***Official JN Jay Cutler Talk - All Jay, All Day*** [Merged 49X]

[SMC]

romo blows and is the most overrated QB in history of NFL

Palmer has done squat in how many years?

Mcnabb got to dance once and choked his arse off?

I would take JC over Brees as well

Then you've moved up to heroin.

Who gives a **** about McNabb getting to the dance once, he's still better than Cutler. Guess what? Cutler choked his ass off at the end of last season with the season on the line. That doesn't make Cutler a bad QB.

Cutler is all about POTENTIAL. The 3 QBs I've mentioned are all about PRODUCTION. They've all done it consistently over a period of years.

Let me put this is simple terms: McNabb, Brees, Palmer & Romo are hot 21 year old college girls while Cutler is a good looking 16 year that you want to put on layaway in the hopes she's hot at 21.

[T0mShane]

They have said that a lot (Shanny to Washington) but I can't figure that out. Why would Shanny want to coach for a team that Synder owns? Just doesn't seem like a good marriage.

Especially with Shanahan getting burned by Al Davis early in his career. It depends how hungry Shanahan is for the money-grab.

As for Washington, the rumor is Jason Campbell, Chris Cooley and the #13 overall for Cutler and Tony Scheffler. That is one hell of a nice deal.

[Alk]

I will admit that Cutler right now is probably a borderline Top 5 qb. That really means nothing though when there is such a HUGE dropoff after the top 3.

[slats]

If you think Cutler RIGHT NOW is better than McNabb, Romo, and Palmer then you're smoking crack.

He's better than Romo, and I certainly trust him more than McNabb at this stage. Palmer I would say is easily better - if he wasn't coming off a serious injury.

Even with your list though, you're talking about a guy who you think is all about potential -unfulfilled- who at 25 years old is already a top 10 QB in the NFL. I think you trade for a guy like that, no?

And while I'd hope Denver's not dealing from a position of strength, the length of potential suitors -especially with Dan Snyder among them- would suggest that their position is plenty strong.

[Alk]

For good chunks of the last season... His overall numbers are above average/near elite when you consider how bad their defense was..

So it's the defense's fault that the Broncos were only 16th. in scoring last season and tied for 4th. in INTs too I suppose.

[SMC]

Let me revise my opinion on Harris.

Concievably, if Gholston makes the leap to a good player and Rex thinks Thomas can play inside next to Scott, I'll be willing to part ways with Harris. Gholston is the key. If he makes the leap, he can make Harris expendable (Thomas too, but he's not trade bait).

[afosomf]

He's better than Romo, and I certainly trust him more than McNabb at this stage. Palmer I would say is easily better - if he wasn't coming off a serious injury.

Even with your list though, you're talking about a guy who you think is all about potential -unfulfilled- who at 25 years old is already a top 10 QB in the NFL. I think you trade for a guy like that, no?

And while I'd hope Denver's not dealing from a position of strength, the length of potential suitors -especially with Dan Snyder among them- would suggest that their position is plenty strong.

what has CP done when healthy?

Denver has leverage with 10 teams bidding...SMC is asleep at wheel

[Alk]

He's better than Romo, and I certainly trust him more than McNabb at this stage. Palmer I would say is easily better - if he wasn't coming off a serious injury.

Even with your list though, you're talking about a guy who you think is all about potential -unfulfilled- who at 25 years old is already a top 10 QB in the NFL. I think you trade for a guy like that, no?

And while I'd hope Denver's not dealing from a position of strength, the length of potential suitors -especially with Dan Snyder among them- would suggest that their position is plenty strong.

I would give him the nod over Romo only because he has a stronger arm. Other than that they're the same qb. Right now though I would take McNabb every single time. This Top 10 qb crap doesn't mean anything. It's Brady/Manning then Brees and then about 4-5 notches down before you even start to talk about the next qb on the list.

[T0mShane]

Let me revise my opinion on Harris.

Concievably, if Gholston makes the leap to a good player and Rex thinks Thomas can play inside next to Scott, I'll be willing to part ways with Harris. Gholston is the key. If he makes the leap, he can make Harris expendable (Thomas too, but he's not trade bait).

Draft is huge deep in LB prospects, man. Harris is a one-dimensional, two-down LB. A good one, yes, but a one-tick pony nonetheless.

[afosomf]

I would give him the nod over Romo only because he has a stronger arm. Other than that they're the same qb. Right now though I would take McNabb every single time. This Top 10 qb crap doesn't mean anything. It's Brady/Manning then Brees and then about 4-5 notches down before you even start to talk about the next qb on the list.

