What I Want for Christmas (i.e. the coming Offseason)

[JustInFudge]

17 minutes ago, peebag said:

I think the only big contract they handed out was to the penalty machine, Brian Winters and that was out of desperation.

Beachum too...the other one was Carpenter but they actually restructured that contract to a team friendly deal.  For some reason I thought they extended him.

[Matt39]

9 minutes ago, JiF said:

Exactly.  And I'm almost willing to start putting money on this is exactly what happens.  That said, I think he takes another flier on Bryce Petty type of talent in the mid rounds. 

This is exactly how it will go. Mason Rudolph in the 4th or something to hedge on them bringing in mediocre veteran. Todd Bowles will never go into a season playing or attaching himself to a young QB. It's the Arians model.

[MDL_JET]

12 minutes ago, JiF said:

Exactly.  And I'm almost willing to start putting money on this is exactly what happens.  That said, I think he takes another flier on Bryce Petty type of talent in the mid rounds. 

Not happening. Cousins yes, maybe if he gets free. Everyone else nah. It's draft a QB high or bust. It's happening guys. 

 

[kelly]

3 minutes ago, MDL_JET said:

Not happening. Cousins yes, maybe if he gets free. Everyone else nah. It's draft a QB high or bust. It's happening guys. 

 

[CanadaSteve]

22 hours ago, Warfish said:

3. I want a dedication to rebuilding the O-line with our 80 million in Free Agent money.  The line today is unacceptable, one of our worst units.  It must be improved for our young QB to flourish.  If we're going to spend, spend here on the best, most elite talent available this off-season.  2 top FA players, minimum.

6. I do NOT want to draft Defense until at least round 4 of the draft.  If we have FA money, fine, spend some of it to bolster CB, LB or DLine.  But no drafting D-Linemen.

3.  Here is the problem for the O-line.  There is only two centers that are UFA's next year that are center, which is our BIGGEST weakness by far.  One of the center's that is a UFA is our center.  The other is Evan Smith, who is playing guard for Tampa.

As for LT, there is some good guys there, but they will get resigned, and we are stuck with Beachum for another year.  I see it more feasible as drafting a center with one of our two 2nd round picks, and perhaps drafting more developmental guys with later picks. As I stated in another thread, I cannot believe that Winters AND Carpenter have all of a sudden dropped off a cliff talent wise after Nick Mangold, our ring of honor C and potential HOF candidate gets replaced by one of the worst ranked centers.  I think you replace him, the O-line play will drastically improve, but we do need an upgrade at LT, and we need to start thinking ahead for our G situation. 

6. The best place to spend money is at CB, as long as all the good ones do not get re-upped prior to.  We could fill some holes with FA at this position, but EDGE rusher will have to come via the draft, unless we believe Aldon Smith can do something, or Ensah will leave Detroit (which I DOUBT is happening)

[JustInFudge]

4 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

This is exactly how it will go. Mason Rudolph in the 4th or something to hedge on them bringing in mediocre veteran. Todd Bowles will never go into a season playing or attaching himself to a young QB. It's the Arians model.

Ward/Payne/Key in the 1st.  Hurst/Webster/Allen in the 2nd.  Flier QB in 3rd or 4th.  Resign McCown (or maybe Smith/Cousins) and party on to 5 victories baby!!!!

[JustInFudge]

4 minutes ago, MDL_JET said:

Not happening. Cousins yes, maybe if he gets free. Everyone else nah. It's draft a QB high or bust. It's happening guys. 

 

I'm close putting a 100% not happening on this right now but I'm reserving the right to see how things shake out between the end of the season and the process.  I'm only at 95% certainty at this point. 

[kelly]

18 hours ago, jeremy2020 said:

I don't think you're going to get what you want for Christmas.

[Warfish]

32 minutes ago, CanadaSteve said:

3.  Here is the problem for the O-line.  There is only two centers that are UFA's next year that are center, which is our BIGGEST weakness by far.  One of the center's that is a UFA is our center.  The other is Evan Smith, who is playing guard for Tampa.

