Randy Moss to the Vikes?

[Vicious89x]

The best safeties have always been the gamblers...

And the same applies to the worst... it's just the way the position plays out. I'm saying what I saw in college is that for every big play he had he had like 5 terrible ones. JMO.

[Kleckineau]

Kleck, the Pats were 16-0 two years ago with the major aquisitions coming via trade and free agency. The following year they went 10-6 with a backup QB. Last year they were 10-6 with the golden boy back behind center even though preseason everybody had them making a run at perfection again. The reason they won the division last year was because the Jets weren't ready with a rookie HC and rookie QB to take it from them, not because they are some awesome team.

Their defense is currently as bad as it has ever been in the Belichick era. Do you think that's because they draft well? Look at their roster and then look at the Jets and then tell me which team has been the better drafting team.

Heres the thing.

The scumbag BB is so good at what he does that he goes 10-6 while rebuilding on the fly.

Most of the teams have to gut their roster and go 5-11 for a few years to rebuild. (if they even can)

You think they are so bad at drafting because they havent drafted stars like the NYJ?

Name one real star BB ever drafted besides Brady?

[Klecko73isGod]

Heres the thing.

The scumbag BB is so good at what he does that he goes 10-6 while rebuilding on the fly.

Most of the teams have to gut their roster and go 5-11 for a few years to rebuild. (if they even can)

You think they are so bad at drafting because they havent drafted stars like the NYJ?

Name one real star BB ever drafted besides Brady?

If that were true why haven't they won a SuperBowl in six years?

They are done bud. The window is closed.

[SoFlaJets]

and out of those 40 players he has drafted since 2007 how many are even still on the team-anyone know?

[jussssstme]

They're young dude...they're going to have sh*tty moments. Chung looks like your prototypical SS...Butler's got the best athleticism and pure man to man skills of the 3...McCourty is the big, physical CB.

Iunno...gut feel has me thinking their "downfall" is ridiculously overstated and more of a dream/wish than actual reality. They're going through the lull that comes from having one group of great, great players move on/retire. Most franchises that loses future HOFers like they have over the past 3-4 years tend to fall off the face of a cliff...They just seem to be in transition...the plus is that their HC is forcing the issue and pushing his young players...Only a good thing for their long term.

Keep thinking that. They no longer have the free agent viewpoint of taking one for the team. There won't be any more hometown discounts or free agents taking less to play for them.

You hear murmurs of discord filtering out of the locker room on an annual basis.

It may not be a freefall, but it looks to be a long time life of mediocrity, with more possibility of downspin than upswing.

[JetsFanInDenver]

Jesus christ already with this Pats dont know how to draft blowhard know it all bullsh!t.

If the fockin Pats cant draft why the fock do they win the division every fockin year and are 3-1 now and have as good a chance as the NYJ do to win again this year.

Give it a rest already it really gettin old.

You are 3-1 and at this point even the "great" coach does not believe his team can compete in the division and has already started planning for the future.

[JasonFabinisBackhair]

Heres a list seems pretty impressive to me.

2010

Pick 27(1) - Devin McCourty - CB Rutgers

Pick 42(2) - Rob Gronkowski - TE Arizona

Pick 53(2) - Jermaine Cunningham - DE Florida

Pick 62(2) - Brandon Spikes - MLB Florida

Pick 90(3) - Taylor Price - WR Ohio University

Pick 113(4) - Aaron Hernandez - TE Florida

Pick 150(5) - Zoltan Mesko - P Michigan

Pick 105(6) - Ted Larsen - C North Carolina State

Pick 208)(7) - Thomas Welch - OL Vanderbilt

Pick 247(7) - Brandon Deaderick - DL Alabama

Pick 248(7) - Kade Weston - DT Georgia

Pick 250(7) - Zac Robinson - QB Oklahoma State

2009

Pick 34(2) - Patrick Chung - SS Oregon

Pick 40(2) - Ron Brace - DT Boston College

Pick 41(2) - Darius Butler - CB Connecticut

Pick 58(2) - Sebastian Vollmer - OL Houston

Pick 83(3) - Brandon Tate - WR North Carolina

Pick 97(3) - Tyrone McKenzie - LB South Florida

Pick 123(4) - Rich Ohrnberger - OL Penn State

Pick 170(5) - George Bussey - OL Louisville

Pick 198(6) - Jake Ingram - LS Hawaii

Pick 207(6) - Myron Pryor - DT Kentucky

Pick 232(7) - Julian Edelman - WR Kent State

Pick 234(7) - Darryl Richard - DT Georgia Tech

2008

Pick 10(1) - Jerod Mayo - LB Tennessee

Pick 62(2) - Terrence Wheatley - CB Colorado

Pick 78(3) - Shawn Crable - LB Michigan

Pick 94(3) - Kevin O'Connell - QB San Diego State

Pick 129(4) - Jonathan Wilhite - CB Auburn

Pick 153(5) - Matthew Slater - WR UCLA

Pick 197(6) - Bo Ruud - LB Nebraska

2007

Pick 24(1) - Brandon Meriweather - S Miami (Fla.)

