Jamison Crowder - Not @ OTA's due to "contract" per Saleh

[kthisguy]

Let's wait to see the process play out a bit before establishing this.  Crowder is not getting cut unless negotiations go very sour, very quickly.  In the end this will be a win-win for both the Jets and Crowder.  He'll remain a Jet at a stronger salary than he'd get on the open market.  

Never said we had too many WRs. This issue it seems for JD is the salary tied up in the WR position. Crowder not showing for OTAs due to salary negotiations is short sighted by JD is the point. He was/is the most reliable WR on the team. My preference as stated was bring them all in “happy” and let it play out. Quibbling over his salary when there is not need to seems odd.

Personally, I would rather have Crowder at $10million for a year than Cole at 5.5 with our rookie QB or for that matter Cole and an unhappy Crowder (taking less cash) so the Johnsons’ can pocket it. I am not knocking Cole at all, but to think he’s a upgrade over Crowder is a stretch. I have a feeling he was brought in to be the #2 slot not knowing that Moore would be there in the Second round. (Which was a no brainer pick). I think it backed JD into a corner with three slot WRs and with a second round contract puts that position’s salary on the high side. (If JD knew Moore would be there in in the second I doubt he signed Cole).

As to the second part, I agree let it play out and let the best players on the field however the known WR we have is sitting out for the above stated reasons. So that doesn’t seem possible.


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[Jetsfan80]

38 minutes ago, kthisguy said:

Never said we had too many WRs. This issue it seems for JD is the salary tied up in the WR position. Crowder not showing for OTAs due to salary negotiations is short sighted by JD is the point. He was/is the most reliable WR on the team. My preference as stated was bring them all in “happy” and let it play out. Quibbling over his salary when there is not need to seems odd.

Personally, I would rather have Crowder at $10million for a year than Cole at 5.5 with our rookie QB or for that matter Cole and an unhappy Crowder (taking less cash) so the Johnsons’ can pocket it. I am not knocking Cole at all, but to think he’s a upgrade over Crowder is a stretch. I have a feeling he was brought in to be the #2 slot not knowing that Moore would be there in the Second round. (Which was a no brainer pick). I think it backed JD into a corner with three slot WRs and with a second round contract puts that position’s salary on the high side. (If JD knew Moore would be there in in the second I doubt he signed Cole).

 

I disagree with the bold.  Players skip OTA's for a lot of reasons.  Negotiating his contract seems like a wise reason for Crowder to miss out for both sides of the table.  It's not "short-sighted" because the end result could be Crowder as a Jet not only in 2021 but maybe in 2022 as well, just at a lower cap number.

I get that we have a rookie QB in development, but there's also a lot of young WRs to develop too, so does it really matter that much he isn't there?  I don't see it as a problem for either camp.  Get this thing hammered out first, then get him ready for camp.  If he gets hurt at OTA's he'd end up losing a lot of money, because nearly all of Crowder's salary in 2021 comes without any guarantees.

This is a business and this is offseason business dealings.  It's really not a big deal at all. 

[kthisguy]

 
I disagree with the bold.  Players skip OTA's for a lot of reasons.  Negotiating his contract seems like a wise reason for Crowder to miss out for both sides of the table.  It's not "short-sighted" because the end result could be Crowder as a Jet not only in 2021 but maybe in 2022 as well, just at a lower cap number.
I get that we have a rookie QB in development, but there's also a lot of young WRs to develop too, so does it really matter that much he isn't there?  I don't see it as a problem for either camp.  Get this thing hammered out first, then get him ready for camp.  If he gets hurt at OTA's he'd end up losing a lot of money, because nearly all of Crowder's salary in 2021 comes without any guarantees.
This is a business and this is offseason business dealings.  It's really not a big deal at all. 

I can agree it is wise for Crowder to skip them since JD doesn’t want to pay him on his current contract but not for the team nor Wilson’s development.

However since he is sitting out I doubt that it’s
an extension more like straight pay cut otherwise most agents would recommend their player to attend OTAs in “good faith” and for insurance reasons (if an injury happened he’d be covered) Again trying to cut Crowder to 7 million or so by JD seems odd as the team has a ton of cap space and having a WR of his caliber in camp for Wilson seems short sighted as there is not need to cut his salary other than to put money on the Johnsons’ pocket.


