Was Geno the Jets Plan All Along?

[mickeyshuler]

5 minutes ago, PatsFanTX said:

 

 

The CS has moved on?

 

Did they give away the locker they were saving for Fitz?

I almost liked your post. I looked again as to who wrote it. So close......

[PatsFanTX]

It's currently being quarantined because of beard mite issues.

Those things are nasty...

Maybe they should just let Petty use the locker to store all his Madden tapes.

[Villain The Foe]

5 hours ago, Big Blocker said:

Speculation along the lines referred to by the OP would not exist if Fitz was under contract.  So does that mean the fact that he is not supports a CT that they really want Smith?

Part of the problem in answering that is that people tend to think the FO proceeds with all its decisions in a rational manner.  But we have seen plenty of screw ups by them over the years.  So it is entirely possible the FO is not doing everything in a rational manner here.  Yet the facts you point to hardly indicate faith in Smith, and cannot jibe with a notion that the FO prefers Smith over any reasonable alternative.

Then my question is: What is considered a reasonable alternative over Geno Smith and what is keeping the jets from moving foward with such alternative?

The fact that the Jets are willing to move forward with Geno as the Starter indicates a level of faith in itself. I dont feel like throwing on %'age on the level of faith but its certainly more faith than "hardly". 

My problem with this faith talk is that the Jets can TODAY sign Fitzpatrick to what Fitz wants, or they can let Petty start, or they can let Hackenberg start. The Jets havent done any of those mentioned. Is it the lack of faith in signing Fitz to that amount of money? I think so. Is it the lack of faith of Petty and Hackenberg being ready? I'd say so. 

It seems like the QB given the most faith by this front office when weighing the "reasonable alternatives" has come down to Geno Smith, because like you said, the alternatives are reasonable which would mean that its possible to do....yet it hasnt been done. Maybe Geno isnt as bad in the eyes of the individuals who actually know him and see him everyday. Possible right? 

[Mike135]

39 minutes ago, mickeyshuler said:

Thanks for the reply. I'm surprised, but I guess its entirely possible to follow a team, be an adult, and have an entirely different perspective

Sure it's possible, but I don't know if this is a case of having an entirely different perspective on the team.

Just Fitz, and not wanting to waste years and money on him.  As I've mentioned before, good chance I'm halfway through life... ha, it's time to realize I may never witness a Jets SB victory.  I'll disagree with any move I view as accepting/prolonging mediocrity.

Hey, if Fitz was currently on the team and Geno was being offered 24mil, I'd be against that too.  Though at least with Geno there'd be some potential.

[CrazyCarl40]

1 hour ago, joewilly12 said:

Exactly they have new found hope in Geno Smith the coaching staff has moved on from Fitzpatrick the sooner the fans do the better. 

New hope? There wasn't even any old hope. 

Also, if Fitz wasn't in the plans, why is Hack not #14? Let's at least be logical here. 

[mickeyshuler]

34 minutes ago, Mike135 said:

Sure it's possible, but I don't know if this is a case of having an entirely different perspective on the team.

Just Fitz, and not wanting to waste years and money on him.  As I've mentioned before, good chance I'm halfway through life... ha, it's time to realize I may never witness a Jets SB victory.  I'll disagree with any move I view as accepting/prolonging mediocrity.

Hey, if Fitz was currently on the team and Geno was being offered 24mil, I'd be against that too.  Though at least with Geno there'd be some potential.

Cool enough. And you are correct on what I was referring too. I do have a close connection to a former coach, was there a long time till Rex got canned, so my opinions tend to reflect what he tells me about guys on the team he knows and saw day in day out.

That being said he doesn't know Fitz, he does know members of current staff, and he still is in contact with guys on the team. So anyhow read between the lines for what its worth.

[Larz]

in that case it was pretty ballsy to offer fitz 3/24, lol

 

or was it stupid ?

of is this just july madness ?

[Joe Jets fan]

6 hours ago, JetBlue said:

Not really.  Fitz was signed as a back up; Petty was a drafted as project qb and to a lesser degree so was Hack although his upside is much higher.  Geno was inherited by this regime and they were prepared to see what he could do with an improved offensive attack but alas they never got to see it as a result of the "Punch".   A year later, and season of watching from the sidelines, he finds himself in a similar position.  He is going into training camp as the starter.  

Hack was NOT drafted as a project QB.  

Geno is not going into training camp as the starter.  

[JohnnyLV]

7 hours ago, CrazyCarl40 said:

If this was the plan all along, and I'm a veteran on this team, I would not be pleased in the least bit. It's basically throwing way a year of their football lives, which is a limited commodity.

Which is why good football teams pay no heed to veteran players opinions in situations like this and coaches should never, ever have final say on the 46

[Jetscode1]

I'm just glad that Geno looks ready for this next step.

J

E

T

S

Jets, Jets, Jets.

[greenwave81]

1 hour ago, mickeyshuler said:

1 hour ago, Larz said:

in that case it was pretty ballsy to offer fitz 3/24, lol

 

or was it stupid ?

of is this just july madness ?

