Sanchez vs Smith

[Jetsfan80]

When Sanchez is named the starter in early August, I'm coming for you first.

 

And your reward will be watching Revis run Sanchez's first throw into our end zone.  Congrata-f***ing-lations.

[jack48]

Amazing that you can come to a conclusion (on Smith) like that so early in his first pre-season.  Sanchez will never approach being 15th best QB in any league.  Unless it has 15 teams.  I know what Sanchez is and what he isn't.  In fact, he is what he isn't.

[jack48]

Actually no we haven't seen "how this movie ends", at all.  The Jets haven't had a legitimate QB competition since......when, exactly?  And we have nothing to compare it to in the NFL currently.

 

On one hand, we have a QB who is mind-numbingly bad, who runs into his linemen and fumbles, and throws interceptions to defensive linemen.  On the other, we have a very talented QB who had a stellar college career and has the prototypical physical attributes to be a successful QB, but who is extremely raw.

 

What "movies" have you been watching where the above scenario is the case, and is so easy to predict?

sanchez is still raw after 4 years.

[Jetsfan80]

Amazing that you can come to a conclusion (on Smith) like that so early in his first pre-season.  Sanchez will never approach being 15th best QB in any league.  Unless it has 15 teams.  I know what Sanchez is and what he isn't.  In fact, he is what he isn't.

 

We've been saying for years that all we need is for Sanchez to minimize the turnovers and just be OK at quarterback.  Instead, he committed 52 turnovers over a 2-year period and has only been better than maybe whoever Arizona was trotting out there.  But it's all Rex Ryan and Clyde Gates' fault so whatever.  And Geno can't beat him out because he's sucked through 2 weeks of practice and is a rookie.  lulz. *Bitonti/CrazyCarl logic*

[jack48]

personally speaking, i gave sanchez the benefit of the doubt last year after all, everyone is entitled to a bad year and seeing how he didnt suffer a sophmore slump i just looked at it as that but a year later.  But two bad years and actually doing even worse in his second bad year has given me all i can handle from him.  if he is the starting QB, I will root for him and hope the new offense and OC/QB Coach has fixed his double pump to his target allowing all defenders in the area to swarm on his target.  it was a total abortion of a year on the offensive side of the ball and it affected our defensive side of the ball as well.  just a total sh!t show.

 

 

I thought it was his footwork.  I remember reading articles about how little sanchez would hang out at USC practice emilating carson palmer and working on his footwork off to the side of practice.

are they entitled to a bad year every year?

[jack48]

We've been saying for years that all we need is for Sanchez to minimize the turnovers and just be OK at quarterback.  Instead, he committed 52 turnovers over a 2-year period and has only been better than maybe whoever Arizona was trotting out there.  But it's all Rex Ryan and Clyde Gates' fault so whatever.  And Geno can't beat him out because he's sucked through 2 weeks of practice and is a rookie.  lulz. *Bitonti/CrazyCarl logic*

 

 

I put very ilittle stock in these flag football practices.  When Sanches hears contact he will develop stress incontinence.

[jack48]

New regimes mean new QB's.  There's no predicability here.  Rex is coaching for his job so he needs to send the best guy out there.  If its Geno, he'll start.  Anything else is mere speculation and you cannot act like you know one way or the other what will happen yet.

 

 

See I actually believe now that if Rex sends Geno out there and he is just okay for a rookie, Rex comes back.  If he sends Sanchez out there, he better win 10 games or he is gone.

[NCJETSFAN]

Does anyone think that maybe we need to look at the coaches in doing a bad job with qbs

It's like we won't coach Sanchez when he becomes bad we draft a new one and do same thing

I guess at mini camp geno hasn't brought anything to the table besides we have no TE or WRS. Or RBs.

[bitonti]

Does anyone think that maybe we need to look at the coaches in doing a bad job with qbs

It's like we won't coach Sanchez when he becomes bad we draft a new one and do same thing

I guess at mini camp geno hasn't brought anything to the table besides we have no TE or WRS. Or RBs.

 

or maybe they are drafting the wrong QB's.  It's hard to find these guys. 

[dbatesman]

stress incontinence

This is a fantastic term.

[jack48]

This is a fantastic term.

 

Ha ha.  Lots of old people have it.  They drip, you see.

[bassmaster2]

See I actually believe now that if Rex sends Geno out there and he is just okay for a rookie, Rex comes back.  If he sends Sanchez out there, he better win 10 games or he is gone.

I do not agree , Rex need 7 wins to save his job , play Geno is not going to help him , Rex is going to start Mark and if things turn bad turn to Geno , the Jets have a hard start of the season

[pedro55]

or maybe they are drafting the wrong QB's.  It's hard to find these guys. 

 

  It's a combination of both.  They draft the wrong guys or put them in the wrong situations and then they don't coach them up at all.

