Josh Allen Hype Train Rolls on With Mayock’s QB Rankings

[T0mShane]

12 minutes ago, RedBeardedSavage said:

I agree with your premise.

I also worry that running quarterbacks risk injury too much.  I'd rather the consensus top three quarterbacks than Jackson because of that, but I'll take Jackson over Allen all day.  

I mostly feel the same. Jackson is a talented dude, but he’d rot on the vine here.

[NoBowles]

10 minutes ago, Larz said:

I knew jack sh*t, and you sir are no jack sh*t

[Bruce Harper]

16 minutes ago, RedBeardedSavage said:

I agree with your premise.

I also worry that running quarterbacks risk injury too much.  I'd rather the consensus top three quarterbacks than Jackson because of that, but I'll take Jackson over Allen all day.  

Trading down and taking Jackson might not be the worst idea ever.  Until he gets hurt, he is going to be awfully exciting to watch.

[Paradis]

32 minutes ago, Dcat said:

explain the racial overtones you see/hear.  Is it simply because one is white and the other is black?  Or is there something significant you see?  

You mean, besides race, is there is something that suggest undertones of racism? No... I'd say race is pretty integral to racism.

Anything you (the proverbial you) say about Josh Allen, I (proverbial I) can say Lamar did it better. 

Lamar played more consistent than Allen

Lamar had better accuracy that Allen

Lamar is more athletic than Allen

Lamar showed a better feel for the pocket that Allen

Lamar was has a better feel for defenses

Lamar has done more with less

[Paradis]

36 minutes ago, bitonti said:

Hes taller. He's bigger. He's got a stronger arm. Let's not pretend like Josh Allen is chad pennington.  For the record I would be happy with either player at 6 (Or mayfield or rosen). There's no rule that says one of these guys will be good and the others will stink

There's absolutely nothing at all, that suggests being 6'4 and change is better than being 6'3, or that having a REALLY strong arm is better than having a strong arm (which Jackson has)... it's all superficial bullsh*t. 

There's literally nothing that Allen has demonstrated that Lamar hasn't done and done better. 

The only thing you could lean on is frame. Clearly (as of right now), Allen's frame is filled out and safer... but that's it. That's not a reason to neglect every other measurable component at QB which Lamar has been better than Allen at. 

[NoBowles]

3 minutes ago, Paradis said:

You mean, besides race, is there is something that suggest undertones of racism? No... I'd say race is pretty integral to racism.

Anything you (the proverbial you) say about Josh Allen, I (proverbial I) can say Lamar did it better. 

Lamar played more consistent than Allen

Lamar had better accuracy that Allen

Lamar is more athletic than Allen

Lamar showed a better feel for the pocket that Allen

Lamar was has a better feel for defenses

Lamar has done more with less

Im so sick of the race card being played for everything.... Its exhausting.

The NFL GM's and coaches care about winning, fans care about winning, they don't give a rats ass about race. Cam Newton, Bridgewater, Winston, Tyrod Taylor, Russ Wilson, all Black QB's who start or started in the NFL in recent years. 

Instead of looking at race, why don't we look at projection from college to NFL.

You take away the running aspect of his game, its hard to project how consistent and what he will do in the NFL. A huge part of his game was running, and to date that has not translated to the NFL. On top of it, most QBs who rely on their legs heavily get hurt, a hurt QB can't help you win games. Its really that simple.

[UntouchableCrew]

30 minutes ago, Warfish said:

Allen seems be 100% potential, very little on production.  And that's always a huge concern for me come draft time, as it works so poorly for us in the past.

Particuarly when the Jets have such a sterling track record of developing QBs and unlocking said potential.

[Dcat]

6 minutes ago, Paradis said:

You mean, besides race, is there is something that suggest undertones of racism? No... I'd say race is pretty integral to racism.

Anything you (the proverbial you) say about Josh Allen, I (proverbial I) can say Lamar did it better. 

Lamar played more consistent than Allen

Lamar had better accuracy that Allen

Lamar is more athletic than Allen

Lamar showed a better feel for the pocket that Allen

Lamar was has a better feel for defenses

Lamar has done more with less

But what does the preference for Allen by many have to do with race? Are you assuming that the reason for prefernce of Allen over Jackson is the color of their skin?   If you raise the race issue, shouldn't you have more of a reason than one is black and the other is white.  Sorry, I'm just not understanding where the "racial overtones" you sense are in play here other than the fact that Jackson is black and Allen is white.  I don't see racial issues there.  But what do I know.

 

[Warfish]

31 minutes ago, Lupz27 said:

I’m not beating any drum for Allen, but I’d take him over Mayfield any day.

