WIZARD OF OZ Mafia Game Thread

[Jets Voice of Reason]

Been gone all day but i'm back now. Gonna catch up.

[Vicious89x]

What a scumbag post. Why is our luck turning? Because D1 was so bad, or because you needed to sound "innocent"?

All eyes are on you, so be careful...

Why mention this if you don't think we should discuss it?

Oh please. Could you be any more obvious? You get two votes and you start slinging mud as soon as possible. And at me, trust me I understand where my rep lies right now.

You're telling me losing the tracker isn't important? Runin pointed this out just now. If we lost another townie that's 1 more in favor of scum. Although I'm sure you're feeling frustrated right now.

[Vicious89x]

A quiet night, glad we didn't lose another one. I'll be back shortly, after walking my dog I have to shower. It's so yucky outside. Tomorrow I'm just sitting next to the air conditioner all day.

[Dan.]

Back ... it's hard for me to look back at the "train" on I28 because of the work he was supposedly putting in to get people on it. Which is why I hate things like that. Why do people always think they can catch the ones the want to ... it's just as easy to get townies on your case, too.

I'm a little uneasy about all the very quiet folk we have in this game so far. This seems to be the type of game that lends itself well to scum staying in hiding. Now that I'm back at my computer I can read through posts by DPR and some who remain in the shadows.

[Dan.]

Hehe! JVoR is not going to appreciate this one.

[Jets Voice of Reason]

Had our fiscal year kickoff meeting off site so no access to a computer all day. As I was reading I was getting ready to call b.s. on I28's reveal but it turns out he was telling the truth... Losing someone who gets people talking in I28 and an experienced player who was our Watcher in WWWWWWombat sucks... bad.

Not sure how fair it is to have taken out wombat considering the last vote on thread was cast by I28. It may have been the same time stamp but I28's was obviously a few seconds behind since his post was AFTER wombats.

FOS all the people that find nothing wrong with Lily's play thus far... I'm not saying she's definitely scum but to not see anything odd at all? bs.

I said pretty much the same exact thing last game. I confronted CTM about it cause for some oddball reason he wouldn't even question her play.

Both were town.

The one regret I had from last game was I got so caught up in her natural aura of scumminess that even though she put in a few town tells it just got to the point where I could not tell the difference and went gung ho on her. It was counterproductive because since we were both innocent if we went after and got her than I'd be lynched next and we basically would've just done scum work. For me personally I have to watch her for a few days before I come to a more definitive conclusion. I realized I have to do the same thing with Vicious since I probably would've shot him had Dan opted not to.

Pressure is good though, but those are just my thoughts on Lily.

Strikes: No real scumhunting target and just voted I28 cause it was "where the town was going." And really going through her posts her only real target is Barm who is an easy target cause well he pretty much stays in the background these games.

[Jets Voice of Reason]

Hehe! JVoR is not going to appreciate this one.

Wow I didn't even get that part of it until now. Vicious KMA, KTHXBAI

[Jets Voice of Reason]

Right now there's a couple people I feel suspicious of but a lot more I don't have a good feel for.

Vote: Smash

23 posts and about 3 or 4 with any meat on them. it's past day 1.

[Lily]

Interesting stuff Runnin... It didn't go unnoticed that he was an aggressive force in the I28 lynch while trying to give the impression he was an impartial observer...

also stands to reason that with his massive ego he'd think he was good enough to push the lynch along and stifle any suspicion that came his way as a result.

but for the record Lily did the exact same thing... and the timing of her vote was very important as with a deadline approaching it all but sealed the fact I28 was going to be a strong lynch candidate.

please Lily.. I implore you... don't suggest that my suspicion has anything to do with whatever personal stuff supposedly happened earlier on.. I'm oblivious to it (really). I'm on you because you and now DPR have both have done a few slight of hand tricks that are scummy in appearance.

I agree with that, Pac.

Nope. Not going to. I want that stuff buried. Nae and I have worked through things, and let

[Jets Voice of Reason]

I agree with that, Pac.

Nope. Not going to. I want that stuff buried. Nae and I have worked through things, and let

[Lily]

Pressure is good though, but those are just my thoughts on Lily.

Strikes: No real scumhunting target and just voted I28 cause it was "where the town was going." And really going through her posts her only real target is Barm who is an easy target cause well he pretty much stays in the background these games.

