Gas2No99 Posted May 9, 2016 Share Posted May 9, 2016 Darron Lee, Jordan Jenkins and the Jets' squeaky clean 'Wonder' boys First-round pick Darron Lee scored well on intelligence tests such as the Wonderlic along with showing his considerable physical tools. Bill Kostroun/AP A look at what's happening around the New York Jets: LeDick InCimini-atedESPN Staff Writer 1. Lucky 13: One of the themes that has emerged from Mike Maccagnan's first two drafts is that he prefers intelligent football players with no off-the-field issues. He has picked a total of 13 players, and not one has a known red flag in his background -- unusual in the current NFL. This is the right approach for a new regime. Once you've established a locker-room culture, it becomes easier to gamble on a character risk. For now, it makes sense to fill the room with solid citizens -- and smart players. Most of the current draft class posted above-average scores on the Wonderlic intelligence test (max grade: 50). In fact, Jordan Jenkins (33) and Darron Lee (31) were among the highest for linebackers. (Joe Schobert, drafted by the Cleveland Browns, led with a 36.) I spoke to scouts from two different teams, and they both described Jenkins and Lee as quality individuals. Lee is mature and polished, which came through in his first news conference at the Jets' facility. Jenkins is "a classy kid," one NFC scout told me. Cornerback Juston Burris (27) and punter Lachlan Edwards (30) also scored high for their respective positions. Quarterback Christian Hackenberg (24) and wide receiver Charone Peake (18) were average, and tackle Brandon Shell (17) was below average, based on their positions. 2. Exception to the rule: By now, you probably know the Jets tried to trade up for Laremy Tunsil, the tackle who fell to 13th because of the bong-smoking video that surfaced as the draft started. Clearly, Maccagnan was willing to deviate from his goody-two-shoes philosophy for Tunsil, who was rated as one of the top players on the Jets' draft board. A double standard? Here's how I see it: Maccagnan was so confident in his prep work on Tunsil that, unlike some GMs, he didn't freak out upon seeing the video. I know of one team in the top 12 that did an about-face on Tunsil as soon as the video made it to their draft room. Let's be honest, though: Maccagnan didn't try to trade up for Tunsil as much as he tried to steal him. He thought he smelled a fire sale. He offered the New York Giants, picking 10th, a second-round pick to swap places in the first round, according to the New York Daily News. That was a Ryan Fitzpatrick-type of offer, meaning below the market price, based on the draft-trade chart used by teams. He called other teams, too, finding no takers. 3. Always thinking big: Another two-year trend has developed with Maccagnan's drafting: He's not a small-school kind of GM, as 11 of the 13 picks came from the Power 5 conferences. The only exceptions were seventh-round picks: Nose tackle Deon Simon (Northwestern State, 2015) and Edwards (Sam Houston State, 2016). 4. Attack on Hack: Wow, the analytics people are really down on Hackenberg. Football Outsiders, which cooked up a formula that uses college stats to project NFL performance, essentially says Hackenberg will be a bust. It has a ranking system called QBASE (Quarterback Adjusted Stats and Experience), and no quarterback in QBASE's database (top-100 picks since 1996) has succeeded in the NFL with college stats similar to those of Hackenberg. Other top-100 picks who completed under 55 percent in the final college season were Brock Huard, Dave Ragone, Kyle Boller, Marques Tuiasosopo and Quincy Carter -- all flops. Like I said during the draft, I think the Jets reached for Hackenberg in the second round, but they looked past the numbers, relying on their scouting instincts. Time will tell if they're right. If Hackenberg succeeds, he will be a statistical anomaly. 5. Hack vs. Geno vs. Bryce: In their seemingly endless search for a franchise quarterback, the Jets have accumulated three high-profile former college passers. I asked ESPN draft analyst Todd McShay to compare Hackenberg, Geno Smith and Bryce Petty, based on their draft grades. "I think [Petty] has a lower ceiling than Hackenberg," McShay said. "Ultimately, Hackenberg, from a pro-style system and his skill set, has the greatest upside of that group. But he's the furthest away in terms of accuracy of those three." McShay said Petty "had the best leadership and football character of all those guys," which I found interesting. Basically, the Jets have three players with different strengths and different weaknesses, and they have to hope one of them has enough good stuff to develop. 6. Fitz-Hackenberg connections: If Fitzpatrick and Hackenberg end up in the same quarterback room, they will have two common denominators -- Bill O'Brien and Jordan Palmer. Both quarterbacks played for O'Brien, Hackenberg in 2013 (Penn State), Fitzpatrick in 2014 (Houston Texans). Fitzpatrick told me last season he learned more in one year under O'Brien than under any of his previous coaches. Fitzpatrick is close friends with former Cincinnati Bengalsteammate Carson Palmer, the older brother of Jordan Palmer, Hackenberg's personal QB coach during the pre-draft process. Small world, right? 