I don't understand why, other than Mayfields height issue. 

In no other way has Allen shown himself to be a superior player to-date, quite the contrary he is materially and demonstrably worse.

So while I get you're not beating the drum, help me understand why I would want to be happy with drafting a mediocre performer at the minor league level at #6 or higher in the 1st round?

[Paradis]

7 minutes ago, NoBowles said:

Im so sick of the race card being played for everything.... Its exhausting.

Deal with it, cause this time it's legit. And if that's all you took about the Lamar vs Allen argument, then your wasting your time. 

[NoBowles]

Just now, Paradis said:

Deal with it, cause this time it's legit. And if that's all you took about the Lamar vs Allen argument, then your wasting your time. 

Its BS, its nonsense propaganda with zero basis whatsoever.

[Paradis]

4 minutes ago, Dcat said:

But what does the preference for Allen by many have to do with race? Are you assuming that the reason for prefernce of Allen over Jackson is the color of their skin?   If you raise the race issue, shouldn't you have more of a reason than one is black and the other is white.  Sorry, I'm just not understanding where the "racial overtones" you sense are in play here other than the fact that Jackson is black and Allen is white.  I don't see racial issues there.  But what do I know.

 

Allen is getting some defacto-preference because of his skin color and the history of white QBs. 

Again, that's not really the narrative to be pushing here. Focus on the fact that Allen isn't as good as Lamar. 

[Paradis]

1 minute ago, NoBowles said:

Its BS, its nonsense propaganda with zero basis whatsoever.

Says you. 

[T0mShane]

10 minutes ago, NoBowles said:

Im so sick of the race card being played for everything.... Its exhausting.

 

The universal preface to an unfailingly awesome take.

[Paradis]

2 minutes ago, NoBowles said:

Its BS, its nonsense propaganda with zero basis whatsoever.

actually, you're not even trying. You're just being an idiot.

Why is allen ranked ahead of Lamar? 

Why is Allen ranked below Darnold, but ahead of Lamar. Give me a full write up. or STFU with the zero basis part

[NoBowles]

Just now, Paradis said:

Says you. 

Your the one playing the race card, not me. Many "experts" and "pundits" are busy debating if Allen is better than Darnold or Rosen. Nobody is debating Jackson up there with those two, and your argument is its because Allan's white? 

If Jackson was white, or any other color, and his game was based on his running ability at the QB position, he would be looked at exactly the same way. 

 

 

[NoBowles]

Just now, Paradis said:

actually, you're not even trying. You're just being an idiot.

Why is allen ranked ahead of Lamar? 

Why is Allen ranked below Darnold, but ahead of Lamar. Give me a full write up. or STFU with the zero basis part

Im being an idiot because I think its baseless to see race playing into how "experts" and "pundits" rank QB's? OK pal, yeah, Im the idiot here.....

[NoBowles]

3 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

The universal preface to an unfailingly awesome take.

[T0mShane]

3 minutes ago, NoBowles said:

Im being an idiot because I think its baseless to see race playing into how "experts" and "pundits" rank QB's? OK pal, yeah, Im the idiot here.....

Here is how race is playing into this. 

1. Most people who work in player personnel are dumb as ****. Honestly. ******* stupid as sh*t, and lazy besides. Look at the people who have those jobs. Better yet, look at the people who rise to the top of that profession. They’re pudgy meatheads who make awful decisions. Consider that Charlie Casserly and Mike Lombardi are considered deans of the craft. What would Mike Maccagnan do for a job if he wasn’t in the NFL?

 

2. Because these men are (1) Dumb and (2) Lazy, most of their professional development revolves around looking at other teams that win and simply copying what those teams did to get to that point, including which type of player was successful for that particular team. 

 

3. These scouts see 6’4” Caucasian quarterbacks winning Super Bowls.

 

4. Now, these lazy idiots don’t have to be “racist” in the sense that they’d express hostility toward non-whites, but they will, as a function of their job and as a result of their idiocy, discount QB prospects who are not (1) 6’4” and (2) Caucasian. 

 

And that’s why people draft Christian Hackenberg.

[NoBowles]

2 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

Here is how race is playing into this. 

1. Most people who work in player personnel are dumb as ****. Honestly. ******* stupid as sh*t, and lazy besides. Look at the people who have those jobs. Better yet, look at the people who rise to the top of that profession. They’re pudgy meatheads who make awful decisions. Consider that Charlie Casserly and Mike Lombardi are considered deans of the craft. What would Mike Maccagnan do for a job if he wasn’t in the NFL?