The best example is a guy like Alex Smith.  For years he sucked. Was a bust.  He had a somewhat ok year with Norv Turner as OC, but then Norv was gone and it was back to being a bust.   Harbaugh and staff come onboard and the guy suddenly becomes like Chad Pennington but with a better healthier arm.  How do you suddenly go from being a bust to a go who was on pace to have a 70 percent completion percentage last year?  Maybe he grew up, but a lot of it also had to do with coaching.  

 

 Sometimes you might not have the next HOF QB, but you have a guy who can win you a super bowl or get you close.   The Jets don't seem to ever have the right coaches who know how to develop players.

[dbatesman]

Ha ha. Lots of old people have it. They drip, you see.

I'm definitely using it from now on.

[CotcheryifyouCan]

did anyone see mangold today wearing the headband in support for sanchez?  heres a link

 

 

http://deadspin.com/jets-center-nick-mangold-wore-a-futbol-style-headband-512736264

[Smashmouth]

Bill Walsh said Draft a QB every year, I don't know the real knock on Geno. He's a steal in the 2nd on potential alone. He was very accurate in Collage. Something we lacked with Sanchez.

If he ant the guy and we have to go Q.B next year it means you could have a quality cheap backup.

Zero downside, besides the injury to Dave G would have ment Sanchez would have been our 100% starter for 2013.

 

funny thing is Sanchez was very accurate in college as well ....we see what that got him

[Maxman]

They way I see it both of these guys on there best days are maybe a 15 th best qb so it doesn't matter who starts we still need a franchise QB!!

 

The Jets can win the Super Bowl with the 15th best QB.  They have been at 29 plus for awhile.  15 would be a huge improvement.

[Stonehands]

we've seen alot of QBs come and go in the draft and when a guy isn't RG3 fast, Cam Newton big, but he's still an elite prospect, they point to accuracy.  We do have other data by the way minicamps where Sanchez is getting more reps and scoring more TD's. 

 

I don't know where that information is coming from because everything I read indicates that Geno is throwing a noticeably better ball than Sanchez with more zip and accuracy and just needs to get comfortable in the offense.

[stugotz81]

did anyone see mangold today wearing the headband in support for sanchez?  heres a link

 

 

http://deadspin.com/jets-center-nick-mangold-wore-a-futbol-style-headband-512736264

Yea, but Mangold is bad ass and can pull that off....Sanchez just looks like a lil btch with it. Sanchez should wear a do-rag for sure.

[Obrien2Toon]

Start Geno, see what he has. I predict not much, hope and pray we suck enough for Bridgewater.

[bitonti]

  It's a combination of both.  They draft the wrong guys or put them in the wrong situations and then they don't coach them up at all.

The best example is a guy like Alex Smith.  For years he sucked. Was a bust.  He had a somewhat ok year with Norv Turner as OC, but then Norv was gone and it was back to being a bust.   Harbaugh and staff come onboard and the guy suddenly becomes like Chad Pennington but with a better healthier arm.  How do you suddenly go from being a bust to a go who was on pace to have a 70 percent completion percentage last year?  Maybe he grew up, but a lot of it also had to do with coaching.  

 

 Sometimes you might not have the next HOF QB, but you have a guy who can win you a super bowl or get you close.   The Jets don't seem to ever have the right coaches who know how to develop players.

 

 

this is a decent example but keep in mind Alex Smith was a 1 overall. Sanchez was a 5 and geno was a 2nd rounder. While a Tom Brady lightining strike does sometimes happen, usually the only sure thing QBs are at 1 overall. 

[JoeKlecko]

So we can't say anything bad about the jets?

Do u really think geno is a top QB in this league .

My prob is they are rebuilding and prob will win between 2 - 4 games and we will be possible a qb pick again and therefore geno was a wasted pick!!

If u wanna rebuild then be bad it's the only way

 

Sigh.  You just don't get it do you?  He doesn't have to be a top QB in the league.  Hopefully, he will prove you and other doubters wrong, but he could consistently be the 15th-ranked QB in the NFL and if Rex is able to get the D back to the top 3 in scoring defense AND be able to generate consistent pressure on opposing QBs, that could very well be enough to win a SB or two.

