****The official Jets VS 49ers Game thread****®️©️™️

[FidelioJet]

4 minutes ago, Mogglez said:

Come back with something tangible

167 1/1

[Prodigal Syndicate]

Are we pretending Rodgers wasn't bad tonight? Really?

He had 1 nice drive. Looked old and slow most of the night.

 

If Josh Allen or Tua put up the night he had every single poster here would be calling them trash and horrible and frauds.

If that's what we can expect from Rodgers this isn't a playoff team.

 

[Grandy]

2 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

If he were a rookie or a second year guy and this was a rebuild I would agree with you here.  

But we're talking about Aaron Rodger and a team talking about SB contenders.  He looked NOTHING like a QB capable of carrying a team to a Super Bowl.  Not even a little bit.

Yes, it's week 1 and that can change - but he looked old and I don't even think it's arguable.

Have you ever watched Aaron Rodgers play the Shanahan 49ers? He's looked even worse against them during seasons where he won MVPs.

[Jimmy 2 Times]

Just now, RevisIsland610 said:

Give me a break. AR his last full season he threw for 3700 yards, 65%, 26/12. Sign me up. 

Yes, and he was moving around just fine that year.  

The guy is one year removed from a two year recovery injury.  You have to expect him to look old because, he is. 

 

-Fix the run defense.

-Fix the run offense.

-We will be fine because the first two will be fixed simply by not playing the Niners. 

[Mogglez]

5 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

The scary part is twofold: 1. The Niners shut Rodgers down simply by sliding coverage over onto Garrett Wilson. The Jets didn’t plan for that? and 2. Rodgers moved like he was walking on two old-timey pirate peg-legs. When he has time to stand in a throw, yes, he’s still Aaron Rodgers. But any shred of adversity appears on the play and he’s no longer able to adjust. This was true his last year in Green Bay, it’s what got him squished last year, and in this game he looked rinsed as ****. 

At worst, he was responsible for 3 incompletions tonight T0m.  The pass catchers need to shake this off, step up for the rest of year, and the defense needs to do their job so that the offense can get on the field to run more plays.  It’s that simple.  If those two things happened tonight, it would have been a totally different game, even with the lack of a running game.

[Prodigal Syndicate]

32 minutes ago, RevisIsland610 said:

13/21 for 167 1/1 is not terrible especially for his 1st game in 20 months. Just stop. It wasn't Rodgers fault. What game were you watching. 

From posters beating their chests about 

HOF QB

HOF QB

HOF QB

to "these numbers Aidan O'Connell could put up aren't bad at all actually"

[FidelioJet]

3 minutes ago, Grandy said:

Have you ever watched Aaron Rodgers play the Shanahan 49ers? He's looked even worse against them during seasons where he won MVPs.

So does that mean he wasn't bad tonight?

I'm not saying he's going to be bad all year-I surely think he'll be better.  I'm just saying he was bad tonight...and saying anything else is just being a blind homer.  

People are here telling me he was good.  He wasn't.

[Mogglez]

1 minute ago, FidelioJet said:

167 1/1

This is just a bad faith argument at this point.  If you want to break down games by ignoring context and just post stats from espn.com, go for it. 

[Maynard13]

8 minutes ago, Jimmy 2 Times said:

It looked like he was running on sand.  

Most QB's run exactly the same in this league.  Brady in his last years was slowwwww as molasses.  Just how many SB's did he win with his arm - not his feet. Your'e not going to win a lot of games when your defense is getting slaughtered on long drives and falling way behind early. Couple that with no run game, a fumble by Breece, drops by Breece, drops by GW, mental mistakes by GW, penalties/penalties/penalties on both sides of the ball and you have a sheet show.

[FidelioJet]

Just now, Mogglez said:

This is just a bad faith argument at this point.  If you want to break down games by ignoring context and just post stats from espn.com, go for it. 

You asked me for something tangible.  167 1/1 is a tangible data point.

[RevisIsland610]

5 minutes ago, Maynard13 said:

I dont. the defense had ZERO pressure on the QB. ZERO. They ran at will against them.  This happened when Ulbrich first took over and teams ran it down our throats the entire year.  They improved the DL the next couple of years thereafter and have now really stuck a hole into it.

They had 3 sacks so they did have some pressure. The run defense was a problem though. Still think they will be better moving forward. 

[kevinc855]

This team didn’t look good tonight.

Something is off. Maybe it’s week 1 but man, what a let down.

Never been the biggest Saleh fan but this is def lurking pressure on him 

[T0mShane]

2 minutes ago, Mogglez said:

At worst, he was responsible for 3 incompletions tonight T0m.  The pass catchers need to shake this off, step up for the rest of year, and the defense needs to do their job so that the offense can get on the field to run more plays.  It’s that simple.  If those two things happened tonight, it would have been a totally different game, even with the lack of a running game.

