PATS' BRANDON SPIKES UNDER INVESTIGATION FOR AN ALLEGED HIT AND RUN

[Jet Nut]

Same here. Most people realize deflategate a big joke.

 

Did you know that in NCAA football teams can use any football manufacturer that they want and any air pressure they like?

Actually most people are more Bothered by deflate gate than they were by Spygate. Then again could be the cumulative effect of being caught cheating multiple times.

So let's follow this new Patriot logic. The NCAA doesn't have a rule in place, therefore it lessens the Pats guilt breaking a NFL rule. You guys sit up nights on end trying to lessen the blow of cheating? WTF, how did you miss that Pop Warner doesn't care about inflation rates.

[CaliforniaJet]

Hard to be an internet troll when you are invited here. 

 

And my lifeis pretty good.

 

 

Of course, we can totally tell. LMAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[PFSIKH]

First of all I don't think there was testing at that time but even if it is true about the Steelers, what is your point here?  Is it that if one team won trophies 40 years ago while taking "supplements" that were not against the rules at that time then this essentially provides permission for another, different team to break the rules in any way they want without penalty?  Is that what you are saying?

 

That is the "what about Hitler?" defense.

 

While steroids were not illegal in the NFL until the late 80s/90s, just look how Haslett was ripped by the team when he confirmed what everyone knows, the Steelers (and likely a good chunk of the league) used roids.  Something that was not illegal, but no one admits to it.  Why?  It is viewed as tainted. 

 

Again the context of my statement as it relates to the Steelers was no one gives a sh*t that the Steerlers used/took to another level anabolic steroid use in the NFL.  I am sure there are AFC North fanboys that do, but for the most part, the general public does not.

[EM31]

While steroids were not illegal in the NFL until the late 80s/90s, just look how Haslett was ripped by the team when he confirmed what everyone knows, the Steelers (and likely a good chunk of the league) used roids.  Something that was not illegal, but no one admits to it.  Why?  It is viewed as tainted. 

 

Again the context of my statement as it relates to the Steelers was no one gives a sh*t that the Steerlers used/took to another level anabolic steroid use in the NFL.  I am sure there are AFC North fanboys that do, but for the most part, the general public does not.

 

If everyone was doing it then it was pretty much a wash during that era.

 

I am not sure how any of that gives your guys a free pass some 40 years later.

[PFSIKH]

If everyone was doing it then it was pretty much a wash during that era.

 

I am not sure how any of that gives your guys a free pass some 40 years later.

 

Again, point                                                                                                                 you.

 

That is not the point.  Outside of fanboys and apparently the Steelers of the 70s, no one really cares that they took roids or perfected what was going on back then.

 

In 40 years, outside of fanboys, no one is going to care if the Patriots took air out of the ball or even where they recorded signals from.

[ylekram]

Again, point                                                                                                                 you.

 

That is not the point.  Outside of fanboys and apparently the Steelers of the 70s, no one really cares that they took roids or perfected what was going on back then.

 

In 40 years, outside of fanboys, no one is going to care if the Patriots took air out of the ball or even where they recorded signals from.

imo, I don't think so. in 40 years, the words "cheating" and "patriots" will go hand in hand. nobody remembers tonya harding was a great skater.

[Dcat]

imo, I don't think so. in 40 years, the words "cheating" and "patriots" will go hand in hand. nobody remembers tonya harding was a great skater.

 

Yep.  It has reached the point where cheating, tainted championships and asterisks will live on in infamy when the Pats are mentioned.  This will indeed be remembered, just like Barry Bonds/Sammy Sosa/Mark McQuire.  Pats fans are deluding themselves thinking that anyone outside of Pats homers respects these tainted trophies.  The cheating Pats of this generation will always be associated with a stench that can't be removed.  No matter how much sad Pats fans close their eyes and wish it wasn't so, that's the way it will always be.

[GandWFan]

nobody remembers tonya harding was a great skater.

 

 

This is a GREAT quote.  And so TRUE.  When you cheat, AND ARE CONVICTED OF CHEATING MULTIPLE TIMES, you will always be remembered as a cheater, no matter what else you accomplish.  Forever tainted.

