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Mark Sanchez-- Was it worth it?


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First things first: At the end of last year, after Brett Favre retired, there was no question we needed a new QB. That much we can all agree on.

Kellen Clemens was not going to be the answer for the future, so we went ahead and drafted one. There were three top QBs that declared; Stafford, Sanchez and Freeman. I did not think that this was a solid QB class especially considering who stayed in school and what not. The biggest red-flag I have ever have seen, was when Pete Carroll came out to the media and said that he was making a big mistake by coming out early. There is no reason that a coach should ever say that to media, no matter how strongly he feels about it. But, since the kid's coach himself said something like this, I knew that something was going to be a problem.

Based on the way our team was built, to be a great rushing/defensive team (which we are), I was shocked that we did not even try to look for a vet QB to hold the reigns for a season. Instead we let the rookie QB out there to "grow". I intentionally put grow in quotes because he really hasn't. Actually, even looking back through all the games, I would even go as far as saying he has regressed.. Not because of anything else.. except for he seems to have lost all his confidence. That is a terrible attribute to have as a QB, especially since you are going to now question your decision making, even if for just a little bit, and in this league, that is the difference between a TD and an INT. There is no doubt that this kid has talent, and you can see it in spurts every once and a while, but I do think that this is what Carroll meant when he said that he was not ready for the NFL.

My question is this, was trading up to get Sanchez the right move, especially after Carroll's comments, AND furthermore, starting him without any other qualified option at QB to help show him the way, or, was this the right move to keep him, and play it out and gain "valuable experience" by playing this season?

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All anyone has to do is look at USC's record this past season to know what motivated Carroll's comments.

Carroll didn't want Sanchez to leave and admitted such later on.

I don't see where this kid's lost all confidence. He's not as ****y as he was early on, he's been beaten down a bit but I don't see a scared kid out there.

Sanchez will be fine. In fact, he'll be more than fine.

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My question is this, was trading up to get Sanchez the right move, especially after Carroll's comments, AND furthermore, starting him without any other qualified option at QB to help show him the way, or, was this the right move to keep him, and play it out and gain "valuable experience" by playing this season?

This is not a question we can answer now, but rather in another year at the earliest, and probably 2 more to be fair.

Drafting then starting Sanchez was never about winning a Super Bowl this year. Regardless of whether you believe he will succeed in the future, you need to give him some more time before commenting on the value of this pick.

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All anyone has to do is look at USC's record this past season to know what motivated Carroll's comments.

Carroll didn't want Sanchez to leave and admitted such later on.

I don't see where this kid's lost all confidence. He's not as ****y as he was early on, he's been beaten down a bit but I don't see a scared kid out there.

Sanchez will be fine. In fact, he'll be more than fine.

Bingo

I agree with this 100%

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OK...his rookie season is almost over and we've got your typical extremist's on either side. Some are already calling him a major bust and a general ******* in life. Others are preaching the few things he does right and creating every imaginable excuse for his mistakes.

Reality is, his performance is somewhere in between just like everything. I've heard people say, "What has he shown?"

Well, he's shown he can throw a lot of picks....which is the answer the people asking the question are looking for...but he has shown a lot more too. I, personally, am not anywhere near giving up on him and I still think he'll be a good QB. Remember, don't compare him to Peyton Manning, Joe Montana, Dan Marino, etc. Those are some of the greatest quarterbacks to ever play the game...we don't need that to win a lot of games and a Superbowl. I highly doubt Ben Roethlisberger(however you spell that) is going to the Hall of Fame...but I don't think any Steelers fans are complaining.

In Mark Sanchez's Rookie Season...

...he has 8 games where he has thrown and INT and 5 where he hasn't. Showing me when it rains it pours, something I think is expected with a rookie, but he has the ability to have great games.

...he has 3 games out of 14 with a passer rating over 100. Only 6 QB's are averaging over a 100 QB rating this season. He has his good games, but just like every rookie, he has games where he totally lays an egg...

...he has a 62.3 QB rating, just above fellow 1st round rookies Matthew Stafford and Josh Freeman. They're all rookies, and they all have passer ratings in the low 60's...go figure. The average QB rating in the NFL usually hovers around 78. I won't do the math, but I imagine Sanchez' rating takes a jump if you take out that 8.3 QB rating clunker against Buffalo.

...he has thrown 12 TDs to 20 INTs. Stafford has thrown 13 TD/20 INTs and Freeman 7 TDs/14 INTs. Again, right on par with his colleagues. What you have to remember about the INTs is a lot of them will come from trying to make decisions on throws in half a second that worked in college, but simply won't in the pro's. They'll eventually retrain themselves to not make these throws.

