Anyone doing the DOGE thing?

[JoJoTownsell1]

8 minutes ago, More Cowbell said:

Nobody ever advised me to buy that. 

OMG, this conversation is clearly pointless. 

[More Cowbell]

5 minutes ago, Barry McCockinner said:

But they wouldn't get any commission if they told you to buy bitcoin and you did. You can't buy it through them.

Every time frame you've described bitcoin outperforms the stock market. 

Look, I don't  believe in buying on timing. What you are describing is a bear strategy which is fine (buy on dips and sell when it shows upward momentum). If you are happy with the 10 year rollercoaster I posted, fine. 

[Barry McCockinner]

1 minute ago, JoJoTownsell1 said:

Timing?

If you had bought 10 bitcoin in 2012, you would be rich 

If you had bought 10 bitcoin in 2013, you would be rich 

If you had bought 10 bitcoin in 2014, you would be rich 

If you had bought 10 bitcoin in 2015, you would be rich 

If you had bought 10 bitcoin in 2016, you would be rich

If you had bought 10 bitcoin in 2017, you would be rich

If you had bought 10 bitcoin in 2018, you would be up

If you had bought 10 bitcoin in 2019, you would be up

If you had bought 10 bitcoin in 2020, you would be up

The only time in history that a person that invested in bitcoin, and held, that is down money are people that first bought at some point this year. So yeah there is no guarantee that Bitcoin will go up every day. Pretty sure the stock market  has bad months/quarters also. 

 

I mean, 10 bitcoin is worth the same whether you bought it in 2012 or 2021. I get the point you're trying to make but showing a percentage increase would have been a more effective way of making it IMO.

[Barry McCockinner]

1 minute ago, More Cowbell said:

Look, I don't  believe in buying on timing. What you are describing is a bear strategy which is fine (buy on dips and sell when it shows upward momentum). If you are happy with the 10 year rollercoaster I posted, fine. 

I have not described that strategy at all. I have specifically said the opposite. I don't know what thread you're reading or what charts you're reading. I don't think you know what you're talking about tbh.

[Fantasy Island]

 

[sackdance]

15 minutes ago, More Cowbell said:

Nobody ever advised me to buy that. 

I think we're all trying to tell you that it's not a coincidence.  

[More Cowbell]

Just now, sackdance said:

I think we're all trying to tell you that it's not a coincidence.  

Honestly, nobody advises me to do anything. I have managed accounts. They do all the buying and selling. They can but and sell whatever. All i know is for the last 10 years, they have made me a lot of money. 

[BklynJetsFan85]

Got in at .04, .05 (had 3000 shares by then), then another 375 shares when it was at 0.29... just holding it - see what it is in a year or 2... then see what's up. I also have a couple shares of ETH 

[Barry McCockinner]

https://www.cnbc.com/2021/06/03/russia-to-remove-dollar-assets-from-national-wealth-fund.html

The US dollar is vulnerable as the world reserve currency. Russia alone doesn't do much but if other countries joined them things could capitulate quickly.

Quote

“What alarms me is if Russia, China, and Iran each creates central bank digital currencies to operate outside of the dollar and other countries followed them,” he told CNBC’s Hadley Gamble on Wednesday. “That would be alarming.”

 

[Biggs]

4 hours ago, Barry McCockinner said:

I very much disagree that bitcoin is an asset that nobody needs. Throughout history governments have debased currencies, stealing value from citizens. Bitcoin unleashes humanity from the shackles of central banks and governments debasing us. We now can finally have separation of money and state. This is the value of bitcoin.

Bitcoin has typically outperformed every asset every major asset class since it has been released. I expect this to continue.

Where do you think we are in this cycle?

 

"The Times 03/Jan/2009 Chancellor on brink of second bailout for banks." - Satoshi Nakamoto

 

This is pure nonsense.  We just had a pandemic.  We expanded the money supply to give people money to survive.  Yes it caused shortages and inflation because people weren't producing goods and services but they still were able to demand them.  People weren't thrown out of their homes or starving in the streat. Central banks can shrink the money supply and adjust.