Pick 127(4) - Kareem Brown - DL Miami (Fla.)

Pick 171(5) - Clint Oldenburg - T Colorado State

Pick 180(6) - Justin Rogers - LB Southern Methodist

Pick 202(6) - Mike Richardson - CB Notre Dame

Pick 208(6) - Justise Hairston - RB Central Connecticut

Pick 208(6) - Corey Hilliard - T Oklahoma State

Pick 211(7) - Oscar Lua - LB Southern California

Pick 247(7) - Mike Elgin - G/C Iowa

_

Personally I think that shows that the Pats have been blowing their recent drafts. You also failed to include 2006, which was a disaster.

40 picks in 4 years, and how many great players drafted?

Sure it's too early to give a final grade but I mostly see mediocre players.

[Klecko73isGod]

Personally I think that shows that the Pats have been blowing their recent drafts. You also failed to include 2006, which was a disaster.

40 picks in 4 years, and how many great players drafted?

Sure it's too early to give a final grade but I mostly see mediocre players.

Those drafts are strangely reminiscent of the Jets early to mid 90s drafts.

[THE ILK]

The panthers should trade the cheats Steve Smith.

[JetsFanInDenver]

Personally I think that shows that the Pats have been blowing their recent drafts. You also failed to include 2006, which was a disaster.

40 picks in 4 years, and how many great players drafted?

Sure it's too early to give a final grade but I mostly see mediocre players.

I counted 8 2nd rd picks and 5 3rd round picks in the last 3 years alone.

If those drafts were good the Patsies would be dominant team right now.

[PatsFanTX]

If the fockin Pats cant draft why the fock do they win the division every fockin year and are 3-1 now and have as good a chance as the NYJ do to win again this year.

Always nice to see common sense and football knowledge regarding anything that is non-Jets.

[JetsFanInDenver]

The Pats are the like the mafia. If you do not remain in the fold they go all out to kill you.

Here's the Pats now trying to assassinate Moss character after he was unceremoniously shipped out after 3 years of service.

And they got a lackey on ESPN doing their bidding.

http://sports.espn.go.com/boston/nfl/news/story?id=5655198

[slats]

Always nice to see common sense and football knowledge regarding anything that is non-Jets.

Yeah, but what do you think of the Pats trading Moss for a pick next year? Does it help or hurt this year's team?

I've been waiting to hear from Pats fans all morning.

[Klecko73isGod]

Always nice to see common sense and football knowledge regarding anything that is non-Jets.

So anything remotely complimentary about the Pats demonstrates common sense and football knowledge?

OK Homer.

[JasonFabinisBackhair]

Are Pats fans honestly happy about the drafting going on over the past 5 years? Serious question.

[Matt39]

In sports, everyone is a winner—some people just win better than others. Like all those "Patriot Way" fetishists in New England, now freed from the tyranny of watching the greatest deep threat the NFL has ever seen.

I refer to the Shaughnessy-WEEI-Tommy from Quinzee axis, the folks who nod their heads vigorously when Chris Mortensen goes on the radio and declares that Randy Moss's not-unreasonable request for a new contract is "just not the Patriot Way, is it?"

Or when Dan Shaughnessy writes, of the press conference at which Moss made that not-unreasonable request for a new contract:

[Wes] Welker was scheduled to follow Moss to the podium and waited patiently by one of the exit doors for more than five minutes while Moss continued his manifesto. The imagery was perfect. Welker, the warrior/team guy who stands for all things Patriot — was forced to stand and wait while Moss talked about his contract and his personal hurt.

What's especially hilarious about this — aside from the inevitable cameo of Route 9 unicorn Wes Welker — is that Moss understood the Patriot Way better than anyone, and certainly better than Mort or Dan Shaughnessy or whoever's hosting today's drive-time sports-and-fascism hour. The real Patriot Way, that is, not the coloring-book version in Shaughnessy's head. Here's how Moss put it in February:

"You know the Patriots don't really pay, so when I got my second contract from them that was a blessing in disguise. I understand the business. I don't think they're going to re-sign me back. I'm not mad. I'm not bitter. It's just the way things are in this NFL, so like I said after this year I'll be looking for a new team. I think so."

