TANNENBAUM | SANCHEZ SUPPORTERS

[Darth Vader]

Let me say this right off the bat. I'm PRO-SANCHEZ. Face it - he's a successful QB despite the inept personnel management and OC he's had to deal with.

I see all the reactionary crap about Sanchez and it makes me sick. I'm not going to argue with you about:

1: The interceptions the last several weeks that were result of WRs not "receiving the ball".

2: The constant drops by TEs, WRs, and RBs.

3: Mangold's fumble at the goal line yesterday.

4: D'Brickashaw and Hunter getting eaten alive by JPP, Tuck, Babin and the rest of the Giants and Eagles.

So let me make this unequivocally clear:

The way this team has been constructed falls squarely on ONE GUY. And I love that guy bc he has balls of iron. He takes risks, and they often pan out. He has a different style in terms of drafting - like the Wild West - that leaves us a bit short on depth, but has landed us guys like Revis, Harris, Greene, Sanchez, McKnight, etc. and he is a cap-geek Wiz.

That said, the ONE MAN RESPONSIBLE for the way the team is constructed - and that includes in this case the fact that Schottenheimer was retained when Mangini was cast-off - THAT ONE MAN IS MIKE TANNENBAUM.

YOU PEOPLE are ridiculous for blaming and turning on Mark Sanchez. INSANE. This guy has had different WRs every year, a different starting RB every year. And an OL that was ALLOWED to disintegrate.

The situation for Sanchez this year is not like the situation the first two years.

We don't have a dominant defense.

We don't have a dominant running game.

We don't have a dominant OL - in either run or pass blocking.

We don't have a dominant outside threat at WR.

We don't have a TE that can catch and block, or two that can do either.

Sanchez has done what he has done despite having significantly degraded talent ALL AROUND HIM.

So, let me remind you. It was the decision making of MIKE TANNENBAUM that tooled our personnel.

This goes back to the problem at LG and Alan Faneca, if you all remember. This goes back to the ghost of Bill Bellichik and the hiring of his crony Mangini. And when he was toast, the hiring of Rex Ryan was the antithetical reaction to BB/Mangini.

This is the ghost of Brett Favre and Chad Pennington. This was Sanchez drafted #5 overall in an EPIC trade-up orchestrated by MIKE TANNENBAUM.

You have a problem with Sanchez? What, he's not growing up fast enough for you? Set enough records for you? Not won enough playoff games? You don't like his body language?

MIKE TANNENBAUM.

You love the trade up for Revis. But you hate Mark Sanchez. These are the wages of the game of poker, people. Tannenbaum is fawned over for the trade-up for Revis and Harris. But somehow, it is all Mark Sanchez's fault that the ENTIRE TEAM's PERSONNEL IS WORSE THAN the last two years?

MIKE TANNENBAUM.

People will see what they want to see. A QB that can't be protected can't complete a pass - but somehow it's Sanchez's fault when he gets sacked. A WR that doesn't catch the ball when it hits their hands, or bounces off their facemask - this is somehow now statistically an "interception" and an "incomplete pass". An All-pro Center that snaps the ball into his thigh is now somehow a QB miffed snap.

A QB that is getting destroyed by opponent pass rushes, and that OFTEN is coming off the field battered and limping or bent over. This isn't a QB that is tough, and an OL that JUST SUCKS, with WRs that can't get separation....

It's a franchise QB that let's himself get sacked, destroyed, immolated.

MIKE TANNENBAUM.

I'm on Sanchez's side. I'm on Mike Tannenbaum's side. There's risk in every game. Sometimes you win and sometimes you lose.

The challenge for us is one of measuring reaction. Being analytical, remembering the historical circumstances and the decisions that were made (and by whom, for what reasons?), and being analytical.

You put 2011 Mark Sanchez on the 2009 or 2010 Jets, and we have one or two division titles, one or two Superbowl appearances, one or two Vince Lombardis.

The difference is the cast around him He's not Tom Brady in the middle of his career. He's an early-to-emerging-career QB in a cannibalistic market.

