McGraw38 Posted October 7, 2007 Share Posted October 7, 2007 He'd have been great without injuries, just got unlucky. Bad feeling we'll realaese him and he'll ripit up wherever he gos, hopefully Clemens is very good!!!!!!!!!11 Not a chance, Penny failed here and he'll fail somewhere else too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tparich Posted October 7, 2007 Share Posted October 7, 2007 Why woud putting in a 1st yr starting QB fix all the problems? It wont, unless he somehow plays amazingly. He's gonna have his problems reading defenses, like any other 1st yr starter. But down the line, all the problems of the team should be less magnified if he becomes a very good well rounded QB. Chad isnt that, which is why other units of the team are naked. There have been several QBs in the history of the league that have turned their teams around right away. I think Clemens has potential and who knows, he could be the next QB to come in and turn a franchise around and i hope he is. Once he gets his chance as long as he keeps showing that potential and improving I will be happy. Everyone knows your feeling about Chad but if you want to word your statement that way and blame everything on him then you also have to believe that once he is not on the field everything turns around. I think the problems run much deeper then Chad. I like Clemens a lot but I almost think it would be an injustice to him to bring him in now. With the running game the way it is then it is all on him. If he doesn't handle it well this year then you never know what will happen in the offseason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irish Jet Posted October 7, 2007 Share Posted October 7, 2007 Not a chance, Penny failed here and he'll fail somewhere else too. Known the Jets luck yoll be wrongg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tparich Posted October 7, 2007 Share Posted October 7, 2007 How many college games have you watched might i ask . You absolute mental gymnast Since when does how a player does in college have an impact at the pro level? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irish Jet Posted October 7, 2007 Share Posted October 7, 2007 Since when does how a player does in college have an impact at the pro level? Ryan leaf says Hello!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McGraw38 Posted October 7, 2007 Share Posted October 7, 2007 Ryan leaf says Hello!!!! LOL!! Beat me to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vinnys025 Posted October 8, 2007 Share Posted October 8, 2007 Stop being an *******... calm down and think about it... How many draw plays did they call? Screen Plays VS tough DE's Sideline run plays? are you kidding VS this D? Thomas Jones dancing around and then turning his back to the D and falling into them... The running game and playcalling are the only other reason aside from Chad that they lost... if you took a minute and got your head out of your ass I never defended Chad... just pointed out the other flaws... So **** off you stupid ******* Ecurb, I'm sure even you know that draw plays are called because they don't respect Chad's arm strength and they dont want Chad making crucial throws. Playcalling has to be tailored to who is behind center, after all, its not only about Chad Pennington, its about a team win in the end. I actually saw everyone inside the box on some plays, even the two deep safety's were creeping with ZERO personnel respecting the deep ball, it was embarrassing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Troll Posted October 8, 2007 Share Posted October 8, 2007 It's funny, after all times the Chad supporters called the unblind "haters" and said that we weren't real fans, they sure don't want to take any **** whenever they've been proven wrong. It doesn't work that way. You made the bed, lie in it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ECURB Posted October 8, 2007 Share Posted October 8, 2007 It's funny, after all times the Chad supporters called the unblind "haters" and said that we weren't real fans, they sure don't want to take any **** whenever they've been proven wrong. It doesn't work that way. You made the bed, lie in it. Here I am... lying in my bed... take a shot at me... FYI... Im not one to say your not a fan becuase you think Chad sucks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Troll Posted October 8, 2007 Share Posted October 8, 2007 Here I am... lying in my bed... take a shot at me... FYI... Im not one to say your not a fan becuase you think Chad sucks My post was referring more to your buddy IrishJet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ECURB Posted October 8, 2007 Share Posted October 8, 2007 My post was referring more to your buddy IrishJet. Good point. Have a good night... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bpandthefu Posted October 8, 2007 Share Posted October 8, 2007 Where are the excuses as to why he had a bad game....AGAIN!!! Bring it!! This season is collectively over. You can't come from behind when you can't throw the ball downfield. I love Pennington, I bet he's a great guy. I would love to go golfing with him. It's time to Give Clemens more looks. If pennington is going to turn the ball over there are absolutely no positives to his game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KSJets Posted October 8, 2007 Share Posted October 8, 2007 I've backed Chad before, and I can't really comment on the game since I was stuck at work and couldn't watch too much of it on my breaks. I haven't seen any of the INT's on the highlight shows yet since I just got in. About the only thing I did see was a pass by Chad that Coles went way up for (I caught the tail end of Deion's Primetime plays). I said out loud "what the **** was that". I did check the box score, and I know stats can be misleading, but it looks like the Giants knew Eli was having a bad game so they just kept chugging at the running game. We don't have an option to lean on the running game, and I'm not convinced a QB change will fix that. Our OL doesn't even look like they get to block the LB's, but our LB's are always getting blocked on every play. If our 5 OLmen can't even block 4 DLmen, how is that going to change when another QB takes over? The safeties aren't tackling our RB's, the DL and LB's are. I'm starting to get more convinced that the real problem with our run blocking is the blocking scheme. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted October 8, 2007 Share Posted October 8, 2007 I've backed Chad before, and I can't really comment on the game since I was stuck at work and couldn't watch too much of it on my breaks. I haven't seen any of the INT's on the highlight shows yet since I just got in. About the only thing I did see was a pass by Chad that Coles went way up for (I caught the tail end of Deion's Primetime plays). I said out loud "what the **** was that". I did check the box score, and I know stats can be misleading, but it looks like the Giants knew Eli was having a bad game so they just kept chugging at the running game. We don't have an option to lean on the running game, and I'm not convinced a QB change will fix that. Our OL doesn't even look like they get to block the LB's, but our LB's are always getting blocked on every play. If our 5 OLmen can't even block 4 DLmen, how is that going to change when another QB takes over? The safeties aren't tackling our RB's, the DL and LB's are. I'm starting to get more convinced that the real problem with our run blocking is the blocking scheme. The stats certainly won't show both Leon & Cotchery almost getting their heads removed from their bodies on floaters. It also won't show that Pennington threw an interception just a few plays before his last one. DB jumped all over it (a floater, in case there was any guess), and the ball bounced off his hands. Totally disgusted with the Giants refusing to intercept the ball, Pennington did it again a few plays later. Whatever he once was, or whatever people thought he once was, he is right now a total head case. He is completely unable to let a bad play or a bad pass go. One of the things that veterans (good veterans) learn is to have a short memory. Not this one. He remembers. And he panics. And then he makes another meltdown mistake. And then we lose. He'd be more than adequate as a backup with no pressure on him, but not at that cap number. He may still have decent games here & there. But his days of being thought of as a franchise QB (for the Jets or anyone else) are over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KSJets Posted October 8, 2007 Share Posted October 8, 2007 The stats certainly won't show both Leon & Cotchery almost getting their heads removed from their bodies on floaters. It also won't show that Pennington threw an interception just a few plays before his last one. DB jumped all over it (a floater, in case there was any guess), and the ball bounced off his hands. Totally disgusted with the Giants refusing to intercept the ball, Pennington did it again a few plays later. Whatever he once was, or whatever people thought he once was, he is right now a total head case. He is completely unable to let a bad play or a bad pass go. One of the things that veterans (good veterans) learn is to have a short memory. Not this one. He remembers. And he panics. And then he makes another meltdown mistake. And then we lose. He'd be more than adequate as a backup with no pressure on him, but not at that cap number. He may still have decent games here & there. But his days of being thought of as a franchise QB (for the Jets or anyone else) are over. Just my luck...I'm working Tuesday night when the game is being replayed. Maybe I can remember to set my vcr that day And I just saw the highlights...I have no words to describe that one INT he threw that was picked off at the goal line. Four INT's in the fourth quarter of the last two games is just unacceptable. I still wish our defense could stop someone. Nice tackle Dyson. I actually did see that opening drive in the 2nd half on my break (I watch the first 30 minutes of the game on my lunch, then the beginning of the 2nd half on a break, and then I come up on my last break towards the end of the game) I was walking upstairs when the Giants scored on the INT return. After that opening 2nd half TD, I told my coworker before I went downstairs that the Jets would lose. They gave that up way too easily. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