Having a money supply that can expand and contract, regulated by responsible governing bodies is necessary for an expanding economy.   Since we left the gold standard and have become the worlds fiat currency, there has been more middle class people, less starvation and more economic growth then in the entire history of man when currency was backed by asets like gold.

Bitcoin is a tool of cyber criminals, it has no use whatsoever and will be regulated.  It has value as an asset as long as people are willing to pay for it.  It's simply digital gold.  

The very idea that people forming communities has shackled us is one of the most insane things I have ever read.  It's bat sh*t crazy.  We need each other and we need government to facilitate society moving forward.  

[JoJoTownsell1]

11 minutes ago, Biggs said:

This is pure nonsense.  We just had a pandemic.  We expanded the money supply to give people money to survive.  Yes it caused shortages and inflation because people weren't producing goods and services but they still were able to demand them.  People weren't thrown out of their homes or starving in the streat. Central banks can shrink the money supply and adjust.

Having a money supply that can expand and contract, regulated by responsible governing bodies is necessary for an expanding economy.   Since we left the gold standard and have become the worlds fiat currency, there has been more middle class people, less starvation and more economic growth then in the entire history of man when currency was backed by asets like gold.

Bitcoin is a tool of cyber criminals, it has no use whatsoever and will be regulated.  It has value as an asset as long as people are willing to pay for it.  It's simply digital gold.  

The very idea that people forming communities has shackled us is one of the most insane things I have ever read.  It's bat sh*t crazy.  We need each other and we need government to facilitate society moving forward.  

First off, you lose all credibility when you view  Bitcoin is the tool of cyber criminals. That's like saying Cash is the tool of non-cyber criminals. There have been scammers since day 1, so it would be foolish to think Crypto would be immune. 

Second, you have had the luxury of living in America. There are people in many countries that don't trust their currency and for good reason. Look at Lebanon where their currency has lost 90pct of it's value. Look at many South American and African Countries where you would be much safer getting paid in Bitcoin then the fake money they print. 

Third, many routinely lump all crypto into one basket and think Ethereum is Bitcoin is Doge etc.. There are many different forms of crypto than have different uses/benefits. 

Defi has a 130 billion dollar market cap. Most here don't even know it exists or what it even is. There is a whole new financial universe being created and people here are choosing to look the other way because "omg it fluctuates" or "omg I've seen criminals use it." Pretty remarkable. 

 

[Biggs]

4 hours ago, Barry McCockinner said:

Again, bitcoin consistently outperforms the stock market. See the chart I posted above. There is no point in history where anyone bought bitcoin, held for at least 4 years and didn't come out on top. If you play with fire and try to play the volatility and day trade, you will probably get burned.

bitcoin was $9,800 on June 4th, 2020 (1 year ago). It's $38,500 at the time of this post - about a 293% annual increase. Is that not good enough to be considered a bull market? If not, what metric are you looking for?

 

Using statistics without a long enough period to know what the norm is doesn't prove a thing.   If you looked at gold over the last 15 years it has outperformed the Dow.  If you look at the last 30 years the Dow is killing gold.   That's because there is something called compounding.  When you actually reinvest dividends quarterly the S&P has absolutely destroyed gold as an investment.  

That's the problem with Gold and Bitcoin.  It's a lump of nothing.  It doesn't innovate, it doesn't generate cash flow it doesn't have economic growth. 

The reason to invest in stocks and bonds is most people in the world are going to get up in the morning and try to improve their lives.   Some of them are so brilliant they will invent and create and drag the rest of us forward.  Today  right now there are more middle class people in the world with real access to information than at any time in human history.  We will be dragged forward kicking and screaming but it will happen.  

Gold and Bitcoin are investments against capitalism and human innovation.   Granted there are times when humans have been extremely destructive and having a hedge has been profitible.  Most people over the course of their lives will do better dollar cost averaging into stocks and bonds, reinvesting the dividends, buying a house with  leverage and in some casses having a hedge like gold or bitcoin in their portfolio's.