Hey! Something I can respond to. Not scumhunting day one is a scum tell here? Okay, that makes sense. But think back to last game. I would have pushed for Brett, Dan, and Slats - all town. Trust me, we're better off for me to sit back day one and two and observe. Really. I can make a believable case out of nothing. Take JVoR last game, for example. That was decent, not stellar. We are better off with me taking a more laid back approach early on. You saw twice now how I get moving later. Just my style, guys...

[Lily]

Don't take this personally but if i could make a suggestion. How about we put a gag order on the Nae and Lily issue. You want it. Nae wants it. Most of the people in the game I would imagine wants it.

Let's not even talk about wanting it buried because it is serving to kind of reminding me of the issue that we both want to move past.

Let's just focus on gameplay.

YES!!!!! *gagged* (no innuendo)

[SMC]

Don't take this personally but if i could make a suggestion. How about we put a gag order on the Nae and Lily issue. You want it. Nae wants it. Most of the people in the game I would imagine wants it.

Let's not even talk about wanting it buried because it is serving to kind of reminding me of the issue that we both want to move past.

Let's just focus on gameplay.

Like this?

[Jets Voice of Reason]

Like this?

Hot.

Ouch.

Sorry Dan just slapped me.

[Lily]

Note to self - Never play games with you guys while child is in the room......lol

Just kidding. Don't feel bad. She's laughing her ass off!

[Pac]

Why mention this if you don't think we should discuss it?

You mean shouldn't right? Because you and others have successfully crippled towns with outlandish theories. I was trying to do my part to stop that from happening.

[Sharrow]

A valid point, and despite all of the attention on me, an important point to the entire game.

Oh Barmsy, really? The impartial/partial dance? You disagree, but agree based on the fact that you disagree, but agree? Hmmm. We'll see.

And then there is Runnin.

I'll tell you what; I'm ging to go ahead and say that all of the posts I made were in earnest. I'm not trying to flair. I'm not trying to lead, and I'm not trying to do anything othe than just play.

I'll let everyone look at your post, and if people think I have somethign to explain I will. If they see it as you trying to take me out, I'll pretty much agree with them.

But just between you, me, and DM, you aren't doing it right. Don't make me pull the zipper over your face for no reason, Poncho. K?

This is what I didn't like about your play-

I don't buy this for a second. There is no bomb in The Wizard of Oz.

And if you were a bomb, you sure as hell wouldn't have come out of the gate like a banshee.

This has got to be crap.

But it does bring up an interesting dilemma, 'cause I don't want to hammer him. heh

Funny that he failed to mention that, isn't it?

In retrospect, it looks to me like you were trying to get someone to hammer him by casting more doubt on his claim. Just didn't like it. Also, like I pointed out earlier, I didn't like how you among others didn't consider the self-vote, which I would only expect of players who knew it wasn't going to hurt them no matter who he blew up.

It looked like I28 was trying to vote himself without hammering - then he apologized to Wombat for hammering? meh - we'll see what happens.

I also didn't like that post, nothing specific, it just didn't seem genuine to me.

for now i'll vote: DPR

[Pac]

For some reason, people here think my playstyle is scummy. I get that. I

[Sharrow]

Hehe! JVoR is not going to appreciate this one.

Wow I didn't even get that part of it until now. Vicious KMA, KTHXBAI

Just be glad it doesn't show that you're wearing the dress too.

[Jets Voice of Reason]

Just be glad it doesn't show that you're wearing the dress too.

You can KMA too pinball wizard.

[Sharrow]

You mean shouldn't right? Because you and others have successfully crippled towns with outlandish theories. I was trying to do my part to stop that from happening.

outlandish theories, that sounds familiar.

[Pac]

outlandish theories, that sounds familiar.

I still maintain your idea was whack even though it turned out to be true. Put that in your crack pipe and smoke it.

[SMC]

OFFICIAL VOTE COUNT--DAY 2

DPR (3) -- Barm, Runin, Sharrow

Smash (1) -- JVOR

Lily (1) -- Pac

With 18 Ozites in the Castle, it takes 10 to lynch.

[Dan.]

Hey! Something I can respond to. Not scumhunting day one is a scum tell here? Okay, that makes sense. But think back to last game. I would have pushed for Brett, Dan, and Slats - all town. Trust me, we're better off for me to sit back day one and two and observe. Really. I can make a believable case out of nothing. Take JVoR last game, for example. That was decent, not stellar. We are better off with me taking a more laid back approach early on. You saw twice now how I get moving later. Just my style, guys...

The problem with this is it's a built-in excuse to keep yourself around past the first few days and gives you an out for making cases on townies. Rather than saying, "I'm bad at this," and effectively sitting out the early part of the game, it would be more beneficial for you as a townie to at least keep working at it and see what you can find. Nobody's early cases are stellar, and we'll get absolutely nowhere if everyone takes your approach.

