SenorGato Posted November 8, 2011 Share Posted November 8, 2011 Neither the Packers nor the Niners would have made the change if they didn't wholeheartedly believe that the heir apparents was a franchise QB. In fact, Steve Young was the Niners started for TWO SEASONS before the Niners dumped Montana. Both teams dumped the older QB in order to go with the younger signal caller and the older player had pro bowl seasons there after. What's the point being made here? Further, both franchises did that with new HCs than the one that had long term success with the older player. Bill Walsh and Mike Holmgren didn't make the decision to change. Seifert and McCarthy did. Here's a good point. So, in order for the Pats to fit into the Packer/Niner mold, the Patriots would have to have a new HC and then dump Brady believing that Mallet, right then, is a franchise QB. To follow the Niners' path, the Pats would have had to start Mallet for 2 whole seasons before deciding on what to do with Brady. Yeah, they don't have to do exactly as the other two teams do. The whole point of comparison is that both franchises prepped for their HOF QB's fall before it the fall was right on top of their heads. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SMC Posted November 8, 2011 Share Posted November 8, 2011 #HackArguingTechnique I'm not sure he meant that as a knock or rather than a question because you may have not known the history of the Niners-Young-Montana. Steve Young was a highly valued QB thought ruined by the Bucs. The Niners got him and started him after Montana got hurt. Young started for 2 seasons (abbreviated 1991 season (Young got hurt) and full 1992 season while Montana recuperated from a serious elbow injury. When Montana finally became healthy, the Niners dumped him because Young was already the starter and had won the 1992 MVP award. The odds of the Pats repeating that with Mallet are incredibly remote. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason423 Posted November 8, 2011 Share Posted November 8, 2011 This is true. If you watched that Football Life documentary he pretty much said so. He doesnt want to coach into his later years ala Marv Levy A roster spot of a young player who wants to play Football? Didnt they give up a 5 for him? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZachEY Posted November 8, 2011 Share Posted November 8, 2011 Interesting take and I might agree with you if it was the same team that gave him that money. But it wasnt, a new team gave him the deal expecting him to be a certain player and he pretty much sh*t all over them, took the money and ran. Well, that was pretty stupid of the new team, no? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SenorGato Posted November 8, 2011 Share Posted November 8, 2011 They cut Montana loose at a time when he still had gas in the tank (a few good seasons in KC) because they knew what they had in Young. Well the backup we're talking about here *is* a rookie...Brady is not immune to a similar situation, it just doesn't have to be this year or even for the next couple of years... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SMC Posted November 8, 2011 Share Posted November 8, 2011 They cut Montana loose at a time when he still had gas in the tank (a few good seasons in KC) because they knew what they had in Young. And Steven Young had already won the 1992 MVP award. So the Niners already had a 2 yr starter and MVP winner before they got rid of Montana Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SenorGato Posted November 8, 2011 Share Posted November 8, 2011 I'm not sure he meant that as a knock or rather than a question because you may have not known the history of the Niners-Young-Montana. Steve Young was a highly valued QB thought ruined by the Bucs. The Niners got him and started him after Montana got hurt. Young started for 2 seasons (abbreviated 1991 season (Young got hurt) and full 1992 season while Montana recuperated from a serious elbow injury. When Montana finally became healthy, the Niners dumped him because Young was already the starter and had won the 1992 MVP award. The odds of the Pats repeating that with Mallet are incredibly remote. Again...all completely aside from the point. The point is that those franchises knew their QBs were getting old, they went out and bought low on a couple of young QBs, they let those QBs play in their system and develop, and that period of time in their careers probably helped them greatly moving forward. While the odds of repeating it with Mallett are remote, building a future OL (and Vollmer/Mankins/Solder is one heck of a core for a future OL) and the rest of the offense before they have to plug him in will certainly help them significantly if they plan to beat those odds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JiFtheOracle Posted November 8, 2011 Share Posted November 8, 2011 Well, that was pretty stupid of the new team, no? I guess...if you could predict this type of stuff. I mean, it was the Redskins. So... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SenorGato Posted November 8, 2011 Share Posted November 8, 2011 And Steven Young had already won the 1992 MVP award. So the Niners already had a 2 yr starter and MVP winner before they got rid of Montana I'm still completely confused as to why Mallett has to compare directly to Young to be the future QB of the Patriots. I'm actually certain that it's impossible for him to have the accomplishments Young had 7+ years into career when he got his first full time starting gig at this point in his rookie year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flgreen Posted November 8, 2011 Share Posted November 8, 2011 Jets not interested in DT Albert Haynesworth after release from Patriots Published: Tuesday, November 08, 2011, 3:55 PM Updated: Tuesday, November 08, 2011, 3:58 PM By Jenny Vrentas/The Star-Ledger Follow Email Print Stew Milne/US PresswireAlbert Haynesworth won't be on the field for the Pats when the Jets host them this weekend. The Jets are not interested in acquiring DT Albert Haynesworth following his release from the Patriots today, according to a person with knowledge of the team's plans. That person requested anonymity because the team has not commented publicly on the player. Haynesworth's release was first reported by the Boston Herald. During Sunday's game against the Giants, the controversial player had an altercation on the sidelines with defensive line coach Pepper Johnson. Teams have until 4 p.m. tomorrow to claim Haynesworth and the prorated portion of his salary, reportedly about $700,000. If he is not claimed, he would be a free agent. The Jets play the Patriots on Sunday night, and the gamesmanship of bringing on board an opponent's recent castoff is alive and well in the NFL. But not in this case. New England gambled on Haynesworth, trading a fifth-round pick to the Redskins for the controversial player in July. He is considered to be a better fit in a 4-3 scheme. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klecko73isGod Posted November 8, 2011 Share Posted November 8, 2011 #HackArguingTechnique I was asking an honest question. Anyone who was around back then knows the Niners did not replace Montana with Young sight unseen. He started almost for almost two full years while Montana was recovering from neck and back surgery before they finally shipped Montana out. Not to mention that Young started several games due to Montana injuries during Montana's last couple of years as the active starter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gainzo Posted November 8, 2011 Share Posted November 8, 2011 I was asking an honest question. Anyone who was around back then knows the Niners did not replace Montana with Young sight unseen. He started almost for almost two full years while Montana was recovering from neck and back surgery before they finally shipped Montana out. Not to mention that Young started several games due to Montana injuries during Montana's last couple of years as the active starter. Young didn't start a full season for the 49ers until 1992. 1987: Started 3 games and went 2-1. 1988: Started 3 games and went 2-1. 1989: Started 3 games and went 3-0. 1990: Started 1 game and went 0-1. 1991: Started 10 games and went 5-5. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JetsFanFromQueens Posted November 8, 2011 Share Posted November 8, 2011 Lets stop with this "Ryan Mallett" talk already. The Chargers drafted Leaf to become a franchise QB. The Jets drafted the "NFL's most ready quarterback" in Kellen Clemens (who was a great college quarterback) to become our franchise QB after Pennington. Just because you draft a "potential" franchise QB; doesn't mean that you landed a franchise quarterback. And why are we even talking about "franchise QB's"? Brady is MUCH more than a "franchise quarterback"... He's one of the GREATEST NFL Quarterbacks that's ever lived to the play game. An all-time great. Please, stop with all this "Ryan Mallett" talk. Anyone who doesn't know, nor understand, that New England will fall into a STEEP DECLINE after Brady moves on; must be extremely clueless in regards to this Patriots franchise, or very naive in regards to how truly great Brady has really been. If you really feel the Patriots will "keep the ship moving", after Brady moves on, all because they've drafted a backup quarterback... you're truly kidding yourself. Brady has posted winning records of 9-7, 10-6, 10-6, 11-5, 12-4, 14-2, 14-2, 14-2 (not a typo neither, he's done it three times) and 16-0! Brady has posted quarterback ratings of 85.7, 85.9, 86.5, 87.9, 92.3, 92.6, 96.2, 100.0 (currently), 111.0 and 117.2! 