[EM31]

Again, point                                                                                                                 you.

 

That is not the point.  Outside of fanboys and apparently the Steelers of the 70s, no one really cares that they took roids or perfected what was going on back then.

 

In 40 years, outside of fanboys, no one is going to care if the Patriots took air out of the ball or even where they recorded signals from.

 

Have to differ on this one I am afraid.  The steroid era in football is like the amphetamines era in baseball.  Everybody was actually doing it in those cases and in those days.  Therefore there was no competitive advantage to any team from doing so.  The truly insidious thing about steroids is that players and teams were at a significant competitive disadvantage if they did not do it and there was no established testing policy and so everyone was pretty much forced to do it.  You theory (to quote a line from My cousin Vinny) "does not hold water" 

 

(fast forward to today)

 

Nobody else has been doing the same kind cheating as the Patriots and only an idiot would think Bill Belichick & Co. would roll the dice to do these kinds things if there were not competitive benefits to the team from doing so.

 

This means the Patriots are serial cheaters (established) and they broke the commandment about not getting caught.  I would be shocked if the story of the Patriots recent era is ever actually told without also providing the full context about how those trophies may have been obtained.

[EM31]

imo, I don't think so. in 40 years, the words "cheating" and "patriots" will go hand in hand. nobody remembers tonya harding was a great skater.

 

Right.  Just like Hoover = vacuum cleaner, Patriots = Black Sox = Cheaters.

[PFSIKH]

imo, I don't think so. in 40 years, the words "cheating" and "patriots" will go hand in hand. nobody remembers tonya harding was a great skater.

 

Actually, she was not great.  That is why she clubbed that other girl. 

[PFSIKH]

Have to differ on this one I am afraid.  The steroid era in football is like the amphetamines era in baseball.  Everybody was actually doing it in those cases and in those days.  Therefore there was no competitive advantage to any team from doing so.  The truly insidious thing about steroids is that players and teams were at a significant competitive disadvantage if they did not do it and there was no established testing policy and so everyone was pretty much forced to do it.  You theory (to quote a line from My cousin Vinny) "does not hold water" 

 

(fast forward to today)

 

Nobody else has been doing the same kind cheating as the Patriots and only an idiot would think Bill Belichick & Co. would roll the dice to do these kinds things if there were not competitive benefits to the team from doing so.

 

This means the Patriots are serial cheaters (established) and they broke the commandment about not getting caught.  I would be shocked if the story of the Patriots recent era is ever actually told without also providing the full context about how those trophies may have been obtained.

 

Then why don't the Steelers admit to doing it?  It was not illegal in the league's eyes.  It is accepted that roids were fairly prevalent in the league.  Yet, Haslet was called insane by the Rooneys.  Why? 

 

Only an idiot would think the Patriots are the only team doing it.  Hell, the Patriots were not even the only team to manipulate the ball last year.  Wear the blinders if you want.

[EM31]

Then why don't the Steelers admit to doing it?  It was not illegal in the league's eyes.  It is accepted that roids were fairly prevalent in the league.  Yet, Haslet was called insane by the Rooneys.  Why? 

 

Only an idiot would think the Patriots are the only team doing it.  Hell, the Patriots were not even the only team to manipulate the ball last year.  Wear the blinders if you want.

The everybody does it line of defense is pretty much debunked at this point.  If everybody is doing it as Pats fans contend then why is it that only the Patriots have been caught doing it?

 

The everyone does it excuse is pretty much on the same level as the dog ate my homework. 

[ylekram]

Actually, she was not great.  That is why she clubbed that other girl. 

she was good enough. maybe pete rose would be a better example for ya

[AFCEastFan]

The everybody does it line of defense is pretty much debunked at this point.  If everybody is doing it as Pats fans contend then why is it that only the Patriots have been caught doing it?

 

The everyone does it excuse is pretty much on the same level as the dog ate my homework. 

 

And yet, that is exactly the excuse you just used to explain the Steelers steroid abuse in the 70s....