MIKE TANNENBAUM.

[T0mShane]

Clearly, you don't recognize the genius of visiting Plaxico Burress in prison in order to sign him two years later and then building your passing attack around him.

[Kleckineau]

_{Mark Sanchez is Richard Todd with a tan.}

_{Tannenbaum is a good GM. He missed on Sanchez. It happens to the best of them.}

_{Lesson learned?}

_{Stay clear of USC quartebacks. They suck.}

[Darth Vader]

_{Mark Sanchez is Richard Todd with a tan.}

_{Tannenbaum is a good GM. He missed on Sanchez. It happens to the best of them.}

_{Lesson learned?}

_{Stay clear of USC quartebacks. They suck.}

you are crazy. absolutely nuts. you don't draft a QB in the top 5 and then move on after 3 years.

you have to develop your players.

[jetsjetsjetss]

you are crazy. absolutely nuts. you don't draft a QB in the top 5 and then move on after 3 years.

you have to develop your players.

your crazy if you believe that improving on bad is a good strategy. Whole point of drafting in top 5 is for a rook qb that can start now, problem is sanchez will improve on suck. Look at the rookies this year, all putting up good numbers.

[Il Mostro]

... you don't draft a QB in the top 5 and then move on after 3 years.

You do if you are smart enough to realized he is completely inept and then decide to cut your losses.

[Darth Vader]

your crazy if you believe that improving on bad is a good strategy. Whole point of drafting in top 5 is for a rook qb that can start now, problem is sanchez will improve on suck. Look at the rookies this year, all putting up good numbers.

Fine. Then Blame Mike Tannenbaum.

and FWIW the likelihood is great that someone will pick up Mark Sanchez and he will become Drew Brees or Eli.

[dbatesman]

Ah, the old "No one is allowed to judge the QB unless and until he's coached by the finest offensive minds in the game, protected by a top-3 defense, and gets to play with All-Pros at running back, wide receiver, slot receiver, tight end, left tackle, left guard, center, right guard, and right tackle" chestnut. I can't remember if this is Stage II or III of Penningtology.

[Darth Vader]

Ah, the old "No one is allowed to judge the QB unless and until he's coached by the finest offensive minds in the game, protected by a top-3 defense, and gets to play with All-Pros at running back, wide receiver, slot receiver, tight end, left tackle, left guard, center, right guard, and right tackle" chestnut. I can't remember if this is Stage II or III of Penningtology.

what do you blame him for yesterday. serious question.

[Larz]

tanny had a very bad off season, and the jets are inexplicably $8 mill under the cap

I wonder if the $8 mil is intended for super mario or some other purpose

cuz

not upgrading/trading for/signing a RT or safety after week 2 is basically incompetency

even I saw the writing on the wall

hard for me to believe he didn't or bradway or joey or even rex

weird

[Larz]

Ah, the old "No one is allowed to judge the QB unless and until he's coached by the finest offensive minds in the game, protected by a top-3 defense, and gets to play with All-Pros at running back, wide receiver, slot receiver, tight end, left tackle, left guard, center, right guard, and right tackle" chestnut. I can't remember if this is Stage II or III of Penningtology.

I don't think I see many posts around here absolving sanchez or repsonsibility, ignoring his faults, or declaring his greatness

I just see some fans who understand it's a team game, and aren't going to lazily blame one guy

but I think posters like you just like stirring the pot, so who cares really

how about those special teams yesterday ?

[Ghost]

Fortunately, the Jets did not give up anything at all to trade up to grab Sanchez. We made a mistake drafting him.

[Vudu]

Sanchez blows...O-Line blows, Pass rush blows..Offense blows. Jets arent making the playoffs. Time for Rex to STFU and start taking control of the team. His NY honeymoon is over.

[dbatesman]

I don't think I see many posts around here absolving sanchez or repsonsibility, ignoring his faults, or declaring his greatness

YOU PEOPLE are ridiculous for blaming and turning on Mark Sanchez. INSANE. This guy has had different WRs every year, a different starting RB every year. And an OL that was ALLOWED to disintegrate.