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[Jetsfan80]

6 minutes ago, kthisguy said:

 

 

I can agree it is wise for Crowder to skip them since JD doesn’t want to pay him on his current contract but not for the team nor Wilson’s development.

However since he is sitting out I doubt that it’s
an extension more like straight pay cut otherwise most agents would recommend their player to attend OTAs in “good faith” and for insurance reasons (if an injury happened he’d be covered) Again trying to cut Crowder to 7 million or so by JD seems odd as the team has a ton of cap space and having a WR of his caliber in camp for Wilson seems short sighted as there is not need to cut his salary other than to put money on the Johnsons’ pocket.

 

Saving a few million here and there is always a wise business practice in the NFL.  You have to be prepared for any situation that could arise.  There could easily be some young-ish players who shake loose in the coming months that Douglas feels he can use, not just for 2021 but beyond.  Saving a few million may not seem significant but its an important business practice in the NFL, and one that all successful GM's employ.  This isn't about the Johnson's wallet.

And I wouldn't rule out this being not only a restructure but an extension as well.  Crowder isn't old and he's one of the best slot receivers in the game.  I could easily see a scenario where Crowder ends up signing a deal that keeps him here thru 2022.  

[Joe W. Namath]

Do they need to hash this out before mandatory mini camp next week?

The Jets are not going to want him there if he has not restructured.  What is he blows out an achilles?  We would be on the hook.

I am thinking he is restructured or cut before Tuesday.

[kthisguy]

 
Saving a few million here and there is always a wise business practice in the NFL.  You have to be prepared for any situation that could arise.  There could easily be some young-ish players who shake loose in the coming months that Douglas feels he can use, not just for 2021 but beyond.  Saving a few million may not seem significant but its an important business practice in the NFL, and one that all successful GM's employ.  This isn't about the Johnson's wallet.
And I wouldn't rule out this being not only a restructure but an extension as well.  Crowder isn't old and he's one of the best slot receivers in the game.  I could easily see a scenario where Crowder ends up signing a deal that keeps him here thru 2022.  

Saving future millions is key in future years. When ‘in season’ saving millions means much less when not against the cap ceiling. I think the Jets will have around $10 million (could be wrong but that was the last number I remember) in cap space after all the picks are signed. If dollars are needed during the cut down period for some “youngish player” it is there. (I always hope that someone great gets cut in those periods and come to the Jets but they always seem to get to the contenders for cheap).

Also why tie up Crowder for next year with an extension when Moore should be able to take over the spot? That is why I said maybe Cole was the buyers remorse signing after JD drafted Moore. I think we can agree that Crowder is the better player and more likely to help Wilson’s development.

I hope it goes smoothly and they renegotiate but the optics are not great for a bad team with tons of cap space nickel and dime their best WR in the final year.




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[Jetsfan80]

47 minutes ago, kthisguy said:

 

Saving future millions is key in future years. When ‘in season’ saving millions means much less when not against the cap ceiling. I think the Jets will have around $10 million (could be wrong but that was the last number I remember) in cap space after all the picks are signed. If dollars are needed during the cut down period for some “youngish player” it is there. (I always hope that someone great gets cut in those periods and come to the Jets but they always seem to get to the contenders for cheap).

Also why tie up Crowder for next year with an extension when Moore should be able to take over the spot? That is why I said maybe Cole was the buyers remorse signing after JD drafted Moore. I think we can agree that Crowder is the better player and more likely to help Wilson’s development.

I hope it goes smoothly and they renegotiate but the optics are not great for a bad team with tons of cap space nickel and dime their best WR in the final year.

 

I don't think Moore will be a pure slot at all.  That's why I wouldn't mind Crowder being back in 2022 if it comes to that.  Maybe make it a "voidable year" of sorts if indeed Crowder's services are no longer required.

As for Cole, even if he quickly gets passed by on the WR depth chart, there won't be any buyer's remorse, because he has the capability of contributing on special teams.  A WR4/WR5 who can provide depth and also return punts is always valuable to a team.  Again, after a year chalk full of injuries at the WR position last season, I have zero issue with some redundancy at the WR position.  Even if Cole is a little expensive for a WR4/WR5.  We're one injury away from Cole vaulting into a starting spot and us being very glad to have him.  