6 pro bowl selections, 2 first team all-pro selections, 1 second team all-pro selection, one NFL player of the year award, Two NFL MVP awards, NFL comeback player of the year award, voted into the NFL's 2000's All-Decade team etc, etc. And most importantly? Not only has Brady won 2 Super Bowl MVP awards; but he's won 3 Super Bowl Championships! You can't just "replace this" with a "potential" franchise QB. And just because the 49ers and Packers hit the jack pot with Young and Rodgers, doesn't mean the Patriots did the same thing. Have you not seen the Patriots draft's over the years? They've stunk. Chances are, Ryan Mallett wil stink as well. Have you not seen this NE defense? This Patriots defense is in SHAMBLES right now. They'll need ALOT more than a "franchise QB" once Brady moves on; they'll need an ALL-TIME great to survive. But I'm sorry, this backup quarterback will NEVER become an ALL TIME GREAT! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted November 8, 2011 Share Posted November 8, 2011 Coaches should never be allowed to be their own GMs. Recipe for disaster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SenorGato Posted November 8, 2011 Share Posted November 8, 2011 Lets stop with this "Ryan Mallett" talk already. The Chargers drafted Leaf to become a franchise QB. The Jets drafted the "NFL's most ready quarterback" in Kellen Clemens (who was a great college quarterback) to become our franchise QB after Pennington. Just because you draft a "potential" franchise QB; doesn't mean that you landed a franchise quarterback. 1. Why is Ryan Mallett's name in quotes DWC? 2. What? Young didn't start a full season for the 49ers until 1992. 1987: Started 3 games and went 2-1. 1988: Started 3 games and went 2-1. 1989: Started 3 games and went 3-0. 1990: Started 1 game and went 0-1. 1991: Started 10 games and went 5-5. At age 31... I was asking an honest question. Anyone who was around back then knows the Niners did not replace Montana with Young sight unseen. He started almost for almost two full years while Montana was recovering from neck and back surgery before they finally shipped Montana out. Not to mention that Young started several games due to Montana injuries during Montana's last couple of years as the active starter. I really still can't understand how this has any effect on Mallett's future. The fact is that the 49ers bought low on a QB talent, the Packers bought low on a QB talent, and the Pats bought low on a QB talent all in the years preceding the end of days with their incumbent future HOF. It's what smart teams do, and I'm just saying that the decision to go after Mallett just might pay off in the long term for the Pats. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleedin Green Posted November 9, 2011 Share Posted November 9, 2011 1. Why is Ryan Mallett's name in quotes DWC? 2. What? At age 31... I really still can't understand how this has any effect on Mallett's future. The fact is that the 49ers bought low on a QB talent, the Packers bought low on a QB talent, and the Pats bought low on a QB talent all in the years preceding the end of days with their incumbent future HOF. It's what smart teams do, and I'm just saying that the decision to go after Mallett just might pay off in the long term for the Pats. Um... the Packers drafted Rodgers in the first round. That's "buying low"? And I don't disagree it could pay off, but it's the furthest thing from a guarantee. Before Mallett, O'Connell was supposed to be that guy, and we've seen how that's worked out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GREENBEAN Posted November 9, 2011 Share Posted November 9, 2011 sign this bust. LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billo83 Posted November 9, 2011 Share Posted November 9, 2011 Didnt they give up a 5 for him? Yep. Not that Belicheat would have done anything with the pick anyway. It was really no gamble there Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RutgersJetFan Posted November 9, 2011 Share Posted November 9, 2011 Um... the Packers drafted Rodgers in the first round. That's "buying low"? I actually agree with that. Not a lot of investment in a end-round pick, even in the 1st. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted November 9, 2011 Share Posted November 9, 2011 I actually agree with that. Not a lot of investment in a end-round pick, even in the 1st. Yep. Hell, the Packers drafted Randall Cobb with the 32nd pick to be their kick returner and # 5 receiver (elevating to # 4 when Driver retires). I don't see them suffering for that decision or their fans complaining about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PFSIKH Posted November 9, 2011 Share Posted November 9, 2011 Well the backup we're talking about here *is* a rookie...Brady is not immune to a similar situation, it just doesn't have to be this year or even for the next couple of years... Cannot argue that. Brady signed a 4 year deal. He has said he would like to play into his 40s, but that was then and in 2+ years he might feel different. The Patriots might feel different. Mallett was a good pick because of his issues he dropped where he would have been selected. And if Brady leaves or decides to hang them up in a couple of years, the Patriots have Mallett. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maxman Posted November 9, 2011 Share Posted November 9, 2011 AdamSchein Adam Schein RT @RapSheet BREAKING: The Patriots have released DT Albert Haynesworth, I'm reporting. Wow. Ocho probably isn't that far behind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason423 Posted November 9, 2011 Share Posted November 9, 2011 The 49ers got rid of Montana because they felt his time was done. He was 36 years old, missed all of the 1991 season and rarely played a full year before that. The team went 10-6 without him behind Steve Young and Steve Bono and then they made the choice to go with Young who got them just as far in 92 and Montana got them in 90. So they traded him. Brady doesnt have the durability issues that would make the Pats consider it. The only reason for NE to ever think of moving Brady is if the cap charges became an issue but right now they are super far under the cap so its not a problem. There was a time when NE could have survived without Brady. I know the schedule was weak in 2008 but they did go 10-6 with Matt Cassel, who is terrible, at QB. But that was also before the poor drafting and bad personnel decisions caught up with them. If you put Cassel on this version of the Patriots they would be 6-10. He does not mean as much as Manning, but he probably means more than any other QB in the NFL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleedin Green Posted November 9, 2011 Share Posted November 9, 2011 I actually agree with that. Not a lot of investment in a end-round pick, even in the 1st. Perhaps, but that's also assuming your team is good enough to pull that off. When you've got other positions in need of upgrade, it's not exactly easy to make the decision to grab a guy in the first round (even if it is late) who you know will see exactly zero snaps for you for the next few years in place of a possible day one starter. Hell, how many years have Jets fans been talking the team's late round pick of Bryan Thomas over Ed Reed? Not to say it's a major investment that can't be recovered from or anything, but it's hardly the same as throwing some late round picks at the QB position and hoping one of them works out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJD Posted November 9, 2011 Share Posted November 9, 2011 The JETS should pick up albert, we can use his fat a$$ to plug the middle. can yu imagine, albert, pouha and devito side by side oh my... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maxman Posted November 9, 2011 Share Posted November 9, 2011 The JETS should pick up albert, we can use his fat a$$ to plug the middle. can yu imagine, albert, pouha and devito side by side oh my... Normally I think they would consider it but he is such bad news at this point, the distraction just wouldn't be worth it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted November 9, 2011 Share Posted November 9, 2011 I wouldn't be surprised if the Jets brought Haynesworth in for a look. They were linked to him a few times when the Redskins were moving him. I don't think they want him badly, but I also think the Jets don't have any problems picking up guys with attitude problems. Haynesworth is a douche, but getting into a verbal altercation with Pepper Johnson is not very difficult. It's like fighting with Bryan Cox. It's not a surprise. I'm sure the Jets could use Haynesworth as much as Bellore, McIntyre, Baker, Lee, Riley, Turner and a host of other guys. I wouldn't be surprised if they had him in because in addition to tweaking the Pats, they have injury concerns among the big bodies. Devito, Ellis and Dixon are all hurt. That leaves them Wilkerson, Pouha, Pitoitua and Tevesau. I think Wilkerson has been dealing with shoulder issues and Pouha got gonged last week too. The Pats probably aren't the team they'd need the extra big body for though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maxman Posted November 9, 2011 Share Posted November 9, 2011 I wouldn't be surprised if the Jets brought Haynesworth in for a look. They were linked to him a few times when the Redskins were moving him. I don't think they want him badly, but I also think the Jets don't have any problems picking up guys with attitude problems. Haynesworth is a douche, but getting into a verbal altercation with Pepper Johnson is not very difficult. It's like fighting with Bryan Cox. It's not a surprise. I'm sure the Jets could use Haynesworth as much as Bellore, McIntyre, Baker, Lee, Riley, Turner and a host of other guys. I wouldn't be surprised if they had him in because