.

I just see some fans who understand it's a team game, and aren't going to lazily blame one guy

but I think posters like you just like stirring the pot, so who cares really

Yeah yeah yeah, pseudo-intellectual, stirring the pot, ad hominem ad nauseum, derp. Hunter and Keller are terrible and I won't shed a tear when Schottenheimer's gone. None of those weak links happen to play the most important position on the field. Glad to see we can come full circle and equate recitation of facts with laziness though.

[dbatesman]

what do you blame him for yesterday. serious question.

Being terrible at football.

[jetsjetsjetss]

what do you blame him for yesterday. serious question.

bad pocket pressence. Not making plays (whole offense), dumb throws into triple coverage. MCknight throw? a bunch of other things

[Darth Vader]

tanny had a very bad off season, and the jets are inexplicably $8 mill under the cap

I wonder if the $8 mil is intended for super mario or some other purpose

cuz

not upgrading/trading for/signing a RT or safety after week 2 is basically incompetency

even I saw the writing on the wall

hard for me to believe he didn't or bradway or joey or even rex

weird

what about putting himself in a position to have to choose between edwards and holmes? replacing edwards with plax...letting cotch go and --- signing mason? only to release mason? and replace him with a rookie?

just BAD BAD long-term personnel strategy.

When we got BE mid-season -- we were all like woooo! we finally got a #1 WR downfield threat.

an entire element of our passing game was just lifted away from our offense this year.

[Larz]

.

Yeah yeah yeah, pseudo-intellectual, stirring the pot, ad hominem ad nauseum, derp. Hunter and Keller are terrible and I won't shed a tear when Schottenheimer's gone. None of those weak links happen to play the most important position on the field. Glad to see we can come full circle and equate recitation of facts with laziness though.

pseudo intellectual ? yikes. don't flatter yourself.

nobody is debating the importance of the position either. it's pretty simple really, there are haters, and observers

don't be a hater

[dbatesman]

there are haters, and observers

Can't I be both?

[Lil Bit Special]

I blame everyone. Except Bilal Powell.

[billo83]

tanny had a very bad off season, and the jets are inexplicably $8 mill under the cap

I wonder if the $8 mil is intended for super mario or some other purpose

cuz

not upgrading/trading for/signing a RT or safety after week 2 is basically incompetency

even I saw the writing on the wall

hard for me to believe he didn't or bradway or joey or even rex

weird

I like Tanny, but I must say this one has me baffled. It's almost as though Woody instructed him to save the money to offset the PSL's although I don't want to believe that. It's mind boggling really. That & the fact that he could have kept both Edwards & Holmes & even added Buress.

[JOJOTOWNSELL]

win the game = praise sanchez

lose the game = kill sanchez

pretty simple formula for pretty simple minds.....this site is only an small slice of borderline scary, fanatical Jets fans who will have you believe that they actually understand football.......if they weren't telling us how bad Sanchez sucked they would be waxing poetic on the virtues of C3PO vs Jar Jar Binks.....This guy is a winner, i don't see how anyone wants to bounce him after 3 years......if he was Aaron Rodgers he wouldn't have even started a game yet at this point of his career......

[Il Mostro]

what do you blame him for yesterday. serious question.

Sucking a$$ -- and I am not referring to what he does on his own time.

[Smashmouth]

Let me say this right off the bat. I'm PRO-SANCHEZ. Face it - he's a successful QB despite the inept personnel management and OC he's had to deal with.

I see all the reactionary crap about Sanchez and it makes me sick. I'm not going to argue with you about:

1: The interceptions the last several weeks that were result of WRs not "receiving the ball".

2: The constant drops by TEs, WRs, and RBs.

3: Mangold's fumble at the goal line yesterday.

4: D'Brickashaw and Hunter getting eaten alive by JPP, Tuck, Babin and the rest of the Giants and Eagles.

