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Jetfan13

Antonio Cromartie, Dee Milliner among the worst ranked cornerbacks in the NFL

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I'd say its more coincidence than anything tbh. You cant tell me Calvin Johnson's contract is what's holding the Lions back. Or Petersons.

 

Revis' current contract with Tampa isnt why the stink. Teams are built via the draft and you give the extra special players the big second and third contracts. Revis is a royal pain the rear, but the dude is still a phenomenal player...and was a huge cog in Rex being so successful here defensively. Were obviosuly seeing the difference this season....its like the 2008 defense all over. We loved Jenkins but what use was he if teams just had their QB's throw off of 3 step drops?

 

I actually think it kind of goes in the opposite direction.  It's not that the reason for these team's struggles are the fact that they are paying these players that much money, it's simply that those struggling teams are the only ones who are generally willing to commit that kind of money to those positions.  Historically speaking, you will very rarely see any of the consistently top teams ever pay out a substantial amount of money to a non-QB position.  So there is a correlation there, but I agree that it's not necessarily the cause.

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You won't get any argument from me there on either of those points.  There are lots of moronic contracts out there, including a number of them on the Jets, but it is horribly flawed logic to use that as justification for why a tea should knowingly overpay someone else beyond what anyone at their position is worth, as some certain unnamed posters around here seem to like to do.

 

Agreed. I think however simply pointing to Tampa being winless as justification of Revis not being worth it or that good....isnt totally accurate. Some guys are worth more to certain teams than others.

 

I guarantee you if Rex is here next season he'll be pounding the table for CB's.

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i dont think he's worth 16 million but tampa bay is getting more on their investment in him than the Jets in their investment in Cro and Dee.

 

 

16 million dollars to lose every ******* game so far?  STEAL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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i dont think he's worth 16 million but tampa bay is getting more on their investment in him than the Jets in their investment in Cro and Dee.

 

The win column disagrees. 

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I am sure Tampa is feeling good about their investment sitting pretty with an 0 and 7 record

 

They're all sitting around having a nice cup of coffee mocking the stupid 4-4 Jets for having terrible corners.  

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so just to review

 

Revis 25th

Walls 67th

Wilson 90th

Dee 101st

Cro 102nd out of 103 CBs

 

What a great trade. 

 

 

Sheldon Richardson has been far more impactful than Revis this season and should continue to do so for a long time.  So, in my estimation, it was a great trade.  Revis has done ugatz in Tampa -- and his absence last season was a non-factor for the Jets.  

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also keep in mind that the Jets didn't have to pay Revis 16 mil. He had 1 year on his deal they could have let him play it out. That was the outcome I wanted, if we go back and search about it. Everyone said "Oh but he'll walk for nothing" they got Dee Milliner is he better than nothing? The jury is still out. they could have easily taken Sheldon at 9 and kept Revis for a year and see what happens.  another thing to note is that trading Revis accelerated 13 mil on the cap of dead space, which guarunteed the Jets wouldn't have cap room. they chose to be cap strapped this offseason it was not required to be cap strapped. How many good players does 13 mil buy? 

Edited by bitonti

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I'd say its more coincidence than anything tbh. You cant tell me Calvin Johnson's contract is what's holding the Lions back. Or Petersons.

 

Revis' current contract with Tampa isnt why the stink. Teams are built via the draft and you give the extra special players the big second and third contracts. Revis is a royal pain the rear, but the dude is still a phenomenal player...and was a huge cog in Rex being so successful here defensively. Were obviosuly seeing the difference this season....its like the 2008 defense all over. We loved Jenkins but what use was he if teams just had their QB's throw off of 3 step drops?

 

Hard to call it a coincidence when it's true across the board.

 

In any individual case, it may certainly look that way, but I think there's a lot of validity to the idea that one player, who's not a QB, isn't contributing enough to take that percentage of the cap.  Honestly, it's too perfect to be coincidence.

