Hack reporter Rich Cimini advoctes keeping Bowles with inane reasoning.

[Jetster]

I'm so pissed about this season & the crappy job Bowles did I'd keep him just to force him into enduring another 2-14 season so we can finally put the lid on this crap that somewhere inside of him is a good coach. I haven't seen one iota of a good coach in Bowles. Let's grab ourselves a franchise QB in 2018. Keeping Bowles pretty much guarantees that, especially if the 49ers take a QB high in this upcoming draft.

[Pac]

1 hour ago, Sperm Edwards said:

No, I'm slamming him for constantly coming up short in closing deals he covets because of his unrealistic demands, and for the Jets being worse off as a result.

I'm also questioning this baseless idea that he is well respected around the league. There is neither evidence of this assertion, nor is there any credible reason to believe it's true. 

King's ransom? Check this out. He was supposedly super high on Tunsil (as was everyone before the social media picture posting), and was calling team after team to move up as early as the 7th pick when he started his fall. In no instance was MM willing to cough up even regular chart value. For a move up from #20 to #10, for a "can't miss" player that should have gone #1 overall, he drew a hard line in the sand of his lower 2nd round pick (the Hackenberg pick) and no more. Get this? In impossible fashion, Lady Luck intervened to dangle a huge gift for him at a premiere position of enormous need, but he wouldn't take this gift. Not to mention, by that time word had reached everyone that Tunsil's smoke picture was from years earlier, and was posted by someone trying to hurt him (as opposed to an hour or so earlier, when people thought it was a recent picture & that he'd posted it himself). Instead, MM got cute over the extra, requisite compensation he otherwise has no problem tossing away for short term bandaids.

So for a premiere prospect he was willing to cough up over 95% of the necessary compensation, yet he balked at the other 5% needed to close the deal. News flash: if the trade up cost was a "king's ransom" then 95% of that is still a king's ransom.

And if you're sitting at #20 and are inquiring about reading up to #1 and #2, it goes without saying the cost is going to be gargantuan and I'm quite sure he's aware of that. 

So much for yet another false premise about MM's alleged wisdom. 

I never thought the calls to the 1st and 2nd pick were realistic and my guess is neither did he.  He was hoping they'd say something like give us the 20th, your 2nd rounder, and Mo.

As to the story about the supposed Giants trade, I think the 20th and 51st picks was a fair offer.  I mean you have to draw a line in the sand somewhere.  If Darren Lee and Burris pan out we'll be happy he stood his ground.

In short, you're trashing him for moves that can't even be accurately judged yet. 

 

[greenwave81]

On 12/25/2016 at 10:09 AM, dbatesman said:

The biggest problem with firing Bowles now, as @Sperm Edwards has pointed out,  is that it probably buys Maccagnan at least 2-3 more years. Fire them both now or fire them both a year from now, but firing one now is dumb.

Which goes to the bigger problem, which is, Woody is making the football decisions..and unlike a lot here, I don't dislike the man, just know at this point he ain't qualified to determine what the ultimate problem is here.

Is it that Mac is getting Bowles crappy players? Is Bowles underutilizing/undercoaching adequate players?  I have my opinions, as do most here. I also recognize that it takes longer to analyze a GM than it may to analyze the performance of a coach.  But the problem is, Woody is going to make the determination as to who is the problem...HC?  GM?  Both? Doubt he has the football acumen to make the correct decision.

Funny thing about Jerry Jones....he's made some head scratchers over the years, but he's been intimitately involved in all football decisions for Dallas.  Head coaches can evolve it's been said...can Owners in the role of 'head of football operations'?  Perhaps.

But Woody takes a standoffish position when it comes to most football decisions, yet has the ultimate authority to make the decisions that matter the most like who leads this franchise, who stays and who gets the axe.

Bad situation all around.

 

[Sperm Edwards]

11 hours ago, Pac said:

I never thought the calls to the 1st and 2nd pick were realistic and my guess is neither did he.  He was hoping they'd say something like give us the 20th, your 2nd rounder, and Mo.

As to the story about the supposed Giants trade, I think the 20th and 51st picks was a fair offer.  I mean you have to draw a line in the sand somewhere.  If Darren Lee and Burris pan out we'll be happy he stood his ground.

In short, you're trashing him for moves that can't even be accurately judged yet. 

 

You never thought calls it's known he actually made were realistic, yet you presume to know what it was in his head that was never announced, leaked, nor hinted. People don't routinely call all over the place with the intended purpose of making unrealistic offers, wasting the on-the-clock time of other teams' GMs, and then presume he is respected by his peers.

Line in the sand somewhere? How about draw a line in the sand of the actual chart value? I have no problem with him trying to get a deal. I do have a problem with him not making a deal over so little extra, for a player he badly wanted, whom he never thought he'd be able to acquire. He reportedly called as many as 3 teams starting as early as the 7th & 8th picks to move up to draft Tunsil, so this was a deal he clearly wanted to make, for a unique-talent player he clearly wanted to draft.

