few cards and somebody's castoff trundled out as this year's great hope?

Many guys are picking on the skill players on offense.  When Garrett Wilson went down, it took the air out of the bag all across NY.  Those ribs will hurt all season.  While I too want to whine, I know that the "Icky Woods" seasons happen once every ten years.  Rookies seldom lead you to the playoffs.  Nevertheless, we are getting younger and deeper.  I can see the personnel getting better.  When Wilson went out, we brought in Berrios.  We have five decent guys but all but one is young.  I see the potential.  Same too with Hall.  I did not want an early back.  Felt we were not good enough to splurge yet.  But he is here and he is good.  

Now here comes Zach WIlson.  Be honest.  Do any of you really believe that the things I have identified as obvious issues will be improved by the Zach's game?  Does he have decent ballhandling skills?  No.  Will the NFL cease the nine man fronts?  No.  Will Fant get healthy?  Could be rabbet.   Will Garrett Wilson's ribs magically improve?  No.  Will Zach magically begin taking snaps under center.  No, Zach - like Darnold - lives in the shotgun.  Can Zach improve the execution of run substitutes.  No.  It is not his strength.  So as for the wins and losses, I am not too optimistic.  The only way that Zach can get them off him is if he can hit downfield passes early and drive the safeties back.  Joe Cool could not do that, we became one dimensional and they teed off on us.  And not just on Joe Cool.  They began slamming receivers ten yards over the middle because we never hit anything else.  Everything is turning into a buddy pass.  

The offensive line is not good enough right now to run a downfield passing attack.  Because Zach and Joe cannot take snaps under center it is getting unfair to the rest of the offense - the OL included - to keep such one dimensional QBs on the field until we get our house in order.  If we send Zach out there we will not play winning football and I fear he will get hurt.  You know what?  Mike White could probably play 500 football with this team.  Everything we need he does well.  I am not saying he is the truth.  If Zach fails, we reload.  Mike gets to keep the seat warm and all of us know it.  But his polished game will cure much of what ails the offense.

The defense kept giving us multiple chances to win.  Even when the offense dumped another turnover on them.  One touchdown.  Just one more score early in the game and it goes down to the wire.  The defense played them tough.  The game plan was decent.  Joe is awful at selling run substitutes and you must use them when facing nine man fronts.  You cannot throw on every play but your run substitutes must be effective.  White makes them effective.  He should have started the season.  That is on Saleh.  But the team came ready to play yesterday.

So  to the 2022 Jets.  Keep the faith fellas.  You are better than you think.  If we had enjoyed better luck on the offensive line, the Joe Cool plan could have worked.  Zack is going to have to hit downfield passes or it is just more nine man fronts.  I cannot close without mentioning Quincy WIlliams.  He was flying around yesterday.  Best guy on the front seven until he went down with what appeared to be a season ender.  Get well.

 

 

You make a compelling argument for the staying the course, being patient, etc.

and for that, be ready to be raked over the coals.

[Kendan]

Good post. I agree with most of the points of the OP.

Flacco doesn’t have the mobility to keep plays alive or run when the play breaks down. He’s obviously not a running threat and it constrains what we can do on offense. Either Zack or Mike should be an improvement here.  

If Zack can’t go next week we should put in White. We need to make the change to youth at QB for mobility. We should have ran White out in the 4th quarter.