 

2. Because these men are (1) Dumb and (2) Lazy, most of their professional development revolves around looking at other teams that win and simply copying what those teams did to get to that point, including which type of player was successful for that particular team. 

 

3. These scouts see 6’4” Caucasian quarterbacks winning Super Bowls.

 

4. Now, these lazy idiots don’t have to be “racist” in the sense that they’d express hostility toward non-whites, but they will, as a function of their job and as a result of their idiocy, discount QB prospects who are not (1) 6’4” and (2) Caucasian. 

 

And that’s why people draft Christian Hackenberg.

[Stark]

48 minutes ago, Lupz27 said:

Allen in no way shape or form is Hack.  You want a comparison a less accurate Pat Mahomes, and a lot less accurate, but nowhere near the inept Hack.  Which lends me to the fact you can’t draft either Allen, or Mayfield this year at 6 with the same front office still in place after passing on a far superior player then both last year at 6 while in dire need of a future QB just as much.

Give me Darnold, Rosen, or Jackson, then if you can’t land any of the 3 get me Lauletta later.

Allen is more Hack than Mahomes - IMO. that is beside the point

Agree on all the bold .... I like Falk too, to me he is ahead of Lauletta.

[Lupz27]

53 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

I mostly feel the same. Jackson is a talented dude, but he’d rot on the vine here.

I mean if Bates can design an offense around him the way his mentor did with RGIII, and Jackson isn’t a moron, and knows when to get out of bounds, and slide (some guys just have that weird special thing where they know how to avoid the big hit like Emmit Smith, Curtis Martin, Russell Wilson to name a few), and all reports say kid has a good head on his shoulder, and is 100% committed to football, and putting in the time needed to succeed as a QB at the NFL level, again once the combine happens won’t be able to turn on any channel that covers NFL without hearing Jackson’s name so will be fun, or annoying depending on what you think of Jackson.

[Gangrene]

3 hours ago, NoBowles said:

I have never seen Game of thrones, I am too cheap for HBO, so I don't know if this is a good thing or bad thing.

While there are as many GoT haters as fans, It's a good thing, don't worry ! You don't need a subscription to HBO to watch the HBO shows, you can buy them a la carte, if you direct stream TV through iTunes or one of the other alternatives.

[T0mShane]

Just now, Lupz27 said:

I mean if Bates can design an offense around him the way his mentor did with RGIII, and Allen isn’t a moron, and knows when to get out of bounds, and slide (some guys just have that weird special thing where they know how to avoid the big hit like Emmit Smith, Curtis Martin, Russell Wilson to name a few), and all reports say kid has a good head on his shoulder, and is 100% committed to football, and putting in the time needed to succeed as a QB at the NFL level, again once the combine happens won’t be able to turn on any channel that covers NFL without hearing Jackson’s name so will be fun, or annoying depending on what you think of Jackson.

Morton was fired expressly because Bowles wants to run the ball more and have a Josh McCown-led ball-control offense. 

[Paradis]

27 minutes ago, NoBowles said:

Im being an idiot because I think its baseless to see race playing into how "experts" and "pundits" rank QB's? OK pal, yeah, Im the idiot here.....

Yea that's the fcking point, captain pointy pants. Otherwise my post would sound something like Darnold is good. Rosen is good.... well, no sh*t... That's what i'm saying -- it's garbage that Lamar ISN'T in the convos. Just like it was garbage RUSSELL WILSON wasn't in those convos. Etc etc 

 

[Lupz27]

6 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

Morton was fired expressly because Bowles wants to run the ball more and have a Josh McCown-led ball-control offense. 

Well between RGIII, and Alfred Morris that season they probably ran for close to 2K yards just guessing there.

[NoBowles]

1 minute ago, Paradis said:

Yea that's the fcking point, captain pointy pants. Otherwise my post would sound something like Darnold is good. Rosen is good.... well, no sh*t... That's what i'm saying -- it's garbage that Lamar ISN'T in the convos. Just like it was garbage RUSSELL WILSON wasn't in those convos. Etc etc 

 

OK, so if I am getting this right.....

You hate Allen, so he is up high because of racism....

Cam Newton was rated by most as top QB in his draft, but he averted the incredibly racist ranking system and NFL personnel people.

Geno Smith was rated by most as top QB in his draft, but he averted the incredibly racist ranking system and NFL personnel people.

Oh way, I guess your right, Geno wasn't taken 1st in his draft, Emanual was, oh wait, he was black, never mind.

SO, its only racism if you and @T0mShane don't like the player who is rated higher than the black player, otherwise, the somehow escape the racist system?

Am I getting this ******* point right?

