New York Mets 2023 Thread (LFGM)

[JohnJ]

12 hours ago, Maynard13 said:

The whole bullpen is an aberration.  Its just abominable. I knew they would get swept by the  Braves even when they were up several runs. Its just a matter time before the bullpen meltdowns and boom boom boom. Pathetic. 

Not sure how to embed a tweet but this is about the time I made my post. I had the volume off while I had the game on

https://twitter.com/awfulannouncing/status/1667345660184780802?s=20

[Maynard13]

1 hour ago, JohnJ said:

Not sure how to embed a tweet but this is about the time I made my post. I had the volume off while I had the game on

https://twitter.com/awfulannouncing/status/1667345660184780802?s=20

I didnt even bother to watch the Pirates game last night. I just checked in to get the score. Was like 10-4 or something ridiculous LOL.  Rock bottom LOL I Love this insight by Nietzche which is so apropos:

“If you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”

It’s believed that when Nietzsche said this, he was referring to how we all have darkness within us, but what we choose to do about that darkness can define us and our futures. This darkness has to be acknowledged in order for us to properly confront the bad in us.

https://www.quora.com/What-did-Nietzsche-mean-when-he-said-if-you-stare-into-the-abyss-the-abyss-stares-back-at-you

[JohnJ]

10 minutes ago, Maynard13 said:

I didnt even bother to watch the Pirates game last night. I just checked in to get the score. Was like 10-4 or something ridiculous LOL.  Rock bottom LOL I Love this insight by Nietzche which is so apropos:

“If you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you.”

It’s believed that when Nietzsche said this, he was referring to how we all have darkness within us, but what we choose to do about that darkness can define us and our futures. This darkness has to be acknowledged in order for us to properly confront the bad in us.

https://www.quora.com/What-did-Nietzsche-mean-when-he-said-if-you-stare-into-the-abyss-the-abyss-stares-back-at-you

Robert Ressler, FBI profiler/behaviorist, talked about that in one of his books. He interviewed the worst of the serial killers and he sank pretty low. Never forgot it and believe it.

That's a little deeper than the Mets but I like it 😆

[Maynard13]

10 minutes ago, JohnJ said:

Robert Ressler, FBI profiler/behaviorist, talked about that in one of his books. He interviewed the worst of the serial killers and he sank pretty low. Never forgot it and believe it.

That's a little deeper than the Mets but I like it 😆

Admit it is a dramatic response 😆 but being a diehard Mets fan, it's just heartbreaking to see this stuff 🤒

[JohnJ]

14 minutes ago, Maynard13 said:

Itis but being a diehard Mets fan, its just heartbreaking to see this stuff 🤒

Yeah, I'm kidding. It sucks

The Diaz injury killed it for me. That was just brutal. I heard there was a serious injury and I just knew it was Lindor or Diaz, knew it ahead of time, smh. I tried getting back on it but it's just not there. That injury shortened the bullpen but it's a lot more than that. Peterson and Megill have surprised me how bad they've been. I thought both of them would do well.

I'm watching for the young guys right now and could see myself going to an MLB subscription to watch others teams that might interest me later in the summer that will be more entertaining. Unless they can somehow find a way to become more competitive

[Maynard13]

2 minutes ago, JohnJ said:

Yeah, I'm kidding. It sucks

The Diaz injury killed it for me. That was just brutal. I heard there was a serious injury and I just knew it was Lindor or Diaz, knew it ahead of time, smh. I tried getting back on it but it's just not there. That injury shortened the bullpen but it's a lot more than that. Peterson and Megill have surprised me how bad they've been. I thought both of them would do well.

I'm watching for the young guys right now and could see myself going to a MLB subscription to watch others teams that might interest me later in the summer that will be more entertaining. Unless they can somehow find a way to become more competitive

They're done. Stick a pitchfork in 'em.  Next year I can see them bounce back with reinforcements. I think @RutgersJetFan said there are a lot of FA pitchers that will hit the market that are accomplished. And you know Cohen will go all out to get Shotoni but I think he prefers being on the west coast. Anyways, it doesn't seem like its going to be an impossible turn around next year but they have their work cut out for them to turn this roster around.  Be interesting to see what others think about who stays, who goes, upgrades etc etc etc.

[JohnJ]

3 minutes ago, Maynard13 said:

They're done. Stick a pitchfork in 'em.  Next year I can see them bounce back with reinforcements. I think @RutgersJetFan said there are a lot of FA pitchers that will hit the market that are accomplished. And you know Cohen will go all out to get Shotoni but I think he prefers being on the west coast. Anyways, it doesn't seem like its going to be an impossible turn around next year but they have their work cut out for them to turn this roster around.  Be interesting to see what others think about who stays, who goes, upgrades etc etc etc.