Moss was asked to expound on his theory that the Patriots "don't really pay" and said it's just the organization's philosophy.

"That's not a knock on them. That's just how they run their organization," said Moss. "That's how it is. Put it like this, I guess that before I came there the philosophy was believing in their system. I think that's where they really don't pay guys because they have so much faith in their system. I didn't mean it as a knock against the organization. They just don't pay. If as an individual I'm not really in their future plans I would like to go elsewhere."

Moss received a lot of flak for saying he felt unappreciated in New England, but if the Patriot Way means anything at all, it means exactly that. It's an organizational philosophy, honed to an art form by Bill Belichick, of being strategically unappreciative — of treating football players as coldly and cynically as the rules allow. Moss was just pointing out the obvious, and he got killed for it, and now Brett Favre's a happier man, and poor Wes Welker will have two defenders in his earhole from here on out. Belichick just sacrificed a Hall of Famer at the altar of the local stupids. Hope you guys are happy.

[Child please]

"The patriot way" always included using illegal videotape, ever since that was derailed, the "patriot way" hasn't won a damn thing.

[PatsFanTX]

Yeah, but what do you think of the Pats trading Moss for a pick next year? Does it help or hurt this year's team?

I've been waiting to hear from Pats fans all morning.

I have mixed feelings.

Even if Moss doesn't produce on the field (like Monday night), his mere presence on the field helps the the Pats offense because of all the double teams.

Now, teams will keep single coverage on Tate freeing up a safety to cheat inside and double Welker.

The keys will be the performance of Tate and Hernandez. Tate is a pure burner who can stretch the field and I would expect teams to focus more on Hernandez.

I guess time will tell.

[PatsFanTX]

Are Pats fans honestly happy about the drafting going on over the past 5 years? Serious question.

I'm fine with waht they have done.

If the Pats have drafted so poorly (like many Jets fans claim), don't you think they would have had a few 6-10 or 7-9 seasons by now?

All they do is win 10+ games every year and that is a direct result of drafting well.

[Kleckineau]

Ok I think I understand now.

Pats* have one losing season out of the last 15 years.

This clearly indicates they dont know how to work the draft. (11-5 and out of the playoffs one time ha ha ha ha!)

Got it now.

[JetsFanInDenver]

I guess time will tell.

Translation: We are screwed!

[JasonFabinisBackhair]

I'm fine with waht they have done.

If the Pats have drafted so poorly (like many Jets fans claim), don't you think they would have had a few 6-10 or 7-9 seasons by now?

All they do is win 10+ games every year and that is a direct result of drafting well.

I'd say it's because of great coaching and Tom Brady. Plus, some moves like getting Moss and Welker, etc. But really, with all of the high picks over the past few years, the Pats had a shot at re-loading and becoming a juggernaut. In reality, they seem to be sliding down towards the rest of the league. Don't you think the Pats have missed a golden opportunity?

Also, not to be forgotten is the ineptitude of the Dolphins, Jets, and Bills over this time period, which helped the Pats mask some deficiencies.

[Klecko73isGod]

I'm fine with waht they have done.

If the Pats have drafted so poorly (like many Jets fans claim), don't you think they would have had a few 6-10 or 7-9 seasons by now?

All they do is win 10+ games every year and that is a direct result of drafting well.

Wow, your standards have dropped dramatically over the years. You used to strut around JI shouting that the regular season was "meaningless" and that SB championships were all that mattered. No you are bragging about 10 win seasons?

It's gonna suck when the Jets are are the far side of our dynasty in 10 years, huh?

[PatsFanTX]

But really, with all of the high picks over the past few years, the Pats had a shot at re-loading and becoming a juggernaut.

All the high draft picks?

The highest the Pats have drafted in recent years is the #11 pick and they selected Jerod Mayo.

The Pats were typically drafting in the high 20's or low 30's for most of the past decade.

[JustInFudge]

Heres the thing.

The scumbag BB is so good at what he does that he goes 10-6 while rebuilding on the fly.

Most of the teams have to gut their roster and go 5-11 for a few years to rebuild. (if they even can)

You think they are so bad at drafting because they havent drafted stars like the NYJ?

Name one real star BB ever drafted besides Brady?

Not every team benefits from having one of the greatest QB's in the history of the game at the helm. Teams dont rebuild when they have HOF QB's. Thats the bottom line.