As much as I'm not a Fitz fan per se, setting a potential 'floor' on your QB situation for the next 3 years at $8 mill/per on avg ain't that bad considering career backups like Chase Daniel are getting $7 mill per.  Just a thought.

 

[CrazyCarl40]

13 minutes ago, johnnysd said:

Which is why good football teams pay no heed to veteran players opinions in situations like this and coaches should never, ever have final say on the 46

You're in denial if you don't think Peyton or Brady or any players of that caliber don't have SOME say in the dealings of rosters. 

[ylekram]

this article is like Viagra to the likes of joewilly12,135,vtf,johnnysd and the like. been sitting around with boners for 9 straight hours

[Powpow]

Yea the plan is to start Geno, have him get punched before training camp, have Petty take over, go 2-14, get the #1 pick in 2017 draft, grab the QB from Clemson with the pick......Brilliant!!!!!

[Mike135]

11 minutes ago, ylekram said:

this article is like Viagra to the likes of joewilly12,135,vtf,johnnysd and the like. been sitting around with boners for 9 straight hours

This is no joking matter.  I'm thinking about going the the ER.  10 hours now...

If Your Erection Should Last More Than 4 Hours...

http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/462742.html

 

[ylekram]

2 minutes ago, Mike135 said:

This is no joking matter.  I'm thinking about going the the ER.  10 hours now...

If Your Erection Should Last More Than 4 Hours...

http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/462742.html

 

looks like misses 135 might see some action tonight. I wouldn't tell her you are thinking of geno,tho. that could be awkward

[Warfish]

10 hours ago, JetBlue said:

ESPN NY's Don LaGreca seems to think so.   I know a whole bunch of folks will disagree with this; I just hope that, if it turns out to be true, we don't have an overload on the suicide hotline. There is going to be a whole lot of wringing of hands and gnashing of teeth.  

Sorry I wasn't able embed the video so click on the link. 

http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=espn:17047619

If Fitz is not resigned, yes, I could believe that Geno was the plan all along.

I could also believe Fitz really was stupid enough to turn down 12/6/6

I could also believe it was all dependant on Mo and Mo said "****off" and screwed it all up.

Only Macc and Co. know for sure, really.

If Geno WAS the plan "all along", Macc has lost much of my previous faith, and his decision will have to work for him to regain it.

[EM31]

If Geno really was the plan all along then offering and leaving on the table $24 million to another guy to be the starter AND in Geno's last year under contract with the Jets is lunacy. 

[Mike135]

7 minutes ago, EM31 said:

If Geno really was the plan all along then offering and leaving on the table $24 million to another guy to be the starter AND in Geno's last year under contract with the Jets is lunacy. 

I'm thinking the 3 year 24mil "offer" was an arrangement between Macc and Fitz.  Fitz probably asked Macc to make the offer public so other teams would then feel comfortable making similar offers.

Basically just Macc doing Fitz a favor for playing more last season than what was expected.

Problem is, even with the Jets offer out there, other GMs still know Fitz isn't worth more than a good backup salary of like 4-5mil.

[Powpow]

40 minutes ago, EM31 said:

If Geno really was the plan all along then offering and leaving on the table $24 million to another guy to be the starter AND in Geno's last year under contract with the Jets is lunacy. 

So you're saying whoever hinted at this is a lunatic. I concur.

[jetscrazey]

Geno is not the answer.  Trust me on this one.

If Geno is the week 1 starter there's a high chance this team starts 1-5 or 0-6

[Mike135]

27 minutes ago, jetscrazey said:

Geno is not the answer.  Trust me on this one.

If Geno is the week 1 starter there's a high chance this team starts 1-5 or 0-6

Considering we won only two games vs teams over .500 last season (Redskins were 9-7, and the Pats when they were injured and losing to everyone), it's entirely possible we're 1-5 or 0-6 with Fitz as well.

Difference with Geno being we don't know what he can do with a good team around him vs the better teams in the league.  While we already know what Fitz can do vs good teams...  and it's not much.

[NYs Stepchild]

16 hours ago, Jet Nut said:

We haven't seen plenty of screw ups by this FO.  Macc has had one year.  What Tanny or Idzik did has no bearing here.  That's fan talk

Obviously the screw ups were not really mistakes but part of a larger scheme to manipulate the team. Mac is so diabolical that he can see what ripple effect his decisions have down the road. We can't always understand it but it's part of Mac's grand plan for us. We just need to have faith that Mac will never give us more than we can handle. 

When Fitz signs that'll really motivate Geno but you'll have some work trying to explain what happened. 

[PatsFanTX]

Considering we won only two games vs teams over .500 last season (Redskins were 9-7, and the Pats when they were injured and losing to everyone), it's entirely possible we're 1-5 or 0-6 with Fitz as well. While we already know what Fitz can do vs good teams...  and it's not much.

Rangers9 and company will not like that post.

[Big Blocker]

15 hours ago, Jet Nut said:

Nice spin but you said we've seen enough screw ups by the FO.  No from office is perfect, we need to give this group more than one off season and blame from the past regimes.  As for Mo, I think to them it is resolved.  They'll pay him 15mil this year, 17 or son next and then are done with him.  They get his two prime seasons and no long term commitment to the tune of 50+ mil as with others.  