In my 20's I made an absolute fortune buying Mexican Telephone in peso's before it was every on the NY Stock exchange.  It was not an invetment but I profited.  It was flat out gambling on a narrative that worked out great until the cell phone was invented.  

 

 

[Barry McCockinner]

22 minutes ago, Biggs said:

This is pure nonsense.  We just had a pandemic.  We expanded the money supply to give people money to survive.  Yes it caused shortages and inflation because people weren't producing goods and services but they still were able to demand them.  People weren't thrown out of their homes or starving in the streat. Central banks can shrink the money supply and adjust.

Having a money supply that can expand and contract, regulated by responsible governing bodies is necessary for an expanding economy.   Since we left the gold standard and have become the worlds fiat currency, there has been more middle class people, less starvation and more economic growth then in the entire history of man when currency was backed by asets like gold.

Bitcoin is a tool of cyber criminals, it has no use whatsoever and will be regulated.  It has value as an asset as long as people are willing to pay for it.  It's simply digital gold.  

The very idea that people forming communities has shackled us is one of the most insane things I have ever read.  It's bat sh*t crazy.  We need each other and we need government to facilitate society moving forward.  

The only reason the US has gotten away with printing money at will is because they are in the very privileged position of being the world reserve currency. That will not last forever and we are particularly vulnerable now. Below are the m1 & m2 supply charts. Feel free to point out where on the chart the money supply went down.

 

[WhartonJet]

3 hours ago, More Cowbell said:

Totally. I remodeled my entire apartment solely on the money they made me and keep making me. I have no problem with what they are doing. 

Maybe you would be able to afford a house if you bought bitcoin

[Biggs]

5 minutes ago, JoJoTownsell1 said:

First off, you lose all credibility when you view  Bitcoin is the tool of cyber criminals. That's like saying Cash is the tool of non-cyber criminals. There have been scammers since day 1, so it would be foolish to think Crypto would be immune. 

Second, you have had the luxury of living in America. There are people in many countries that don't trust their currency and for good reason. Look at Lebanon where their currency has lost 90pct of it's value. Look at many South American and African Countries where you would be much safer getting paid in Bitcoin then the fake money they print. 

Third, many routinely lump all crypto into one basket and think Ethereum is Bitcoin is Doge etc.. There are many different forms of crypto than have different uses/benefits. 

Defi has a 130 billion dollar market cap. Most here don't even know it exists or what it even is. There is a whole new financial universe being created and people here are choosing to look the other way because "omg it fluctuates" or "omg I've seen criminals use it." Pretty remarkable. 

 

Bitcoin is the tool of cyber criminals and that has to be reigned in.  It's a huge threat to our economy and key supply chains that we all depend on.  Cash transactions are monitored by the US government.  Denying that is absurd.  Of course criminals use cash.  They don't shut down oil lines, food lines and ask for millions in USD.  They ask for untraceable bitcoin.  That's going to end because it will be regulated.

Nobody on this board is buying digitial currency because they are worried about the stability of the US government alhough there is an argument to be made that we are near the end of our useful existence as a country.   That's been going on since day 1.  

It's an assett it's not a currency.  It's not generating cash flow, it's not innovative.  It's a static assett that's value is completely dependent on irrational/rational exuberance.  

 

[Biggs]

19 minutes ago, Barry McCockinner said:

The only reason the US has gotten away with printing money at will is because they are in the very privileged position of being the world reserve currency. That will not last forever and we are particularly vulnerable now. Below are the m1 & m2 supply charts. Feel free to point out where on the chart the money supply went down.

 

By privledged you mean we have an incredibly well educated population that has been able to increase the food supply, increase production of all kinds of stuff that we all use, defend ourselves from foreign and domestic threats and maintained some of the greatest instiutions in the world that have allowed us to move forward with an open concept of government and business based on free thought and democratic principles.   A static money supply would have killed us. 