Brees!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Ben has 2 rings please...what has Drew done???????????????

Romo makes more mistakes than delhomme

[SMC]

Draft is huge deep in LB prospects, man. Harris is a one-dimensional, two-down LB. A good one, yes, but a one-tick pony nonetheless.

How deep if the Jets are giving up the 1st & 3rd.

That's the problem. The Jets are giving up a starter AND high draft picks. It's hard to give up a starter and not get the pick to replace him.

[T0mShane]

How deep if the Jets are giving up the 1st & 3rd.

That's the problem. The Jets are giving up a starter AND high draft picks. It's hard to give up a starter and not get the pick to replace him.

I know it's dicey, asking our personnel "gurus" to come up with a replacement ILB, but that IS kinda what they get paid for. Plus, with Bart Scott in the fold, they just need a banger in there next to him, not a star.

[slats]

So it's the defense's fault that the Broncos were only 16th. in scoring last season and tied for 4th. in INTs too I suppose.

I don't want to make excuses for the guy, but if the defense can't get off the field it's tough for the offense to score points. And if the defense puts your QB in a position where he's behind, he's likely to be taking more chances with the football.

And his int percentage wasn't bad. #4 in int's, but #2 in pass attempts? Not bad for a second year starter.

[afosomf]

afos top 5

1 Peyton

2 Brady

3 Ben

4 Rivers

5 Cutler

[Alk]

Brees!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Ben has 2 rings please...what has Drew done???????????????

Romo makes more mistakes than delhomme

He has two rings yet he only contributed to one. He's not in Brees' league.

[SMC]

I know it's dicey, asking our personnel "gurus" to come up with a replacement ILB, but that IS kinda what they get paid for. Plus, with Bart Scott in the fold, they just need a banger in there next to him, not a star.

I get ya, but that's why I complained about also giving up a 3rd this year. If the Jets are giving up a starter, they shouldn't have to give up 2 of their first 3 picks as well which they would use to replace a starter.

1st, Harris, and next year's 2nd would be more preferrable to me. The Jets can use the 2nd or 3rd to replace Harris and still use the other pick to fill a need.

[T0mShane]

Brees!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Ben has 2 rings please...what has Drew done???????????????

Romo makes more mistakes than delhomme

Word. It's Brady, P. Manning, Roethlisberger on the top tier. Then it's Brees, Cutler, Palmer and Rivers on the second tier.

[slats]

I would give him the nod over Romo only because he has a stronger arm. Other than that they're the same qb. Right now though I would take McNabb every single time. This Top 10 qb crap doesn't mean anything. It's Brady/Manning then Brees and then about 4-5 notches down before you even start to talk about the next qb on the list.

Right, but top 10 or like you said; borderline top 5 - from a 25 year old QB in his second year starting? He's already very good, and has the potential to get much better.

He's far from perfect, but he's better than anything on the Jets, or anyone they're likely to draft this year.

[afosomf]

He has two rings yet he only contributed to one. He's not in Brees' league.

sorry Ben will be in HOF and drew will not

Ben has game winning td drive in last 2 minutes of SB, something that

cindy hasn't done

[T0mShane]

I don't want to make excuses for the guy, but if the defense can't get off the field it's tough for the offense to score points. And if the defense puts your QB in a position where he's behind, he's likely to be taking more chances with the football.

And his int percentage wasn't bad. #4 in int's, but #2 in pass attempts? Not bad for a second year starter.

I saw a stat today somewhere, when the Broncos held the opposition to less than 21 points, Cutler is 13-1. Kind of a fuzzy stat, but there is no doubt that Cutler can put up points.

[Alk]

Right, but top 10 or like you said; borderline top 5 - from a 25 year old QB in his second year starting? He's already very good, and has the potential to get much better.

He's far from perfect, but he's better than anything on the Jets, or anyone they're likely to draft this year.

Just because he's better than what the Jets have doesn't mean they should break the bank for the guy. He goes completely against what a Rex Ryan team is provided his philosophy is anything like the Ravens. All he needs is a qb who will go out there and not make stupid mistakes.

[T0mShane]

I get ya, but that's why I complained about also giving up a 3rd this year. If the Jets are giving up a starter, they shouldn't have to give up 2 of their first 3 picks as well which they would use to replace a starter.

1st, Harris, and next year's 2nd would be more preferrable to me. The Jets can use the 2nd or 3rd to replace Harris and still use the other pick to fill a need.

Regrettably, the offer out there to beat looks to be Washington's: Jason Campbell, the #13 and Chris Cooley. The #17, Harris and a future seond rounder ain't getting it done.