Yeah, I haven't really paid too much attention to that stuff like I used to. Right now I'm hoping to see Alvarez and Baty blossom on the level of the young guys like the Braves have. I really wanted to see them pick up where they left off last year and wanted to see Buck get to the WS. It was a big letdown for me

They have to get younger too if the pipeline is gonna take time outside of Alvarez, Baty, Vientos, and hopefully Mauricio. 

[doitny]

38 minutes ago, Maynard13 said:

They're done. Stick a pitchfork in 'em.  Next year I can see them bounce back with reinforcements. I think @RutgersJetFan said there are a lot of FA pitchers that will hit the market that are accomplished. And you know Cohen will go all out to get Shotoni but I think he prefers being on the west coast. Anyways, it doesn't seem like its going to be an impossible turn around next year but they have their work cut out for them to turn this roster around.  Be interesting to see what others think about who stays, who goes, upgrades etc etc etc.

forget Shotoni. we cant waste what 40-50 mil a year on him. take that money to get 2-3 good middle relief guys. plus we need some to sign Alonzo soon. 

despite all that stuff you wrote about who is not hitting and pitching we would be in 1st place right now with decent middle relivers. they have been brutal. 

we have the highest payroll in sports history and we probably wont make the playoffs. teams with the lower payrolls like TB are playing much better. Cohen is learning you cant stack your team with 40-50 mil dollar players. i doubt he goes for Shotoni. 

[RutgersJetFan]

3 hours ago, Maynard13 said:

They're done. Stick a pitchfork in 'em.  Next year I can see them bounce back with reinforcements. I think @RutgersJetFan said there are a lot of FA pitchers that will hit the market that are accomplished. And you know Cohen will go all out to get Shotoni but I think he prefers being on the west coast. Anyways, it doesn't seem like its going to be an impossible turn around next year but they have their work cut out for them to turn this roster around.  Be interesting to see what others think about who stays, who goes, upgrades etc etc etc.

IMO the offense will be fine. Pitching is a lot easier to turn around than an entire lineup. They’re not too far off. I think Scott put it best when he said the bullpen woes are from the starters not able to consistently go 6 + Diaz.

All this said I really don't think they're done. Maybe I've got rose-colored glasses but MLB is so different now. If you're at .500 at the break you can make the playoffs and do just fine. Baseball season is such an epically long slog there is always time to course correct before August. 

Senga is going to be good next year. Really, really good. 

[Rangers9]

7 hours ago, Maynard13 said:

This season is OVER. It was over when Diaz got hurt. Verlander looks human as does Scherzer. Neither can go deep into games. McGil and Peterson have really hurt the pitching staff. Both have been terrible. The other SP they signed whose name I dont even know wont be back unitl August I hear.  Great.  The bullpen is horrible.  Their farm system has NO pitching. No one hits for average. Alonso is out for a month, probably more adding in the rehab. Baty is very average at 3rd base. He's got a ways to go both on offense and defense.  Lindor cant hit himself out a bag. McNeil also having a mediocre year. Alvarez is the bright spot. Kid is gonna be a star.  Buck aint going nowhere. Not his fault this is a lost season. It happens.  Next year will be a completely different look. Scherzer will be replaced by hopefully Shotoni and they supplement teh pitching staff with other FA's.   And they will have to revamp the bullpen. And get someone who can hit and can on base. Poor Nimmo. He must feel so alone. Its not an improbable makeover. Cohen is not afraid to spend.

It's a long season and Mets won today. Teams in .500 territory even as late as the All Star game have put together big second halves. Alvarez hit another HR today and you have to love what you see even defensively he's very aggressive behind the plate not afraid to make mistakes shows leadership ability. Now you know why scouts touted him and said he was the top prospect in baseball. If the Mets can stay in it and hang around in Sept if Diaz comes back and is anywhere close to what he was last year the Mets could sneak into the playoffs and if the team gets hot win games. I'm not writing us off yet although even I doubt my optimism. I've just seen it before bad first half good second half. Like the Phillies last year. And the 2021 Braves, etc. 

[Maynard13]

4 hours ago, doitny said:

forget Shotoni. we cant waste what 40-50 mil a year on him. take that money to get 2-3 good middle relief guys. plus we need some to sign Alonzo soon. 

despite all that stuff you wrote about who is not hitting and pitching we would be in 1st place right now with decent middle relivers. they have been brutal. 

we have the highest payroll in sports history and we probably wont make the playoffs. teams with the lower payrolls like TB are playing much better. Cohen is learning you cant stack your team with 40-50 mil dollar players. i doubt he goes for Shotoni. 