 

A few years ago, I remember looking at the leagues top WRs compared to Super Bowl wins and the best WR to win a Super Bowl was Reggie Wayne.  Most of the top 10 guys had never won.  Wouldn't be surprised if the same were true for RBs.

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All this Revis talk is based on the fact Cro sucks this year. 2 different animals. Cro stepped in nicely last year, but weather it is injury, age or heart, he doesn't have it this year. Revis is on a terrible team that doesn't play to his strength. Both teams got what they wanted but Richardson seems to be the breaker.

If Milliner turns out to be what we hoped he would be, we robbed Tampa blind. If not, then both teams made a mistake.

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also keep in mind that the Jets didn't have to pay Revis 16 mil. He had 1 year on his deal they could have let him play it out. That was the outcome I wanted, if we go back and search about it. Everyone said "Oh but he'll walk for nothing" they got Dee Milliner is he better than nothing? The jury is still out. they could have easily taken Sheldon at 9 and kept Revis for a year and see what happens.  another thing to note is that trading Revis accelerated 13 mil on the cap of dead space, which guarunteed the Jets wouldn't have cap room. they chose to be cap strapped this offseason it was not required to be cap strapped. How many good players does 13 mil buy? 

 

Having Revis this year doesn't win us a Super Bowl.  Having Richardson for the next 10 might.

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Hard to call it a coincidence when it's true across the board.

 

In any individual case, it may certainly look that way, but I think there's a lot of validity to the idea that one player, who's not a QB, isn't contributing enough to take that percentage of the cap.  Honestly, it's too perfect to be coincidence.

 

A few years ago, I remember looking at the leagues top WRs compared to Super Bowl wins and the best WR to win a Super Bowl was Reggie Wayne.  Most of the top 10 guys had never won.  Wouldn't be surprised if the same were true for RBs.

 

What's true across the board? Great receivers and backs prevent you from winning Super Bowls? Come on. The Lions should have let Megatron hit FA?

 

Jerry Rice won a few Super Bowls.  

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Having Revis this year doesn't win us a Super Bowl.  Having Richardson for the next 10 might.

 

Mid 2009 we'd be saying the same thing about Revis vs another player that wants to be paid. WIlkerson's going to demand a huge deal....let him walk?

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This imaginary game of waiting for a franchise QB and not paying anyone else till you find that guy is not how the NFL works. You pay your really good players if you have them.

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What's true across the board? Great receivers and backs prevent you from winning Super Bowls? Come on. The Lions should have let Megatron hit FA?

 

Jerry Rice won a few Super Bowls.  

 

That paying players QB money, who aren't QBs, does not translate to wins and certainly not championships.

 

Jerry Rice's last Super Bowl was in a very different NFL.

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That paying players QB money, who aren't QBs, does not translate to wins and certainly not championships.

 

Jerry Rice's last Super Bowl was in a very different NFL.

 

So you let those players walk? The Lions should have let Johnson leave? The Texans shouldn't pay JJ Watt?

 

Jerry Rice was worth more when he was playing vs Megatron's worth now? Doubtful...

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Mid 2009 we'd be saying the same thing about Revis vs another player that wants to be paid. WIlkerson's going to demand a huge deal....let him walk?

 

And, in Mid 2009, keeping Revis was the right move.  He had his years, they didn't win.  I don't want to pay him 16M during a rebuild to keep trying.

 

As for Wilkerson, you pay him in line with the top DEs, not in line with the top QBs.  If Wilkerson will settle for nothing less than top QB money, then yes, you have to let him go.  That's why you let Revis go.  Then, sit back as the team who signs him (Bucs/Revis) or (Bills/M. Williams) does nothing.  If hope that doesn't happen.  I don't expect Wilkerson to give us a discount, but the guys I mentioned in the original post all made significantly more than the next highest player at their positions when they signed.

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Like I said this imaginary build a team- paying no one until you land a franchise QB isnt reality. Jets fans have been so burned by bad contracts to mediocre players they're afraid of giving actually good talent their new deals.

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So you let those players walk? The Lions should have let Johnson leave? The Texans shouldn't pay JJ Watt?

