Conservative game plan and Cro sealed the Jets's fate

[RSJ]

When they win: "Rex is amazing, holding this team together by sheer force of will!"

When they lose: "The quarterback sucks."

 

I guess when you only score 6 points, throw two red zone int's and miss a wide open WR for 6 points, that is going to happen?

[BP]

When they win: "Rex is amazing, holding this team together by sheer force of will!"

When they lose: "The quarterback sucks."

also when they lose =  the GM sucks and we have no talent

 

Cant add much to when they win. Rex = Moses

[RSJ]

also when they lose =  the GM sucks and we have no talent

 

Cant add much to when they win. Rex = Moses

 

You do know that Kellen Winslow leads this team in receiving, right?

[BP]

I guess when you only score 6 points, throw two red zone int's and miss a wide open WR for 6 points, that is going to happen?

They played classic ''not to lose'' football today. Rex didnt always coach like this.

 

I remember Sanchez's first year at home against the Pats the Jets were behind at halftime and Rex said we will come out in the 3rd quarter and attack. and that's what they did, in 2009 of course.

[RSJ]

They played classic ''not to lose'' football today. Rex didnt always coach like this.

 

I remember Sanchez's first year at home against the Pats the Jets were behind at halftime and Rex said we will come out in the 3rd quarter and attack. and that's what they did, in 2009 of course.

 

Honestly though, do you think this team has talent on offense right now? Does it have more or less than 2009? I would take 2009 Cotchery over ANYONE on this offense right now.

[BP]

You do know that Kellen Winslow leads this team in receiving, right?

So then you don't play predictable on offense. also, there was no sense of urgency when they were on offense down 13 points with 6 minutes left in the game. thats not on our sh*tty players.

[joewilly12]

The play calling was horrendous and cro sucked ass today yes I agree.

[BP]

Honestly though, do you think this team has talent on offense right now? Does it have more or less than 2009? I would take 2009 Cotchery over ANYONE on this offense right now.

Oh yeah, less talent than 2009. but what about Monday night? the offense was lighting it up? now they suck?

[RSJ]

So then you don't play predictable on offense. also, there was no sense of urgency when they were on offense down 13 points with 6 minutes left in the game. thats not on our sh*tty players.

 

They really just couldnt get anything going on offense. Again, I'm going to ask you. Does this offense have talent? I'm watching the Saints game and clearly Ivory was a product of a great OL in NO. Powell is decent - but nothing special. Hill is a deep threat and thats it. Kerley is a good slot. Gates sucks, Cumberland is decent and Geno is totally hot and cold.

[Matt39]

They really just couldnt get anything going on offense. Again, I'm going to ask you. Does this offense have talent? I'm watching the Saints game and clearly Ivory was a product of a great OL in NO. Powell is decent - but nothing special. Hill is a deep threat and thats it. Kerley is a good slot. Gates sucks, Cumberland is decent and Geno is totally hot and cold.

 

Ivory needs to get the ball more....he's the only guy who can score from anywhere that we have.

[RSJ]

Oh yeah, less talent than 2009. but what about Monday night? the offense was lighting it up? now they suck?

 

 

Atlanta's defense is bad, like really bad. It was still a tough win and quality for a rookie QB on the road. Still, I cant help but think that this is what Sanchez would look like in 2009 if they never traded for Braylon.

[RSJ]

Ivory needs to get the ball more....he's the only guy who can score from anywhere that we have.

 

Maybe so, but they need a quality WR. Nicks or someone like him would do wonders for this offense.

[BP]

They really just couldnt get anything going on offense. Again, I'm going to ask you. Does this offense have talent? I'm watching the Saints game and clearly Ivory was a product of a great OL in NO. Powell is decent - but nothing special. Hill is a deep threat and thats it. Kerley is a good slot. Gates sucks, Cumberland is decent and Geno is totally hot and cold.

I answered your question already. no, they don't have much talent on offense other than a good offensive line (which is a start).

[ECURB]

Geno missing hill for the long td lost the game.

[sirlancemehlot]

Geno missing hill for the long td lost the game.

