Is Tannenbaum the Problem??

[TheSage]

Many of the posters here are quick to blame Tannenbaum but is he really the problem? He manages the cap and seems to have done that well, makes the call for the picks but is he the talent evaluater or does he merely makes the picks and deals based upon the judgment of the football staff? We know Rex is all defense with an occasional offensive thought and the picks seem to have that trend as well.

Quite frankly, I dont see him as one to override the football staff evaluations, wants and desires.

[SoFlaJets]

I'd give him about half of the blame of which there seems to be a lot of to go around

[Pac]

the problem is overreacting ninnies who are readly to declare the season lost before it's even started.

I can't ever remember it being this bad.

[yuvabuv]

He has neglected the glaring O line problem that was the death of the jets last year. he has made some questionable picks (gholston, Vlad, kyle wilson?). and he trades away valuable picks for FA's, and then overpays them. He was on the right track for "building" a team in the 06/07 drafts, but he does not seem interested in that anymore.

[stoicsentry]

the problem is overreacting ninnies who are readly to declare the season lost before it's even started.

I can't ever remember it being this bad.

We were 8-8 last season, coming off two years of AFC Championship Game appearances. It has never been this bad! Sky is falling!!!

[Ranick10]

Well, he overpaid on the Holmes and Sanchez extensions. Neither of them are worth near what they're getting paid. He tried to at least partially address the O-Line problem with Otah, which unfortunately backfired. He traded up to take Stephen Hill whose worth remains to be seen. So yeah, I guess in my mind he has some partial blame.

[Jetsfan80]

We know Rex is all defense with an occasional offensive thought and the picks seem to have that trend as well.

This is pure and utter bullsh*t. See below:

2009

Round 1, 5th pick: Mark Sanchez, QB, USC (traded up from 17)

Round 3, 227th pick: Shonn Green, RB, Iowa (traded up)

Round 6, 193rd pick: Matt Slauson, OG, Nebraska

2010

Round 1, 29th pick: Kyle Wilson, CB, Boise St.

Round 2, 61st pick: Vlad Ducasse, OT, UMASS

Round 4, 112th pick: Joe McKnight, RB, USC (traded up)

Round 5, 139th pick: John Conner, FB, Kentucky -- 100 % Rex pick

2011

Round 1, 30th pick: Muhammad Wilkerson, DE, Temple

Round 3, 94th pick: Kenrick Ellis, DT, Hampton

Round 4, 126th pick: Bilal Powell, RB, Louisville

Round 5, 153rd pick: Jeremy Kerley, WR, TCU (traded up)

Round 7, 208th pick: Greg McElroy, QB, Alabama

Round 7, 227th pick: Scotty McKnight, WR, Colorado

2012

Round 1, 16th pick: Quinton Coples, DE, UNC

Round 2, 43rd pick: Stephen Hill, WR, Georgia Tech (traded up)

Round 3, 77th pick: Demario Davis, LB, Arkansas St.

Round 6, 187th pick: Josh Bush, S, Wake Forest

Round 6, 202nd pick: Terrance Ganaway, RB, Baylor

Round 6, 203rd pick: Robert Griffin, G, Baylor

Round 7, 242nd pick: Antonio Allen, S, South Carolina

Round 7, 244th pick: Jordan White, WR, Western Michigan

21 Total Picks: 14 offense, 7 defense

FOUR times, you'll notice, the Jets have traded up to take a player on offense they really like. That hasn't happened yet on the defensive side of the ball.

What are we supposed to do; keep investing picks on offense and hope Sanchez somehow figures it out? If the very first pick of the Rex era had worked out like its supposed to, and we'd gotten a franchise QB, we wouldn't have needed to draft 13 offensive players out of the next 20.

Not to mention, its looking like Rex has hit homeruns on just about all of his picks on defense. What offensive players would you have preferred to take in the spots we were in that would have been significantly better than Wilson, Wilkerson, Ellis, Coples, Davis, and the safeties?

[faba]

He is responsible for putting together the team to navigate the salary cap so he has to take blame-how much you want to give is up to you

[slats]

He has neglected the glaring O line problem that was the death of the jets last year. he has made some questionable picks (gholston, Vlad, kyle wilson?). and he trades away valuable picks for FA's [sic], and then overpays them. He was on the right track for "building" a team in the 06/07 drafts, but he does not seem interested in that anymore.

The bold is his biggest crime.