So let me make this unequivocally clear:

The way this team has been constructed falls squarely on ONE GUY. And I love that guy bc he has balls of iron. He takes risks, and they often pan out. He has a different style in terms of drafting - like the Wild West - that leaves us a bit short on depth, but has landed us guys like Revis, Harris, Greene, Sanchez, McKnight, etc. and he is a cap-geek Wiz.

That said, the ONE MAN RESPONSIBLE for the way the team is constructed - and that includes in this case the fact that Schottenheimer was retained when Mangini was cast-off - THAT ONE MAN IS MIKE TANNENBAUM.

YOU PEOPLE are ridiculous for blaming and turning on Mark Sanchez. INSANE. This guy has had different WRs every year, a different starting RB every year. And an OL that was ALLOWED to disintegrate.

The situation for Sanchez this year is not like the situation the first two years.

We don't have a dominant defense.

We don't have a dominant running game.

We don't have a dominant OL - in either run or pass blocking.

We don't have a dominant outside threat at WR.

We don't have a TE that can catch and block, or two that can do either.

Sanchez has done what he has done despite having significantly degraded talent ALL AROUND HIM.

So, let me remind you. It was the decision making of MIKE TANNENBAUM that tooled our personnel.

This goes back to the problem at LG and Alan Faneca, if you all remember. This goes back to the ghost of Bill Bellichik and the hiring of his crony Mangini. And when he was toast, the hiring of Rex Ryan was the antithetical reaction to BB/Mangini.

This is the ghost of Brett Favre and Chad Pennington. This was Sanchez drafted #5 overall in an EPIC trade-up orchestrated by MIKE TANNENBAUM.

You have a problem with Sanchez? What, he's not growing up fast enough for you? Set enough records for you? Not won enough playoff games? You don't like his body language?

MIKE TANNENBAUM.

You love the trade up for Revis. But you hate Mark Sanchez. These are the wages of the game of poker, people. Tannenbaum is fawned over for the trade-up for Revis and Harris. But somehow, it is all Mark Sanchez's fault that the ENTIRE TEAM's PERSONNEL IS WORSE THAN the last two years?

MIKE TANNENBAUM.

People will see what they want to see. A QB that can't be protected can't complete a pass - but somehow it's Sanchez's fault when he gets sacked. A WR that doesn't catch the ball when it hits their hands, or bounces off their facemask - this is somehow now statistically an "interception" and an "incomplete pass". An All-pro Center that snaps the ball into his thigh is now somehow a QB miffed snap.

A QB that is getting destroyed by opponent pass rushes, and that OFTEN is coming off the field battered and limping or bent over. This isn't a QB that is tough, and an OL that JUST SUCKS, with WRs that can't get separation....

It's a franchise QB that let's himself get sacked, destroyed, immolated.

MIKE TANNENBAUM.

I'm on Sanchez's side. I'm on Mike Tannenbaum's side. There's risk in every game. Sometimes you win and sometimes you lose.

The challenge for us is one of measuring reaction. Being analytical, remembering the historical circumstances and the decisions that were made (and by whom, for what reasons?), and being analytical.

You put 2011 Mark Sanchez on the 2009 or 2010 Jets, and we have one or two division titles, one or two Superbowl appearances, one or two Vince Lombardis.

The difference is the cast around him He's not Tom Brady in the middle of his career. He's an early-to-emerging-career QB in a cannibalistic market.

MIKE TANNENBAUM.

I agree with you but in the Mangini era Tanny was taking orders from Mangini on Presonnel . Mangini wanted to build the O-Line and the D-Line and the core for the team. His philosophy was good and he made some nice draftpicks. When it came to trading up and those type situations and dealing with Cap situations, I would say that was Tanny. In other words Mangini wanted Revis and Tanny traded up and mad it happen.

In the Rex Ryan regime I think Tanny had a little more say in who was actully drafted and honestly the players we have drafted have been nothing special. The players we lost, talking about players who are not in the spotlight like Richardson Woody Hartsock who were all pivotial in the running game are gone and were replaced by guys like Conner, Mulligan, and Hunter and thats laughable when you replace pro bowlers like woody and Rich with what we replaced them with. People wonder why we cant run the ball as we did in the past 2 years and you dont have to go far to find out why.