Either way, yes, I think it really does matter that we save a few million bucks, even if its only for purposes of possibly signing someone this summer.

[doitny]

2 hours ago, kthisguy said:

 

 

I can agree it is wise for Crowder to skip them since JD doesn’t want to pay him on his current contract but not for the team nor Wilson’s development.

However since he is sitting out I doubt that it’s
an extension more like straight pay cut otherwise most agents would recommend their player to attend OTAs in “good faith” and for insurance reasons (if an injury happened he’d be covered) Again trying to cut Crowder to 7 million or so by JD seems odd as the team has a ton of cap space and having a WR of his caliber in camp for Wilson seems short sighted as there is not need to cut his salary other than to put money on the Johnsons’ pocket.


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you keep making me laugh with saying the Johnsons want to cut Crowder to put the money in there pocket.

are you a Mets fan? 

because Woody is not Fred Wilpon. he has the money. 

JD: hey Woody can i get that 10 million we saved by cutting Crowder so we can sign another player..

Woody: sorry JD i used that money to buy another yacht. ...lol

Woody is worth 3.5 Bil personally. that 10 million will be sitting in a bank waiting for JD to use it anyway he wants

[David Harris]

With the stupid spending Mike Mac did I don’t think people here understand how much $10 million in cap space is and what that can get you.  We’re used to paying guys like Henry Anderson $7-9 million a year. 
 

I love Crowder as a player but at this point he’s a part time player getting paid starting RT money. There’s younger more dynamic players in the room in Moore AND Cole.  I’d love him at a reduced rate but hell no at $11.

[ncjetman]

word is he’s sitting out pta’s while contract restructuring is being negotiated - seems like both sides are standing firm - why else would this drag on - i hope they work it out - he’s a professional receiver and we need him this year

 

 

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[Sperm Edwards]

4 hours ago, David Harris said:

With the stupid spending Mike Mac did I don’t think people here understand how much $10 million in cap space is and what that can get you.  We’re used to paying guys like Henry Anderson $7-9 million a year. 
 

I love Crowder as a player but at this point he’s a part time player getting paid starting RT money. There’s younger more dynamic players in the room in Moore AND Cole.  I’d love him at a reduced rate but hell no at $11.

I agree he's a bit overpaid, but disagree with the idea that his $10MM salary - instead of a $7MM salary, or even a $1MM salary - is keeping the team from signing anyone else. They've got somewhere in the $25-30MM range of cap space for this year and the rookies should take away another $10MM. 

Even at full price, Crowder at full price isn't stopping the Jets from signing anyone.

Also as of today he's not any more of a part time player than the day he was signed. Cole hasn't taken anyone's starting (or as a slot receiver, semi-starting) job. Plus people are assuming Moore will play his position instead of Mims's just because of his size, but with his 4.35 wheels it's less of a factor. From some reports he's lining up split wide in early practices so far, so it seems the coaches aren't pigeonholing Moore into the slot just because of his height+weight. 

[jgb]

18 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

 

Saving a few million here and there is always a wise business practice in the NFL.  You have to be prepared for any situation that could arise.  There could easily be some young-ish players who shake loose in the coming months that Douglas feels he can use, not just for 2021 but beyond.  Saving a few million may not seem significant but its an important business practice in the NFL, and one that all successful GM's employ.  This isn't about the Johnson's wallet.

And I wouldn't rule out this being not only a restructure but an extension as well.  Crowder isn't old and he's one of the best slot receivers in the game.  I could easily see a scenario where Crowder ends up signing a deal that keeps him here thru 2022.  

Wish we had offered Trubisky $4M to be the backup (if the reports that he took less to be in BUF are true).

[choon328]

Crowder to Atlanta for Hurst makes too much sense now after the Julio trade. The Jets would have to eat some money but may get a 4th or 5th with Hurst in order to do so. 

[jgb]

4 minutes ago, choon328 said:

Crowder to Atlanta for Hurst makes too much sense now after the Julio trade. The Jets would have to eat some money but may get a 4th or 5th with Hurst in order to do so. 

You think ATL would be the one throwing in picks for a Crowder/Hurst deal?