You are a quandary for me because it's so easy to find "scummy" statements or decent reasons for you to be scum. This being only my second game with you, I'm still not 100% sure what's you playing scummy with an agenda and you simply struggling with the game as town. I don't know what's out of the ordinary for you. (This was my issue with JetsBabe way back when, and I argued really hard for us to have principles and lynch her for acting scummy no matter what, so that she would learn to stop doing that as town ... but that's where CTM stepped in and argued about the value of keeping her in longer.)

Hot.

Ouch.

Sorry Dan just slapped me.

Yeah, as if I care what you look at. Now get back in your cage!!

[DPR]

You mean shouldn't right? Because you and others have successfully crippled towns with outlandish theories. I was trying to do my part to stop that from happening.

I meant should. Shouldn't would have been a double negative.

This is what I didn't like about your play-

In retrospect, it looks to me like you were trying to get someone to hammer him by casting more doubt on his claim. Just didn't like it. Also, like I pointed out earlier, I didn't like how you among others didn't consider the self-vote, which I would only expect of players who knew it wasn't going to hurt them no matter who he blew up.

I also didn't like that post, nothing specific, it just didn't seem genuine to me.

for now i'll vote: DPR

You are welcome to vote me, of course. But just like Runnin, I have to say that this game is filled with people that want to spin things to their own end. i do it, you do it, and that's all fine and good, but the question is, why? And when you look at my posts, do you really see anything other than a deadline lynch? You say you are uncomfrotable with people who did not see the flaw in I28 not voting for himself (which orchestrated, would have been great, btw...) but you don't see the point in waiting for everyone else to comment o it?

You made the point early, which is fine, but you can't discount that others would be waiting to see if scum were going to reveal themselves by not mentioning it. Sheesh.

Vote me all you want. I don't get any evil vibes from you at all.

[Lily]

I'm not saying you have to change anything. We all have styles that we enjoy - I like to roughhouse, DPR likes to play a misguided General, JiF plays like a homo, Smash like a psycho, and CTM like know-it-all fairy that everyone hates. It's just who we are.

Again... it's not your "style" that I find scummy... it's what I perceived to be an early overreaction to minimal pressure coupled with a very scummy looking push on I28. Now that I'm thinking about it I'm wondering if you would be so transparent with your vote on him but it's the best thing I see going.

In fact Vote Lily for now.

Okay. It makes me feel better that you seem not terribly excited about this. In my defense, I once got called out for not responding to each little accusation, and I'm trying to find the "acceptable" amount of response. It has occured to me, however that that level is different for each of you....lol. You guys are like dogs over a bone sometimes, but that's okay. The longer I play here the more I feel the rhythm of the dance. And, Pac, Lily is rarely transparent. I've been called obtuse at times, but rarely transparent.

[Jets Voice of Reason]

The problem with this is it's a built-in excuse to keep yourself around past the first few days and gives you an out for making cases on townies. Rather than saying, "I'm bad at this," and effectively sitting out the early part of the game, it would be more beneficial for you as a townie to at least keep working at it and see what you can find. Nobody's early cases are stellar, and we'll get absolutely nowhere if everyone takes your approach.

You are a quandary for me because it's so easy to find "scummy" statements or decent reasons for you to be scum. This being only my second game with you, I'm still not 100% sure what's you playing scummy with an agenda and you simply struggling with the game as town. I don't know what's out of the ordinary for you. (This was my issue with JetsBabe way back when, and I argued really hard for us to have principles and lynch her for acting scummy no matter what, so that she would learn to stop doing that as town ... but that's where CTM stepped in and argued about the value of keeping her in longer.)

Yeah, as if I care what you look at. Now get back in your cage!!

lol. As if that's the dynamic of our relationship. We both know who's boss.

[Dan.]

I've only played the Star Wars game with DPR ... how was he during the Lost game? All I've seen was his destruction of Doggin, followed by his own brilliant crashing and burning. I've also been heh-ed at by him quite a bit, so I don't want that coloring my perspective.

The quiet folk give us so little to work with, I think it's really important to stay vigilant. I have my eye on some people. For right now, though, I'll vote Naeann. Very chatty early on, quieted down as the real discussions started, then popped in as soon as I28 was lynched to make a few jokes.