I cannot accept the drops argument from the same bunch who excoriated both Mike White and Zach Wilson  the last three years without once factoring in “drops.” It’s part and parcel to the game and every QB has to deal with it and overcome. Aiyuk dropped a sure TD that Purdy dropped into his hands. The Niners got called for two BS penalties on the same drive—one of which took a TD off the board—and they still put it in the endzone. The leading receiver for the Niners tonight was Jauan Jennings. Purdy dropped a flag route for thirty to his fullback. 

[Prodigal Syndicate]

21 minutes ago, Joe W. Namath said:

If Im Saleh, Id take over the defensive playcalling moving forward.  Ulbrich was a joke today.  Unacceptable.

Between Huff, Jefferson and JFM that's 20 sacks lost from the front.

Reddick isn't playing because Douglas thinks he's a 3x champ with a lifetime contract and Will Macdonald looks like he gets muscle burns from opening doors.

[Bleedin Green]

2 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

They were getting blown off the ball...those were monster holes.  I'm just not sure that's a coaching issue as much as a talent issue.

But I do hear you....certainly the coaching isn't great - but I think when it's that ugly it just feels like it's more on talent than scheme.

Exactly, but some around here often cannot fathom a concept of more than one person failing at their jobs at the same time, so Saleh is the newest fan-designated fall guy of this team, continuing on a long-standing tradition that has never once turned out to be true.  It's truly identical to the arguments being had on this same topic 6 years ago.

In regards to defensive talent, the DL is dramatically worse, the same LBs get exposed against the run / over the middle each year, and the safeties went from mediocre starters to their mediocre backups.  As Jets draft picks have largely been unable to be starting quality outside of CB, it's a unit built mostly on other team's rejects that people are then shocked don't all see a magical career breakout.

[Prodigal Syndicate]

24 minutes ago, Jet_Engine1 said:

The 49ers Offense held the ball for about 70 minutes tonight. Did you want Rodgers to mug them for the ball at gunpoint?

Both teams got the same amount of drives.

[Jimmy 2 Times]

Just now, Maynard13 said:

Most QB's run exactly the same in this league.  Brady in his last years was slowwwww as molasses.  Just how many SB's did he win with his arm - not his feet. Your'e not going to win a lot of games when your defense is getting slaughtered on long drives and falling way behind early. Couple that with no run game, a fumble by Breece, drops by Breece, drops by GW, mental mistakes by GW, penalties/penalties/penalties on both sides of the ball and you have a sheet show.

The problem is Rodgers' entire career was based on him moving around.  He rarely sat in the pocket like Brady.  I'm not sayin he can't do it, because I think he can.  I'm saying it was noticeable and to be expected coming off his injury.  

 

Honestly, I think he'd look like this even if he was 30 years old at this point of his recovery.  

[Jets0712]

The game is win and lost in the trenches. The Jets lost badly in those trenches. Front 4 should be embarrassed… that is why we lost PERIOD


Sent from my iPhone using JetNation.com mobile app

[FidelioJet]

2 minutes ago, Prodigal Syndicate said:

Between Huff, Jefferson and JFM that's 20 sacks lost from the front.

Reddick isn't playing because Douglas thinks he's a 3x champ with a lifetime contract and Will Macdonald looks like he gets muscle burns from opening doors.

Yup.  Joe Douglas and his I haven't spoken to the guy since April because I'm making a stand is just absurd.

[RevisIsland610]

4 minutes ago, Prodigal Syndicate said:

From posters beating their chests about 

HOF QB

HOF QB

HOF QB

to "these numbers Aidan O'Connell could put up aren't bad at all actually"

He is a HOF QB but no longer MVP caliber nor does he have to be. He was fine considering first game in 20 months and who they were playing. Offense will look better as the play together more. 

[Maynard13]

5 minutes ago, Mogglez said:

At worst, he was responsible for 3 incompletions tonight T0m.  The pass catchers need to shake this off, step up for the rest of year, and the defense needs to do their job so that the offense can get on the field to run more plays.  It’s that simple.  If those two things happened tonight, it would have been a totally different game, even with the lack of a running game.

NO effin excuse for not being able to run the ball. Niners put some UPS undrafted guy who rips them apart for 147 yards.  Are you  fkin kidding me. We spent all this money on Smith, Simpson, Moses and these guys ALL sucked azz. couldn't even get a 3rd and 1 which was absolutely imperative at that point of the game. The OL was atrocious. The DL was even worse.  So disgusted.  I'd be screaming at all of them after this loss in the locker room.  Whats worse, Saleh at halftime tells the reporter Oh we're ok or some stupid azz sheet.  WAKE UP YOU BUM.