He's reactionary rather than proactive much of the time. Oh, we're a little weak at WR? Lets trade a 3rd and a 5th for Braylon Edwards! He trades away way too many picks in general. A fourth for Tebow, a 4th and a 6th for Shonn Greene, trade ups for Keller, Harris, Kellen Clemens, Revis (that one worked out), etc. A 3rd and a 5th for Jenkins, a fifth and a big contract for Holmes.

The lack of depth, or even starting talent, on the OL or LBs can be directly attributed to the trading away of all those picks.

What's funny is that I think a lot of fans would applaud the guy if he managed to trade away a couple future picks again if it meant getting a new starter at RT right now. But that's no way to build a team. Not for the long haul.

I'm not overly impressed with his cap management, either. His bloated deals for Pace and Scott continue to hurt, this penchant for guaranteeing deals in lieu of bonuses is also stifling. And the extension for Sanchez makes no sense at all.

[Jetsfan80]

If Tannenbaum gets fired, it will be because of two reasons and two reasons only:

1) Trading up to take Mark Sanchez in 2009.

2) Handing Mark Sanchez a contract extension in 2012.

[Thor99]

and he trades away valuable picks for FA's

He should definitely get fired for this. Usually GM's just have to sign FA's.

[Jetsfan80]

Man, imagine where we'd be had we brought back Favre in 2009 then snagged, say, Christian Ponder in the 2011 draft. Maybe have a ring AND a real franchise QB.

But alas, we're the Jets.

[Pac]

We were 8-8 last season, coming off two years of AFC Championship Game appearances. It has never been this bad! Sky is falling!!!

Sanchez very well may suck again this year (I don't think he will) but without more than 1.8 seconds to make a throw we'll never know. Remove 3 of the top 4 targets for any middle of the road QB and put Wayne Hunter on their line and see what happens. How people can watch that jailbreak and blame Sanchez is mind boggling.

[THE ILK]

Wayne Hunter is the problem, so yes.

[FloridaJetsFan]

Wayne Hunter is the problem, so yes.

Ahh ... another Wayne Hunter thread!!!! I approve!

[Smashmouth]

Tannenbaum is a freakin capologist. He is NOT an NFL GM and he never will be. The guy who built the core of this football team was Eric Mangini . He may not have been a good coach but he certainly understood how to build a team and bring in smart players who had good attitudes, were multi talented, and could contribute in many areas. Look at the crop of players this current FO has brought in. Have you heard some of these guys talk in interviews ? They sound like a bunch of Idiots. Ths team has lost its identity in 3 short years and Tanny should not take all that blame, the scouts, the coachs, and the owner, all play a part.

None of us really know what goes on behind closed doors but you have to be an idiot to think Woody Johnson did not have a say in the Tebow Trade. You add up Tebow and Wayne Hunter and Vlad Ducasse and you easily have the money to sign Eric Winston and solidify the offensive line.. Rex claims to be Ground and Pound. All we have seen is them get Pounded.

Most teams that want to pass the football go out and get WR's and solidify their O-Lines focus on pass protection and scoring points. The Jets on the other hand claim to be a running team yet have garbage in the backfield and an OL that is a shell of its former self after losing two key contributors. D-Brick no matter how you slice it is over rated and making a huge salary but in is defense he basicly plays next to a JAG. Either way double digit sacks is inexcusable and we had it from both the Right and Left Tackles last year yet we expect a QB whos trying to break out to be able to deal with that ?

With all these needs and holes The Jets decide to Draft a Defensive Lineman who very well may be a damn good player but most people felt in a 3-4 system the Jets were just fine depth wise on the DL. So why did we use our first pick on defense when we always seem to play well on defense and a lot of the blame as to why they get winded in the 4th quarter of games was all the 3 and outs by the offense ? Why not Draft a Decastro and Sign Winston like I explained in the first paragraph and solidify what you claim to be your freakin teams Identity ??

Some peole here may not agree with the Ground and Pound philosophy, but weather you do or you dont, its what our coach wants to do so why on earth have we ignored the line and the RB's on this football team ? We lost LT last year, he was meh and at the end of his career but do any of you think we have a back capable of replacing him as a receiver out of the back field ? Can any of our RB's like Joe ****ing McKnight pick up blitzing LB's and Safties ? Powell certainly has shown he cant as well as McKnight so WTF ? Greene has potential to be a decent back but hes always dealing with nagging injuries.