7. Looking for a hybrid: Maccagnan said in a radio interview the Jets looked into signing safety-turned-linebacker Mark Barron as a free agent. That should've been an indication they were in the market for a big safety/small linebacker, and they found it with Lee. Barron ended up re-signing with the Los Angeles Rams. 8. Fountain of Youth: Maccagnan made it a point of mentioning that Lee and Hackenberg are relatively young for incoming rookies. He's right. Of the 31 players drafted by AFC East teams, Hackenberg (21 years, 91 days) and Lee (21 years, 200 days) are the second- and third-youngest. The youngest is Miami Dolphins tight end Thomas Duarte (21 years, 38 days). What does it mean? I'm not sure. All I know is, Hackenberg and Duarte were born when I was covering the Rich Kotite Jets, and that's rather scary. 9. Keeping the light on: Todd Bowles said he hasn't shut the door in re-signing linebacker Calvin Pace and/or cornerback Antonio Cromartie. Right now they have a greater need for Pace because of the inexperience at outside linebacker. The smart play: Evaluate the kids through the June minicamp, and perhaps into the early of portion of training camp. If they're struggling, summon the graybeard from the bullpen. 10. The last rookie camp? Bowles admitted he considered the possibility of cancelling on-field drills in favor of classroom work, a growing trend around the league. He decided to stick to a traditional minicamp because of Hackenberg. "If we didn't draft a quarterback, I wasn't going to have one, either," he said, adding that rookie quarterbacks need the mental reps on the field. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JetFreak89 Posted May 9, 2016 Share Posted May 9, 2016 Sorely disappointed in the lack of "tit-bits" in this thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerfish Posted May 9, 2016 Share Posted May 9, 2016 If only Geno smith has even reasonable instincts. He is mobile, throws a nice ball, just killed by lack of awareness and brain cramps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gas2No99 Posted May 9, 2016 Author Share Posted May 9, 2016 44 minutes ago, JetFreak89 said: Sorely disappointed in the lack of "tit-bits" in this thread. LOL. Sorry, that was a typo (supposed to be TID bits) But so as to comply with the title and STILL be football related, HERE YA GO! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Long Island Leprechaun Posted May 9, 2016 Share Posted May 9, 2016 As everyone understands that Hackenberg was selected based on his first year in a pro-style offense, studies of how he did in the spread in his next two years completely misses the point. Simply crunching the numbers without context is pretty useless. I have no clue whether Hackenberg will succeed, although I have a sneaky gut feeling he will do well, but I'm pretty certain the Jets were not using statistics alone or even as a primary factor in selecting him. Let's see how he develops going forward. His college career is meaningless now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerfish Posted May 9, 2016 Share Posted May 9, 2016 9 minutes ago, Long Island Leprechaun said: As everyone understands that Hackenberg was selected based on his first year in a pro-style offense, studies of how he did in the spread in his next two years completely misses the point. Simply crunching the numbers without context is pretty useless. I have no clue whether Hackenberg will succeed, although I have a sneaky gut feeling he will do well, but I'm pretty certain the Jets were not using statistics alone or even as a primary factor in selecting him. Let's see how he develops going forward. His college career is meaningless now. Totally ignoring the last two years of a guys college career because it was not pro style is bizarre, especially when we drafted a Qb the year before who never ran a pro style and put up huge numbers. The biggest worry about Hackenburg is his accuracy, in college in his workouts and in his very limited rookie camp time. Now, you can live with a bit of a dip in accuracy if you don't foolishly turn the ball over. If he is smart enough in that area he for sure has a shot, if not he will just be another Sanchez geno. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gas2No99 Posted May 9, 2016 Author Share Posted May 9, 2016 I was listening to Kiper's DETAILED sole-analysis on ESPN Podcast (not the show w/McShay, Idiot Herm, and PolishRifle) this morning and I concluded an interesting possibility: For a QB, is there a correlation between hand-size and accuracy? Simple summary: Main concern with Hack is his accuracy & he was "slightly" over drafted in the 2nd round. Meanwhile, Cleveland's pick of Cody Kessler which shocked many in the 3rd round was because Hue Jackson sees an "Andy Dalton" clone; in that Kessler has "excellent accuracy" (main point Jackson kept emphasizing) and had MASSIVE hands measuring at 10 7/8". Meanwhile Hack had the smallest hands along w/Goff @ 9" yet Goff had a peak of 64.5% accuracy his senior year. Does hand size affect a QB's completion percentage and accuracy? Thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BowlesMovement Posted May 9, 2016 Share Posted May 9, 2016 1 minute ago, Gas2No99 said: I was listening to Kiper's DETAILED sole-analysis on ESPN Podcast (not the show w/McShay, Idiot Herm, and PolishRifle) this morning and I concluded an interesting possibility: For a QB, is there a correlation between hand-size and accuracy? Simple summary: Main concern with Hack is his accuracy & he was "slightly" over drafted in the 2nd round. Meanwhile, Cleveland's pick of Cody Kessler which shocked many in the 3rd round was because Hue Jackson sees an "Andy Dalton" clone; in that Kessler has "excellent accuracy" (main point Jackson kept emphasizing) and had MASSIVE hands measuring at 10 7/8". Meanwhile Hack had the smallest hands along w/Goff @ 9" yet Goff had a peak of 64.5% accuracy his senior year. Does hand size affect a QB's completion percentage and accuracy? Thoughts? You know what they say about dudes with small hands right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gas2No99 Posted May 9, 2016 Author Share Posted May 9, 2016 Just now, BowlesMovement said: You know what they say about dudes with small hands right? Cheap? When I was growing up it was the size of feet. It's all Bull$hit in the end. In this society what matters are: Intelligence: Perseverance: and MONEY! The rest falls into place Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt39 Posted May 9, 2016 Share Posted May 9, 2016 15 minutes ago, Gas2No99 said: I was listening to Kiper's DETAILED sole-analysis on ESPN Podcast (not the show w/McShay, Idiot Herm, and PolishRifle) this morning and I concluded an interesting possibility: For a QB, is there a correlation between hand-size and accuracy? Simple summary: Main concern with Hack is his accuracy & he was "slightly" over drafted in the 2nd round. Meanwhile, Cleveland's pick of Cody Kessler which shocked many in the 3rd round was because Hue Jackson sees an "Andy Dalton" clone; in that Kessler has "excellent accuracy" (main point Jackson kept emphasizing) and had MASSIVE hands measuring at 10 7/8". Meanwhile Hack had the smallest hands along w/Goff @ 9" yet Goff had a peak of 64.5% accuracy his senior year. Does hand size affect a QB's completion percentage and accuracy? Thoughts? A lot of Hackenbergs passes arent clean spirals which I'd have to guess has to do with handsize. 9 is really small for an NFL QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jet Nut Posted May 9, 2016 Share Posted May 9, 2016 17 minutes ago, BowlesMovement said: You know what they say about dudes with small hands right? Yeah, small gloves. Sanchez has big hands, how accurate is he? Over blown nonsense to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jet Nut Posted May 9, 2016 Share Posted May 9, 2016 1 hour ago, Beerfish said: Totally ignoring the last two years of a guys college career because it was not pro style is bizarre, especially when we drafted a Qb the year before who never ran a pro style and put up huge numbers. The biggest worry about Hackenburg is his accuracy, in college in his workouts and in his very limited rookie camp time. Now, you can live with a bit of a dip in accuracy if you don't foolishly turn the ball over. If he is smart enough in that area he for sure has a shot, if not he will just be another Sanchez geno. But its a valid point. Put a QB into a system he has no chance at succeeding with and he's going to drop if you look at those seasons. Its exactly what happened with Hack. We'll see which QB he is. The up and coming stud running the pats offense or the guy who cant run the spread while being chased by defensemen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Integrity28 Posted May 9, 2016 Share Posted May 9, 2016 2 hours ago, JetFreak89 said: Sorely disappointed in the lack of "tit-bits" in this thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BowlesMovement Posted May 9, 2016 Share Posted May 9, 2016 11 minutes ago, Jet Nut said: Yeah, small gloves. Sanchez has big hands, how accurate is he? Over blown nonsense to me. I thought they said small wiener, but maybe small gloves is right, not sure Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbatesman Posted May 9, 2016 Share Posted May 9, 2016 LeDick InCimini-ated Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SenorGato Posted May 9, 2016 Share Posted May 9, 2016 1 hour ago, Gas2No99 said: Cheap? When I was growing up it was the size of feet. It's all Bull$hit in the end. In this society what matters are: Intelligence: Perseverance: and MONEY! The rest falls into place Reverse that order Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jet in PA Posted May 9, 2016 Share Posted May 9, 2016 Yeah, small gloves. Sanchez has big hands, how accurate is he? Over blown nonsense to me. Yeah Sanchez has big hands and it helped him with accuracy and more importantly with ball security. It's not like he ever lost the ball in hilarious fashion with the whole world watching or anything.....a little bit of awareness can offset and vice versa. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Long Island Leprechaun Posted May 9, 2016 Share Posted May 9, 2016 2 hours ago, Gas2No99 said: I was listening to Kiper's DETAILED sole-analysis on ESPN Podcast (not the show w/McShay, Idiot Herm, and PolishRifle) this morning and I concluded an interesting possibility: For a QB, is there a correlation between hand-size and accuracy? Simple summary: Main concern with Hack is his accuracy & he was "slightly" over drafted in the 2nd round. Meanwhile, Cleveland's pick of Cody Kessler which shocked many in the 3rd round was because Hue Jackson sees an "Andy Dalton" clone; in that Kessler has "excellent accuracy" (main point Jackson kept emphasizing) and had MASSIVE hands measuring at 10 7/8". Meanwhile Hack had the smallest hands along w/Goff @ 9" yet Goff had a peak of 64.5% accuracy his senior year. Does hand size affect a QB's completion percentage and accuracy? Thoughts? If I had to choose between a guy with small hands and big brain, or big hands and a small brain, I'd go with the latter. Geno and Sanchez have small brains. Their hands haven't helped them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tinstar Posted May 9, 2016 Share Posted May 9, 2016 1 minute ago, Long Island Leprechaun said: If I had to choose between a guy with small hands and big brain, or big hands and a small brain, I'd go with the latter. Geno and Sanchez have small brains. Their hands haven't helped them. Didn't Geno Smith do well on that test they administer at the combines . Why does Jet fans think this kid is a dimwit ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slats Posted May 9, 2016 Share Posted May 9, 2016 43 minutes ago, Tinstar said: Didn't Geno Smith do well on that test they administer at the combines . Why does Jet fans think this kid is a dimwit ? He did the same as the football genius Christian Hackenberg, and dramatically better than the QB we're all eventually gonna wish we had taken instead, Paxton Lynch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetrider Posted May 9, 2016 Share Posted May 9, 2016 Namath would've bombed the Wonderlic. Just sayin' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ljr Posted May 9, 2016 Share Posted May 9, 2016 Lol that already at point 2 he had to put in an exception saying that what he'd just said was crap, with the Tunsil attempted trade Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Jets fan Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 2 hours ago, Tinstar said: Didn't Geno Smith do well on that test they administer at the combines . Why does Jet fans think this kid is a dimwit ? Because we have seen him play football Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tinstar Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 6 minutes ago, Joe Jets fan said: Because we have seen him play football exactly when was this ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Jets fan Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 1 minute ago, Tinstar said: exactly when was this ? Um, 2013 and 2014? Have you been under a rock ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tinstar Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 7 minutes ago, Joe Jets fan said: Um, 2013 and 2014? Have you been under a rock ? You say you have seen this chap with your own eyes play the game of football. Might I ask, was he any good at this endeavor ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetsons Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 3 hours ago, Tinstar said: Didn't Geno Smith do well on that test they administer at the combines . Why does Jet fans think this kid is a dimwit ? Well, proper grammar would be a start Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tinstar Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 1 minute ago, jetsons said: Well, proper grammar would be a start sorry professor jetsons , me bad . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Jets fan Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 35 minutes ago, Tinstar said: You say you have seen this chap with your own eyes play the game of football. Might I ask, was he any good at this endeavor ? Tool Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cant wait Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 Romo and Vick both have smaller hands (8.88 & 8.5) and I think bridgewater and Carr are under 9.25 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYs Stepchild Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 7 hours ago, cant wait said: Romo and Vick both have smaller hands (8.88 & 8.5) and I think bridgewater and Carr are under 9.25 Aaron Rodgers' hands are too small to be an NFL QB 9 3/8 If your hands are big enough to spin the ball we're good. Watching Hack throw, it looks like his hands are big enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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