 

Also, your all or nothing, boom or bust in his rookie year logic is totally off and simply put, just plain stupid.  Just because the Jets only win 2-4 games this year (I'm not saying I think you're right, just going along with that point for argument's sake) doesn't mean it's Smith's fault or he's a wasted pick.  If he doesn't start until midway thru the season or even later, and then plays pretty solidly, how would that be his fault or make him a wasted pick, especially since the whole offense is learning a new system and there are major question marks at WR and TE not to mention OG?  Anyone with half a brain knew this was going to be a 2-year rebuild.  The Jets simply had too many holes in the starting lineups and too little quality depth.  They knew Geno needed some time to work on his fundamentals, adjust to the NFL and wasn't a Russell Wilson, RGIII or Luck.  That's why they were able to draft him in the second round.  In all likelihood, no one player they could have taken in the 2nd round would have made any difference between 4 wins and 5 wins.  As has been said many times on this board, he was the top-rated QB in this draft, the Jets are desperate at QB, and there are no guarantees that the 2014 draft will be any better than this year's draft, or even if it is, that the Jets will be in a position to get one of those QBs.  In addition, the Jets are going to need a quality backup going forward, so even if Smith never develops into a topflight starting QB, he could provide very solid backup play for the next 10 years.  So to say that he was a wasted pick at this point is just mind-numbingly stupid.

 

You sound like you're about 12 years old and have watched maybe 10 minutes of NFL football and are in full fledged panic mode because they aren't going to be a true contender for the Lombardi Trophy.  You need to chillax, dude.  Sit back and give Idzik and Smith a chance.  They may ultimately fail, as many Jets GMs and QBs have, but I'm willing to give them a couple of years to see.  You can't get a real idea before then in most cases.  It does take players some time to develop.  Not every draft pick that comes into the NFL is either a star from the first moment he sets foot on the field in rookie OTAs or a flat out bust.  In fact, most players are in the middle somewhere, and it takes at least a year, if not two or three for many of them to develop, and they turn into very solid role and depth players at a minimum, while some go on to be very, very good starters.  Still others do wash out.  The point being that it takes time.

[T0mShane]

this is a decent example but keep in mind Alex Smith was a 1 overall. Sanchez was a 5 and geno was a 2nd rounder. While a Tom Brady lightining strike does sometimes happen, usually the only sure thing QBs are at 1 overall.

The best quarterback in the league is Aaron Rodgers, who was draft at 24. The next best QB is Drew Brees, drafted at 33. The next best QB is Tom Brady, drafted in the sixth round.

[bitonti]

The best quarterback in the league is Aaron Rodgers, who was draft at 24. The next best QB is Drew Brees, drafted at 33. The next best QB is Tom Brady, drafted in the sixth round.

 

I specifically said lightning strikes do happen. How many busts at QBs were drafted over that time? Dozens.

 

Jets fans stand next to a tree in a thunderstorm and wonder where's the lightning? Bottom line Joe might be right. Geno might not be any better than Mark.

 

 Different doesn't always mean better. We had the same situation with the coordinators last year. It turns out that yes there was a coordinator worse than Schotty. 

[T0mShane]

I specifically said lightning strikes do happen. How many busts at QBs were drafted over that time? Dozens.

Jets fans stand next to a tree in a thunderstorm and wonder where's the lightning? Bottom line Joe might be right. Geno might not be any better than Mark.

Different doesn't always mean better. We had the same situation with the coordinators last year. It turns out that yes there was a coordinator worse than Schotty.

Do they have particularly persistent lightning where you're from?

[JoeKlecko]

I specifically said lightning strikes do happen. How many busts at QBs were drafted over that time? Dozens.

 

Jets fans stand next to a tree in a thunderstorm and wonder where's the lightning? Bottom line Joe might be right. Geno might not be any better than Mark.

 

 Different doesn't always mean better. We had the same situation with the coordinators last year. It turns out that yes there was a coordinator worse than Schotty. 

 

Yes, but although OC was his title, Sparano had next to no experience as an OC, and was a terrible hire from the get go.  Unless he was forced upon Rex by Tanny (and all of the quotes regarding Sparano's hire indicate that Rex wanted him), then Rex needs to take the hit for hiring that incompetent hack in the first place. Schotty's terrible, but at least he had experience and some pedigree as an OC.  Sparano didn't.  Don't say Dallas, either, because he really wasn't the OC there.

[dbatesman]

I specifically said lightning strikes do happen. How many busts at QBs were drafted over that time? Dozens.

 

Jets fans stand next to a tree in a thunderstorm and wonder where's the lightning? Bottom line Joe might be right. Geno might not be any better than Mark.

 

 Different doesn't always mean better. We had the same situation with the coordinators last year. It turns out that yes there was a coordinator worse than Schotty. 

 

I'm with you. Nothing to be done. Firing Tannenbaum doesn't make the team better. Anxiety is the dizziness of freedom. Hell is...trading Revis. Ceci n'est pas une pipe.

[peebag]

I'm with you. Nothing to be done. Firing Tannenbaum doesn't make the team better. Anxiety is the dizziness of freedom. Hell is...trading Revis. Ceci n'est pas une pipe.

 

get the hell out of our American thread Frenchy!