[Lily]

The problem with this is it's a built-in excuse to keep yourself around past the first few days and gives you an out for making cases on townies. Rather than saying, "I'm bad at this," and effectively sitting out the early part of the game, it would be more beneficial for you as a townie to at least keep working at it and see what you can find. Nobody's early cases are stellar, and we'll get absolutely nowhere if everyone takes your approach.

You are a quandary for me because it's so easy to find "scummy" statements or decent reasons for you to be scum. This being only my second game with you, I'm still not 100% sure what's you playing scummy with an agenda and you simply struggling with the game as town. I don't know what's out of the ordinary for you. (This was my issue with JetsBabe way back when, and I argued really hard for us to have principles and lynch her for acting scummy no matter what, so that she would learn to stop doing that as town ... but that's where CTM stepped in and argued about the value of keeping her in longer.)

Yeah, as if I care what you look at. Now get back in your cage!!

I don't want to put nails in my own coffin, but come on, seriously? Who would make that easy if they had a choice? If you learn my town tells, I'll never pull one over on you as scum. Do you want people to know which you are easily? That's the fun of the game, Dan.

I'm not, and I never will be, someone to FOS everyone. I do poke at people at DM a lot, but here it's gotten me into a lot of trouble. I need some time still to, like I said, feel the rhythm more before knowing who and how to poke. (no innuendos, guys. Really)

[Dan.]

I don't want to put nails in my own coffin, but come on, seriously? Who would make that easy if they had a choice? If you learn my town tells, I'll never pull one over on you as scum. Do you want people to know which you are easily? That's the fun of the game, Dan.

I'm not, and I never will be, someone to FOS everyone. I do poke at people at DM a lot, but here it's gotten me into a lot of trouble. I need some time still to, like I said, feel the rhythm more before knowing who and how to poke. (no innuendos, guys. Really)

I'm not saying you need to FOS everyone, but I hope you can at least acknowledge that it makes it more difficult for your teammates (if you're town) if you're simply waiting for several days to pass before getting started.

I also don't care about covering my future scum tracks as town. I'm focusing on this game and solving this puzzle, right now. If some people always know my alignment right away, then clearly my scum game needs a lot of polishing, but that's not what concerns me right now. My concern is helping the town to the best of my abilities by putting in as much effort as I can. I just like to know that the other townies are trying, too.

[Lily]

I'm not saying you need to FOS everyone, but I hope you can at least acknowledge that it makes it more difficult for your teammates (if you're town) if you're simply waiting for several days to pass before getting started.

I also don't care about covering my future scum tracks as town. I'm focusing on this game and solving this puzzle, right now. If some people always know my alignment right away, then clearly my scum game needs a lot of polishing, but that's not what concerns me right now. My concern is helping the town to the best of my abilities by putting in as much effort as I can. I just like to know that the other townies are trying, too.

That makes sense. I have a lot to learn about being town, and haven't had much practice. I play town the way I play scum because that's what I know how to do, so you're probably always going to have this problem with me. I'll give you a freebie, though. If I come out guns blazing earlier than usual, either the person is obviously pinging my radar or I'm up to something.

[Pac]

I meant should. Shouldn't would have been a double negative.

yes at first glance I missed the word "don't"... why the slight of hand though? Instead of acknowledging my point you opted to play grammar police.

[Pac]

Okay. It makes me feel better that you seem not terribly excited about this. In my defense, I once got called out for not responding to each little accusation, and I'm trying to find the "acceptable" amount of response. It has occured to me, however that that level is different for each of you....lol. You guys are like dogs over a bone sometimes, but that's okay. The longer I play here the more I feel the rhythm of the dance. And, Pac, Lily is rarely transparent. I've been called obtuse at times, but rarely transparent.

What about my vote on you makes you think I'm not excited? I think it's the best thing going. Nice jedi mind trick though... as DPR would say - "heh".

[Barmacral]

Oh Barmsy, really? The impartial/partial dance? You disagree, but agree based on the fact that you disagree, but agree? Hmmm. We'll see.

My agreeing with you and agreeing with him are based on entirely different points. Don't try and confuse everyone pointlessly.

The quiet folk give us so little to work with, I think it's really important to stay vigilant. I have my eye on some people. For right now, though, I'll vote Naeann. Very chatty early on, quieted down as the real discussions started, then popped in as soon as I28 was lynched to make a few jokes.

She's also been around rather less than usual this week, and if I do recall, she stated on the signup thread that she'd be on less for the first week or two due to work.

[Lily]

What about my vote on you makes you think I'm not excited? I think it's the best thing going. Nice jedi mind trick though... as DPR would say - "heh".

I stand corrected again *sigh* I am no jedi.....lol.