How did the Jets deal with the WR problem ? They signed a player whos always hurt and drafted a player in Hill who could very well be a crap shoot. That being said, Im ok with Hill, I think he can be the real deal but what happens after that ? Holmes needs someone who can open things up on the other side of the field, if that does not happen he will be shut down just like last year.

Are all these issues the sign of a good GM ? Is Rex Ryan and offensive Idiot ? Is the Owner getting too involved and thats the reason he didnt go after a strong minded GM like Casserly ? These are the questions we must ask this team but we will never get the real answer. I think this team is heading for failure and by failure I mean they wont make the playoffs and it will get worse every comming year. This team has been turned into a circus, the Same type of circus Bill Parcells rescued us from in the mid 90's . Get ready the worst is yet to come.

[JustInFudge]

If Tannenbaum gets fired, it will be because of two reasons and two reasons only:

1) Trading up to take Mark Sanchez in 2009.

2) Handing Mark Sanchez a contract extension in 2012.

This...if Mark Sanchez was at the very least, Matt Ryan - Tanny would be largely a success.

QB QB QB - he's tried multiple times, many different ways and it just hasnt worked out. Sucks. Damn shame. This team is really F'ing good outside of that position...and RT.

[Matt39]

The best players Tanny brought in on offense were from other teams. The talent on that side of the ball is just so bad its hard to even care. What exactly is the Jets philosophy on offense when the ground and pound yields four straight 3 and outs in the Buffalo game?

[Smashmouth]

Sanchez very well may suck again this year (I don't think he will) but without more than 1.8 seconds to make a throw we'll never know. Remove 3 of the top 4 targets for any middle of the road QB and put Wayne Hunter on their line and see what happens. How people can watch that jailbreak and blame Sanchez is mind boggling.

what many seem to forget is Brick gave up one less sack than Hunter last year. So how bad can it actully get ?

[Smashmouth]

This...if Mark Sanchez was at the very least, Matt Ryan - Tanny would be largely a success.

QB QB QB - he's tried multiple times, many different ways and it just hasnt worked out. Sucks. Damn shame. This team is really F'ing good outside of that position...and RT.

Yah because ll NFL QB's do well when getting raped on a regular basis. Brady and Rodgers didreal well last year in the playoffs and SB under the Pressure of the Giants DL and they didnt face anything remotely close to what happened Saturday Night.

And DONT claim Im comparing Brady and Rodgers to Sanchez ....Pressure is Pressure no matter how you slice it no QB does good in that situation

[JustInFudge]

Yah because ll NFL QB's do well when getting raped on a regular basis. Brady and Rodgers didreal well last year in the playoffs and SB under the Pressure of the Giants DL and they didnt face anything remotely close to what happened Saturday Night.

And DONT claim Im comparing Brady and Rodgers to Sanchez ....Pressure is Pressure no matter how you slice it no QB does good in that situation

What does that have to do with Tanny missing on every QB he's tried to bring in? This isnt about 1 preseason game. lmfao

[HDKostempski]

The bold is his biggest crime.

He's reactionary rather than proactive much of the time. Oh, we're a little weak at WR? Lets trade a 3rd and a 5th for Braylon Edwards! He trades away way too many picks in general. A fourth for Tebow, a 4th and a 6th for Shonn Greene, trade ups for Keller, Harris, Kellen Clemens, Revis (that one worked out), etc. A 3rd and a 5th for Jenkins, a fifth and a big contract for Holmes.

The lack of depth, or even starting talent, on the OL or LBs can be directly attributed to the trading away of all those picks.

What's funny is that I think a lot of fans would applaud the guy if he managed to trade away a couple future picks again if it meant getting a new starter at RT right now. But that's no way to build a team. Not for the long haul.

I'm not overly impressed with his cap management, either. His bloated deals for Pace and Scott continue to hurt, this penchant for guaranteeing deals in lieu of bonuses is also stifling. And the extension for Sanchez makes no sense at all.

Tannenbaum's cap management is so good that the Jets couldn't afford to bring in any mid-shelf FAs this past off-season, much less top-shelf performers. They also can't afford to trade or cut a trouble-maker like Holmes because of his contract. Plus, it's likely that the Jets will continue to have difficulty signing FAs in the future as the cap is projected to be relatively flat for the next few years.

That does NOT strike me as particularly impressive, either.

[Jetsfan80]

Yah because ll NFL QB's do well when getting raped on a regular basis.