in addition to tweaking the Pats, they have injury concerns among the big bodies. Devito, Ellis and Dixon are all hurt. That leaves them Wilkerson, Pouha, Pitoitua and Tevesau. I think Wilkerson has been dealing with shoulder issues and Pouha got gonged last week too. The Pats probably aren't the team they'd need the extra big body for though. Does he even know their playbook? I think he is just flat out done. If Belly couldn't get anything out of him I wouldn't even pay for his plane ride here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SenorGato Posted November 9, 2011 Share Posted November 9, 2011 Um... the Packers drafted Rodgers in the first round. That's "buying low" And I don't disagree it could pay off, but it's the furthest thing from a guarantee. Before Mallett, O'Connell was supposed to be that guy, and we've seen how that's worked out. Um Rodgers was a candidate for 1 that year and was considered the #1 QB in his draft year by a couple out there. It was a big deal him dropping that far at the time....Bought low...stole...same sh*t. Plus what RJF said, and throw in that Tedford QBs weren't and probably still aren't really popular prospects. O'Connel was from a smaller school and had baby hands. He was picked in the third of a pretty crappy draft iirc anyway...plus Brady wasn't 34 then either. Basically, the only comparison btw him and Mallet is that they're both QBs drafted by the Pats. Mallet has significantly more talent.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted November 9, 2011 Share Posted November 9, 2011 Does he even know their playbook? I think he is just flat out done. If Belly couldn't get anything out of him I wouldn't even pay for his plane ride here. I was thinking along the lines of Parcells "planet theory". There aren't that many guys that big with that skill set so you have him in. It doesn't mean they will sign him. Didn't they have Jamarcus Russell in at some point? I see there was an article saying that the Jets aren't interested. I certainly wouldn't pick up his contract, but I'd probably have him in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SenorGato Posted November 9, 2011 Share Posted November 9, 2011 Does he even know their playbook? I think he is just flat out done. If Belly couldn't get anything out of him I wouldn't even pay for his plane ride here. Well to play a devils advocate...His role would be to be big and use whatever athleticism he thinks he has left...Itd be pretty funny if he finished strong with the Jets after trolling the Pats. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maxman Posted November 9, 2011 Share Posted November 9, 2011 Well to play a devils advocate...His role would be to be big and use whatever athleticism he thinks he has left...Itd be pretty funny if he finished strong with the Jets after trolling the Pats. I would love it. But some pretty good coaches (Hall of Fame level) have failed with him. I trust Rex but just don't see it happening here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted November 9, 2011 Share Posted November 9, 2011 This is the third team in the past 4 years that decided they no longer want anything to do with this douche... that alone should tell you all you need to know. The Titans didn't exaclty decide that they didn't want anything to do with him. They didn't want to pay him $56M. If the 'skins didn't pay him all that money and/or totally change their defensive scheme things might have been very different there. Seriously, who the hell would you cut from the Jets for this lump of sh*t? Shawn Nelson. Eron Riley. Isiah Trufant. From the linked article: It's just comical. Those passer numbers work out to a 110 passer rating. Four yards a rush is nothing to write home about, either. Solid? Lol! Be fair. How do those figures stand up compared to the Pats regular defense? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maxman Posted November 9, 2011 Share Posted November 9, 2011 The Titans didn't exaclty decide that they didn't want anything to do with him. They didn't want to pay him $56M. If the 'skins didn't pay him all that money and/or totally change their defensive scheme things might have been very different there. Shawn Nelson. Eron Riley. Isiah Trufant. Be fair. How do those figures stand up compared to the Pats regular defense? It is only since that contract was handed down in Washington. But he still has all that bonus money and just doesn't seem hungry since. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted November 9, 2011 Share Posted November 9, 2011 It is only since that contract was handed down in Washington. But he still has all that bonus money and just doesn't seem hungry since. He may not seem hungry, but he doesn't look like he's missing any meals either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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