The way the Jets have handled Sanchez has been the usual NY Jet disgrace. We have changed personnel on him 3 years in a row and in year three we signed a slob in Holmes for 50 Mil which is once again another laughable personnel decision. We did Sign Plax but hes 34 and Im not sure how many years anyone thinks he can give us but he is clearly on the down side of his career. I think SG is a decent RB but hes not one of those types who can take over a game. And hes very inconsistent catching the football.

I keep seeing the Stupid arguement "Oh the Jets have to surround Sanchez with super talent or he cant win" and it really makes me laugh when you look at the talent around the league and compare it to ours. We DO NOT match up with the better offenses and it is a personnel issue. Our Skill players scare NO ONE and its really pretty obvious. Our OC is a moron who cant adjust to whats smacking him right in the face and they constantly put our young QB in horrible situations. HORRIBLE.

Rex is a good motivator, so it seems, but he is not a good head football coach. I think hes a very good defensive coordinator but his ignorance on offense is just plain scary. And Tannys personnel Moves the past few years have been nothing short of Insane leaving money on the table when we had so many glaring weaknesses especially on the O-Line. When your a so called SB contender you Should NEVER leave money on the table. We all talked about the O-Line in preseason and It concerned a lot of posters on this forum. Now granted we did not have the inside scoop and some gave the benifit of the doubt to Tanny and Rex and unfortunately they were wrong and worng in a big time way.

Sometimes Rex reminds me of a fan the way he talks about players its getting old and stupid to be honest.

I dont think Rex should go, I think the Jets should replace Tanny with Charlie Casserly and Let Casserly come in here and rebuild this team around Sanchez and also let him make the choice on the next OC because In no way do I trust Rex to make that call. No way in hell.

Its fine that some disagree on Sanchez but I think he deserves a shot with another OC who has a clue. Hes too young to give up on and I think a big part of the problem is our inept offensive staff.

[ZachEY]

what do you blame him for yesterday. serious question.

General ineptitude?

[ZachEY]

You have a problem with Sanchez? What, he's not growing up fast enough for you? Set enough records for you? Not won enough playoff games? You don't like his body language?

Actually, it's none of those.

It's his inaccuracy, his lack of poise, how bad he is under any pressure, his holding onto the football too long, his inability to protect the football, his struggles to go through his progressions, his lack overall lack of vision on the field, his head scratching interceptions, and how he seems to be lost out there when the strategy isn't to hide him or the game situation dictates that you can't.

[Matt39]

We literally can't complete passes longer than 7 yards. We have to be last in the NFL in plays over 20 yards. The entire offense needs to be blown up starting with Sanchez. The jets have been so god damn borin g on offense the last 10 years or so. Plax is totally finished, Holmes isn't that good, Keller is an embarrassment and wil be gone next year. Kerley looks somewhat promising as a slot I guess.

[GimmeShelter]

I don't think I see many posts around here absolving sanchez or repsonsibility, ignoring his faults, or declaring his greatness

I just see some fans who understand it's a team game, and aren't going to lazily blame one guy

but I think posters like you just like stirring the pot, so who cares really

how about those special teams yesterday ?

As always spot on.

Some posters need a center piece to place their blame on when things go wrong and fail to see the entire picture. No QB plays well when constantly pressured and young ones such as Sanchez do even worse because the game is still too fast for them. We were in Eli's face the majority of the game yesterday and he was a horrendous 9-27. Sanchez has been beaten up the majority of the season but the agenda guys say he has poor pocket presence or holds onto the ball too long.

Plenty of Giants fans called the Eli draft day trade a huge mistake until he won a SB. His SB year he had 23 TD's and 20 INT's and did not complete 60% of his passes until the next season...year # 5 of his career. (Numbers many kill Sanchez over). Last year he had 25 picks and Giants fans wanted his head once again. This year he gets some MVP talk. His YPG numbers were also similiar to Sanchez's early in his career.