Sure he will. Scherzer comes off the books next year. That's a tit for tat practically. And he serves 2 purposes - an ace and a DH. Consider it done IF he wants to come here which he probably wont since he seems to want to play on west coast.  But to your point, its going to take more than a few good relievers. They really need a good LF with speed/power/can hit for average. McNeil is a punch and judy type hitter and has no power. Look at the Braves. Damn near every player on there is hitting HR's. Its absurd.  I'd bring up Mauricio and stick him in at 2nd NOW. Get him acclimated to the position in the big leagues so he'd be ready for 2024.  I'm not feeling Baty right now. his defense i just suspect and he looks lost vs. lefthanders.  Not sure what's up with Marte and his contract but he's no spring chicken either.  And just what do they do with Vientos?  Does he even have a position? 

[doitny]

1 hour ago, Maynard13 said:

Sure he will. Scherzer comes off the books next year. That's a tit for tat practically. And he serves 2 purposes - an ace and a DH. Consider it done IF he wants to come here which he probably wont since he seems to want to play on west coast.  But to your point, its going to take more than a few good relievers. They really need a good LF with speed/power/can hit for average. McNeil is a punch and judy type hitter and has no power. Look at the Braves. Damn near every player on there is hitting HR's. Its absurd.  I'd bring up Mauricio and stick him in at 2nd NOW. Get him acclimated to the position in the big leagues so he'd be ready for 2024.  I'm not feeling Baty right now. his defense i just suspect and he looks lost vs. lefthanders.  Not sure what's up with Marte and his contract but he's no spring chicken either.  And just what do they do with Vientos?  Does he even have a position? 

agreed Shotoni probably wont come here. 

also agree that Mauricio should be here now. put McNeil in left field and Cahna to DH until Vientos starts hitting. Vientos only position is DH but he has played 55 minor league games at 1st including 17 this year. he should be playing 1st with Alonzo out.

and whats up with Buck. i like him but he doesnt like playing the kids. you cant tell me Alverez didnt beat out Nido in spring training. that kid is killing it here. if Nido and Navarez didnt get injured he would still be in triple A. someone needs to force him to play these guys. 

Marte has 2 years left and McNiel just signed a 4 year contract. there are no spots in our outfield.

[SAM SAM HE'S OUR MAN]

It's time for the team to let the manager MANAGE . No more help from the analytics geeks on making the lineup . And get rid of Vogelbach , please . 

[Rangers9]

2 hours ago, SAM SAM HE'S OUR MAN said:

It's time for the team to let the manager MANAGE . No more help from the analytics geeks on making the lineup . And get rid of Vogelbach , please . 

As for getting rid of Vogelbach that seems to have almost unanimous agreement among Mets fans and pundits. But is that the way Buck wants to manage. Getting rid of a recently productive player in a bad slump. Or staying with them and trying to install confidence. Isn't that the message he wants to give the team. He'll stick with you and not get rid of you in bad times. That message of loyalty can reverberate with players. 

[TuscanyTile2]

16 hours ago, RutgersJetFan said:

IMO the offense will be fine. Pitching is a lot easier to turn around than an entire lineup. They’re not too far off. I think Scott put it best when he said the bullpen woes are from the starters not able to consistently go 6 + Diaz.

All this said I really don't think they're done. Maybe I've got rose-colored glasses but MLB is so different now. If you're at .500 at the break you can make the playoffs and do just fine. Baseball season is such an epically long slog there is always time to course correct before August. 

Senga is going to be good next year. Really, really good. 

A few years back the Mets stunk mid-way through the season but caught fire in July and were right back in it.  Baseball is such a long season that you just don't know.  And so many teams make the playoffs now that it's really not crazy to think we can make it as long as we can stay around .500 until reinforcements come (e.g. our players getting healthy or a trade).

[Maynard13]

12 hours ago, doitny said:

agreed Shotoni probably wont come here. 

also agree that Mauricio should be here now. put McNeil in left field and Cahna to DH until Vientos starts hitting. Vientos only position is DH but he has played 55 minor league games at 1st including 17 this year. he should be playing 1st with Alonzo out.

and whats up with Buck. i like him but he doesnt like playing the kids. you cant tell me Alverez didnt beat out Nido in spring training. that kid is killing it here. if Nido and Navarez didnt get injured he would still be in triple A. someone needs to force him to play these guys. 

Marte has 2 years left and McNiel just signed a 4 year contract. there are no spots in our outfield.

