Sanchez wasn't pressured _that_ much

[bitonti]

interesting article from PFF

http://www.profootba...1-quarterbacks/

the "pressured dropbacks" is an interesting stat

mark was pressured 164 total times. that's middle of the pack. if not below average.

here are QBs who dealt with more pressure:

Eli Manning (244)

Cam Newton (208)

Josh Freeman (204)

Mike Vick (199)

Tavares Jackson (196)

Alex Smith (193)

Big Ben (185)

Philip Rivers (181)

Rex Grossman (180)

Colt McCoy (179)

Joe Flacco (177)

Tony Romo (174)

Drew Brees (174)

Tom Brady (173)

Matt Stafford (172)

Matt Ryan (171)

and that's not including Carson Palmer and Jay Cutler who didn't play full seasons.

there's this commonly accepted notion among many Jets fans that sanchez was running for his life and he was under terrible pressure cause the OL was so darn bad. I don't think the numbers back that up.

I think we were used to seeing Mark enjoy very low pressure (like Andy Dalton in the 130 range) and it definately got worse than 2010 and 2009.

but still it's the NFL and there's gonna be pressure. He had normal pressure this year. Not an excessive amount. it was even light compared to some of these other QBs.

and even excessive amount of pressure (look at Eli) can be overcome. The dude has a left guard playing left tackle it's no surprise he's under pressure all the time. doesn't seem to bother them none.

[Damaged89]

Interesting stuff. There were certainly more pressure than in his first two years, but in all liklihood he isn't going to play behind the best line in the league every single year. His tendency to run backwards instead of moving up in the pocket probably didn't help either.

[afosomf]

interesting article from PFF

http://www.profootba...1-quarterbacks/

the "pressured dropbacks" is an interesting stat

mark was pressured 164 total times. that's middle of the pack. if not below average.

here are QBs who dealt with more pressure:

Eli Manning (244)

Cam Newton (208)

Josh Freeman (204)

Mike Vick (199)

Tavares Jackson (196)

Alex Smith (193)

Big Ben (185)

Philip Rivers (181)

Rex Grossman (180)

Colt McCoy (179)

Joe Flacco (177)

Tony Romo (174)

Drew Brees (174)

Tom Brady (173)

Matt Stafford (172)

Matt Ryan (171)

and that's not including Carson Palmer and Jay Cutler who didn't play full seasons.

there's this commonly accepted notion among many Jets fans that sanchez was running for his life and he was under terrible pressure cause the OL was so darn bad. I don't think the numbers back that up.

I think we were used to seeing Mark enjoy very low pressure (like Andy Dalton in the 130 range) and it definately got worse than 2010 and 2009.

but still it's the NFL and there's gonna be pressure. He had normal pressure this year. Not an excessive amount. it was even light compared to some of these other QBs.

and even excessive amount of pressure (look at Eli) can be overcome. The dude has a left guard playing left tackle it's no surprise he's under pressure all the time. doesn't seem to bother them none.

I think that stat tells u Sanchez is far worse than advertised

[stoicsentry]

Does it take into account:

1.) % of dropbacks which are pressured. Obviously Eli is going to have more, he threw the ball a crap ton more.

2.) Avg. time between dropback and attempt? It's amazing Sanchez was pressured as much as he was, considering he rarely threw longer than 10 yards.

[LurkerKing]

Out of how many snaps? Ive got to believe that the huge amount of 3 and outs means he took far less snaps than most qbs. The amount of pressures is really a meaningless stat, the percentage of pressures would be far more informative.

[BroadwayJ667]

Things will get better

[CrazyCarl40]

It's not just pressure. It's a combination of pressure, receivers not getting separation, running game being nonexistent for stretches, etc etc.

[bitonti]

Out of how many snaps? Ive got to believe that the huge amount of 3 and outs means he took far less snaps than most qbs.

it's a good question but look at that list again. did he have more 3 and outs than Tavares Jackson or Josh Freeman? Colt McCoy? there are some shabby offenses there.

[bitonti]

It's not just pressure. It's a combination of pressure, receivers not getting separation, running game being nonexistent for stretches, etc etc.

excuses. if he needs all these great players he's not really worth 10 million dollars.

i wonder what people would think of Mark Sanchez if they had to pay him.

[Sperm Edwards]

excuses. the stats aren't kind.

The excuses assume that QBs are incapable of buying themselves more time and are basically inconsequential in the whole process.

[CTM]

all this proves is that some folks only watch jets games and they do so with bias... which was already known... our sack rates are in the middle of the pack, and this is with a QB who has poor pocket presence

[CTM]

i wonder what people would think of Mark Sanchez if they had to pay him.

Remind them when they complain about cost of parking, bear and tickets

[Sharrow]

excuses. if he needs all these great players he's not really worth 10 million dollars.

i wonder what people would think of Mark Sanchez if they had to pay him.

**** all these players, I'm keeping the $120 million.

[CrazyCarl40]

excuses. if he needs all these great players he's not really worth 10 million dollars.

i wonder what people would think of Mark Sanchez if they had to pay him.