As for LT, there is some good guys there, but they will get resigned, and we are stuck with Beachum for another year.  I see it more feasible as drafting a center with one of our two 2nd round picks, and perhaps drafting more developmental guys with later picks. As I stated in another thread, I cannot believe that Winters AND Carpenter have all of a sudden dropped off a cliff talent wise after Nick Mangold, our ring of honor C and potential HOF candidate gets replaced by one of the worst ranked centers.  I think you replace him, the O-line play will drastically improve, but we do need an upgrade at LT, and we need to start thinking ahead for our G situation. 

6. The best place to spend money is at CB, as long as all the good ones do not get re-upped prior to.  We could fill some holes with FA at this position, but EDGE rusher will have to come via the draft, unless we believe Aldon Smith can do something, or Ensah will leave Detroit (which I DOUBT is happening)

This will not be popular:  I would resign Mangold for a 2 year deal for low-money.  As I said at teh time, he would have been 100% better than the guy we replaced him with, and no, his not having played this year doesn't bother me or change my view.  if the FA market for centers is truly weak, I look for a better one in the draft as well then.

I'm fine spending some money of a FA CB.  Just not making CB the be-all-end-all of FA.

[FidelioJet]

Draft a QB and put all other resources into the O-Line and get a RB.

That's exactly what they should be doing....Honestly, I don't know how you can look at this team and think anything else.

I don't care who the coach is, who the GM is -----get that 1st round QB, get him a quick RB and most importantly build the best possible line money can buy.

[ZachEY]

22 hours ago, Jack Straw said:

Agreed. If you give Bowles a veteran QB on this roster, he will play him, regardless of how wretchedly awful he is.

If you're Maccagnan, you have to take that option away from him.

Please name the time Bowles played a veteran QB over a younger player that showed any potential whatsoever?

[The Crusher]

6 minutes ago, gEYno said:

Please name the time Bowles played a veteran QB over a younger player that showed any potential whatsoever?

Is dressing for game day two time in two years considered potential? 

 

[ZachEY]

1. Fire Mac

2. Fire Bowles

3. Hire President of Football OPs

4. Hire new GM

5. Hire new Coach

6. Prioritize a QB, but Darnold and Rosen are probably unobtainable.  Scout the hell out of Mayfield, and you don't like him, spend on Cousins.  Avoid Allen unless it's round 3 or later.

7. Fix the O-Line

[SenorGato]

Can you please stop it with the gifs from that show? 

—————————

All I want is for this franchise to be hyper aggressive about the QB position. Sign Cousins, grab the inevitable falling QB prospect, land an OT, and get younger at RB. They have the resources for all of this to happen, the last one isn’t even hard, and it sets up a higher floor for 2018 and 2019 without selling those drafts. I believe they’ve showed signs of organizational growth on offense under Bowles - there’s been an actual passing game more often than not, do it with a makeshift OL, going three deep at RB with multiple competent pass catchers, they’ve piled up bodies at the other pass catcher positions - and it’s just a matter of finding a QB that can buy multiple years of sweet, sweet time to start plugging leaks. 

 

[Jack Straw]

38 minutes ago, gEYno said:

Please name the time Bowles played a veteran QB over a younger player that showed any potential whatsoever?

Please name the time Bowles played a young QB due to any reason other than injury.

[SenorGato]

32 minutes ago, gEYno said:

1. Fire Mac

2. Fire Bowles

3. Hire President of Football OPs

4. Hire new GM

5. Hire new Coach

6. Prioritize a QB, but Darnold and Rosen are probably unobtainable.  Scout the hell out of Mayfield, and you don't like him, spend on Cousins.  Avoid Allen unless it's round 3 or later.

7. Fix the O-Line

Yes please

One impression you get from the Jets over the years is that the FO is very, very small and everyone is just trying to buy another year or two. This is a position that can help change that with the right hire. 

[Matt39]

50 minutes ago, gEYno said:

Please name the time Bowles played a veteran QB over a younger player that showed any potential whatsoever?

