4HCrew Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 If Clemens once again cannot beat out Chad this camp (which for some reason I think will happen) at what point do the Jets need to look in another direction? Sure Chad is a veteran saavy leader but he is not in the top 15 of NFL quarterbacks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JETSFAN5180 Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 If Clemens once again cannot beat out Chad this camp (which for some reason I think will happen) at what point do the Jets need to look in another direction? Sure Chad is a veteran saavy leader but he is not in the top 15 of NFL quarterbacks. They are 1 step ahead of you the signing of Ainge tells me they have looked and already decided. Clemens will be like Nagle,Foley and ODonnell etc etc. Im worried based on what I saw from Clemens in 2007. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C-Mart28 Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 I think if given the chance Kellen can lead this team, the question becomes how far? 1 win? 5? 10? The whole shebang? idk. I saw promise, lets face it, he was thrown into a bad scenario from the start, so expecting 8 and 0 is too much, but he lead the team against Pitt, beat persevered against KC in bad conditions, and beat the crud out of Miami...well who didnt do that last year. Plus he should have beaten the Redskins, assuming cotchery makes that overtime catch, and potentially the Ravens (thank you JMAC). I think we need to see what he's got over a season and if its nothing move on, look elswhere, either Ainge or the draft, we will see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gun Of Bavaria Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 If Clemens once again cannot beat out Chad this camp (which for some reason I think will happen) at what point do the Jets need to look in another direction? Sure Chad is a veteran saavy leader but he is not in the top 15 of NFL quarterbacks. He's not in the top 30. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NJ Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 He's not in the top 30. Damnit Gunner - I was just typing he isnt in the top 25 either - but you're right the number is probably 30 maybe even 32. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gun Of Bavaria Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 Damnit Gunner - I was just typing he isnt in the top 25 either - but you're right the number is probably 30 maybe even 32. I left the 31st and 32nd spot for Rex Grossman and whoever starts for the Dolphins Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
124 Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 So they drafted Erik Ainge as a back-up plan to Clemens, 5180? Really? Chad Pennington Jr. is the back-up plan? Excellent. I'm excited. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irish Jet Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 Rex Grossman Tavaris Jackson Kyle Boller Brodie Croyle Chris Redman Alex Smith JaMarcus Russell (Unproven) At this point there is no way you can say any of those QB's are better than Chad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 They are 1 step ahead of you the signing of Ainge tells me they have looked and already decided. Clemens will be like Nagle,Foley and ODonnell etc etc. Im worried based on what I saw from Clemens in 2007. If that was the case, they wouldn't have waited until the bottom of round 5 to address the position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irish Jet Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 They are 1 step ahead of you the signing of Ainge tells me they have looked and already decided. Clemens will be like Nagle,Foley and ODonnell etc etc. Im worried based on what I saw from Clemens in 2007. I thought it was Brett Ratliff who was the saviour? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gun Of Bavaria Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 Rex Grossman Tavaris Jackson Kyle Boller Brodie Croyle Chris Redman Alex Smith JaMarcus Russell (Unproven) At this point there is no way you can say any of those QB's are better than Chad. They all have stronger arms. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irish Jet Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 They all have stronger arms. And? That does not in any way make them better QB's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
124 Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 And? That does not in any way make them better QB's. Rex Grossman > Post 2004 Chad Pennington. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irish Jet Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 Rex Grossman > Post 2004 Chad Pennington. No Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
124 Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 No Awesome argument. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gun Of Bavaria Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 And? That does not in any way make them better QB's. Possibly, but at least one has made it to a Super Bowl. Christ even Trent Dilfer made it to a super bowl. which means somewhere along the way, they at least did enough not to lose the game. Chad on the other hand, has frequently done just enough to lose it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C-Mart28 Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 Possibly, but at least one has made it to a Super Bowl. Christ even Trent Dilfer made it to a super bowl. which means somewhere along the way, they at least did enough not to lose the game. Chad on the other hand, has frequently done just enough to lose it. Heck, Dilfer won it all for that matter Chad does just enough not to get benched these days Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thai Jet Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 They are 1 step ahead of you the signing of Ainge tells me they have looked and already decided. Clemens will be like Nagle,Foley and ODonnell etc etc. Im worried based on what I saw from Clemens in 2007. Good analysis. I would think this just might be the make or break year for Kellen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
124 Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 Good analysis. I would think this just might be the make or break year for Kellen. Don't see how it can possibly be a make or break year for him. If you want to bring in some veteran competition for him if he struggles this year, or is just barely adequate, than fine, but to totally give up on him would be just flat out dumb. How can anyone evaluate a Quarterback in (if he starts all 16 gamest his season and the team doesn't make the playoffs) 23, 24 starts? I just don't see it. A season and a half and you know what you have for sure? Good thing nobody told the Giants this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thai Jet Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 Don't see how it can possibly be a make or break year for him. If you want to bring in some veteran competition for him if he struggles this year, or is just barely adequate, than fine, but to totally give up on him would be just flat out dumb. How can anyone evaluate a Quarterback in (if he starts all 16 gamest his season and the team doesn't make the playoffs) 23, 24 starts? I just don't see it. A season and a half and you know what you have for sure? Good thing nobody told the Giants this. My thinking is that (I know that this is a shock to you ) Chad isn't exactly in the top 15 NFL QB's. If I'm the coach and Kellen by now can't beat out Chad then perhaps we should start looking in another direction. At least that notion should be part of the process. A lot of people here were thinking that LAST year he should have been ahead of Chad coming out of TC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 Good analysis. I would think this just might be the make or break year for Kellen. How is that an analysis? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SayNoToDMC Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 If Clemens once again cannot beat out Chad this camp (which for some reason I think will happen) at what point do the Jets need to look in another direction? Sure Chad is a veteran saavy leader but he is not in the top 15 of NFL quarterbacks. If he can't beat out Chad? Week 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shawn306 Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 I think this is a make or break or season for Clemens. If he cannot beat out Pennington by this point then he never will. He has 8 games under his belt. The speed of the game should be slowing down. He will have an improved offensive line and a full set of healthy weapons. There is NO reason why he should not win the job unless he completely tanks in the pre season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 I think this is a make or break or season for Clemens. If he cannot beat out Pennington by this point then he never will. He has 8 games under his belt. The speed of the game should be slowing down. He will have an improved offensive line and a full set of healthy weapons. There is NO reason why he should not win the job unless he completely tanks in the pre season. No one really knows how he'll do this year, but it really should slow down a bit. It's one thing to absorb the play book, and another thing to re-absorb the play book again after you've run those same plays against a live defense. He hadn't started a football game, or even had meaningful snaps in a real game, since November of 2005. Combine that with zero NFL experience and no OL, a weak ground game, bad playcalling, and backup WR's in the starting role, and I'm not surprised that he sucked. I was hoping he'd suck less than he did, but in hindsight it shouldn't come as such a surprise. Now the truth is, he may not really be any better than that. But to say his career is finished because he couldn't beat out a QB who is years past his last really good season, isn't really any sure thing. Even among some of the game's QB's today: Going into his 3rd year, Tony Romo still didn't beat out Drew Bledsoe. In his 3rd season, Derek Anderson lost the QB camp-competition to Charlie Frye. Going into year 4, San Diego burned a top 5 pick on a replacement for Drew Brees after drafting him #32 overall & getting a good look at him for 3 seasons. After his first stint with the Seahawks, it didn't look like such a brilliant move for Seattle to have given up a 3rd and (the draft slot value of) a 2nd rounder for Matt Hasselbeck. David Garrard didn't really "get it" until he was 29. Hell, Chad Pennington couldn't beat out Vinny in camp until his 4th season and the Jets burned a first round pick on him. And this is to say nothing of the career-is-over-before-it-got-started, first few years after college, for the likes of Jeff Garcia, Kurt Warner, and others I'm probably forgetting. Right there, that's 7 QB's who were starters in 2007, all of whom are (or at one time were) among the games better passers. All of them got off to slow - if not rocky - starts. So while the odds would certainly stacked against him, I wouldn't say his career is over because he couldn't win the starting job entering his 3rd season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gun Of Bavaria Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 Good Analysis Spermy. 4H is right in the sense that he has to step up because the rest of the team around him is improving. QB could be the Jesus Pin that makes or breaks the entire season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irish Jet Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 Awesome argument. LOL, you didn't provide one yourself, you just made a ridiculous statement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4HCrew Posted July 23, 2008 Author Share Posted July 23, 2008 Was not really saying his career would be over but with the weapons he would now have in addition to improved line play the list of excuses dramatically decreases. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost Posted July 23, 2008 Share Posted July 23, 2008 Clemens last chance has to be this year, I'm sick of us having a QB with question marks. I want a QB that we can always depend on. We need to do something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uart Posted July 23, 2008 Share Posted July 23, 2008 If Clemens doesn't beat out Chad this year, then Mangini is a tard who can't be trusted to make important decisions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted July 23, 2008 Share Posted July 23, 2008 If Clemens doesn't beat out Chad this year, then Mangini is a tard who can't be trusted to make important decisions. How do you figure? Or if Clemens is really that much worse than Pennington, he should trot his awfulness out there anyway? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ECURB Posted July 23, 2008 Share Posted July 23, 2008 How do you figure? Or if Clemens is really that much worse than Pennington, he should trot his awfulness out there anyway? Mangini is actually looking good in this situation for having the balls not to just hand Kellen the job... anybody would think give the 2nd round pick a chance just becuase of who he is... but Mangini wont just give it to him... if he does win the job he will have mroe confidence in his play and the team will trust him and suppport him more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stoicsentry Posted July 23, 2008 Share Posted July 23, 2008 If Clemens once again cannot beat out Chad this camp (which for some reason I think will happen) at what point do the Jets need to look in another direction? Sure Chad is a veteran saavy leader but he is not in the top 15 of NFL quarterbacks. If Clemens cannot beat Chad out in camp then honestly I just don't know what to say. He'd have to be bad beyond repair to lose the competition. Even if Penny wins it with spectacular play (read:not gonna happen), then still there isn't really any upside for us, since he will go down at a moment's notice and be out for the entire season.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greenseed3 Posted July 23, 2008 Share Posted July 23, 2008 From what I recall, (and it's been a while), Kellen was able to make the right reads. His velocity is nice, and a much needed change-of-pace from the chad-floaters. His major problems were his happy-feet and a tendancy to throw high. The happy-feet are a result of unneccessary sacks (which should change with better protection). I am concerned with the high throws. Accuracy shouldn't be an issue at this level, and makes me think his height might be; maybe he's afraid of batted balls and he overcompensates. (???) One would hope that something like that can be coached out of him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.