[Jets512]

3 hours ago, Barry McCockinner said:

I have not described that strategy at all. I have specifically said the opposite. I don't know what thread you're reading or what charts you're reading. I don't think you know what you're talking about tbh.

I've seen a lot of crypto skeptics who have had some somewhat valid points. The nonsense this guy keeps spewing is about as clueless as it gets. The 2012 - 2017 comment I honestly thought was made in jest, but nope, Just wants to keep digging that hole he's buried himself in. No need to argue with people like this who aren't debating in good faith. Let him listen to his adviser and we will continue to make laughably larger returns than he ever will.

[Barry McCockinner]

29 minutes ago, Biggs said:

By privledged you mean we have an incredibly well educated population that has been able to increase the food supply, increase production of all kinds of stuff that we all use, defend ourselves from foreign and domestic threats and maintained some of the greatest instiutions in the world that have allowed us to move forward with an open concept of government and business based on free thought and democratic principles.  

I suppose you believe this was all made possible by printing unlimited money and debasing the value of our dollar. 

[Barry McCockinner]

34 minutes ago, Biggs said:

Bitcoin is the tool of cyber criminals and that has to be reigned in.  It's a huge threat to our economy and key supply chains that we all depend on.  Cash transactions are monitored by the US government.  Denying that is absurd.  Of course criminals use cash.  They don't shut down oil lines, food lines and ask for millions in USD.  They ask for untraceable bitcoin.  That's going to end because it will be regulated.

Nobody on this board is buying digitial currency because they are worried about the stability of the US government alhough there is an argument to be made that we are near the end of our useful existence as a country.   That's been going on since day 1.  

It's an assett it's not a currency.  It's not generating cash flow, it's not innovative.  It's a static assett that's value is completely dependent on irrational/rational exuberance.  

 

Every bitcoin transaction is available on a public ledger - not untraceable. Seems like a pretty crappy property for criminals. If you don't believe bitcoin is innovative it's because you don't understand it.

It is not the fault of bitcoin that private companies have poor network security. 

[JoJoTownsell1]

1 hour ago, Biggs said:

Bitcoin is the tool of cyber criminals and that has to be reigned in.  It's a huge threat to our economy and key supply chains that we all depend on.  Cash transactions are monitored by the US government.  Denying that is absurd.  Of course criminals use cash.  They don't shut down oil lines, food lines and ask for millions in USD.  They ask for untraceable bitcoin.  That's going to end because it will be regulated.

Nobody on this board is buying digitial currency because they are worried about the stability of the US government alhough there is an argument to be made that we are near the end of our useful existence as a country.   That's been going on since day 1.  

It's an assett it's not a currency.  It's not generating cash flow, it's not innovative.  It's a static assett that's value is completely dependent on irrational/rational exuberance.  

 

You can call it an asset all you want. Someone else can call it a currency and I also wouldn't care. There have been different US Federal courts, parts of the US Government that have labeled it either a Currency (US Treasury) or an Asset (IRS). People love to pigeonhole things. Trying to define bitcoin the same way you define Ethereum and the same way you define the US dollar is a waste of time. 

Second, it's value is based on a number of factors including scarcity (like gold). If there could be a billion more bitcoin made the value would drop. So it clearly isn't ONLY valued based on relative exuberance. 

 

[Biggs]

55 minutes ago, Barry McCockinner said:

I suppose you believe this was all made possible by printing unlimited money and debasing the value of our dollar. 

It certainly wasn't done with a static money supply and a capitalist system without rules and regulations that developed over years.

[Biggs]

15 minutes ago, JoJoTownsell1 said:

You can call it an asset all you want. Someone else can call it a currency and I also wouldn't care. There have been different US Federal courts, parts of the US Government that have labeled it either a Currency (US Treasury) or an Asset (IRS). People love to pigeonhole things. Trying to define bitcoin the same way you define Ethereum and the same way you define the US dollar is a waste of time. 