All their mistakes or misses via free agency or the draft can be masked by Tom Brady. Plain and simple. Same reason why Favre has only had one losing season in his career...you dont technically have to rebuild when you have one of the best playing at the most important position on the team.

[Klecko73isGod]

"The patriot way" always included using illegal videotape, ever since that was derailed, the "patriot way" hasn't won a damn thing.

LOL

I just got off the phone with a customer who is a huge Bostonian Pats fan. He is in full on "Patriot Way" denial mode.

"Fack him, he just yapped his ungrateful a$$ right outta Bahston!"

[SenorGato]

Keep thinking that. They no longer have the free agent viewpoint of taking one for the team. There won't be any more hometown discounts or free agents taking less to play for them.

You hear murmurs of discord filtering out of the locker room on an annual basis.

It may not be a freefall, but it looks to be a long time life of mediocrity, with more possibility of downspin than upswing.

Who's...taken less? What?

And yes, it is a time of mediocrity. That tends to happen when you lose a few HOFers.

[Kleckineau]

Not every team benefits from having one of the greatest QB's in the history of the game at the helm. Teams dont rebuild when they have HOF QB's. Thats the bottom line.

All their mistakes or misses via free agency or the draft can be masked by Tom Brady. Plain and simple. Same reason why Favre has only had one losing season in his career...you dont technically have to rebuild when you have one of the best playing at the most important position on the team.

Cmon man, your smarter than that.

I dont care how good your QB is you need a good supporting cast, especially o-line.

Many a good (great?) QB has had their career ruined by teams that couldnt keep quality players arond them.

(see early 70's Jets)

(see late 80's Jets)

Teams do need to rebuild even if they have a great QB

[Klecko73isGod]

Cmon man, your smarter than that.

I dont care how good your QB is you need a good supporting cast, especially o-line.

Many a good (great?) QB has had their career ruined by teams that couldnt keep quality players arond them.

(see early 70's Jets)

(see late 80's Jets)

And the Pats are sliding into mediocrity.

[Kleckineau]

And the Pats are sliding into mediocrity.

This from the guy that says Brady was never a prolific passer before Moss came to the team.

[JasonFabinisBackhair]

All the high draft picks?

The highest the Pats have drafted in recent years is the #11 pick and they selected Jerod Mayo.

The Pats were typically drafting in the high 20's or low 30's for most of the past decade.

Meant the multiple 1st, 2nd and 3rd rounders. They were specifically trading back to get multiple picks, I love that strategy, I just don't think they capitalized on it. These are serious question, not trying to be a douche, I don't pretend to be a Pats expert. To me, it looks like you only hit a few singles and doubles, but how many of these guys would describe as home runs?

Specifically, I'm contrasting the Pats approach the past 5 years to the Jets (trading up and getting the guy you want). Obviously, Gholston was a bust, but aside from that, I really like what the Jets have done.

[JustInFudge]

Cmon man, your smarter than that.

I dont care how good your QB is you need a good supporting cast, especially o-line.

Many a good (great?) QB has had their career ruined by teams that couldnt keep quality players arond them.

(see early 70's Jets)

(see late 80's Jets)

Teams do need to rebuild even if they have a great QB

I'm not saying they dont, I'm saying they rebuild yet still win games because they have the most important position on the field taken care of.

[Klecko73isGod]

This from the guy that says Brady was never a prolific passer before Moss came to the team.

He wasn't. His best year was 3600 yards and 28 TDs. That ain't lightin' the world on fire pal.

In 2007 he suddenly jumps to 4800 yards and 50 TDs? Gee, I wonder who mostly was responsible for that?

[SenorGato]

You know what having a franchise QB does?

It allows going from winning Super Bowls with guys like Branch/Givens/late-30's Brown to setting all time records with the NFL's greatest playmaking WR to probably seamlessly to going back to pulling out another 10+ win season with a brand new crop of young WRs.

It makes life *easier* for an NFL franchise to do extreme things with the offense. Belichick knows this, Brady knows this, both guys know they're capable of winning without a superstar WR...Now it's just up to them to put their young weapons in a position to succeed...It sounds cliche but it's what has to and probably will happen.

[SMC]

If the fockin Pats cant draft why the fock do they win the division every fockin year and are 3-1 now and have as good a chance as the NYJ do to win again this year.

Because they have one of the greatest QBs and HCs of All-Time?

Brady and Belichick cover up a lot of drafting mistakes. That's the nature of the NFL.