True. However I think it's fair to assume Bowles' preference is the older veteran- considering his connections around the league and draft history along with the Paxton Lynch stuff.

[ZachEY]

43 minutes ago, Jack Straw said:

Please name the time Bowles played a young QB due to any reason other than injury.

The point is, he's never had one worth playing.  Petty and Hack are both garbage, unfortunately.

[ZachEY]

32 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

True. However I think it's fair to assume Bowles' preference is the older veteran- considering his connections around the league and draft history along with the Paxton Lynch stuff.

He's not looking to be wrong re: Paxton Lynch.

You'd have to assume that Bowles is oblivious to the fact that the way in which he feeds his family is directly related to his ability to find a young QB to accept the narrative I was responding to.

[Matt39]

2 minutes ago, gEYno said:

He's not looking to be wrong re: Paxton Lynch.

You'd have to assume that Bowles is oblivious to the fact that the way in which he feeds his family is directly related to his ability to find a young QB to accept the narrative I was responding to.

I think he's totally oblivious.

[CanadaSteve]

1 hour ago, gEYno said:

1. Fire Mac

2. Fire Bowles

3. Hire President of Football OPs

4. Hire new GM

5. Hire new Coach

6. Prioritize a QB, but Darnold and Rosen are probably unobtainable.  Scout the hell out of Mayfield, and you don't like him, spend on Cousins.  Avoid Allen unless it's round 3 or later.

7. Fix the O-Line

I would change one thing, if this is what you want.

4. Hire new GM WHO HIRES new Coach.

[T0mShane]

2 hours ago, JiF said:

Exactly.  And I'm almost willing to start putting money on this is exactly what happens.  That said, I think he takes another flier on Bryce Petty type of talent in the mid rounds. 

 

2 hours ago, Matt39 said:

This is exactly how it will go. Mason Rudolph in the 4th or something to hedge on them bringing in mediocre veteran. Todd Bowles will never go into a season playing or attaching himself to a young QB. It's the Arians model.

And if you’re that mid-round QB the Jets draft, you should refuse to report because your career is over the second you sign on the line as long as Bowles is here. 

[T0mShane]

18 minutes ago, gEYno said:

The point is, he's never had one worth playing.  Petty and Hack are both garbage, unfortunately.

I think it’s likely that Petty sucks, but there’s also no doubt that he’s in the worst possible environment for a QB. A gutless GM bowing to a conservative, halfwit coach who only wants to play kindly veterans. 

[RutgersJetFan]

2 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

I think it’s likely that Petty sucks, but there’s also no doubt that he’s in the worst possible environment for a QB. A gutless GM bowing to a conservative, halfwit coach who only wants to play kindly veterans. 

How do you know McCown and Fitz are kindly.

[T0mShane]

2 minutes ago, RutgersJetFan said:

How do you know McCown and Fitz are kindly.

I will admit to some racial, ageist and ethnic stereotyping on that one

[Bleedin Green]

52 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

I think he's totally oblivious.

That's a matter of thinking what you want to believe, which even includes some mystical responsibility of Bowles for Macc's own ineptitude.

The funny thing is in 2 of 3 seasons, Bowles made desperate attempts to start the young kid over the old man, and both times the kids totally ****ed it up.  Of course, people like to ignore all of that because it doesn't fit their narrative.  This doesn't make Bowles a good coach mind you, but it points to how baseless the same constantly repeated storyline is.

[Matt39]

Just now, Bleedin Green said:

That's a matter of thinking what you want to believe, which even includes some mystical responsibility of Bowles for Macc's own ineptitude.

The funny thing is in 2 of 3 seasons, Bowles made desperate attempts to start the young kid over the old man, and both times the kids totally ****ed it up.  Of course, people like to ignore all of that because it doesn't fit their narrative.  This doesn't make Bowles a good coach mind you, but it points to how baseless the same constantly repeated storyline is.