They could always trade McNeil or Marte although McNeil holds more trade value and Marte is the better player and still has a few years left in his tank.  Never really been enamored with McNeil. He's an average fielder, lacks speed/[power. He's a good utility guy IMO and I could care less he won the batting title.  This team needs to get some power in the lineup or they will never seriously contend. Right now they have Alonso and thankfully Alvarez is blooming quickly.  

[Maynard13]

This idea of hanging around and make a run blah blah blah is comical. We need to get dominant. Like back in 1986 and they damn near lost lost then. This aint 1973 and that didn't end well either. The Phillies went on a tear last year and that didnt end well either. Point is there is no guarantee but I dont want a team that is gonna sneak into the playoffs that has no business being there in the first place. Super rare for teams to win a WS from that perspective. The Yankees in the 90's (ugh) were dominant and created a dynasty.  We had the chance to do that in the mid 80's but injuries and other factors derailed that. But those teams were special. This team aint special and has numerous flaws. 

[Maynard13]

1 hour ago, Rangers9 said:

As for getting rid of Vogelbach that seems to have almost unanimous agreement among Mets fans and pundits. But is that the way Buck wants to manage. Getting rid of a recently productive player in a bad slump. Or staying with them and trying to install confidence. Isn't that the message he wants to give the team. He'll stick with you and not get rid of you in bad times. That message of loyalty can reverberate with players. 

Whateva (in a California valley accent).  Vogelbach is the first move I make and cut his phat butt.  He cant hit lefthanders, KO's way to much and is slower than a phat turtle. He doesn't play a position, and is just clogging up the roster. Cut him NOW and bring up Mauricio and stick him onto 2nd base. How this guy is on this team or was traded for is beyond me. 

[Rangers9]

I think if this continues they will cut him. But the reason they traded for him in the first place was to bat against righties only. It was I thought at the time a good strategy with Ruff against left handers. His numbers showed he had power from the left side production over the years plus a good eye and willingness to take walks. His on base percentage has been good. I'm not ever going to criticize a player who gets BBs. It's very smart baseball. Buck knows the temperament of the clubhouse and I'd go with his judgment. Look good managers and coaches can be fired usually when they wear out their welcome with players and the org and that's happened before with Buck. In the past he's been known as a micro-manager. But I don't think we've reached that yet potentially and probably in the future. 

[Maynard13]

2 hours ago, Maynard13 said:

They could always trade McNeil or Marte although McNeil holds more trade value and Marte is the better player and still has a few years left in his tank.  Never really been enamored with McNeil. He's an average fielder, lacks speed/[power. He's a good utility guy IMO and I could care less he won the batting title.  This team needs to get some power in the lineup or they will never seriously contend. Right now they have Alonso and thankfully Alvarez is blooming quickly.  

And with that, McNeil hits a HR today with of course no one on base LOL - his 3rd of the year - STOP THE PRESSES

[doitny]

🤬🤬🤬

[JohnJ]

Mercifully that game wasn't too long. Doesn't matter how many runs are scored = loss

[Maynard13]

An offensive barrage. THIS TEAM SUCKS

[SAM SAM HE'S OUR MAN]

14 hours ago, Maynard13 said:

An offensive barrage. THIS TEAM SUCKS

[Scott Dierking]

On 6/9/2023 at 8:45 AM, Scott Dierking said:

I really hope that David Stearns is coming here, even though Cohen said he wasn't. Wait and see.

What Cohen inherited was a very incomplete team. They have been trying to patch holes with pricey veterans and a mix and match. It hasn't been pretty. Have to wait for this farm system some of the kids they recently drafted. That is a process. Team really needs to get some pitchers i the pipeline.

They just look awful at this point.

Hahaha. Well, the reverse curse has worked again in this thread. It sounds like David Stearns WILL be hired by the Mets after the season. This is great, great news. This man knows talent and how to build an organization. Hope!!!

[Scott Dierking]

It was reported Sunday afternoon by Bob Nightengale of USA Today that the New York Mets are expected to hire former Milwaukee Brewers general manager David Stearns this offseason. His contract expires after the season, and he is expected to be hired in Flushing to a high-ranking front office job.

Stearns stepped down from his general manager role with the Brewers after the 2022 season. However, his contract with the team spanned in the 2023 season as well.

Stearns was hired by Milwaukee on September 21 of 2015. Under his reign, the Brewers appeared in the playoffs four-straight seasons from 2018 through 2021. Some of his best moves were the acquisitions of starting pitcher Freddy Peralta, former MVP Christian Yelich, among others.