[kelticwizard]

this is a decent example but keep in mind Alex Smith was a 1 overall. Sanchez was a 5 and geno was a 2nd rounder. While a Tom Brady lightining strike does sometimes happen, usually the only sure thing QBs are at 1 overall. 

 

There is a difference in second round QB's.

 

Drew Brees had drawn NFL interest for a couple of years in college and was widely regarded as a first round choice. He just slipped to the first pick of the second round.

 

Boomer Esiason was also projected mid-to-late first round, he slipped to early first round.

 

So Geno, widely regarded everywhere but Buffalo as the best QB in the draft, slips to early second round.

 

When you are widely regarded in college as going first round and you slip to second, that's a different case from being widely regarded as third round and moving up to second on draft day, such as Kellen Clemems, (who was good enough to have 7 years in the NFL and still going).

[pedro55]

There is a difference in second round QB's.

 

Drew Brees had drawn NFL interest for a couple of years in college and was widely regarded as a first round choice. He just slipped to the first pick of the second round.

 

Boomer Esiason was also projected mid-to-late first round, he slipped to early first round.

 

So Geno, widely regarded everywhere but Buffalo as the best QB in the draft, slips to early second round.

 

When you are widely regarded in college as going first round and you slip to second, that's a different case from being widely regarded as third round and moving up to second on draft day, such as Kellen Clemems, (who was good enough to have 7 years in the NFL and still going).

 

  This has more to do with he's cheap and probably a good kid, easy to get along with, etc and seems to have no issues being a 2nd or 3rd string QB.   

I mean he's practically never played over his career.  There are plenty of backup and 3rd string QBs who stink and stick around for years.  

 

Sometimes it's about the cheap cost, sometimes its easier to stick with a guy who has been in the NFL and isn't looking to ever start compared to hoping some 3rd or 4th round pick doesn't just suck.   I mean Charlie Whitehurst has been in the NFL for like 8 years.  That doesn't say he's good enough to be in the NFL.

 

Hell everybody thinks Tebow sucks, but if he sticks around as the 2nd or 3rd string QB for the Patriots and Brady plays another 4 years,  you could say Tebow was good enough to be an backup NFL qb for 7 years too.

[Lizard King]

I am just glad Cavanaugh no longer has access to our QB's.

[jbone]

I am just glad Cavanaugh no longer has access to our QB's.

Lee already has him using his left hand to protect the ball. I guess that thought never occurred to Cavanuagh? I don't know who is luckier, Cavanuagh not having to deal with the abyss that is Mark Sanchez, or Mark not having to deal with Cavanugh's incompetence. Seems like a win-win for both.

 

Jay Cutler and Bears are the real losers here.

[bitonti]

There is a difference in second round QB's.

 

Drew Brees had drawn NFL interest for a couple of years in college and was widely regarded as a first round choice. He just slipped to the first pick of the second round.

 

Boomer Esiason was also projected mid-to-late first round, he slipped to early first round.

 

So Geno, widely regarded everywhere but Buffalo as the best QB in the draft, slips to early second round.

 

Using this ogic Brees >>>>>>>> Esiason > G Smith. He's one pick away from Esiason. But he's also drafted lower than Manti friggin T'eo. 

[Jetsfan80]

Using this ogic Brees >>>>>>>> Esiason > G Smith. He's one pick away from Esiason. But he's also drafted lower than Manti friggin T'eo. 

 

There's no logic in this post whatsoever.  

[kelticwizard]

  This has more to do with he's cheap and probably a good kid, easy to get along with, etc and seems to have no issues being a 2nd or 3rd string QB.   

I mean he's practically never played over his career.  There are plenty of backup and 3rd string QBs who stink and stick around for years.  

 

Sometimes it's about the cheap cost, sometimes its easier to stick with a guy who has been in the NFL and isn't looking to ever start compared to hoping some 3rd or 4th round pick doesn't just suck.   I mean Charlie Whitehurst has been in the NFL for like 8 years.  That doesn't say he's good enough to be in the NFL.

 

Hell everybody thinks Tebow sucks, but if he sticks around as the 2nd or 3rd string QB for the Patriots and Brady plays another 4 years,  you could say Tebow was good enough to be an backup NFL qb for 7 years too.

 

I think Clemens is in a position where he is the default backup for Schottenheimer.  He knows Schotty's system since forever, more important he has won NFL games under Schotty's system, and yes he'll accept the #2  job.

 

Nonetheless, if a low draft choice or undrafted free agent came to camp and convinced Schotty that he can run Schotty's system somewhat better then Clemens, then Clemens loses his job.  After all is said and done, you need to have enough skill to put on the field and win when the starter goes down.  Clemens and Whitehurst have survived partly because they are experienced, and partly because their challengers didn't show enough to beat them out.

 

For an unheralded draft choice expected to go third round or so, Clemens has had a decent career for a second rounder.  Most second rounders don't last 7 years.