serphnx Posted October 8, 2007 Share Posted October 8, 2007 Here I am... lying in my bed... take a shot at me... FYI... Im not one to say your not a fan becuase you think Chad sucks You've done it a few times. I know because I've been the one you claimed wasn't a fan! Anyway, I didn't think Chad sucked. Me and you I thought agreed that Chad was around the top third of QBs...but, now I'm going to have to revise what I thought. Maybe he really does suck. I don't get it, I expect a stinker here and there from him, but this is 2 in a row against terrible teams, I really expect better than that. He has completely regressed, instead of improving as I had hoped. In the offseason I thought maybe this year is different because he is in the second year of a system and had a full offseason injury free, but he is playing worse than ever. I don't think the team is that talent bereft as others are saying. The O-line is giving adequate pass blocking usually, and the WRs and other skill positions are fairly talented. This offense should be able to put up very good passing numbers, at the very least, it should be as capable as the Cleveland Browns offense. Or the Oakland Raiders. Or even the Detroit Lions. All those offenses are somehow better than ours though! I don't think much of TJ, but I certainly think he is better than a 50 yard a game back. With a good passing attack, TJ will get his yardage. This defense also isn't really that bad. Jets fans are just spoiled. We've had pretty good scoring defenses the past few years for the most part. But football is a lot about momentum. If we start scoring more on offense the defense will start getting better too, a lot of it is hustle and desire. That is why in the playoffs teams that previously had adequate defenses suddenly all become nearly impossible to run against. That's also why in the playoffs Chad generally does nothing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KSJets Posted October 8, 2007 Share Posted October 8, 2007 You've done it a few times. I know because I've been the one you claimed wasn't a fan! Anyway, I didn't think Chad sucked. Me and you I thought agreed that Chad was around the top third of QBs...but, now I'm going to have to revise what I thought. Maybe he really does suck. I don't get it, I expect a stinker here and there from him, but this is 2 in a row against terrible teams, I really expect better than that. He has completely regressed, instead of improving as I had hoped. In the offseason I thought maybe this year is different because he is in the second year of a system and had a full offseason injury free, but he is playing worse than ever. I don't think the team is that talent bereft as others are saying. The O-line is giving adequate pass blocking usually, and the WRs and other skill positions are fairly talented. This offense should be able to put up very good passing numbers, at the very least, it should be as capable as the Cleveland Browns offense. Or the Oakland Raiders. Or even the Detroit Lions. All those offenses are somehow better than ours though! I don't think much of TJ, but I certainly think he is better than a 50 yard a game back. With a good passing attack, TJ will get his yardage. This defense also isn't really that bad. Jets fans are just spoiled. We've had pretty good scoring defenses the past few years for the most part. But football is a lot about momentum. If we start scoring more on offense the defense will start getting better too, a lot of it is hustle and desire. That is why in the playoffs teams that previously had adequate defenses suddenly all become nearly impossible to run against. That's also why in the playoffs Chad generally does nothing. No, our defense really is that bad. We couldn't stop a bus load of elderly people going into a supermarket to get their groceries. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted October 8, 2007 Share Posted October 8, 2007 No, our defense really is that bad. We couldn't stop a bus load of elderly people going into a supermarket to get their groceries. Bench Vilma & the defense gets better instantly. Still wouldn't be anything resembling a dominant front-seven, but they would be better if they stopped playing essentially a free safety at ILB where we need a thumper. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
serphnx Posted October 8, 2007 Share Posted October 8, 2007 Bench Vilma & the defense gets better instantly. Still wouldn't be anything resembling a dominant front-seven, but they would be better if they stopped playing essentially a free safety at ILB where we need a thumper. I wonder if we can package CP and Vilma to the Chiefs for anything. Maybe a 3rd and a 4th, last time we got LW with our 4th, I thought that was a very good pick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted October 8, 2007 Share Posted October 8, 2007 I wonder if we can package CP and Vilma to the Chiefs for anything. If they offered a single 7th-rounder for both I'd take it if not for the PR backlash. Addition by subtraction. The worst part about it is these two are team captains. When the captains of the team are lousy in-game football players, they should be gone asap. What does it say about the rest of the team that they vote these two over-hyped choke-artists as captains? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maxman Posted October 8, 2007 Share Posted October 8, 2007 Posting for Baumerjet: Baumer has people posting for him now. That's when you know you truly have made it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DHJF Posted October 8, 2007 Share Posted October 8, 2007 I think you have to give the nod to Clemens moving forward. I've always supported Chad, but I'm a team-over-individual fan, and it's quite obvious to me now that Chad just can't get it done when necessary. There's plenty of blame to go around again (see: TJ, etc.), but Chad's deficiencies are becoming more than apparent. They're laughable. I was watching Football Night in America before SNF last night, and Costas made a joke/comment that they put a radar gun on some of Chad's passes, and the reading on the gun read "HAHAHA." I wanted to get pissed at this, but I couldn't. Chad is a great leader and stand-up individual, but the physical attributes to fully run the position are gone. Simply gone. It's sad when a player has all of the desire and heart and leadership to bring a Championship, but severely lacks the muscle to get it done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoachTsurfing Posted October 8, 2007 Share Posted October 8, 2007 How was the playcalling horrible? The execution was horrible, not the playcalling. I don't think that Mangini always puts the players with the skills that they have in the best position to win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted October 8, 2007 Share Posted October 8, 2007 I think you have to give the nod to Clemens moving forward. I've always supported Chad, but I'm a team-over-individual fan, and it's quite obvious to me now that Chad just can't get it done when necessary. There's plenty of blame to go around again (see: TJ, etc.), but Chad's deficiencies are becoming more than apparent. They're laughable. I was watching Football Night in America before SNF last night, and Costas made a joke/comment that they put a radar gun on some of Chad's passes, and the reading on the gun read "HAHAHA." I wanted to get pissed at this, but I couldn't. Chad is a great leader and stand-up individual, but the physical attributes to fully run the position are gone. Simply gone. It's sad when a player has all of the desire and heart and leadership to bring a Championship, but severely lacks the muscle to get it done. Truly. Whatever he may or may not have been at one time, this is what he is now. Even if he bounces back with a solid game or two, what is Mangini going to wait for? All the other pieces to the puzzle to get in here so Chad can throw a pair of 4th quarter picks in a meaningful game that ends a season with superbowl potential? It can be admirable for a coach to stand by his players & not throw them under the bus in scapegoat-like fashion, but enough is enough. Pennington is not the sole problem with this team, but he clearly is one of them. This defense & this running game are not good enough for Pennington's play-it-safe mode (where he can be effective). This team needs a QB to go out and win the game for them with his arm. He is not capable of doing this. Most of the fans know this. You can bet your ass opposing DC's know this. And as a former DB coach AND DC that faced Chad twice a year, Mangini should damn well know this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
will Posted October 8, 2007 Share Posted October 8, 2007 Truly. Whatever he may or may not have been at one time, this is what he is now. Even if he bounces back with a solid game or two, what is Mangini going to wait for? All the other pieces to the puzzle to get in here so Chad can throw a pair of 4th quarter picks in a meaningful game that ends a season with superbowl potential? It can be admirable for a coach to stand by his players & not throw them under the bus in scapegoat-like fashion, but enough is enough. Pennington is not the sole problem with this team, but he clearly is one of them. This defense & this running game are not good enough for Pennington's play-it-safe mode (where he can be effective). This team needs a QB to go out and win the game for them with his arm. He is not capable of doing this. Most of the fans know this. You can bet your ass opposing DC's know this. And as a former DB coach AND DC that faced Chad twice a year, Mangini should damn well know this. Yup. Its indicative of the change in Mangini from last year to this one. Last year we heard about competition, creativity and intensity. This year the team behaves as if there is nothing more to accomplish. The team displays none of these characteristics - the offense is unwatchable (except for the two minute offense, which is still pretty) and the defense is an embarrassment (to me Dyson will forever be a bum). The FO was bold in moving up to take Revis and Harris in the draft. But it cant go another off-season with so many players that dont fit the scheme. Its nice to have excuses for losing but its better to have the right players. And until Clemens is the starting QB then I will not believe that Mangini is putting the best players on the field. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoachTsurfing Posted October 8, 2007 Share Posted October 8, 2007 If they offered a single 7th-rounder for both I'd take it if not for the PR backlash. Addition by subtraction. The worst part about it is these two are team captains. When the captains of the team are lousy in-game football players, they should be gone asap. What does it say about the rest of the team that they vote these two over-hyped choke-artists as captains? They is no way that I would trade them both for a 7th round pick. In a different defense Vilma is a star. This is the example I've been trying to make. Mangini is playing schemes that hurt our players. Their skills are not being utilized correctly. As far as Chad goes, he needs to step down and maybe get a fresh start somewhere like Baltimore or the Panthers. T. Jones will be a lot better once everyone knows we have a qb that can throw further then 10 yards. I would think we could get at least a 2 or 3 rd for Vilma, I'd rather get a player for him. Not sure what the going market for chad would be. Yeah, this is where everyone says we could get a 6 pack of beer or some cheetos. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted October 8, 2007 Share Posted October 8, 2007 They is no way that I would trade them both for a 7th round pick. In a different defense Vilma is a star. This is the example I've been trying to make. Mangini is playing schemes that hurt our players. Their skills are not being utilized correctly. As far as Chad goes, he needs to step down and maybe get a fresh start somewhere like Baltimore or the Panthers. T. Jones will be a lot better once everyone knows we have a qb that can throw further then 10 yards. I would think we could get at least a 2 or 3 rd for Vilma, I'd rather get a player for him. Not sure what the going market for chad would be. Yeah, this is where everyone says we could get a 6 pack of beer or some cheetos. Vilma wouldn't be a star in the 4-3 either. He used to amass a bunch of tackles after the first-down marker even in the 4-3. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SouthernJet Posted October 8, 2007 Share Posted October 8, 2007 The ONLY exuses are the playcalling and the run game... other than that I got nothin the RUN game,, you cant have a effective run game in the long run when the defense knows a qb cant throw long and therefore they stack the line.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted October 8, 2007 Share Posted October 8, 2007 the RUN game,, you cant have a effective run game in the long run when the defense knows a qb cant throw long and therefore they stack the line.. They would not have an effective running game with Daryle Lamonica. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SouthernJet Posted October 8, 2007 Share Posted October 8, 2007 They would not have an effective running game with Daryle Lamonica. i disagree,, i think it would be SOMEWHAT better wit ha deep threat arm,,I never said it would be great,, but a tad better might have given us the buff and giants game.. balt was kids 1st game and balt pretty much stacke dline due to not beleiving in hois 1st start,,if he could prove himse;lf on tape to upcoming defenses it might help our running game Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BwanaZulia Posted October 8, 2007 Share Posted October 8, 2007 Where are the excuses as to why he had a bad game....AGAIN!!! Bring it!! Here I am.... But there is no excuse. Time to shake up the game, the team and the plan. Time to put in the kid we drafted. BZ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drago Posted October 8, 2007 Share Posted October 8, 2007 Ok its official you know nothing about football, Do me a favor and go off yourself. Everybody will appreciate it you waste of space Who is this guy? and why is he still here? I hate people like this, they have nothing to add so they rip on fellow posters. Go to JI, or somewhere else, we really don't need you here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irish Jet Posted October 8, 2007 Share Posted October 8, 2007 the RUN game,, you cant have a effective run game in the long run when the defense knows a qb cant throw long and therefore they stack the line.. NO! NO! NO! NO! NO! NO! NO! NO! NO! NO! NO! NO! NO! NO! NO! NO! For the second consecutive week Chad had nothing to do with the bad running game, when the opponents front 4 (yes 4, not 8) are demolishing our O-line, It just doesnt matter. You could have Tom Brady in as QB IT JUST WOULDNT MATTER!!! How much would you be willing to bet there will be no major improvement if any in our run game with Clemens in???? Our O-line line just cant run-block. Respect or not, they cant do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
serphnx Posted October 9, 2007 Share Posted October 9, 2007 NO! NO! NO! NO! NO! NO! NO! NO! NO! NO! NO! NO! NO! NO! NO! NO! For the second consecutive week Chad had nothing to do with the bad running game, when the opponents front 4 (yes 4, not 8) are demolishing our O-line, It just doesnt matter. You could have Tom Brady in as QB IT JUST WOULDNT MATTER!!! How much would you be willing to bet there will be no major improvement if any in our run game with Clemens in???? Our O-line line just cant run-block. Respect or not, they cant do it. I'll sig bet that in 4 games with clemens we will have more rushing yards than the 4 Chad started. Of course it is moot, Chad will keep starting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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