Villain The Foe Posted March 15, 2014 Share Posted March 15, 2014 We're really going to miss Pettigrew's two touchdowns. Exactly. Why dont we put Cumberland and his 4 TD's on the bench so Pettigrew can display those 2 awesome TD's Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AVM Posted March 15, 2014 Share Posted March 15, 2014 No, of course not. You can fill 3 holes with 3 free agents, then fill the remaining 5 with draft picks. What's the harm in that again? Are we really at risk of "****** our cap up" when we have about $40M to work with? Yes. There is a much bigger picture at play when you're a team looking to build, not chase a title in the upcoming year like the Pats/Broncos are doing. Spend all that money up to the cap so that we're tied up for the next 4-5 years with those FA's and even though the cap continues to increase how are you going to pay Wilkerson? Richardson? Snacks? Milliner? Imagine if Geno or Milliner pan out, you'll have to pay them too. If not, you're looking at spending on a new QB in the draft or needing the space to bring one in, a-la Drew Brees and the Saints. A lot of people have argued there was no true #1 WR in FA this time around (I disagree, but it really depends on your definition of #1). Do you want the flexibility next year to sign a #1 if one comes available? People seem to think Watkins is a pretty decent shot to become one of those guys but the rest of the WR's in this draft are as most are every year -- maybe you hit big, maybe you don't and it may take a while. Watkins likely costs too much to move up and get. And still, FA is over with this year. DRC still being talked to, maybe they bring in a guard like Wharton if he doesn't retire (I don't care for him, but not the point), maybe they sign a RB (again, don't necessarily care for one). Perhaps James Jones gets inked, or Emmanuel Sanders, or Jermichael Finley. There's just way more into spending FA money than some of you guys are considering, in my opinion. I'm no more an expert than you, that's just my take. I'm sure you'll argue back that we should extend these players then or do this or that, but it's not needed RIGHT NOW. The point of what Idziks doing, in my view, is create flexibility. That's been preached by a few of the folks that know more than I this week -- sign players that keep you flexible in the draft. Also sign players that keep you flexible for the future. The exception is if you think you've got a guy who can contribute and be a big part of your plans in the present and the future -- apparently they feel that way about Decker. They may very well feel that way about DRC...I suppose we'll see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villain The Foe Posted March 15, 2014 Share Posted March 15, 2014 Tj ward 5 m per Pettigrew 5 m per Schwartz 4 m per You want to pay Pettigrew 5 million dollars for what bro? Cumberland had arguably better numbers than Pettigrew last season and Pettigrew never once cracked the 800 rec. yards mark as a TE. 5 million....seriously? This would be one of those wreckless signings that the Jets need to stay away from. Pettigrew caught 40 passes for 400 yards and 2 TD's in 14 games. You want to pay 5 million for a guy who averaged less than 30 rec yards a game last year? Mind you this is a guy who has the most dangerously explosive WR in the NFL in Megatron taking away attention. 5 million....thats laughable. TJ Ward is a strong safety, though better than the SS we have now, our concern is getting a FS. I'd prefer to save that 5 mill and develop Antonio Allen even more. Allen was having a really good season imo last year before the signing of Ed Reed interrupted things. And Antonio Allen has shown that he can cover top tier TE's. I would have liked Schwartz at 4 mill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyberjet Posted March 15, 2014 Share Posted March 15, 2014 Damn how come the ID didn't think of this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AVM Posted March 15, 2014 Share Posted March 15, 2014 You do realize there are ways to structure a contract to avoid these problems down the road, right? And to this, yes. At some point there becomes a trade off though, you can't say you're in a build mode AND spend lots of money on free agency for a number of reasons. 1 -- Most of the guys that are big impact players want to get paid. 2 -- The ones that aren't looking for a huge pay day may be looking for one when it's time to REALLY contend. 3 -- Do they fit in the system? 4 -- Are they interested in coming in to a team that's not an immediate contender? 5 -- When you've got big paydays coming up for some of the guys we've got, you have to plan ahead. You can structure contracts in a certain way, but eventually you're going to need some hometown discounts to make it work continually (see: Brady, Tom. It's pretty rare as you know). When it comes to guys like Ward, yeah...sucks we couldn't sign him at that contract. I don't disagree with you whatsoever. I'd also be a little irked if DRC gets a contract close to Revis and they weren't interested in Revis -- but that's just a personal preference to Revis because we've all seen him be the best. I actually liked the Pettigrew signing, but it's not end of the world to not get him either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AVM Posted March 15, 2014 Share Posted March 15, 2014 You want to pay Pettigrew 5 million dollars for what bro? Cumberland had arguably better numbers than Pettigrew last season and Pettigrew never once cracked the 800 rec. yards mark as a TE. 5 million....seriously? This would be one of those wreckless signings that the Jets need to stay away from. Pettigrew caught 40 passes for 400 yards and 2 TD's in 14 games. You want to pay 5 million for a guy who averaged less than 30 rec yards a game last year? Mind you this is a guy who has the most dangerously explosive WR in the NFL in Megatron taking away attention. 