Sanchez plays a part in the "getting raped" (a notion which has, categorically, been proven to be incorrect. He was pressured at an average level by NFL standards last year). Guy can't make a pre-snap read to save his life. So much of the reason why great QB's don't get hit is because they understand what defenses are trying to do. Half of a QB's job happens before the ball is snapped.

And when Sanchez DOES get time, you'll notice he holds the ball......holds it......hoooooolllllds it. This is because he either doesn't see open receivers, or he doesn't have the confidence to make the throw when its there. Countless fans and some analysts have reported from games that they see receivers open with enough space that a QB could reasonably be expected to make the throw......yet he doesn't do it, time and time again. That will lead to sacks that are 0 % on the offensive line.

Eli Manning won a Super Bowl last year behind a pretty pedestrian offensive line with a crappy RT. Why can't Sanchez?

[T0mShane]

What is the job of a General Manager?

[Bugg]

Tannenbaum is a freakin capologist. He is NOT an NFL GM and he never will be. The guy who built the core of this football team was Eric Mangini . He may not have been a good coach but he certainly understood how to build a team and bring in smart players who had good attitudes, were multi talented, and could contribute in many areas. Look at the crop of players this current FO has brought in. Have you heard some of these guys talk in interviews ? They sound like a bunch of Idiots. Ths team has lost its identity in 3 short years and Tanny should not take all that blame, the scouts, the coachs, and the owner, all play a part.

None of us really know what goes on behind closed doors but you have to be an idiot to think Woody Johnson did not have a say in the Tebow Trade. You add up Tebow and Wayne Hunter and Vlad Ducasse and you easily have the money to sign Eric Winston and solidify the offensive line.. Rex claims to be Ground and Pound. All we have seen is them get Pounded.

Most teams that want to pass the football go out and get WR's and solidify their O-Lines focus on pass protection and scoring points. The Jets on the other hand claim to be a running team yet have garbage in the backfield and an OL that is a shell of its former self after losing two key contributors. D-Brick no matter how you slice it is over rated and making a huge salary but in is defense he basicly plays next to a JAG. Either way double digit sacks is inexcusable and we had it from both the Right and Left Tackles last year yet we expect a QB whos trying to break out to be able to deal with that ?

With all these needs and holes The Jets decide to Draft a Defensive Lineman who very well may be a damn good player but most people felt in a 3-4 system the Jets were just fine depth wise on the DL. So why did we use our first pick on defense when we always seem to play well on defense and a lot of the blame as to why they get winded in the 4th quarter of games was all the 3 and outs by the offense ? Why not Draft a Decastro and Sign Winston like I explained in the first paragraph and solidify what you claim to be your freakin teams Identity ??

Some peole here may not agree with the Ground and Pound philosophy, but weather you do or you dont, its what our coach wants to do so why on earth have we ignored the line and the RB's on this football team ? We lost LT last year, he was meh and at the end of his career but do any of you think we have a back capable of replacing him as a receiver out of the back field ? Can any of our RB's like Joe ****ing McKnight pick up blitzing LB's and Safties ? Powell certainly has shown he cant as well as McKnight so WTF ? Greene has potential to be a decent back but hes always dealing with nagging injuries.

How did the Jets deal with the WR problem ? They signed a player whos always hurt and drafted a player in Hill who could very well be a crap shoot. That being said, Im ok with Hill, I think he can be the real deal but what happens after that ? Holmes needs someone who can open things up on the other side of the field, if that does not happen he will be shut down just like last year.

Are all these issues the sign of a good GM ? Is Rex Ryan and offensive Idiot ? Is the Owner getting too involved and thats the reason he didnt go after a strong minded GM like Casserly ? These are the questions we must ask this team but we will never get the real answer. I think this team is heading for failure and by failure I mean they wont make the playoffs and it will get worse every comming year. This team has been turned into a circus, the Same type of circus Bill Parcells rescued us from in the mid 90's . Get ready the worst is yet to come.

Don't agree with all of this. But truth here is if you really want to ground and pound you have big, nasty OL, big serious-blocking TEs and hard-charging RBs who beat up the other team's front 7. Line up 11 guys, pound their 11 and advance the ball brutally play after play. In that scheme, again, the jets' stated philosophy, Tebow might even make a world of sense. The WRs, if that is your scheme, your identity, are basically an afterthought. Instead we have 3/5s of an OL, no legit TEs to speak of, and below average RBs. Add in a QB who clearly sucks, and we have the makings for s disaster. I don't know how the FO and CS looked at this OL, the RBs and the complete lack of decent blocking TEs and keep talking gibberish. They haven't scored a TD in 2 preseason 2nd halves playing against a bunch of guys who will be ending bar and selling insurance in September.