[Jetsfan80]

4 minutes ago, choon328 said:

Crowder to Atlanta for Hurst makes too much sense now after the Julio trade. The Jets would have to eat some money but may get a 4th or 5th with Hurst in order to do so. 

Meh.  I want to like Hurst, I really do.  But the Ravens giving up on him so quickly still gives me pause there.  And despite only being in the league since 2018, the dude is the same age as Crowder.  

If we're gonna trade Crowder, just take the pick(s) and see if this coaching staff can get anything out of Herndon.  

[choon328]

41 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Meh.  I want to like Hurst, I really do.  But the Ravens giving up on him so quickly still gives me pause there.  And despite only being in the league since 2018, the dude is the same age as Crowder.  

If we're gonna trade Crowder, just take the pick(s) and see if this coaching staff can get anything out of Herndon.  

Hurst is a better player than Herndon and I'm not sure its that close. He had his best year in 2020 after finally being utilized as the #1 guy. 56 rec and 6 tds in a WR heavy scheme. Meanwhile Herndon couldn't catch a cold last year. 

[Jetsfan80]

31 minutes ago, choon328 said:

Hurst is a better player than Herndon and I'm not sure its that close. He had his best year in 2020 after finally being utilized as the #1 guy. 56 rec and 6 tds in a WR heavy scheme. Meanwhile Herndon couldn't catch a cold last year. 

Of course Hurst is the better player.  But the problem is we have to give up assets to acquire Hurst.  Crowder for Hurst or handing over a mid-round draft pick makes little sense to me.  

[Joe W. Namath]

1 hour ago, choon328 said:

Crowder to Atlanta for Hurst makes too much sense now after the Julio trade. The Jets would have to eat some money but may get a 4th or 5th with Hurst in order to do so. 

OMG, Hurst sucks.  The analytics had him as like the worst tight end in the league last year.

Joe Douglas would want 0 part of that scrub.

[Jet Nut]

21 hours ago, kthisguy said:

Crowder not showing for OTAs due to salary negotiations is short sighted by JD is the point.

Its the start of June.  Its OTAs.  Hes the vet of the group.

Relax, it will be meaningless in the grand scheme of things.  Let Zach get comfortable with the rooks

[#27TheDominator]

1 hour ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Meh.  I want to like Hurst, I really do.  But the Ravens giving up on him so quickly still gives me pause there.  And despite only being in the league since 2018, the dude is the same age as Crowder.  

If we're gonna trade Crowder, just take the pick(s) and see if this coaching staff can get anything out of Herndon.  

I don't much like Hurst as a player, but the Ravens giving up on him is no big deal.  They have Anderson.  They weren't going to pay Hurst, so better they move on.  They got a 2nd and 4th for him and a 5th.   They moved him for a good price.

[#27TheDominator]

The thing I am interested in is whether the staff seems annoyed at Crowder being out.  If they are working out a contract cut/extension the team may not mind much.  More reps for the others.  OTOH, they may be pissed, what do I know.  I didn't see Saleh say it at the presser.

[flgreen]

8 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

The thing I am interested in is whether the staff seems annoyed at Crowder being out.  If they are working out a contract cut/extension the team may not mind much.  More reps for the others.  OTOH, they may be pissed, what do I know.  I didn't see Saleh say it at the presser.

Saleh didn't really say much.  Just that Crowder has a role here," if you want to know about the contract ask Joe".

If he takes the pay cut it will be all hugs on the CS part.  

[choon328]

Crowder is being traded. No reason to rush him getting injured at OTA's. He'll be traded before Camp, maybe even mini camp next week. 

[jgb]

2 hours ago, choon328 said:

Crowder is being traded. No reason to rush him getting injured at OTA's. He'll be traded before Camp, maybe even mini camp next week. 

Hope not

[Joe W. Namath]

3 hours ago, choon328 said:

Crowder is being traded. No reason to rush him getting injured at OTA's. He'll be traded before Camp, maybe even mini camp next week. 

Its weird because although the camp next week is mandatory, the Jets will not want him there unless he has restructured.

But he gets fined if hes not there.

How will that work?

[Jet2020]

I’m glad Jets avoided a stupid mistake of trading away their best skilled offensive player…for now. I guess we are starting to learn a thing or two. 

Corey, Mims, Crowder, Keenan, Moore. That’s a decent WR. Not top heavy at all but excellent depth.