This. Also leaving a minimum six points on the field with two red zone ints. Weird how many excuses folks are making for the kid. He lost the game single-handedly. Missed a lot of receivers by throwing short, long and behind them. Better receivers still don't catch those balls. The passes were late and off target. That's it. That's what happened. End of story.

[T0mShane]

This. Also leaving a minimum six points on the field with two red zone ints. Weird how many excuses folks are making for the kid. He lost the game single-handedly. Missed a lot of receivers by throwing short, long and behind them. Better receivers still don't catch those balls. The passes were late and off target. That's it. That's what happened. End of story.

I think the fact that the Steelers have a better team is what won them the game.

[HessStation]

This. Also leaving a minimum six points on the field with two red zone ints. Weird how many excuses folks are making for the kid. He lost the game single-handedly. Missed a lot of receivers by throwing short, long and behind them. Better receivers still don't catch those balls. The passes were late and off target. That's it. That's what happened. End of story.

Geno had a bad game. No excuses. Only to the jackasses that want to claim he sucks again and will never be good.

[HessStation]

I think the fact that the Steelers have a better team is what won them the game.

Def this.

[faba]

Steelers record of 0 and 4 was misleading they have talent and good coaches. Geno had a bad game- do not blame him solely for the loss-that is ridiculous

[Smashmouth]

Ivory needs to get the ball more....he's the only guy who can score from anywhere that we have.

 

then we need to let Geno dump the ball to his backs more before he starts slinging the ball down field. Establish the run, dump the ball off, then attack with playaction, we have the backs to do it and I think it will open up the field and take the pressure off the young QB.

[Sperm Edwards]

Smith had a terrible game and we scored 6 points.  I still like Smith, but he threw the game in the toilet.  Getting picked off in the red zone does more than just take points off the board.  He also missed open guys.  It DOES affect playcalling, and it SHOULD.  Smith had a sh*t game.

 

I don't get the argument that if Rex is the HC (or the de facto DC) that the defense has to hold the other team to under 10 points or he should be fired.  The way the game looked from the TV, his guys were in position & just got beat.  Last week they dropped a couple of interceptions. Week before that the best run of the day was one that was stuffed & Jackson just stuck with the play & made something of it.  Well he's a good RB & it happens.  The coach can only put the players in the position to make a play, which the coaches did in all of those situations. Just like yesterday where there were a bunch of wide open receivers, as designed by the offensive coaches.  At that point it's up to Smith to hit the open receivers (and the receivers to catch the ball if he does).

 

Smith's interceptions and the missed long TD (not to mention not hitting or seeing other open receivers for 1st downs in between & along the way) took gobs of points off the board.  He's a rookie & it'll happen.  It's clear he still doesn't see the whole field yet.  Whether he does eventually - or shows signs that he will eventually - is what the team needs to find out prior to the draft.  

 

These receivers do suck, but I said the same thing with Sanchez: the notion that no one is open all day long is made-up nonsense written by excuse-makers who wish to absolve the QB of all blame.  Comments from sirlancemehlot (who was giving game accounts of the field) aside, we could all some key ones they did show on TV.  The only way to blame the receivers is if Smith (or Sanchez before him) was hitting guys in the chest and the ball is bouncing off chests or facemasks or hands.  Sometimes everyone really is covered, but overall that is not the story of yesterday's game.  Smith probably cost the team 3 TDs, not counting other drives that would have been kept alive by seeing/hitting open receivers.  Pittsburgh's defense isn't all that, and saying that they have a HOF DC makes it sound like they're better than they are (or better than they were yesterday).

 

If we had a QB on his game yesterday, we'd have won by plenty.  Even with Cro getting beat like a slow, clueless, talentless rookie; even with a gameplan that's getting nitpicked after the fact; even with the lack of name-players at receiving positions; a QB who saw and hit open receivers gets us 24-30 points yesterday and we walk away with the win.