 

Jerry Rice was worth more when he was playing vs Megatron's worth now? Doubtful...

 

Again, I'm talking about contracts that break the positions mold.  If the top 10 WRs are making 10M per year, I don't think you pay your guy 16M.

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Like I said this imaginary build a team- paying no one until you land a franchise QB isnt reality. Jets fans have been so burned by bad contracts to mediocre players they're afraid of giving actually good talent their new deals.

 

But the point is, every team is burned by giving these monster contracts to non-QBs.  You've just deemed it a coincidence.

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And, in Mid 2009, keeping Revis was the right move.  He had his years, they didn't win.  I don't want to pay him 16M during a rebuild to keep trying.

 

As for Wilkerson, you pay him in line with the top DEs, not in line with the top QBs.  If Wilkerson will settle for nothing less than top QB money, then yes, you have to let him go.  That's why you let Revis go.  Then, sit back as the team who signs him (Bucs/Revis) or (Bills/M. Williams) does nothing.  If hope that doesn't happen.  I don't expect Wilkerson to give us a discount, but the guys I mentioned in the original post all made significantly more than the next highest player at their positions when they signed.

 

Mario Williams isnt the reason the Bills arent winning(11.5 sacks this year btw). JJ Watt wont be the reason the Texans arent winning next year. You have to pay someone. Unless you'd just prefer to be under the salary cap during the season?

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But the point is, every team is burned by giving these monster contracts to non-QBs.  You've just deemed it a coincidence.

 

The Lions have been burned by Megatron? Mario Williams has 11.5 sacks right now. Just because you dont have a franchise guy in place at QB doesnt mean you dont reward great talent.

 

Again- you have to pay someone.

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And, in Mid 2009, keeping Revis was the right move.  He had his years, they didn't win.  I don't want to pay him 16M during a rebuild to keep trying.

 

As for Wilkerson, you pay him in line with the top DEs, not in line with the top QBs.  If Wilkerson will settle for nothing less than top QB money, then yes, you have to let him go.  That's why you let Revis go.  Then, sit back as the team who signs him (Bucs/Revis) or (Bills/M. Williams) does nothing.  If hope that doesn't happen.  I don't expect Wilkerson to give us a discount, but the guys I mentioned in the original post all made significantly more than the next highest player at their positions when they signed.

 

You don't let him go.  You franchise him.  That's the purpose. 

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The Lions have been burned by Megatron? Mario Williams has 11.5 sacks right now. Just because you dont have a franchise guy in place at QB doesnt mean you dont reward great talent.

 

Again- you have to pay someone.

 

Individual players who aren't QBs don't win games on their own.  Mario Williams and JJ Watt may be playing great, but giving them deals that destroy the positional value means you are limited elsewhere.  So, maybe you have Williams, but then you can only afford a C+ at another position instead of a B.  That difference seems to matter when it comes to building an overall team.

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You don't let him go.  You franchise him.  That's the purpose. 

 

Of course, which gets him at a reasonable price, the average of the top 5.  Not 6 million more than the average of the top 5.

 

W/ Revis, we didn't have that luxury.

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Individual players who aren't QBs don't win games on their own.  Mario Williams and JJ Watt may be playing great, but giving them deals that destroy the positional value means you are limited elsewhere.  So, maybe you have Williams, but then you can only afford a C+ at another position instead of a B.  That difference seems to matter when it comes to building an overall team.

 

There are no players in the NFL that win games on their own. If that were the case, then your theory about being limited elsewhere wouldnt hold true.

 

You have a star player in his prime- you gotta pay him. Megatron is worth at least two B players at other positions. Denver has an all star team while paying Peyton. Somehow it gets done there. Give me the A+ skill position player over a B linebacker and B- tackle every day.

Edited by Matt39

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so just to review

 

Revis 25th

Walls 67th

Wilson 90th

Dee 101st

Cro 102nd out of 103 CBs

 

What a great trade. 

 

We traded Revis for Sheldon Richardson and cap space derp derp derp

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