Sorry, but Darren Lee is horrible value for the 20th overall pick on a team that has holes at about a half dozen "big money" positions. It's a luxury, niche pick that a team makes if it's filling the last couple holes. Positions like ILB, S, TE are bad value there unless they turn into HOF-level players (i.e. think Lewis, Reed, Gonzalez/Gronk). If it's a money position like QB, and the player only ends up being just-decent, then it's still a worthwhile pick. If it's a low-dollar position and the player is just-ok, then it's moronic because it's a position that can be filled in free agency without breaking the bank, while passing on players that don't shake loose via trade/FA.

Burris is nothing to talk about yet so I don't know why you're singling him out by name. Still, I hope he and Lee both pan out - we all do - but what you're doing is crediting MM with success stories for players who haven't yet shown that they're good. Not to mention, the whole point of drafting Lee over some other prospects was that Lee would be a real asset as a rookie, not to be a long-term hopeful. That rationalization is right from the horses' mouths, by the way.

He can most definitely be judged accurately when these are transactions he wanted to do but repeatedly didn't because no one is meeting his unrealistic offers.

[Integrity28]

22 hours ago, Pac said:

Wrong.  You keep Macc who has completely revamped the scouting department and FO and let him pick his own coach.  Oh yeah and you make him the coaches boss.

The arranged marriage that Macc and Bowles were forced into was awkward and a big part of the problem.

I trust Macc way more than Bowles.  Let him pick his coach.

 

I was talking about the generalized approach Woody has to firing half of the GM/HC combo. I don't care about the context of right now... if they find a QB then everyone looks brilliant and competent 

[LWC611]

On ‎12‎/‎25‎/‎2016 at 2:02 PM, joewilly12 said:

But he took the Jets to 2 AFC Championship games in a row. 

Those two teams were some of the most talented teams the Jets have had in recent memory.   Rex could not screw them up.   With all due respect to Rexy, I do not remember him as being a great head coach. his in game adjustments were non existent,  he made bad challenges did not manage poor clock management.  When it counted Rex's defense let the Jets down as well.  

[joewilly12]

25 minutes ago, LWC611 said:

Those two teams were some of the most talented teams the Jets have had in recent memory.   Rex could not screw them up.   With all due respect to Rexy, I do not remember him as being a great head coach. his in game adjustments were non existent,  he made bad challenges did not manage poor clock management.  When it counted Rex's defense let the Jets down as well.  

He got the best out of a lot of his players they enjoyed playing for him. Not a big Rex Ryan fan but he's 100x better than what we currently have. 

[Pcola]

The only way to convince someone like Harbaugh and Saban is to have the #1 pick in a QBrich draft and a ton of cap space.

This is not the year to make a change.  Next year, maybe.

[LWC611]

1 hour ago, joewilly12 said:

He got the best out of a lot of his players they enjoyed playing for him. Not a big Rex Ryan fan but he's 100x better than what we currently have. 

I am sure that Bowles is getting the best out of a lot of his players, the difference being they are either to old or not good enough.  I have no way of knowing whether the players enjoy playing for him or not.  I am not in the locker room.  Losing creates dissension.  I think they Rex and Bowles very similar on the field.  I like not having the loud mouthed braggart that could not back it up that Rex was.... So I disagree with Rex being 100x better than what we currently have...

[joewilly12]

1 minute ago, LWC611 said:

I think they Rex and Bowles very similar on the field. 

Complete opposites. 

[LWC611]

Just now, joewilly12 said:

Complete opposites. 

Hopefully we can agree to disagree....

[detectivekimble]

16 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said:

If you can provide a link to any rumor or leak that MM would have accepted a 2nd rounder for Mo I'd be interested in seeing that (I'm not being sarcastic; I'd really be interested in seeing that). Last I remember his final line in the sand was a minimum of a 1st round pick in 2016, which was itself a good amount lower than his demand for Mo a year earlier.

Also when Cleveland was on the clock I'm pretty sure the Jets were reportedly among those calling them about a trade up. I'm not looking up live coverage to replay, but that is my recollection from draft day coverage. If not, frankly it paints an even worse picture of Maccagnan than I'd imagined. 

I'd forget what non-interest you think you heard re Mac/Wentz, because he was also reportedly very interested in Lynch, including possibly trading up to get him, and he then passed on Lynch with our original pick. 

He wasn't.  He was interested in Goff and Hackenberg.

[Sperm Edwards]

29 minutes ago, detectivekimble said:

He wasn't.  He was interested in Goff and Hackenberg.

Well clearly not, in hindsight, since he passed up the opportunity to draft him. My point is whatever you think you heard about his prior interest or disinterest in Wentz is meh. He could have been very interested, but simply wasn't willing to pay what it takes to move up for a QB. Not last year, not this year, not ever. Conversely, no one ever seems to offer up enough to him to get him to give up assets he doesn't even really want in the first place (Mo, Sheldon, and quite possibly Williams).

Even if it's true Maccagnan solely had interest in Goff and Hackenberg at QB, on top of his interest in bringing back Fitzpatrick, you are not really helping to improve my opinion of him.