[Grandy]

Just now, FidelioJet said:

So does that mean he wasn't bad tonight?

I'm not saying he's going to be bad all year-I surely think he'll be better.  I'm just saying he was bad tonight...and saying anything else is just being a blind homer.  

People are here telling me he was good.  He wasn't.

Speaking in such absolutes makes for a bad argument. I'm far from a blind homer, and he was not bad at all. I don't think one can look at every throw and think "bad" unless it's a confirmation bias thing, or they suffer from debilitating pessimism.

Losing badly can take away ones optimism for a bit, but it doesn't remove their eyeballs. Even advanced numbers like QBR and EPA are coming out that he in fact, did not have a bad game.

[slimjasi]

21 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

Jets drives tonight:

1 play, fumble

12 plays, TD

3 and out

3 and out

kneeldown into half

Rodgers INT

Lazard TD on the free play

6 plays, turnover on downs

You’re making my point for me? Thank you! 

One of the three and outs was caused by a drop on 3rd down. take that out. Also, take out the kneel down and the Breece fumble. 

out of the remaining 5 drives, we had 2 TDs, an Int,  a 3 and out, and a turnover on downs. But the turnover on downs really happened because GW didn’t get his feet down (although he did get his heel down . . . ) and then Breece couldn’t pick up a yard. Had little do with Rodgers. 
 

BUT let’s say you want to blame Rodgers for the miss on 4th and 1 (when GW was interfered with, but whatever). Ok - that’s still 2 TDs in 5 drives from the QB. That’s pretty good. If you maintained that clip for a full game, you’d have 28 points in TDs, alone. The difference in the game was that the 49ers scored on 8 straight possessions, and in addition to not being able to stop them, we made some HUGE mistakes that took possessions away (drop on 3rd down, pick on the deflection, Garrett not getting the second foot in/missed PI call)

 

[Mogglez]

6 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

If he were a rookie or a second year guy and this was a rebuild I would agree with you here.  

But we're talking about Aaron Rodger and a team talking about SB contenders.  He looked NOTHING like a QB capable of carrying a team to a Super Bowl.  Not even a little bit.

Yes, it's week 1 and that can change - but he looked old and I don't even think it's arguable.

He threw the ball 21 times, averaged 8 yards per, was the victim of back breaking drops, a fumble, and the defense couldn’t stop a nose bleed to give the offense an opportunity to come back.

I should have known better than to take this bait.

[Prodigal Syndicate]

6 minutes ago, kevinc855 said:

This team didn’t look good tonight.

Something is off. Maybe it’s week 1 but man, what a let down.

Never been the biggest Saleh fan but this is def lurking pressure on him 

Was something off or was this just the same team it's been under Douglas entire tenure?

[Vader]

• Sign Al Woods if he's healthy. Play him 1st and 2nd downs. Priority 1. Look for more DT depth.
• Immediately go to RB by committee, to an extent. Breece can have cold games. His rookie year he danced too much behind the LOS. He can have explosive plays but you need to get Allen and maybe even Davis in there at times and play the hot hand. You can't be the penciled in starter and play as bad as Hall without consequence. Allen is not a joke prospect; he may be better. He has great hands too.
• You can't draft McDonald and Corley and not see immediate results. These are franchise killers. Find a way to immediately get production.
• Mike Williams. ???? Get him involved maybe?
• Tight End. You are allowed to use Tight Ends. If Rodgers won't throw to a TE it could be an issue especially if there's no consistent possession receiver and Breece continues to make huge mistakes such as turnovers and dropped passes.  

[Maynard13]

10 minutes ago, RevisIsland610 said:

They had 3 sacks so they did have some pressure. The run defense was a problem though. Still think they will be better moving forward. 

3 MEANINGLESS sacks. Oh joy.

[Mogglez]

2 minutes ago, Grandy said:

Speaking in such absolutes makes for a bad argument. I'm far from a blind homer, and he was not bad at all. I don't think one can look at every throw and think "bad" unless it's a confirmation bias thing, or they suffer from debilitating pessimism.

Losing badly can take away ones optimism for a bit, but it doesn't remove their eyeballs. Even advanced numbers like QBR and EPA are coming out that he in fact, did not have a bad game.

This shouldn’t be surprising to anyone who actually watched what happened tonight.

[T0mShane]

1 minute ago, slimjasi said:

You’re making my point for me? Thank you! 

One of the three and outs was caused by a drop on 3rd down. take that out. Also, take the out the kneel down and the Breece fumble. 

out of the remaining 5 drives, we had 2 TDs, an Int,  a 3 and out, and a turnover on downs. But the turnover on downs really happened because GW didn’t get his feet down (although he did get his heel down . . . ) and then Breece couldn’t pick up a yard. Had little do with Rodgers. 
 