We are going into year four and there's been zero effort from this regime to tie themselves to a young QB. Whether it be trading up(which they easily could have, twice) or taken Watson- there's been little to no effort other than laughable hedges in Petty and Hackenberg. You want to blame Maccagnan for all of this? That's fine. But every first round draft pick basically fits the pattern of what Bowles defense did in Arizona. To me he's just as culpable for the state of the roster as Maccagnan. 

[Philc1]

2 hours ago, gEYno said:

1. Fire Mac

2. Fire Bowles

3. Hire President of Football OPs

4. Hire new GM

5. Hire new Coach

6. Prioritize a QB, but Darnold and Rosen are probably unobtainable.  Scout the hell out of Mayfield, and you don't like him, spend on Cousins.  Avoid Allen unless it's round 3 or later.

7. Fix the O-Line

Yup, this

[Philc1]

4 hours ago, nycdan said:

Since we're wishing and dreaming, can we add Dolan's name to your list?

Why? Knicks have good young players and currently a winning record ... unlike the jets

[Philc1]

8 minutes ago, Bleedin Green said:

That's a matter of thinking what you want to believe, which even includes some mystical responsibility of Bowles for Macc's own ineptitude.

The funny thing is in 2 of 3 seasons, Bowles made desperate attempts to start the young kid over the old man, and both times the kids totally ****ed it up.  Of course, people like to ignore all of that because it doesn't fit their narrative.  This doesn't make Bowles a good coach mind you, but it points to how baseless the same constantly repeated storyline is.

Bowles is horrible but he is getting blamed for a lot of stuff that’s not really his fault.  The roster is bottom 5 after 3 seasons and what hope is there besides an extra second round pick and maybe Josh Allen learns how to throw accurately?

[JohnnyLV]

On 12/20/2017 at 9:48 AM, Warfish said:

1. I want Bowles fired.  I want to replace him with someone who has some of Rex's passion tempered by Bowles seriousness, a coach who can lead men both in private and in public, and shows the fans he cares, but not to crazypants meme-worthy levels.  A Coach with gravitas and a resume, a man who has won something, done something in football, college or Pro.  Who?  No idea.

2. I want the Jets to draft a QB in the first round.  Personally, I want Baker Mayfield.  But I would accept a reasonable trade up for Darnold/Allen/Rosen, or a trade down to pick Jackson or Rudolph.  I simply want a 1st round QB that we will build around, whomever that guy is.  I do not want a Hack who will ride pine for three years, I want a kid with passion, talent, potential and the drive to start and start now.  A player we have no need to worry about "hurting his confidence" if we play him.  if we want to draft a 2nd QB in a later round (4, 5 or 6 say) thats fine too.  We must have hope at this position.

3. I want a dedication to rebuilding the O-line with our 80 million in Free Agent money.  The line today is unacceptable, one of our worst units.  It must be improved for our young QB to flourish.  If we're going to spend, spend here on the best, most elite talent available this off-season.  2 top FA players, minimum.

4. I want to cut Forte.  I want to replace him with someone dynamic and young in the draft.  Not worried what round, just someone we think can pair with McGuire and Powell effectively.  Our young QB will need a productive trio of RB's to help him early on.

5. I do NOT want to draft any WR's.  Kearse, Enunwa, Anderson, Hanson, Stewart at WR, ASJ, Tomlinson and the injured Leggett at TE is 100% fine by me, talent wise.  Give them all a chance.

6. I do NOT want to draft Defense until at least round 4 of the draft.  If we have FA money, fine, spend some of it to bolster CB, LB or DLine.  But no drafting D-Linemen.

7. I do NOT want to see any emphasis on "kick returners" this off-season.  The Kick Return game is, without question, one of the least relevant in the modern day NFL.  Put your best hands guy back there, and down it in the end zone every single time, and we'd be better off 90% of the time.  Focus should be "no fumbles", not "big returns".  Not in this era.