[Bugg]

What is the job of a General Manager?

Personnel and finance.Scout talent, manage the cap and draft, plan for the future of the franchise.

Again, I want to know that who ever recommended Dukie-asse to be drafted in the round 2 and somehow ignored Victor Cruz 15 feet to Dukie-asse's left at Umass has been fired. Especially if it was our Umass alum GM.

[bitonti]

somehow ignored Victor Cruz

if Victor Cruz was on the Jets, his career would have been over by now.

quarterbacks make their WR. Put Cruz on this team he'd be just another young guy who isn't getting the ball

[Bugg]

if Victor Cruz was on the Jets, his career would have been over by now.

quarterbacks make their WR. Put Cruz on this team he'd be just another young guy who isn't getting the ball

I know you are a astute observer of NFL talent. But that kind of speed with decent hands is simply too good to ignore.Might not be nearly as successful because the Jets QB is not nearly s good as Eli.

[Lizard King]

Tannenbaum's cap management is so good that the Jets couldn't afford to bring in any mid-shelf FAs this past off-season, much less top-shelf performers. They also can't afford to trade or cut a trouble-maker like Holmes because of his contract. Plus, it's likely that the Jets will continue to have difficulty signing FAs in the future as the cap is projected to be relatively flat for the next few years.

That does NOT strike me as particularly impressive, either.

Agreed but It starts at the tippetty top- Woody. His $$ and he is giving the ok on everything. Holmes is a Super Bowl MVP? Ok throw him a ton of money and print those jerseys and make sure to announce it before every home game. Then our capologist/"GM" has to make the rest work.

Then Tannenbaum has a laundry list of moves that in the draft alone have been a complete bust, refer to JF80's post which is enough to make you cry thinking of the talent the last three years alone we've missed. Connecting dots earlier you basically see that Tanny gives his staff ie Rex major say in the picks...and who can forget the Cimini war room article, they looked like it was a fukkin board meeting. It's the blind leading the blind over there on offense. No Sporano reference intended.

This is simplistic but I'm working right now.

[bitonti]

I know you are a astute observer of NFL talent. But that kind of speed with decent hands is simply too good to ignore.Might not be nearly as successful because the Jets QB is not nearly s good as Eli.

Mark screwed Santonio last year, who was often wide open. Why do we assume he'd find Cruz? Here's a question when's the last time Mark threw a pass downfield? Was it 2010? The dude is captain checkdown after 5 or 6 seconds of not making a decision.

[Matt39]

if Victor Cruz was on the Jets, his career would have been over by now.

no, no, no

[Lizard King]

Mark screwed Santonio last year, who was often wide open. Why do we assume he'd find Cruz? Here's a question when's the last time Mark threw a pass downfield? Was it 2010? The dude is captain checkdown after 5 or 6 seconds of not making a decision.

He got some nice balls to Braylon though. How else can you describe that besides having better protection?

[bitonti]

no, no, no

here's another one if Aaron Rodgers were on the Jets no way he sits 4 seasons. He gets thrown out there and who knows what his career is like at this point.

everyone assumes that if one player was great for one team he'd be great for another. We really have no way of knowing.

[Matt39]

here's another one if Aaron Rodgers were on the Jets no way he sits 4 seasons. He gets thrown out there and who knows what his career is like at this point.

everyone assumes that if one player was great for one team he'd be great for another. We really have no way of knowing.

you just went from Cruz would be out of the league to not knowing what he would be.

if Gholston were drafted by the Giants he'd still be out of the league. Talent gets on the field. There's a reason Barden hasnt been made to look like an all pro with Eli. He stinks. Cruz can play.

[ZachEY]

Sanchez very well may suck again this year (I don't think he will) but without more than 1.8 seconds to make a throw we'll never know. Remove 3 of the top 4 targets for any middle of the road QB and put Wayne Hunter on their line and see what happens. How people can watch that jailbreak and blame Sanchez is mind boggling.

Having a bad Right Tackle and a bad QB are not mutually exclusive. Sanchez had plenty of time to throw that pick six, just as we saw far too often last year. He's the worst QB in the league under pressure and led the league in sacks where he had over 4 seconds to throw.

Tannenbaum AND Sanchez are the two worst things going for this organization. Wayne Hunter is 3rd, but he's in that position as a direct result of Tannenbaum's incredible blunders with regard to the position.