 

They've been accused by outsiders (Haslett) of being at the forefront of steroid abuse and have had insiders (Courson, Bradshaw) admit to using, plus they've had a rash of early deaths that have been attributed to steroid abuse (In 2006, a Los Angeles Times survey found that nearly one-fifth of the NFL players from the 1970s and 1980s who had died since 2000 were former Steelers -- those who like to link Patriots' fumble rates to ball deflation should be all over the steroid abuse/early death correlation as well).  

 

Where is all the finger-pointing and admissions from "everybody else" that was doing it?  This is a message board, so being fair and consistent is not anyone's obligation, but c'mon now....

[EM31]

And yet, that is exactly the excuse you just used to explain the Steelers steroid abuse in the 70s....

 

They've been accused by outsiders (Haslett) of being at the forefront of steroid abuse and have had insiders (Courson, Bradshaw) admit to using, plus they've had a rash of early deaths that have been attributed to steroid abuse (In 2006, a Los Angeles Times survey found that nearly one-fifth of the NFL players from the 1970s and 1980s who had died since 2000 were former Steelers -- those who like to link Patriots' fumble rates to ball deflation should be all over the steroid abuse/early death correlation as well).  

 

Where is all the finger-pointing and admissions from "everybody else" that was doing it?  This is a message board, so being fair and consistent is not anyone's obligation, but c'mon now....

 

Not excusing the Steelers franchise or anyone else.  I am saying that in a world that permits and even encourages widespread use of steroids then the real issue from an individual point of view is that those athletes are faced with a choice of doing the drugs and being able to compete or get cut in favor of someone else who is willing to do them.  

 

Other than some literary license I pretty much assume that North Dallas Forty is a reasonably accurate depiction of the way things were back then.

 

Aside from a random comment here or there on Spygate and almost nothing at all on the ball deflating issue, there is very little if any evidence at all that ANY of the other teams have been doing any of these things.  

[PFSIKH]

The everybody does it line of defense is pretty much debunked at this point.  If everybody is doing it as Pats fans contend then why is it that only the Patriots have been caught doing it?

 

The everyone does it excuse is pretty much on the same level as the dog ate my homework. 

 

They do not cheat well enough. 

[pdxgreen]

   I think I can understand how much Red Sox fans hate the Yankees now.  But hating the Patriots has never been much fun till this year.  Its like Disneyland.

[PFSIKH]

Not excusing the Steelers franchise or anyone else.  I am saying that in a world that permits and even encourages widespread use of steroids then the real issue from an individual point of view is that those athletes are faced with a choice of doing the drugs and being able to compete or get cut in favor of someone else who is willing to do them.  

 

Other than some literary license I pretty much assume that North Dallas Forty is a reasonably accurate depiction of the way things were back then.

 

Aside from a random comment here or there on Spygate and almost nothing at all on the ball deflating issue, there is very little if any evidence at all that ANY of the other teams have been doing any of these things.  

 

So Jimmy Johnson and other coaches saying they did the same exact thing (e.g. video recording) or QBs saying they deflated and/or altered the ball is some manner is not evidence?

[Dcat]

"everybody does it"

 

-standard patriots defense quote.

 

Dull. Boring.  Trite.  But worst of all... doesn't exonerate the Patriots from cheating.

[EM31]

So Jimmy Johnson and other coaches saying they did the same exact thing (e.g. video recording) or QBs saying they deflated and/or altered the ball is some manner is not evidence?

 

No, really it does not.  I am shocked we need to go through this with you yet again.

 

JJ is one coach in a league of 32 teams and literally hundreds of present and former coaches.  He was not referring to the type of taping that the Patriots were found guilty of conducting and he most certainly was was not referring to the era in football after which the taping rules had been clarified by the commissioner and sent out to all 32 teams.  The very idea that you can only come up with one name here and one name there, even then referring to something similar AND all of them decades in the past is pretty conclusive proof that nobody else was doing it and certainly nobody else was doing it in the modern era AFTER the rules had been clarified.  Certainly nobody else conducted a decade long  black-ops department like the Patriots did.