5 million....thats laughable. TJ Ward is a strong safety, though better than the SS we have now, our concern is getting a FS. I'd prefer to save that 5 mill and develop Antonio Allen even more. Allen was having a really good season imo last year before the signing of Ed Reed interrupted things. And Antonio Allen has shown that he can cover top tier TE's. I would have liked Schwartz at 4 mill. Agree with all of this. Would have liked to have Ward, though. Schwartz would have been nice, but we'll see what happens with the G position. If come the season it's a glaring weakness, everyone is more than welcome to say I told you so...and I guarantee they will Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyberjet Posted March 15, 2014 Share Posted March 15, 2014 Yeah, I saw their grading of the 2... it was a Fractional difference. Regardless, we got an equal player at a reduced cost... C+ Idzik Changing the culture is the biggest thing I've noticed to date. Rex's bloviating has been reduced, no more "leaks" to Manish, "cancers" have been removed...A+ Did a good job with a bad situation last year... B FA, so far= C Listen, I like Idzik and hope above all hope he succeeds... he's learning on the job and I respect that. I do hope, however, that he has some "cojones" when it comes to sticking his neck out and not always playing it safe. A+ plus B plus C+ = C so far? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AVM Posted March 15, 2014 Share Posted March 15, 2014 We're really going to miss Pettigrew's two touchdowns. Pettigrew's 2 > Doug Jolley's 1 to be fair... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eboozer Posted March 15, 2014 Share Posted March 15, 2014 And to this, yes. At some point there becomes a trade off though, you can't say you're in a build mode AND spend lots of money on free agency for a number of reasons. 1 -- Most of the guys that are big impact players want to get paid. 2 -- The ones that aren't looking for a huge pay day may be looking for one when it's time to REALLY contend. 3 -- Do they fit in the system? 4 -- Are they interested in coming in to a team that's not an immediate contender? 5 -- When you've got big paydays coming up for some of the guys we've got, you have to plan ahead. You can structure contracts in a certain way, but eventually you're going to need some hometown discounts to make it work continually (see: Brady, Tom. It's pretty rare as you know). When it comes to guys like Ward, yeah...sucks we couldn't sign him at that contract. I don't disagree with you whatsoever. I'd also be a little irked if DRC gets a contract close to Revis and they weren't interested in Revis -- but that's just a personal preference to Revis because we've all seen him be the best. I actually liked the Pettigrew signing, but it's not end of the world to not get him either. I'm glad the antagonism of that other thread, where we were all throwin' around "douche" bombs and "whining, has subsided, and we can all argue our points in a civil manner. You've made all good points. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted March 15, 2014 Share Posted March 15, 2014 We're really going to miss Pettigrew's two touchdowns. Big. Red zone. Target. You do realize there are ways to structure a contract to avoid these problems down the road, right? You do realize that these players have agents. They don't just sign 5yr/$50M contracts and let the teams cut them without paying the bulk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villain The Foe Posted March 15, 2014 Share Posted March 15, 2014 Yeah, I saw their grading of the 2... it was a Fractional difference. Regardless, we got an equal player at a reduced cost... C+ Idzik Changing the culture is the biggest thing I've noticed to date. Rex's bloviating has been reduced, no more "leaks" to Manish, "cancers" have been removed...A+ Did a good job with a bad situation last year... B FA, so far= C Listen, I like Idzik and hope above all hope he succeeds... he's learning on the job and I respect that. I do hope, however, that he has some "cojones" when it comes to sticking his neck out and not always playing it safe. One thing about your cojones is that you dont want lose them...or your neck. You show cojones when you can afford to do so. The Jets are in no position to take big chances on free agents that will cost alot of money. You just said it. Idzik's first objective of business was to get rid of the leaks, cancers etc. Something that a GM can directly and immediately control. Once he established a clean foundation he begins to sell this foundation to FA players like Decker. Idzik knows that sticking his neck out on players wont benefit the team because the team is in no shape to really benefit because we are in a rebuilding stage. The Broncos and John Elway can do this because they are in win now mode. Idzik is still holding competition at his QB spot. The Jets are not ready for that yet. Idzik is bulding a solid foundation to move forward with. Jet fans are expecting everything to be done in one year and it doesnt work like that, the teams who tried it (the last being the eagles) find out the hard way. I wouldnt give Idzik a C grade right now because FA has been open for 5 days. to give a grade before the draft, let alone 5 days is just premature. Idzik is building you a football team. I remember seeing his first conference as the jets GM, and if anyone can find my comment then you know how I feel about this guy. He's serious and this will be the greatest move that Woody has ever done, and will save alot of his stupid moves . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arsis Posted March 15, 2014 Share Posted March 15, 2014 Revis or Verner and Byrd for the Defense and Nicks and Howard for the offense team drastically improved and money to spare with Sanchez still under contract. That's 30 in contracts this year alone. How do we have room after that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bitonti Posted March 15, 2014 Share Posted March 15, 2014 idzik's plan is the same as his plan last year: to get good players at the lowest rates. Decker he got a 2 year 7.5 mil per year contract this is a guy people thought would get 9/10 per year. He will bring in vaguely local players like Breno (and directly local guys like Colon). He will draft a freak athlete in rd 1, probably from the SEC. It's not a terrible plan and probably what Woody wants out of his GM. He didn't want another Tanny. the Revis decision for example is a Woody thing all the way. Idzik gets flack but he's got to answer to Woody. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eboozer Posted March 15, 2014 Share Posted March 15, 2014 Big. Red zone. Target. You do realize that these players have agents. They don't just sign 5yr/$50M contracts and let the teams cut them without paying the bulk. A 5 yr./ $50 mil contract that gives the bulk in the form of roster bonus and a fat signing bonus at the beginning spread out over 3 years is Ok by me. I'll take a look at Jason's website and see how some of these deals have been worked. Remember, GM's are as shrewd as the agents as well. The "art of the deal" is finding that place where all sides feel good about the deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joewilly12 Posted March 15, 2014 Share Posted March 15, 2014 That's 30 in contracts this year alone. How do we have room after that? Creative financing like the Patriots are doing at the start of free agency they had only $15million how did they sign Revis and others and are still managing to negotiate with Edelman. Cut Sanchez,Landry and theres more money. You can buy into Woody and Idziks bullsh*t Im not. 45 years and counting................... Also DO NOT WANT Pettigrew would rather a rookie TE in the draft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NCJETSFAN Posted March 15, 2014 Share Posted March 15, 2014 I think the jets miscalculate the market for CB. OL and safety . I think they called and found out the numbers they balked and they signed elsewhere is all ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joewilly12 Posted March 15, 2014 Share Posted March 15, 2014 I think the jets miscalculate the market for CB. OL and safety . I think they called and found out the numbers they balked and they signed elsewhere is all ! This is similar to what happened when Aso the CB was available why do the Jets make EVERYTHING so damn difficult? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony The Wiz Posted March 15, 2014 Share Posted March 15, 2014 The ideal deal was the Verner deal that Itsy should of made. Cromartie wants 10 million which is crazy but Verner who is better gets a 7 million a year deal. Well worth so you give him 14 million upfront. He deserves it and fitted into your defense. He was the one I pin pointed and he also was a failure in the Mccown situation. You can't go into this year with Geno Smith as your only starter with no competition. I been watching prospects for a long time and I never liked Smith as an above average QB. I said the same about Sanchez and look where that went. Smith has more mobility but they both lack the mentality of a successful QB. So the two pieces I wanted went to Tampa Bay. Without a capable QB you going nowhere in this N.F.L. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eboozer Posted March 15, 2014 Share Posted March 15, 2014 A+ plus B plus C+ = C so far? FA, so far= C.... that was for FA, not the whole lot as a final grade. "Jet fans are expecting everything to be done in one year and it doesnt work like that, the teams who tried it (the last being the eagles) find out the hard way. I wouldnt give Idzik a C grade right now because FA has been open for 5 days. to give a grade before the draft, let alone 5 days is just premature." My kids school has EdLine which gives you current grades throughout the xchool yr. instead of waiting for the final grade, when it's too late to do anything about it. I don't wait to evaluate a guy's performance after 3 years go by.... it's a monthly thing so as to keep on top of things if they start to turn bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted March 15, 2014 Share Posted March 15, 2014 Tj ward 5 m per Pettigrew 5 m per Schwartz 4 m per Pettigrew is trash, and safety is a luxury position for this defense. Schwartz I'll give you, though given that it's March, we don't know for sure if we don't already have our starting RG on the roster already, or if we have plans to address it later in free agency/the draft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eboozer Posted March 15, 2014 Share Posted March 15, 2014 Pettigrew is trash, and safety is a luxury position for this defense. Schwartz I'll give you, though given that it's March, we don't know for sure if we don't already have our starting RG on the roster already, or if we have plans to address it later in free agency/the draft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faba Posted March 15, 2014 Share Posted March 15, 2014 But his actions it is apparent he wants to build a team through the draft and not go wild with free agent acquistions Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted March 15, 2014 Share Posted March 15, 2014 BS? Pettigrew was ranked the 55th TE on PFF. And when has safety EVER been an important piece for this defense? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TnT Posted March 15, 2014 Share Posted March 15, 2014 The ideal deal was the Verner deal that Itsy should of made. Cromartie wants 10 million which is crazy but Verner who is better gets a 7 million a year deal. DRC DOESNT WANT 10 PER YEAR, HE WANTS A LONGER DEAL...THE DENVER CONTRACT MADE HIM CUTTABLE AFTER YEAR 3...THE BREAKDOWN IS IN THE DRC THREAD Well worth so you give him 14 million upfront. He deserves it and fitted into your defense. VERNER DID NOT FIT OUR DEFENSE...AT ALL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eboozer Posted March 15, 2014 Share Posted March 15, 2014 BS? Pettigrew was ranked the 55th TE on PFF. And when has safety EVER been an important piece for this defense? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted March 15, 2014 Share Posted March 15, 2014 A 5 yr./ $50 mil contract that gives the bulk in the form of roster bonus and a fat signing bonus at the beginning spread out over 3 years is Ok by me. I'll take a look at Jason's website and see how some of these deals have been worked. Remember, GM's are as shrewd as the agents as well. The "art of the deal" is finding that place where all sides feel good about the deal. For Brandon Pettigrew? Get ****ed. The guy is a stiff. Starting level TE, not a difference maker. DRC? Eh, maybe. You aren't going to trick anybody and we are keeping flexible. They paid Decker because Decker is a good bet to be quality over the length of the deal. You don't end up in a good situation paying money to guys that are not longer on the team. How long were they paying dead money on Martin and Pennington after the last downs they took for the team? Bad business. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flgreen Posted March 15, 2014 Share Posted March 15, 2014 This is similar to what happened when Aso the CB was available why do the Jets make EVERYTHING so damn difficult? Your not really trying to make an argument that missing out on Aso was a bad thing are you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eboozer Posted March 15, 2014 Share Posted March 15, 2014 Your not really trying to make an argument that missing out on Aso was a bad thing are you? +1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZachEY Posted March 15, 2014 Share Posted March 15, 2014 You do realize there are ways to structure a contract to avoid these problems down the road, right? Yes. You do realize that players and agents are also aware of that, and don't really want that type of deal, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eboozer Posted March 15, 2014 Share Posted March 15, 2014 For Brandon Pettigrew? Get ****ed. The guy is a stiff. Starting level TE, not a difference maker. DRC? Eh, maybe. You aren't going to trick anybody and we are keeping flexible. They paid Decker because Decker is a good bet to be quality over the length of the deal. You don't end up in a good situation paying money to guys that are not longer on the team. How long were they paying dead money on Martin and Pennington after the last downs they took for the team? Bad business. The 5 yr/ $50 mil wasn't about Pettigrew.... we were talking about the Tier 1 guys like Byrd, V. Davis and the like. The rules have changed sinced the Martin, Pennington contracts. Monies can be moved around a lot more differently now. More team friendly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eboozer Posted March 15, 2014 Share Posted March 15, 2014 Yes. You do realize that players and agents are also aware of that, and don't really want that type of deal, right? Well, you do know a LOT of them are signing them as we speak.... with other teams, unfortunately! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZachEY Posted March 15, 2014 Share Posted March 15, 2014 You do realize that these players have agents. They don't just sign 5yr/$50M contracts and let the teams cut them without paying the bulk. Impossible... Players are always looking to make team friendly deals, just ask Chad Pennington. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZachEY Posted March 15, 2014 Share Posted March 15, 2014 Well, you do know a LOT of them are signing them as we speak.... with other teams, unfortunately! Which players are we talking about that are signing the bigger deals that teams can easily get away from after 2-3 years? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eboozer Posted March 15, 2014 Share Posted March 15, 2014 Impossible... Players are always looking to make team friendly deals, just ask Chad Pennington. What's with Chad Pennington today? Do we have to go back 8 years to make our point?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZachEY Posted March 15, 2014 Share Posted March 15, 2014 What's with Chad Pennington today? Do we have to go back 8 years to make our point?? Ok, Santonio Holmes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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