This one is on Fitz.  He got a more than fair offer.  Just because he's holding is breath and threatening to walk whatever he thinks his options are.  If every player cried that he deserves more like Fitz is what are they supposed to do, give him more money?  Pay him as a starter for 3 seasons because he thinks he'll be a starter for at least that long?  

The element of continuity that is here that has not been changed moving from Tanny to Idzik to Macc is Woody.  So there's that.  How much is Woody behind the team's current approach to unresolved problems?  No one here knows, but Woody has a history of getting involved in things and screwing them up. 

I disagree that a contract that requires a player to accept a huge reduction in salary for two years after performing at what one hopes will be a high level in year one IS NOT a fair salary offer.  Anyone here who would do that kind of deal with their employer would be an idiot.

[Big Blocker]

14 hours ago, LIJetsFan said:

Is this your opinion or a fact?

Why don't you tell me where you disagree with me, if you do, before I answer.

[Big Blocker]

14 hours ago, Mike135 said:

37

In dog years?

[Big Blocker]

13 hours ago, Villain The Foe said:

Then my question is: What is considered a reasonable alternative over Geno Smith and what is keeping the jets from moving foward with such alternative?

 

Normally I would not waste my time talking to such a Smith partisan as you, and the part of your post I did not quote is too much based on Smith Homerism and rank speculation to bother with.

But on this the answer could be simple - the Jets simply are maybe just being cheap and inflexible in their offer to Fitzpatrick.

And of course they may simply be hoping RF will cave before it is too late.

In any event I fail to see how Smith Fans can believe the offer to RF is fair, and acknowledge it is still on the table, and deduce from that mix of opinion and fact that they really want Smith to be the starter.

[AFJF]

12 hours ago, Joe Jets fan said:

Hack was NOT drafted as a project QB.  

Geno is not going into training camp as the starter.  

Exactly.

Entering Geno's final season, the last shot to see what he has, they've publicly named Fitz the starter once he feels like signing,  and drafted Hack as their QB if the future.

[Villain The Foe]

11 minutes ago, Big Blocker said:

Normally I would not waste my time talking to such a Smith partisan as you, 

I stopped reading right here^^^^^^

I dont want to waste your time. 

[Big Blocker]

2 hours ago, NYs Stepchild said:

Obviously the screw ups were not really mistakes but part of a larger scheme to manipulate the team. Mac is so diabolical that he can see what ripple effect his decisions have down the road. We can't always understand it but it's part of Mac's grand plan for us. We just need to have faith that Mac will never give us more than we can handle. 

When Fitz signs that'll really motivate Geno but you'll have some work trying to explain what happened. 

Let's be honest about Macc.  When Woody canned Idzik last year, I was quite happy with that.  I thought he was a disaster pretty much from day one.  So cutting him after "only" two years was seen by me as cutting the team's losses, which would have almost certainly continued if Idzik had been retained.

So they do their search, and at the least it looked like they went about it in a reasonable and productive way.  They ended up hiring a guy with no previous experience as a GM, but given the alternatives, he looked like the best choice.  And he said the right things and behaved in a way that inspired confidence.  Then he went about the off season moves in a way that showed a real change of direction, and a change of direction was needed after Idzik.  The Marshall move in particular was brilliant, but the Carpenter move was nearly as good, too. 

But some others, maybe not so brilliant, and however one feels about last off season, the need to be honest about Macc must focus on the fact he has a very limited track record at this point.  Whatever good he's done to date can be overwhelmed in an overall assessment of him if some of the current unresolved issues go badly.

That's unfortunate, since the team needed a strong and capable GM. I am not sure we have that right now.

[joewilly12]

2 minutes ago, AFJF said:

Exactly.

Entering Geno's final season, the last shot to see what he has, they've publicly named Fitz the starter once he feels like signing,  and drafted Hack as their QB if the future.

LOL feels like signing no other team anywhere CFL.NFL does this no wonder its been so long no need to ask anymore. 

[jetscrazey]

7 hours ago, Mike135 said:

Considering we won only two games vs teams over .500 last season (Redskins were 9-7, and the Pats when they were injured and losing to everyone), it's entirely possible we're 1-5 or 0-6 with Fitz as well.

Difference with Geno being we don't know what he can do with a good team around him vs the better teams in the league.  While we already know what Fitz can do vs good teams...  and it's not much.

You may not know what Geno is capable of, but I do.  It's not much

[AFJF]

2 minutes ago, jetscrazey said:

You may not know what Geno is capable of, but I do.  It's not much

Can't underestimate Gailey IMO.  If anyone can get Geno to resemble a competent NFL QB, it's him.

Unlikely to matter once Fitz makes his triumphant return, but Geno might post solid numbers with Chan coaching him.

[joewilly12]

Ryan Fitzpatricks career sucked before he came to the Jets he walked into a perfect situation here in 2015 surrounded by a good team with good coaches on a team with a very weak schedule he did what many others would have done with the exception of making the playoffs. Lets not make plans to attend his induction ceremony in Canton,Ohio.