 

And no... Aaron rogers may indeed prefer a higher ball pressure and Eli Manning may indeed prefer his footballs to be roughed up a certain way but none of them..... None of them suggested preparing balls that were outside league specifications and certainly none of them.... not a single one of them have indicated that they tampered with the equipment AFTER it was inspected on game gay.

 

 

So as I said.  Nobody else was doing it.  Nobody.

[AFCEastFan]

And no... Aaron rogers may indeed prefer a higher ball pressure and Eli Manning may indeed prefer his footballs to be roughed up a certain way but none of them..... None of them suggested preparing balls that were outside league specifications and certainly none of them.... not a single one of them have indicated that they tampered with the equipment AFTER it was inspected on game gay.

So as I said. Nobody else was doing it. Nobody.

Except for Jeff Blake. Your points are good enough without having to resort to overstatement.

[PFSIKH]

No, really it does not.  I am shocked we need to go through this with you yet again.

 

JJ is one coach in a league of 32 teams and literally hundreds of present and former coaches.  He was not referring to the type of taping that the Patriots were found guilty of conducting and he most certainly was was not referring to the era in football after which the taping rules had been clarified by the commissioner and sent out to all 32 teams.  The very idea that you can only come up with one name here and one name there, even then referring to something similar AND all of them decades in the past is pretty conclusive proof that nobody else was doing it and certainly nobody else was doing it in the modern era AFTER the rules had been clarified.  Certainly nobody else conducted a decade long  black-ops department like the Patriots did.

 

And no... Aaron rogers may indeed prefer a higher ball pressure and Eli Manning may indeed prefer his footballs to be roughed up a certain way but none of them..... None of them suggested preparing balls that were outside league specifications and certainly none of them.... not a single one of them have indicated that they tampered with the equipment AFTER it was inspected on game gay.

 

 

So as I said.  Nobody else was doing it.  Nobody.

 

Technically, it was not 'clarified' until September 2006.  So using your reasoning, a majority (or all?) of the tapes confiscated then are technically legal.  That means the 2001, 2003 and 2004 titles are not tainted using your logic.  Right?  It is not like Mangini did not get busted during a playoff game against the Patriots after the clarification.  Only difference, the Patriots did not riase a stink like the Jets did.  They just said stop.    Jimmy said he did it for Marty Schottenheimer.  Was he a lone camerman?  Of course he was.  Dick Vermeil and Bill Cowher said it happens all the time (e.g. recording of signals).       

 

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2015/01/20/aaron-rodgers-likes-his-footballs-overinflated/

 

“‘I like to push the limit to how much air we can put in the football, even go over what they allow you to do and see if the officials take air out of it,'” Simms said Rodgers told them before the game.

 

That appears to be "outside the league specifications".  Brad Johnson and Rich Gannon said they paid ball boys to alter the ball before their Superbowl.  Jeff Blake admitted to letting air out and said it was a comon practice.  The Vikings and Panthers were slapped on the wrist for heating balls.  The Jags and Colts name came up for tampering with balls when Deflategate was ragging.

 

yeah, the Patriots are the only ones that do it.  They are the only ones stupid enough to get caught.

[EM31]

Technically, it was not 'clarified' until September 2006.  So using your reasoning, a majority (or all?) of the tapes confiscated then are technically legal.  That means the 2001, 2003 and 2004 titles are not tainted using your logic.  Right?  It is not like Mangini did not get busted during a playoff game against the Patriots after the clarification.  Only difference, the Patriots did not riase a stink like the Jets did.  They just said stop.    Jimmy said he did it for Marty Schottenheimer.  Was he a lone camerman?  Of course he was.  Dick Vermeil and Bill Cowher said it happens all the time (e.g. recording of signals).       

 

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2015/01/20/aaron-rodgers-likes-his-footballs-overinflated/

 

“‘I like to push the limit to how much air we can put in the football, even go over what they allow you to do and see if the officials take air out of it,'” Simms said Rodgers told them before the game.