No one is making an argument that he isn't overpaid. He is. He should be willing to restructure. That said, whether it's him or someone else as the QB, the team as a whole wasn't good enough.

[CrazyCarl40]

Remind them when they complain about cost of parking, bear and tickets

I don't know about you but I like buying bear.

[CTM]

I don't know about you but I like buying bear.

damnit

[The Crusher]

I don't know about you but I like buying bear.

CTM likes blowing them,

[villain_the_foe]

I think that stat tells u Sanchez is far worse than advertised

SUUUUUURE IT DOES, until we ask the very important question of how many drop backs in total did Sanchez have in the first place. He may have been pressured only164 times, but what % is that of his total snaps on the year? I doubt Sanchez had as many drop backs as Eli or Rivers, or was holding the ball for an extend period of time like Cam, big ben or Vick to extend plays.

I think your statement, like this tread in general tells us that the hate on sanchez is as bad as advertised.

[SMC]

all this proves is that some folks only watch jets games and they do so with bias... which was already known... our sack rates are in the middle of the pack, and this is with a QB who has poor pocket presence

All this proves is Eli is the best in the NFL.

[The Crusher]

All this proves is Eli is the best in the NFL.

Father of the year!!!!

[CTM]

SUUUUUURE IT DOES, until we ask the very important question of how many drop backs in total did Sanchez have in the first place. He may have been pressured only164 times, but what % is that of his total snaps on the year? I doubt Sanchez had as many drop backs as Eli or Rivers, or was holding the ball for an extend period of time like Cam, big ben or Vick to extend plays.

I think your statement, like this tread in general tells us that the hate on sanchez is as bad as advertised.

jeez... is it that hard too look up?

Sanchez was 9th in the league in attempts, if you add his attempts and sacks and compare to eli and rivers... it was

Sanchez 582 vs Eli 617 vs Rivers 612..

assuming sacks count as a pressure .. eli's pressure rate was 40%.. Sanchez's was 28%... Rivers was 30%

[The Crusher]

jeez... is it that hard too look up?

Sanchez was 9th in the league in attempts, if you add his attempts and sacks and compare to eli and rivers... it was

Sanchez 582 vs Eli 617 vs Rivers 612..

assuming sacks count as a pressure .. eli's pressure rate was 40%.. Sanchez's was 28%... Rivers was 30%

Yeah but Eli's receivers get the seperation and Rivers is named after a large smooth flowing stream. Your dumb.

[jack48]

I think that stat tells u Sanchez is far worse than advertised

Well, Eli plays like a man. I think it is more likely that Sanchez had more mistakes directly attributable to those pressures and made fewer plays under pressure. Eli made them all the time. Good post.

[villain_the_foe]

jeez... is it that hard too look up?

Sanchez was 9th in the league in attempts, if you add his attempts and sacks and compare to eli and rivers... it was

Sanchez 582 vs Eli 617 vs Rivers 612..

assuming sacks count as a pressure .. eli's pressure rate was 40%.. Sanchez's was 28%... Rivers was 30%

So, you mean to tell me that Sanchez, being pressured just 28% of the time in comparison to Eli's 40% and Rivers 30%, two QB's who's play design allows them to throw the ball deep rather often is a reasonable comparison to Sanchez, a QB who isnt allowed to throw the ball pass the middle linebackers in an offense that the longest pass play was thrown by a WR on a wildcat rollout.

Like I said, Mark Sanchez being pressured 28% of the time is a disaster when he's only able to throw 5 yards in the first place. Give me a break CTM, how fast must this offensive line be breaking down if he's not even throwing past the damn 1st down mark?

Think about that for a second.....really.

[ZachEY]

i wonder what people would think of Mark Sanchez if they had to pLay him.

Great question. Probably the same thing as the response you'd get with my edit.

[The Crusher]

So, you mean to tell me that Sanchez, being pressured just 28% of the time in comparison to Eli's 40% and Rivers 30%, two QB's who's play design allows them to throw the ball deep rather often is a reasonable comparison to Sanchez, a QB who isnt allowed to throw the ball pass the middle linebackers in an offense that the longest pass play was thrown by a WR on a wildcat rollout.

Like I said, Mark Sanchez being pressured 28% of the time is a disaster when he's only able to throw 5 yards in the first place. Give me a break CTM, how fast must this offensive line be breaking down if he's not even throwing past the damn 1st down mark?

Think about that for a second.....really.

Personally I think Sanchez whipping the ball at the D lineman would have slowed them down some.

[ZachEY]

So, you mean to tell me that Sanchez, being pressured just 28% of the time in comparison to Eli's 40% and Rivers 30%, two QB's who's play design allows them to throw the ball deep rather often is a reasonable comparison to Sanchez, a QB who isnt allowed to throw the ball pass the middle linebackers in an offense that the longest pass play was thrown by a WR on a wildcat rollout.

Like I said, Mark Sanchez being pressured 28% of the time is a disaster when he's only able to throw 5 yards in the first place. Give me a break CTM, how fast must this offensive line be breaking down if he's not even throwing past the damn 1st down mark?