[UntouchableCrew]

3 minutes ago, Paradis said:

Yea that's the fcking point, captain pointy pants. Otherwise my post would sound something like Darnold is good. Rosen is good.... well, no sh*t... That's what i'm saying -- it's garbage that Lamar ISN'T in the convos. Just like it was garbage RUSSELL WILSON wasn't in those convos. Etc etc 

 

I think Russell Wilson wasn't in the conversation because he's short. If Wilson was 6'2" he would have been a first rounder.

Jackson's biggest issue is that he's so thin and that a guy with his frame who runs as much as he does is going to get injured.

[NoBowles]

26 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

Here is how race is playing into this. 

1. Most people who work in player personnel are dumb as ****. Honestly. ******* stupid as sh*t, and lazy besides. Look at the people who have those jobs. Better yet, look at the people who rise to the top of that profession. They’re pudgy meatheads who make awful decisions. Consider that Charlie Casserly and Mike Lombardi are considered deans of the craft. What would Mike Maccagnan do for a job if he wasn’t in the NFL?

 

2. Because these men are (1) Dumb and (2) Lazy, most of their professional development revolves around looking at other teams that win and simply copying what those teams did to get to that point, including which type of player was successful for that particular team. 

 

3. These scouts see 6’4” Caucasian quarterbacks winning Super Bowls.

 

4. Now, these lazy idiots don’t have to be “racist” in the sense that they’d express hostility toward non-whites, but they will, as a function of their job and as a result of their idiocy, discount QB prospects who are not (1) 6’4” and (2) Caucasian. 

 

And that’s why people draft Christian Hackenberg.

Just so you know, your dead wrong on this....

The experts and pundits get their information from scouts and inside sources they have, hell, its how they get their jobs based on their contacts and being presentable on TV. None of them come up with any of this sh*t on their own, none of them. They are all worthless hacks starting with Kiper and McShay. Only slight exception is the incredibly racist Mayock who had the audacity to rank a few white people above Jackson.

NFL GM's and coaches would hire a radical muslim terrorist if they thought it would help them win games. They just flat out don't give a sh*t about what color a QB is.

Real racism does exist, its real, you guys do a disservice to real racism with this nonsense BS claims.

 

[T0mShane]

1 minute ago, NoBowles said:

Just so you know, your dead wrong on this....

The experts and pundits get their information from scouts and inside sources they have, hell, its how they get their jobs based on their contacts and being presentable on TV. None of them come up with any of this sh*t on their own, none of them. They are all worthless hacks starting with Kiper and McShay. Only slight exception is the incredibly racist Mayock who had the audacity to rank a few white people above Jackson.

NFL GM's and coaches would hire a radical muslim terrorist if they thought it would help them win games. They just flat out don't give a sh*t about what color a QB is.

 

This is why we shouldn’t look to expand 5G to rural areas.

[NoBowles]

1 minute ago, T0mShane said:

This is why we shouldn’t look to expand 5G to rural areas.

I agree, only people who hate whites should get 5G.

[ZachEY]

14 minutes ago, NoBowles said:

OK, so if I am getting this right.....

You hate Allen, so he is up high because of racism....

Cam Newton was rated by most as top QB in his draft, but he averted the incredibly racist ranking system and NFL personnel people.

Geno Smith was rated by most as top QB in his draft, but he averted the incredibly racist ranking system and NFL personnel people.

Oh way, I guess your right, Geno wasn't taken 1st in his draft, Emanual was, oh wait, he was black, never mind.

SO, its only racism if you and @T0mShane don't like the player who is rated higher than the black player, otherwise, the somehow escape the racist system?

Am I getting this ******* point right?

Speaking of Cam Newton, in all seriousness, what is your thoughts as to why Tom Brady is a "competitor" for running of the field and not shaking hands when he loses but when Cam Newton does the same, he's a bad sport or immature, or whatever else he was called?

[NoBowles]

2 minutes ago, gEYno said:

Speaking of Cam Newton, in all seriousness, what is your thoughts as to why Tom Brady is a "competitor" for running of the field and not shaking hands when he loses but when Cam Newton does the same, he's a bad sport or immature, or whatever else he was called?

Before I can answer this, I need to know if either Cam Newton or Tom Brady should get 5G?

[Fantasy Island]

6 hours ago, NoBowles said:

Can we be honest here, none of us knows jack sh*t, despite our self proclaimed expertise

We know more than McStupid.  And he will be picking Minkah Fitzpatrick.

[HessStation]

The Saints should draft Jackson.

id take him at 6 if Rosen and Darnold are gone. Sorta toss up w Mayfield for me right now