Second, it's value is based on a number of factors including scarcity (like gold). If there could be a billion more bitcoin made the value would drop. So it clearly isn't ONLY valued based on relative exuberance. 

 

Bitcoin doesn't trade in Bitcoin, it trades in USD.   It's the value in USD that is currency.  It's not currency until it's converted.

[Barry McCockinner]

15 minutes ago, Biggs said:

Bitcoin doesn't trade in Bitcoin, it trades in USD.   It's the value in USD that is currency.  It's not currency until it's converted.

What is the definition of currency?

[Biggs]

Just now, Barry McCockinner said:

What is the definition of currency?

General acceptance and liquidity.  Bitcoin has neither.  

[Barry McCockinner]

2 hours ago, Biggs said:

General acceptance and liquidity.  Bitcoin has neither.  

I think bitcoin has some challenges to be a full time currency but it's certainly used as an exchange of value and has an widely accepted value. The amount of time it takes to verify a transaction without using the lightning network is the biggest problem right now.

I don't know what you mean by liquidity.

[Barry McCockinner]

2 hours ago, Biggs said:

It certainly wasn't done with a static money supply and a capitalist system without rules and regulations that developed over years.

I don't get why you keep conflating capitalism and debasing fiat currency. This country has always been capitalist and was using the gold standard until the 1900's.

[WhartonJet]

This is all pretty simple.  The scarcity of Bitcoin, coupled with the continued devaluation of fiat money and Bitcoin’s wide acceptance as the gold standard store of value to combat inflation will make the price continue to rise.

Shame on everyone who reads this and doesn’t invest in Bitcoin.  It’s almost irresponsible at this point.  Any portfolio that doesn’t contain some cryptocurrency isn’t dealing in the reality of the world we live in.

[Biggs]

14 hours ago, Barry McCockinner said:

Every bitcoin transaction is available on a public ledger - not untraceable. Seems like a pretty crappy property for criminals. If you don't believe bitcoin is innovative it's because you don't understand it.

It is not the fault of bitcoin that private companies have poor network security. 

Your Bitcoin wallet is anonymous and untraceable.  The account can’t be freezed by law enforcement or traced.  

[Biggs]

10 hours ago, Barry McCockinner said:

I don't get why you keep conflating capitalism and debasing fiat currency. This country has always been capitalist and was using the gold standard until the 1900's.

I don’t get why you think government regulating and reacting to changing conditions is debasement of our currency. 

[Barry McCockinner]

43 minutes ago, Biggs said:

Your Bitcoin wallet is anonymous and untraceable.  The account can’t be freezed by law enforcement or traced.  

https://bitcoinmagazine.com/guides/is-bitcoin-anonymous

The fact that your funds can't be frozen is a feature, unless you're a bootlicker.

 

[Barry McCockinner]

13 minutes ago, Biggs said:

I don’t get why you think government regulating and reacting to changing conditions is debasement of our currency. 

Do you think the dollar hasn't been losing value since we left the gold standard?

[Lupz27]

This thread went from fun to depressing quickly I see.

[More Cowbell]

16 hours ago, WhartonJet said:

Maybe you would be able to afford a house if you bought bitcoin

You really shouldn't  speak about things you don't  know. I sold a 2 million dollar home 5 years  ago in the Kingspoint section of Great Neck when i got divorce. This is my second Co-op i ever bought. Always owned a house otherwise, but keep telling me I don't  know how to run my finances.  At this stage in my life I work because I want to, not because I have to.  

 

[Biggs]

1 hour ago, Barry McCockinner said:

https://bitcoinmagazine.com/guides/is-bitcoin-anonymous

The fact that your funds can't be frozen is a feature, unless you're a bootlicker.

 

By bootlicker you mean criminal or tax evader.  

[Barry McCockinner]

13 minutes ago, Biggs said:

By bootlicker you mean criminal or tax evader.  

This has devolved to a point where I think it's best to just move on. Suffice to say I think we see things through a much different prism. Good luck to you.