...he has thrown for 175 yards a game on average...well below Stafford's 226.7 but almost exactly even with Freeman's 176.5. However, dive further into the stats and you realize that because the Jets ground game has been so strong Sanchez hasn't needed to throw the ball as much. Sanchez has 25.3 attempts per game and Stafford has 37.7. Break that all down and you realize Sanchez has 6.9 yards per attempt and Stafford only 6.

...How about passes over 20 yards? Sanchez has 34...Stafford 26...Freeman 21. Interesting considering Stafford and Freeman were the big armed QBs who could chuck it 20-to-20.

...has almost an identical completion percentage with the other two 1st round rookies...Sanchez = 53.5...Stafford = 53.3...Freeman = 53.5

Now, none of this proves anything in either extreme. It doesn't prove he is the next big thing at QB...and it doesn't prove he is the next big bust at QB. It only proves his performance warrants further consideration.

I am definitely still excited about Sanchez's career as a Jet. He plays a bit like Brett Favre (I hate direct comparisons but sometimes they help get a point across), in that he moves around a lot and is very active in the pocket (or completely out of it), and he'll run around for a while trying to find an open receiver. He'll also seem to take unecessary riskes at times, part of that gunslinger mentality. Nothing like Peyton Manning who will sit in the pocket and throw essentially only from there. You hardly ever see Peyton move outside of the pocket. Both styles have proven they can be very successful. But, I am not at all trying to say Sanchez will be anything like either QB or anywhere near as good. Those are future hall of famers...

I'll add that these are what team have to go through with rookies. The early on is always rough but if they pan out your set for 10 years

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Hah. I never said he was a bust, because I know in order to label someone a bust they need to at least be in the league longer than 3 years, but moreso the decision to not get another vet QB to try and play for the team first before tossing him into the fire.

I don't even consider Vernon a bust yet.. so that is saying something lol.

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All anyone has to do is look at USC's record this past season to know what motivated Carroll's comments.

Carroll didn't want Sanchez to leave and admitted such later on.

I don't see where this kid's lost all confidence. He's not as ****y as he was early on, he's been beaten down a bit but I don't see a scared kid out there.

Sanchez will be fine. In fact, he'll be more than fine.

Come'on dude. USC's defense is terrible because last year's D is blowing up in the NFL right now. Cushing, Matthews, Maualuga, Mola, Moore, Maiava. They lost half their defense to the NLF last year and they couldnt stop anyone this season.

Their offense only had 3 games where they scored less than 21 points, and I think they won 2 of them mind you. USC sucked this year, because they couldnt stop anyone, not because Matt Sanchez decided to pursue a modeling career.

The kid is terrible and I see no reason to think he will ever be different, he degressing. I hope I'm wrong. You know that I do, but there's a reason I wanted nothing to do with him and its making it harder and harder to get over the fact that 2 years in the row this team has drafted the 1 guy I wanted nothing to do with.

Edited by JiF
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Come'on dude. USC's defense is terrible because last year's D is blowing up in the NFL right now. Cushing, Matthews, Maualuga, Mola, Moore, Maiava. They lost half their defense to the NLF last year and they couldnt stop anyone this season.

Their offense only had 3 games where they scored less than 21 points, and they won 2 of them mind you. USC sucked this year, because they couldnt stop anyone, not because Matt Sanchez decided to pursue a modeling career.

The kid is terrible and I see no reason to think he will ever be different, he degressing. I hope I'm wrong. You know that I do, but there's a reason I wanted nothing to do with him and its making it harder and harder to get over the fact that 2 years in the row this team has drafted the 1 guy I wanted nothing to do with.

Seriously bud, go home and smoke a bowl.

You're wrapped way too tight on this today.

Judging a player, any player based on his rookie year, especially a QB, is just plain dumb.

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Go look at the first full playing seasons for every QB enshrined in Canton. And then look at their next couple seasons too. No where near enough information on Sanchez to make any sort of statement other than he's not going to win the trophy for the guy who got it down the quickest as an NFL QB.

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Come'on dude. USC's defense is terrible because last year's D is blowing up in the NFL right now. Cushing, Matthews, Maualuga, Mola, Moore, Maiava. They lost half their defense to the NLF last year and they couldnt stop anyone this season.

Their offense only had 3 games where they scored less than 21 points, and I think they won 2 of them mind you. USC sucked this year, because they couldnt stop anyone, not because Matt Sanchez decided to pursue a modeling career.

The kid is terrible and I see no reason to think he will ever be different, he degressing. I hope I'm wrong. You know that I do, but there's a reason I wanted nothing to do with him and its making it harder and harder to get over the fact that 2 years in the row this team has drafted the 1 guy I wanted nothing to do with.

12/20 for TD's and INT isnt that bad. Matter of fact it would be awesome if you where dyslexic. So its really your fault. Sorry Boopsie.