 

That appears to be "outside the league specifications".  Brad Johnson and Rich Gannon said they paid ball boys to alter the ball before their Superbowl.  Jeff Blake admitted to letting air out and said it was a comon practice.  The Vikings and Panthers were slapped on the wrist for heating balls.  The Jags and Colts name came up for tampering with balls when Deflategate was ragging.

 

yeah, the Patriots are the only ones that do it.  They are the only ones stupid enough to get caught.

 

Tapering with the balls after inspection.

 

The Pats were the only ones who got caught because they were the only ones who were doing it.

[#27TheDominator]

 

And no... Aaron rogers may indeed prefer a higher ball pressure and Eli Manning may indeed prefer his footballs to be roughed up a certain way but none of them..... None of them suggested preparing balls that were outside league specifications and certainly none of them.... not a single one of them have indicated that they tampered with the equipment AFTER it was inspected on game gay.

 

I thought Brady was the only one.

[PatriotReign37]

This probably wouldn't be such a big deal if it was a first offense but it's not.  Secondly,  players in the NFL work their butts off to win a fair game/s  Tampering or any other restrictions simply ruins the integrity of the game and is clearly unfair to every NFL player and team.   I also believe the way the NFL handled this entire situation is a bit shady.  For one,  it waited until after the Super Bowl to make a decision.  It took a total of 5 months to research?  I don't think so.  Belichick's decision not to appeal also reeks of guilt IMO. If my team was in the right,  I'd fight for my reputation.  And the rhetoric about Brady not knowing that the balls were deflated?  Some professional QB's came forward and said that he had to know and I also believe Brady knew.  No doubt that the Pats are an outstanding football team.  There wasn't any real need to engage in deflate activity.  

 

Belichick could not appeal for Kraft.

[PatriotReign37]

"everybody does it"

 

-standard patriots defense quote.

 

Dull. Boring.  Trite.  But worst of all... doesn't exonerate the Patriots from cheating.

 

NY Yankee fans " Everybody else in baseball was doing roids and PHDs too"

[AFCEastFan]

NY Yankee fans " Everybody else in baseball was doing roids and PHDs too"

Red Sox reliever Craig Breslow wants to get his doctorate after his baseball career is over, so I suggest you refrain from casting stones from your glass house.

[Larz]

deflating the balls was one thing

 

lying about it, not cooperating and demanding an apology means you can suck my taint

 

get it now ?

[PatriotReign37]

Red Sox reliever Craig Breslow wants to get his doctorate after his baseball career is over, so I suggest you refrain from casting stones from your glass house

 

Never heard of him but that's a nice story.

[AFCEastFan]

Never heard of him but that's a nice story.

http://i.imgur.com/XZJxeN1.gif"http://i.imgur.com/XZJxeN1.gif

[PFSIKH]

Tapering with the balls after inspection.

 

The Pats were the only ones who got caught because they were the only ones who were doing it.

 

The Jags, Colts, Panthers and Vikings were tampering with the balls on the sidelines. 

 

The Panthers and Vikings were caught on film, which is, truthfully, more than you can say about the Patriots.

[PatriotReign37]

The Jags, Colts, Panthers and Vikings were tampering with the balls on the sidelines. 

 

The Panthers and Vikings were caught on film, which is, truthfully, more than you can say about the Patriots.

 

Doesn't matter.

 

Teams like that get a slap on the hand.

[Jetsfan80]

If Patriots fans are allowed to assume everyone else cheats the same way the Pats do, then we can just as easily assume there are many other ways the Patriots have been cheating for which they were never caught. 

 

And there's not a thing you can say against that.  They've been caught twice and heavily penalized for instances spanning over a decade.  Why would a team who never seems to learn and cheats in such arrogant fashion ever have a period where they were NOT bending the rules? 

 

We get it, you all have a tremendous ability to rationalize it all away.  Crafted over many years of rooting for a tainted franchise.  I guess it was worth it?

[JustInFudge]

Patriots fans denial that they root for the biggest frauds and scumbags in the history of sports is hysterical.