BUT let’s say you want to blame Rodgers for the miss on 4th and 1 (when GW was interfered with, but whatever). Ok - that’s still 2 TDs in 5 drives from the QB. That’s pretty good. If you maintained that clip for a full game, you’d have 28 points in TDs, alone. The difference in the game was that the 49ers scored on 8 straight possessions, and in addition to not being able to stop them, we made some HUGE mistakes that took possessions away (drop on 3rd down, pick on the deflection, Garrett not getting the second foot in/missed PI call)

 

The difference in the game was that the Niners offense—with backups—converted third downs and the Jets offense—which I’ve read for months was chockablock with talent—didn’t. 

[Prodigal Syndicate]

11 minutes ago, Mogglez said:

This is just a bad faith argument at this point.  If you want to break down games by ignoring context and just post stats from espn.com, go for it. 

You don't trade away assets, shape your roster, shape your coaching staff and sell your soul for a QB on his last legs for a shot at a SB and get to fall back on excuses we could hear if tyrod taylor had started.

Because tyrod taylor could do what Rodgers did tonight.

Rodgers is supposed to be able to overcome obstacles,not get the excuse train.

[Bleedin Green]

19 minutes ago, Mogglez said:

He threw the ball 21 times at a decent clip; what in the world are you talking about?  Wilson and Hall are supposed to be elite players.  Lazard I half-expect to have a bad drop or two.  I expect better out of Wilson and Hall than what they exhibited tonight; especially Garrett.  He didn’t just drop the ball, he completely lost where he was on the field and, essentially, ended the game by forgetting that he isn’t at Ohio State anymore and needs to get two feet in bounds.  Lazard had the one bad drop but at least he made up for it later on.

 There were three 7-10 yard drops on 3rd and fourth down.  4 if you want to be generous and include Wilson letting himself get outmuscled in 4th and 1 by a slot CB.  Thats 21-30 yards (or 28-40 yards) alone.  Who knows what happens if Breece doesn’t have the ball punched out on 1st down during the 2nd drive.

If you want to add another complaint to my list, sure, let’s go with the game plan .  We were far more effective in the air and they should have thrown the ball more.

Lazard showed up for 2 drives, the first when the game was nearly over, and the other in complete garbage time.  After being the most mentioned name among a poor WR corps who got a heavy load of the blame for Rodgers' 2022 decline, and being beyond atrocious last year, you're being a tad over-generous with your praise of him on this one.

Not disagreeing with your other points, but really just that this team was largely a mess from top to bottom, so there's no short list of names to mention.

[Jimmy 2 Times]

I thought Rodgers looked good, but I wasn't expecting him to be a MVP this quickly.  There's just too much "new" right now with this team.

-The injury and length of time away from the game.

-Despite being on the team for two years, he has zero playing time or chemistry with 90% of the offense around him.

-An entire new o-line that didn't play the preseason.

If they didn't open up at San Fran the results likely would've been different and it's going to take time to build the momentum.  A win next week would go a long way to right the ship and start moving in the right direction.   

[FidelioJet]

Okay, 

I'm going to bed, but if this were any other QB - you guys would be absolutely killing him. 

Rodgers wasn't good tonight.  it's the QB's job to move the offense.  Barring 1 drive and one free play  - the offense was unable to do just about anything.

Rodgers surely can get better, I expect he will, and it certainly wasn't all his fault (there were far too many culprits tonight) but we should be able to be realistic about what we got from our QB tonight.

It takes a full team failure to be completely non competitive like they were.  But Rodgers shouldn't get a pass.

That's all I'm saying.

[Vader]

12 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

You asked me for something tangible.  167 1/1 is a tangible data point.

This stat line is out of context.

[RevisIsland610]

3 minutes ago, slimjasi said:

You’re making my point for me? Thank you! 

One of the three and outs was caused by a drop on 3rd down. take that out. Also, take the out the kneel down and the Breece fumble. 

out of the remaining 5 drives, we had 2 TDs, an Int,  a 3 and out, and a turnover on downs. But the turnover on downs really happened because GW didn’t get his feet down (although he did get his heel down . . . ) and then Breece couldn’t pick up a yard. Had little do with Rodgers. 
 

BUT let’s say you want to blame Rodgers for the miss on 4th and 1 (when GW was interfered with, but whatever). Ok - that’s still 2 TDs in 5 drives from the QB. That’s pretty good. If you maintained that clip for a full game, you’d have 28 points in TDs, alone. The difference in the game was that the 49ers scored on 8 straight possessions, and in addition to not being able to stop them, we made some HUGE mistakes that took possessions away (drop on 3rd down, pick on the deflection, Garrett not getting the second foot in/missed PI call)

 

100%. People complaining about 2 TD's in 5 drives when this offense didn't score a TD until game 5 last year is so SOJF.