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JIF FOR GM!

I knew that was going to come off that way and I was going to edit, but WTF? Why not.

But you gotta see my side. I love the draft and get really into and excited about it. I get into the mock drafts and even post my little sleeper pick thingys and all that stuff...and 2 years in a row...they took the 2 pos I wanted nothing to do with.

Then I got all exicted in the later rounds because we traded up...in my mock when I was at JI, I took Desean Jackson for the Jets...got all excited that we might do something so brilliant, and we took a TE.

:head:

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I knew that was going to come off that way and I was going to edit, but WTF? Why not.

But you gotta see my side. I love the draft and get really into and excited about it. I get into the mock drafts and even post my little sleeper pick thingys and all that stuff...and 2 years in a row...they took the 2 pos I wanted nothing to do with.

Then I got all exicted in the later rounds because we traded up...in my mock when I was at JI, I took Desean Jackson for the Jets...got all excited that we might do something so brilliant, and we took a TE.

:head:

:hand:

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Seriously bud, go home and smoke a bowl.

You're wrapped way too tight on this today.

Judging a player, any player based on his rookie year, especially a QB, is just plain dumb.

Sorry. I'm getting worked up. I know its too early to judge him, but I'm just pissed that it happened 2 years in a row. I told you the second that I saw him on ESPN talking about his hot, toned and tanned body and how he was going to walk the beach with his shirt off, I almost puked. Didnt want anything to do with the pretty boy.

But you are right, its too early, hopefully he proves me wrong.

12/20 for TD's and INT isnt that bad. Matter of fact it would be awesome if you where dyslexic. So its really your fault. Sorry Boopsie.

I'm sorry mt, we havent spoke in a while and I'm having a rough couple of weeks. I know you have too but I miss your soul and its coming out in my posting. Dont hate me.

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All anyone has to do is look at USC's record this past season to know what motivated Carroll's comments.

Carroll didn't want Sanchez to leave and admitted such later on.

I don't think it matters at this point, but Carroll didn't "later on" admit that his comments were motivated by being left to start Barkley a year early.

And Sanchez had already made his announcement and declared for the draft when Carroll made those comments. This argument would hold a lot more water if he said those things publicly while Sanchez was mulling over his decision.

It would also hold a lot more water if we didn't witness a lot of the results of a lack of experience and maturity.

Doesn't at all mean he's now damaged goods. But it isn't a 100% obvious "of course" with Carroll either. What does he gain by saying this after the fact? Everyone knows USC was in a worse position because of it whether Carroll said so or not.

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I knew that was going to come off that way and I was going to edit, but WTF? Why not.

But you gotta see my side. I love the draft and get really into and excited about it. I get into the mock drafts and even post my little sleeper pick thingys and all that stuff...and 2 years in a row...they took the 2 pos I wanted nothing to do with.

Then I got all exicted in the later rounds because we traded up...in my mock when I was at JI, I took Desean Jackson for the Jets...got all excited that we might do something so brilliant, and we took a TE.

:head:

I was serious!

Desean Jackson FTW! I was pumped when we traded up with him on the board. Then I hear we're drafting a TE?

:face:

I've been calling for Sperm as Jets GM for a while, certainly an upgrade over Tanny. Maybe you and him could be Co-GM's? Awesome.

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All anyone has to do is look at USC's record this past season to know what motivated Carroll's comments.

Carroll didn't want Sanchez to leave and admitted such later on.

I don't see where this kid's lost all confidence. He's not as ****y as he was early on, he's been beaten down a bit but I don't see a scared kid out there.

Sanchez will be fine. In fact, he'll be more than fine.

Best explanation for Carroll's motivation. He knew Corp and Barkley were not ready to pad his legacy at USC.

Sanchez has not lost confidence although he has been beaten down. Don't like his inability to learn from his many mistakes. Jury still out as far as how he turns out. Still think he needs a better mentor to maximize any upside.

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I don't think it matters at this point, but Carroll didn't "later on" admit that his comments were motivated by being left to start Barkley a year early.

And Sanchez had already made his announcement and declared for the draft when Carroll made those comments. This argument would hold a lot more water if he said those things publicly while Sanchez was mulling over his decision.

It would also hold a lot more water if we didn't witness a lot of the results of a lack of experience and maturity.

Doesn't at all mean he's now damaged goods. But it isn't a 100% obvious "of course" with Carroll either. What does he gain by saying this after the fact? Everyone knows USC was in a worse position because of it whether Carroll said so or not.

And I saw an interview with Carroll later on where he said he didn't want Sanchez to leave so that was his kneejerk reaction to being told Sanchez declared.

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Wait a year, and keep picks?

Wait a year?

I didn't realize a franchise QB is available everywhere in the 1st round of the draft.