The 38-year-old Harvard alum coincidentally started his career in baseball in the baseball operations department with the New York Mets. He then moved on and joined the MLB’s central offices and had his hand in negotiating the Collective Bargaining Agreement back in 2008.

In December of 2011, he worked with the then Cleveland Indians focusing on player contracts and data analysis. His last stop before the Brewers was with the Houston Astros from 2013-15 as an assistant general manager where the team finally returned back to the playoffs.

The Nightengale articles reports that there are no plans to fire manager Buck Showalter or general manager Billy Eppler, “at least not during the season.” There is no mention of what may happen after the season when Stearns will reportedly be hired.

 

 

[Maynard13]

9 hours ago, Scott Dierking said:

It was reported Sunday afternoon by Bob Nightengale of USA Today that the New York Mets are expected to hire former Milwaukee Brewers general manager David Stearns this offseason. His contract expires after the season, and he is expected to be hired in Flushing to a high-ranking front office job.

Stearns stepped down from his general manager role with the Brewers after the 2022 season. However, his contract with the team spanned in the 2023 season as well.

Stearns was hired by Milwaukee on September 21 of 2015. Under his reign, the Brewers appeared in the playoffs four-straight seasons from 2018 through 2021. Some of his best moves were the acquisitions of starting pitcher Freddy Peralta, former MVP Christian Yelich, among others.

The 38-year-old Harvard alum coincidentally started his career in baseball in the baseball operations department with the New York Mets. He then moved on and joined the MLB’s central offices and had his hand in negotiating the Collective Bargaining Agreement back in 2008.

In December of 2011, he worked with the then Cleveland Indians focusing on player contracts and data analysis. His last stop before the Brewers was with the Houston Astros from 2013-15 as an assistant general manager where the team finally returned back to the playoffs.

The Nightengale articles reports that there are no plans to fire manager Buck Showalter or general manager Billy Eppler, “at least not during the season.” There is no mention of what may happen after the season when Stearns will reportedly be hired.

 

 

THERE IS A GOD!

[Dcat]

Cole has retired 1st 12. Veralnder 12/13. 

But once we get to Mets bullpen, it's over.

[Rangers9]

The key guy in the lineup imo has to be Lindor who's currently hitting .215 but with power. He has to start making more contact. But so far the main prob has been pitching for the Mets. 

[Rangers9]

While Vogelbach is still struggling (I think he'll break out of it but like in all slumps he's looking pretty bad) Pham is playing well he's been a good pick up. 

[Rangers9]

Tonight's Mets game was 2 hours and one minute. On average with pitch clock and other new rules games about 30 minutes less than last year.

[Maynard13]

We are drifting drifting drifting into deep deep waters. Season practically over and even if they make a resurgence, they dont have the pitching on the roster to make a push.  They hit and still lose 9-8   8-7  etc.  They pitch well and lose 2-1   1-0 etc. They are done. This team has MULTIPLE flaws: lack power, bullpen SUCKS azz, starting pitching is old as sin (Scherzer gone after this year, you can get a solid starter and 2 solid relief guys for what they pay him per yar 42M), Baty is NOT ready to be FT 3rd baseman: he is constantly overmatched. They dont have much speed and cant steal bases. They dont hit for average although that is remarkably down across the ML teams. They need to redo this for next year. Its really pathetic baseball they playing this year and its SAD.

Bullpen needs to be overhauled.  They have Brigham and Leone who are guys that should only pitch in blowouts. Keep Robertson and Drew Smith and probably Octavio. Hopefully, Diaz comes back 100% next year.  

They need a 2nd baseman (Mauricio? is he ready? apparently not) and a 3rd baseman (good luck with that) and a LF. Canha is decent but prefer a guy who has more power/speed etc. He is better suited as a sub.  Marte is a great athlete. Hopefully he rebounds. Nimmo is the star of this team. Period. Lindor we are stuck with and he needs to wake TFU.  catching looks promising in Alvarez.  We desperately need a DH. Desperately. 

See, that wasn't hard was it?

 

[RutgersJetFan]

6 hours ago, Maynard13 said:

We are drifting drifting drifting into deep deep waters.

 

Here's how crazy baseball is now: Despite how bad they've been, they're still only 5 back of the wild card.

[Maynard13]

1 minute ago, RutgersJetFan said:

Here's how crazy baseball is now: Despite how bad they've been, they're still only 5 back of the wild card.

Wild that's wild man.

[Scott Dierking]

14 hours ago, RutgersJetFan said:

Here's how crazy baseball is now: Despite how bad they've been, they're still only 5 back of the wild card.

Get to .500, and then I can start to believe a little.