 

[T0mShane]

Smith had a terrible game and we scored 6 points.  I still like Smith, but he threw the game in the toilet.  Getting picked off in the red zone does more than just take points off the board.  He also missed open guys.  It DOES affect playcalling, and it SHOULD.  Smith had a sh*t game.

 

I don't get the argument that if Rex is the HC (or the de facto DC) that the defense has to hold the other team to under 10 points or he should be fired.  The way the game looked from the TV, his guys were in position & just got beat.  Last week they dropped a couple of interceptions. Week before that the best run of the day was one that was stuffed & Jackson just stuck with the play & made something of it.  Well he's a good RB & it happens.  The coach can only put the players in the position to make a play, which the coaches did in all of those situations. Just like yesterday where there were a bunch of wide open receivers, as designed by the offensive coaches.  At that point it's up to Smith to hit the open receivers (and the receivers to catch the ball if he does).

 

Smith's interceptions and the missed long TD (not to mention not hitting or seeing other open receivers for 1st downs in between & along the way) took gobs of points off the board.  He's a rookie & it'll happen.  It's clear he still doesn't see the whole field yet.  Whether he does eventually - or shows signs that he will eventually - is what the team needs to find out prior to the draft.  

 

These receivers do suck, but I said the same thing with Sanchez: the notion that no one is open all day long is made-up nonsense written by excuse-makers who wish to absolve the QB of all blame.  Comments from sirlancemehlot (who was giving game accounts of the field) aside, we could all some key ones they did show on TV.  The only way to blame the receivers is if Smith (or Sanchez before him) was hitting guys in the chest and the ball is bouncing off chests or facemasks or hands.  Sometimes everyone really is covered, but overall that is not the story of yesterday's game.  Smith probably cost the team 3 TDs, not counting other drives that would have been kept alive by seeing/hitting open receivers.  Pittsburgh's defense isn't all that, and saying that they have a HOF DC makes it sound like they're better than they are (or better than they were yesterday).

 

If we had a QB on his game yesterday, we'd have won by plenty.  Even with Cro getting beat like a slow, clueless, talentless rookie; even with a gameplan that's getting nitpicked after the fact; even with the lack of name-players at receiving positions; a QB who saw and hit open receivers gets us 24-30 points yesterday and we walk away with the win.

 

 

This is not to exonerate Smith, nor is it to blame Rex, but the Jets have to decide soon what their objective is on the season and roll with it. I think the Atlanta win tricked them into believing that they can squeak into the playoffs, and that resulted in them pulling the string on the offensive gameplan in an attempt to beat the Steelers 17-14. If they dedicate this season to finding out about Geno, then they have to come out every week and run with the same philosophy that they did against Atlanta--wide open, all the time, with the ball in Geno's hand. They shouldn't be asking him to not make mistakes, and to run a conservative offense, and manage the game because 1. he's potentially better than that and 2. the Jets simply aren't good enough to play that way. They need to live or die on Geno's arm. In doing so, you're going to get some Tennessee-type games and you're going to get some Atlanta-type performances. What was most galling about yesterday is that they intentionally neutered Smith early on and wasted another week of finding out if he could carry the team.

[Matt39]

Geno was terrible yesterday, but the blame goes all the way around. You cant lose the TOP battle by 11 minutes on your home field. The defense couldnt get off the field on 3rd down.

[Sperm Edwards]

This is not to exonerate Smith, nor is it to blame Rex, but the Jets have to decide soon what their objective is on the season and roll with it. I think the Atlanta loss tricked them into believing that they can squeak into the playoffs, and that resulted in them pulling the string on the offensive gameplan in an attempt to beat the Steelers 17-14. If they dedicate this season to finding out about Geno, then they have to come out every week and run with the same philosophy that they did against Atlanta--wide open, all the time, with the ball in Geno's hand. They shouldn't be asking him to not make mistakes, and to run a conservative offense, and manage the game because 1. he's potentially better than that and 2. the Jets simply aren't good enough to play that way. They need to live or die on Geno's arm. In doing so, you're going to get some Tennessee-type games and you're going to get some Atlanta-type performances. What was most galling about yesterday is that they intentionally neutered Smith early on and wasted another week of finding out if he could carry the team.