Think about that for a second.....really.

If you had a defensive lineman who was only able to "get pressure" around a quarter of the time, how would you feel about him as a player.

QBs get pressured, that's what these stats prove. Good QBs know what to do with that pressure. Bad ones do not.

What's pretty much proven by this thread is that Sanchez was under an average amount of pressure with regard to his peers.

[villain_the_foe]

Personally I think Sanchez whipping the ball at the D lineman would have slowed them down some.

lol. Unfortunately they sped up while running toward the endzone.

[villain_the_foe]

If you had a defensive lineman who was only able to "get pressure" around a quarter of the time, how would you feel about him as a player.

QBs get pressured, that's what these stats prove. Good QBs know what to do with that pressure. Bad ones do not.

What's pretty much proven by this thread is that Sanchez was under an average amount of pressure with regard to his peers.

Im not talking about what the stats prove, they're just numbers. im talking about how these stats translate within the overall style of this offense.

He may have been pressured 164 times, but thats still based on the fact that he's NEVER throwing the ball down field, let alone simply beyond the first down mark. Again, how fast must this offensive line be breaking down in relation to 5 yard slant plays? When I speak I dont avoid the information that im commenting on. You're doing that however.

I know I know, that doesnt matter.

[Jetsfan80]

Im not talking about what the stats prove, they're just numbers. im talking about how these stats translate within the overall style of this offense.

He may have been pressured 164 times, but thats still based on the fact that he's NEVER throwing the ball down field, let alone simply beyond the first down mark. Again, how fast must this offensive line be breaking down? When I speak I dont avoid the information that im commenting on. You're doing that however.

I know I know, that doesnt matter.

There were PLENTY of times this season where I can remember Sanchez just waiting, waiting, and waiting some more. Just like in his first two seasons. He doesn't know how to read a defense, and that's why there weren't many downfield throws.

[ZachEY]

Im not talking about what the stats prove, they're just numbers. im talking about how these stats translate within the overall style of this offense.

He may have been pressured 164 times, but thats still based on the fact that he's NEVER throwing the ball down field, let alone simply beyond the first down mark. Again, how fast must this offensive line be breaking down? When I speak I dont avoid the information that im commenting on. You're doing that however.

I know I know, that doesnt matter.

Did you factor in how often teams send an extra man against Sanchez because he does struggle under pressure?

Did you factor in how defenses aren't afraid to send an extra guy against Sanchez because he's never demonstrated the ability to make the hot read?

Did you factor in how often defenses put an extra man in the box because they're not afraid to be beaten over the top?

Or, do you believe that defenses are designed exactly the same regardless of the QB?

[villain_the_foe]

There were PLENTY of times this season where I can remember Sanchez just waiting, waiting, and waiting some more. Just like in his first two seasons. He doesn't know how to read a defense, and that's why there weren't many downfield throws.

Bin Laden?

[villain_the_foe]

Did you factor in how often teams send an extra man against Sanchez because he does struggle under pressure?

Did you factor in how defenses aren't afraid to send an extra guy against Sanchez because he's never demonstrated the ability to make the hot read?

Did you factor in how often defenses put an extra man in the box because they're not afraid to be beaten over the top?

Or, do you believe that defenses are designed exactly the same regardless of the QB?

These are all very good questions. Something that we should certainly think about, along with other very good questions before we simply look at numbers to determine if this guy is horrible based on numbers some would consider "average".

You're following me now. Those are very valid questions as well as mine. sh*t, even Rich Gannon has a point. What about QB development? Does that not count for anything anymore?

[ZachEY]

These are all very good questions. Something that we should certainly think about, along with other very good questions before we simply look at numbers to determine if this guy is horrible based on numbers some would consider "average".

You're following me now. Those are very valid questions as well as mine.

These "questions" are all an effort to avoid parsimony and to make excuses.

You could ask similar questions about any QB in the league, so it pretty much evens out.

At the end of the day, in this case, Mark Sanchez was not pressured any more than an average amount, and that's a fact.

Other facts include, him being one of the lowest rated passers in the league, was at the bottom of yards per attempt, and the bottom of the league in completion percentage. He was at the top of the league in interceptions, and lead the league in turnovers.

You can ask all the questions you want, but even ignoring the eye test (which makes it worse), they're all just excuses and apologies for an obviously bad quarterback.

[villain_the_foe]

These "questions" are all an effort to avoid parsimony and to make excuses.

You could ask similar questions about any QB in the league, so it pretty much evens out.

At the end of the day, in this case, Mark Sanchez was not pressured any more than an average amount, and that's a fact.

Other facts include, him being one of the lowest rated passers in the league, was at the bottom of yards per attempt, and the bottom of the league in completion percentage. He was at the top of the league in interceptions, and lead the league in turnovers.

You can ask all the questions you want, but even ignoring the eye test (which makes it worse), they're all just excuses and apologies for an obviously bad quarterback.

Then in that case, I gave you too much credit.