Who is to say one is available to the Jets in 2010? They don't grow on trees.

Tannenbaum knows the Jets need a franchise QB. They thought they had one in Favre and could get 2 years out of him. That didn't happen. Then he went after Cutler, but Denver wanted him out of the AFC.

So you think Tannenbaum was going to reverse course and sign a JAG QB in 2009 and hope a franchise QB is available in the draft next year AND then have a Sanchezesque season in 2010 for this unannamed rookie QB?

All you're advocating for is putting off the inevitable.

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I'd agree with this. Right now the game looks a bit fast for him. I hate using this example but Peyton Manning said to his father I think after his rookie season that there was just no-one open.

Now again I'm not trying to use the he's going to be the next Manning defense but just saying that it's a problem that can be fixed. The game will slow down for him IMO with time.

The potential has certainly been on display. The kid throws a great deep ball, Edwards didn't have to break stride for that TD. He's thrown a few gems like that this season.

The only thing that has me worried is his movement in the pocket. He needs to stop drifting to the side and step up. The protection is there most of the time, he just either doesn't get the ball out or creates pressure that isn't there.

Tough to judge him right now though, certainly way to early to be declaring him a bust.

Patience.

You can't call Sanchez a bust after one bad season. But the reason Manning is a bad example is also because he threw interceptions at a much lower rate, improved as the season went on, and also threw 26 touchdowns as a rookie. His defense (ranked #29 out of 30) was far worse than the '09 Jets (ranked #1 out of 32), putting him in must-pass situations (led the league in pass attempts) that opposing defenses preyed on, where Sanchez is rarely in those positions (Jets are 32nd in the league in pass attempts). And Faulk Shmaulk. Individually he was more talented than Jones but our ground game is better than the '98 Colts by plenty. He was a better prospect than Sanchez after his junior year and still stayed at Tennessee for the '97 season. That's a lot more reps against live talent before NFL defenses sink their teeth into you.

And lastly, he's Peyton Manning. This makes him a bad comparison for anyone even if you can find some similarities in gross interception totals by year's end.

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I was serious!

Desean Jackson FTW! I was pumped when we traded up with him on the board. Then I hear we're drafting a TE?

:face:

I've been calling for Sperm as Jets GM for a while, certainly an upgrade over Tanny. Maybe you and him could be Co-GM's? Awesome.

Dynasty!!! And if we had some underachievers, we could hire Bit to do our press conferences addressing them under performing.

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First things first: At the end of last year, after Brett Favre retired, there was no question we needed a new QB. That much we can all agree on.

Kellen Clemens was not going to be the answer for the future, so we went ahead and drafted one. There were three top QBs that declared; Stafford, Sanchez and Freeman. I did not think that this was a solid QB class especially considering who stayed in school and what not. The biggest red-flag I have ever have seen, was when Pete Carroll came out to the media and said that he was making a big mistake by coming out early. There is no reason that a coach should ever say that to media, no matter how strongly he feels about it. But, since the kid's coach himself said something like this, I knew that something was going to be a problem.

Based on the way our team was built, to be a great rushing/defensive team (which we are), I was shocked that we did not even try to look for a vet QB to hold the reigns for a season. Instead we let the rookie QB out there to "grow". I intentionally put grow in quotes because he really hasn't. Actually, even looking back through all the games, I would even go as far as saying he has regressed.. Not because of anything else.. except for he seems to have lost all his confidence. That is a terrible attribute to have as a QB, especially since you are going to now question your decision making, even if for just a little bit, and in this league, that is the difference between a TD and an INT. There is no doubt that this kid has talent, and you can see it in spurts every once and a while, but I do think that this is what Carroll meant when he said that he was not ready for the NFL.

My question is this, was trading up to get Sanchez the right move, especially after Carroll's comments, AND furthermore, starting him without any other qualified option at QB to help show him the way, or, was this the right move to keep him, and play it out and gain "valuable experience" by playing this season?

Cant answer this question yet. He's produced enough to still feel that he can come into form. He performed like a rookie this year.

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And I saw an interview with Carroll later on where he said he didn't want Sanchez to leave so that was his kneejerk reaction to being told Sanchez declared.

That's what I said. He made those comments AFTER being informed that Sanchez had declared for the draft.

If it was public that Sanchez was mulling it over but hadn't made any decisions yet, and THEN Carroll said "He's not ready" before a decision was made, then you could say his motivation was to keep Sanchez at USC for himself. It didn't happen that way.

Really doesn't matter anyway. We can all see he wasn't ready. Hopefully he'll be ready next year but with the way he isn't making strides in improvement it isn't looking good. On the plus side, next year is next year and every year some players have breakout seasons. Hopefully Sanchez will be one of them.

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