8. I do NOT want to see another Veteran JAG QB brought in to start.  It serves no purpose.  If our draft pick is not ready day 1, start Hack.  Or Petty.  Or some very cheap PS or #3 QB we steal from another team.  No McCowns, No Vicks, No Fitz's, No Boomer's.  Just no dammit.  If we absolutely MUST have a "veteran QB" on the roster (as opposed to as a Coach), he must be declared the #3 day 1 and there must be no chance he plays outside injury to both #1 and #2 QB's.  And no spending 30 million on some other teams castoff, the grass is not always greener.  

9. I want the "go young" motif on this year to continue.  No new FA signings of players over 30 if avoidable.  We're building here.  We're not one piece away.

10. Next year must be about development and improvement, not winning games.  Player personnel decisions need to be made with a long-term view to consistent competitiveness, not short term fixes or one-year grabs for the playoffs.   

This is not that much to ask IMO.  All of this is generally reasonable.

Wow. I expected to read this and agree with some and disagree with others, but I am a zillion percent with you on this list. I will literally have exactly the same Top 10.  I would add one thing to point 1 though. I would add an offensive minded coach that has experience developing QBs and will also have a QB coach and offensive coordinator that specialize in the same.

The more I watch modern football the more I realize certain things:

1. It is much easier drafting and player personnel wise to be above average on defense than offense

2. OL is only a tw%t hair below QB in importance and almost as difficult to get and maintain. And dramatically more important than any other positional group

3. Non premium positions are even less premium than before. Safety, ILB, non pass rushing linebacker, non pass rushing DL, even to a point CB are all not worthy of a first round pick, high grade or not. first round should be QB, OL pass rusher, WR, pass rushing lineman, RB.

4. Running back Speaking of which RB has become almost too undervalued. Look at Dallas, Jacksonville and LA Rams and you can see first round running backs are still high value,

 

 

[JustInFudge]

33 minutes ago, Bleedin Green said:

That's a matter of thinking what you want to believe, which even includes some mystical responsibility of Bowles for Macc's own ineptitude.

The funny thing is in 2 of 3 seasons, Bowles made desperate attempts to start the young kid over the old man, and both times the kids totally ****ed it up.  Of course, people like to ignore all of that because it doesn't fit their narrative.  This doesn't make Bowles a good coach mind you, but it points to how baseless the same constantly repeated storyline is.

When and what were these desperate attempts to start the kids?  

[JustInFudge]

37 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

We are going into year four and there's been zero effort from this regime to tie themselves to a young QB. Whether it be trading up(which they easily could have, twice) or taken Watson- there's been little to no effort other than laughable hedges in Petty and Hackenberg. You want to blame Maccagnan for all of this? That's fine. But every first round draft pick basically fits the pattern of what Bowles defense did in Arizona. To me he's just as culpable for the state of the roster as Maccagnan. 

100%.  A DE with 3 DE's on the roster, a fit scheme reach for an undersized LB with no instincts but speed, 2 (supposedly) interchangeable versatile Safeties?  Todd has definitely architected this roster.  Big Mac strikes me as one of those guys that's just happy to be in the room with a professional Football player and bows down to his every request = see Ryan Fitzpatrick. 

[ZachEY]

1 hour ago, T0mShane said:

I think it’s likely that Petty sucks, but there’s also no doubt that he’s in the worst possible environment for a QB. A gutless GM bowing to a conservative, halfwit coach who only wants to play kindly veterans. 

I think, when a guy at the professional level, can't hit open WRs when he has time to throw, the problem stops being his "situation."  This is the same as the Sanchez argument.  Sure, we didn't do him any favors after year-3, but he was still wildly inaccurate with time to throw.

[JustInFudge]

6 minutes ago, gEYno said:

I think, when a guy at the professional level, can't hit open WRs when he has time to throw, the problem stops being his "situation."  This is the same as the Sanchez argument.  Sure, we didn't do him any favors after year-3, but he was still wildly inaccurate with time to throw.

He was bouncing balls off the ground to wide open receivers 15 yards away.  That has nothing to do with development or environment.  Which then leads to, wtf was the point of having Fitz and McCown around if it weren't to create a better environment for the kids?  There is no possible way they actually thought they could win with these guys, is there? I mean, they couldn't have actually believed that.