 

You know I've been in Smith's corner, but the guy was awful.  When he misses open receivers - open receivers running DEEP - that is not the product of a conservative offense.  The difference between this and Atlanta was Smith was deadly-accurate and the guy he was locked in on was open.  

 

I do not agree that the gameplan is "Geno, don't screw up."  That is not what I'm seeing at all.  I'm seeing him off-target on open receivers, and not seeing other ones.  If MM dials up a pass play, and someone is open deep, the only way for that to NOT look like a conservative gameplan is if Smith throws it to the open man and hits him.  If he hits those guys deep, suddenly those same exact plays don't look so conservative.

 

We did not "neuter" Smith.  If you want to really screw him up, then come out every game and have him throwing 75% of the time.  That should make it easy to tee off on him.

 

There can always be better gameplans in hindsight, but what screws up every gameplan every time is when the QB isn't seeing and isn't hitting players that the GAMEPLAN designed for them to get wide open (and succeeded in doing so).

 

He's a young QB and I expect these setbacks.  But it doesn't render him blameless.  Nor does it mean others are to blame for his sucky play.

[Matt39]

Geno was off, defense couldnt get off the field....every incompletion basically took 5 minutes off the game for us...you knew after a 3 and out by the Jets, Pittsburgh could rattle together a couple of first downs.

[Larz]

after every loss I want to say mm should have run the ball more to give the jets a chance to win vs bringing geno along.  then I remember the only thing that matters this season is they find out if geno is the guy, so might as well call passes on 3rd and 5 and see what he can do vs blitz

 

mm is basically balancing the benefit of the franchise (calling the game for geno like he would for rodgers) vs the benefit of his boss (winning today)

 

they even said it on tv, the steelers only concern was getting beat deep, so they designed the defense around that

 

geno lost his patience and forced a few in there

 

but you can't say the gameplan was conservative, the steelers took the deep stuff away for the most part.  they actually took a deep shot on 2nd and short I think it was where I was kinda pissed they didn't just run ivory twice

 

maybe that is geno's rep now, he loses patience and forces passes, but throws a nice deep ball so take that away

 

in any event, cro getting beat hurt, but the defense still held them to under their season average so yeah 19 wasn't the problem

[Sperm Edwards]

Geno was off, defense couldnt get off the field....every incompletion basically took 5 minutes off the game for us...you knew after a 3 and out by the Jets, Pittsburgh could rattle together a couple of first downs.

 

Agree it was a team loss, but you can't win when the QB has a game like Geno did without enough good plays to offset the bad.  The pass D was bad, but they smothered Pittsburgh's ground game.  Felix Jones had one 11-yard run (on a drive Pittsburgh ended up punting on) and other than that they went nowhere.  Our pass D was horrendous.  The numbers don't even look as bad as they were because of Cro's deep PI penalty.

 

When that much goes wrong the only way to win is if our RBs are steamrolling the other team, allowing us to take the ball out of a struggling QBs hands, which didn't happen.  So therefore we lost.

[joewilly12]

geno lost his patience and forced a few in there

 

but you can't say the gameplan was conservative, the steelers took the deep stuff away for the most part.  they actually took a deep shot on 2nd and short I think it was where I was kinda pissed they didn't just run ivory twice

Do you notice the WRs don't run complete routes and they don't come back for the ball when Geno is in trouble.

They took 1 deep shot which Hill beat the secondary it almost worked,did they try another?

Why cant the coaching staff address the poor play of the WRs and why cant Mornigway call more plays to open up the running game?

[Matt39]

Agree it was a team loss, but you can't win when the QB has a game like Geno did without enough good plays to offset the bad.  The pass D was bad, but they smothered Pittsburgh's ground game.  Felix Jones had one 11-yard run (on a drive Pittsburgh ended up punting on) and other than that they went nowhere.  Our pass D was horrendous.  The numbers don't even look as bad as they were because of Cro's deep PI penalty.