Sanchez may very well turn out to not be starting QB caliber but he deserves the same growing pains that Eli and many other QB's were allowed. Some fans would rather judge him as early as possible as they'd much rather be a "I told you so" guy than actually see the entire team picture when it comes to failure.

[T0mShane]

As always spot on.

Some posters need a center piece to place their blame on when things go wrong and fail to see the entire picture. No QB plays well when constantly pressured and young ones such as Sanchez do even worse because the game is still too fast for them. We were in Eli's face the majority of the game yesterday and he was a horrendous 9-27. Sanchez has been beaten up the majority of the season but the agenda guys say he has poor pocket presence or holds onto the ball too long.

Plenty of Giants fans called the Eli draft day trade a huge mistake until he won a SB. His SB year he had 23 TD's and 20 INT's and did not complete 60% of his passes until the next season...year # 5 of his career. (Numbers many kill Sanchez over). Last year he had 25 picks and Giants fans wanted his head once again. This year he gets some MVP talk. His YPG numbers were also similiar to Sanchez's early in his career.

Sanchez may very well turn out to not be starting QB caliber but he deserves the same growing pains that Eli and many other QB's were allowed. Some fans would rather judge him as early as possible as they'd much rather be a "I told you so" guy than actually see the entire team picture when it comes to failure.

In order for the Jets to take the leap into being serious contenders, Sanchez's development was the missing piece. Fair or not, he was the one guy who could have elevated the entire franchise and it didn't happen. So, he didn't take the leap, the organization as a whole looks like it's going backwards, and the quarterback gets the beating for that. That's why they get the big bucks.

[GimmeShelter]

In order for the Jets to take the leap into being serious contenders, Sanchez's development was the missing piece. Fair or not, he was the one guy who could have elevated the entire franchise and it didn't happen. So, he didn't take the leap, the organization as a whole looks like it's going backwards, and the quarterback gets the beating for that. That's why they get the big bucks.

Agree with you completely. Just not ready to close the book on him. Tell me which other unit on the team got better this year since Sanchez is the issue? Which one? Special teams?? Defense??? Running game??? Offensive Line???

[T0mShane]

Agree with you completely. Just not ready to close the book on him. Tell me which other unit on the team got better this year since Sanchez is the issue? Which one? Special teams?? Defense??? Running game??? Offensive Line???

I hear you. I just think the mass psychological feeling that's running rampant through Jets Nation right now is that the franchise missed the bus again. That anxiety causes us to see Sanchez as another Pennington or O'Brien; Rex as another Mangini or Edwards. That's what 40+ years of wheel-spinning does to a fanbase.

[Lil Bit Special]

win the game = praise sanchez

This guy is a winner, i don't see how anyone wants to bounce him after 3 years......if he was Aaron Rodgers he wouldn't have even started a game yet at this point of his career......

He's not a winner. He's an average QB.

[RutgersJetFan]

Yeah yeah yeah, pseudo-intellectual, stirring the pot, ad hominem ad nauseum, derp. Hunter and Keller are terrible and I won't shed a tear when Schottenheimer's gone. None of those weak links happen to play the most important position on the field. Glad to see we can come full circle and equate recitation of facts with laziness though.

Oh man. This. A thousand times this.

[Kleckineau]

I hear you. I just think the mass psychological feeling that's running rampant through Jets Nation right now is that the franchise missed the bus again. That anxiety causes us to see Sanchez as another Pennington or O'Brien; Rex as another Mangini or Edwards. That's what 40+ years of wheel-spinning does to a fanbase.

T0m, Sanchez will never be 1/2 the player Kenny O was.

[ylekram]

T0m, Sanchez will never be 1/2 the player Kenny O was.

how do you know!! you dont. i happen to disagree. just for the record,i grew up liking o,brien,thought he was good,and thought he got a bad wrap. you dudes giving up on sanchez in his limited career is unreal