 

When that much goes wrong the only way to win is if our RBs are steamrolling the other team, allowing us to take the ball out of a struggling QBs hands, which didn't happen.  So therefore we lost.

 

Geno missed a few open guys. Cumberland was wide open in the EZ on the pick to Reuland. Hill I thought had more speed than that, but still Geno's gotta place that in his hands.

 

This is what the Steelers do though. We dont have receivers that can consistently beat press...and the only guy who's really capable of catching a pass "covered" is Cumberland. I think you're overestimating the amount of wide open guys yesterday. Granted, if Geno makes those two throws we are in business....but Pitts D locked our wideouts down.

 

I dont know why Ivory isnt getting carries. 

[NJ]

The news - Geno Smith had a horrible, off target game and our defensive secondary allowed the Steelers to drive up and down the field.

The good news - Geno Smith will get better - even this season.

The bad news - our defensive secondary won't get much better and will limit the success of a kick-azz defensive front. Cro was/is hurting and should improve somewhat.

 

We are missing some pieces  - just that simple. We will continue to accumulate talent and the true talent we have will get better. 

 

If Goodson doesn't go down yesterday - Idzik's initial plan with the backfield, given he was playing out Trader Mike's stupid cap hand, looked pretty damn smart.

[Smashmouth]

Agree it was a team loss, but you can't win when the QB has a game like Geno did without enough good plays to offset the bad.  The pass D was bad, but they smothered Pittsburgh's ground game.  Felix Jones had one 11-yard run (on a drive Pittsburgh ended up punting on) and other than that they went nowhere.  Our pass D was horrendous.  The numbers don't even look as bad as they were because of Cro's deep PI penalty.

 

When that much goes wrong the only way to win is if our RBs are steamrolling the other team, allowing us to take the ball out of a struggling QBs hands, which didn't happen.  So therefore we lost.

 

been saying all year our pass D was horrific and as soon as teams started throwing short quick passes we would be exposed and we were and will continue to be.

 

Another thing that really bothers me about our defense that I think keeps them from taking the next step is our pitiful lack of creating turnovers and giving us an easy field position situation to work with from time to time.

[Matt39]

been saying all year our pass D was horrific and as soon as teams started throwing short quick passes we would be exposed and we were and will continue to be.

 

Another thing that really bothers me about our defense that I think keeps them from taking the next step is our pitiful lack of creating turnovers and giving us an easy field position situation to work with from time to time.

 

Yeah, the turnovers thing is getting comical. For as many first round picks this defense has...you think we'd be able to make other teams uncomfortable. One interception all season. That's pathetic.

[Larz]

Do you notice the WRs don't run complete routes and they don't come back for the ball when Geno is in trouble.

They took 1 deep shot which Hill beat the secondary it almost worked,did they try another?

Why cant the coaching staff address the poor play of the WRs and why cant Mornigway call more plays to open up the running game?

 

I don't think the WR's are awesome.  I just don't think you trade a #1 pick with a rookie QB

 

yes they did.  you can count the 2 -3 throw aways as deep shots as well

 

I would expect the WR coach talks to the WR's fairly often

 

I think MM should call more TD's, I like those

[Smashmouth]

The news - Geno Smith had a horrible, off target game and our defensive secondary allowed the Steelers to drive up and down the field.

The good news - Geno Smith will get better - even this season.

The bad news - our defensive secondary won't get much better and will limit the success of a kick-azz defensive front. Cro was/is hurting and should improve somewhat.

 

We are missing some pieces  - just that simple. We will continue to accumulate talent and the true talent we have will get better. 

 

If Goodson doesn't go down yesterday - Idzik's initial plan with the backfield, given he was playing out Trader Mike's stupid cap hand, looked pretty damn smart.

 

right on the money

 

Next year this team needs to get some serious safety help and a fast OLB the rest of the picks need to focus on offense. Since Safeties tend to be very hit or miss through the draft I would much rather see us pick up a proven NFL safety since we do have a lot of cap space .

[joewilly12]

4th and 1 at the goal line first drive of the game you are at home you go for it. 3 points aren't beating the Steelers.