[afosomf]

Just because he's better than what the Jets have doesn't mean they should break the bank for the guy. He goes completely against what a Rex Ryan team is provided his philosophy is anything like the Ravens. All he needs is a qb who will go out there and not make stupid mistakes.

you act like ed reed is in Jets secondary and he is bringing

with him the ravens DL

You need a QB to win in this league

[Thai Jet]

Ryan will not allow Tanny to give up a defensive starter. Its picks or bust.

This is getting ridiculous . If they are hell bent on getting C utler than let it just be picks. Personally I DON'T want C utler at all.

[CTM]

So it's the defense's fault that the Broncos were only 16th. in scoring last season and tied for 4th. in INTs too I suppose.

His defense was second to last in yards per drive given up last year, while Cutlers offense was #1. Denver's offense had the worst starting field position in football last season. That essentially means when CUtler got the ball he was productive with it, but his defense gave back an inordinate amount of those yards..

Now it's certainly true that it's easier to gain yards between the 20's, but it does point that his defense made it more difficult for him to score points..

[CTM]

Top 5 based on "now" rather than what they may be. We're not talking projection or ceiling, but right now. The reason being that RIGHT NOW, without any projection or account for ceiling Revis is a Top 5 CB.

Here's my list of QB who are better than Cutler right now (in no particular order):

Peyton

Brady

Palmer

Brees

Rivers

McNabb

Big Ben

Romo

Cutler's close, but he's not there yet. Revis, on the other hand, is.

Not seeing it. There isn't a guy on that list that is a no brainer to take over Cutler besides Rivers..

[Thai Jet]

I don't believe this one bit. Jerry Jones said he wouldn't trade Romo for anybody.

I didn't even check and I don't believe you. BAN THIS FOOL!

He also told T.O. he wasn't going anywhere.

[Thai Jet]

[quote name='Blackout

[Alk]

Not seeing it. There isn't a guy on that list that is a no brainer to take over Cutler besides Rivers..

Brees? Seriously? Cutler isn't in his league. I would take Roethelshamburgler over Cutler every single time and I freakin' hate the guy.

[slats]

Just because he's better than what the Jets have doesn't mean they should break the bank for the guy. He goes completely against what a Rex Ryan team is provided his philosophy is anything like the Ravens. All he needs is a qb who will go out there and not make stupid mistakes.

I don't want the Jets to bid against themselves for the guy, but the fact is that they'll be bidding against other teams and the cost is probably going to be pretty high.

While I have some optimism about Rex Ryan, if I'm the Jets front office I'm not quite as concerned about what he wants as I am about getting a potential franchise QB in here. If Cutlah comes here, he could very well be the team's QB for the next decade. I don't think the Jets have ever had a coach last ten years.

And I'm not terribly concerned about his philosophy in that respect while he's here. Sometimes coaches win against their philosophy. Brian Billick went to the Ravens as something of an offensive guru, and won the Super Bowl without an offense. Tony Dungy preached nothing but dee for all his years at Tampa Bay, then won a Super Bowl in INdy when he hooked up with Peyton Manning.

I'd hope that Rex Ryan would be able to fit a Pro Bowl QB into his plan for the team. I bet he could.

[InstantClassic]

LOL...Ecurb is like Rodney Dangerfield.

[Jetsfan80]

Chris Mortensen had us as the 3rd most likely team to get Cutler, behind the Bucs and Redskins.

I tend to agree with Mort. We may not have the most pieces in place to go after him, but we've shown we're willing to do what's necessary. I wouldn't put it past Tanenbaum to send a David Harris or Darrelle Revis along with a draft pick to get Cutler.

[Jetsfan80]

I don't think you can make an argument that we shouldn't be going after Cutler at all. Would ANYONE be willing to justify our chances with Clemens, Ratliff and/or a 1st round QB at the helm? The question is clearly, what are we giving up?

I'd be willing to give up a 1st, 4th, and Harris to get Cutler. Our 3rd rounder could be used on bringing in a LB. If it's just draft picks, then I wouldn't be against giving a 1st and future picks for Cutler and, perhaps, a 5th rounder back.

Beyond that is pushing it.

[Aten]

Of course.

Yes, there is. If you look at the last 30 or so SB champions, with few exceptions, the 3 common attributes were:

1. A top 10 defense in points AND overall

2. A QB who had a probowl caliber year the year the team wins the SB

3. Offense that scores 23 or more points

If you look at the history, it is the rarity when a franchise QB wins a SB without an elite defense. The opposite is not the case. Elite defenses have won more SBs without franchise QBs than franchise QBs have won SBs without elite defenses.

Why would I look at 30? Half of those are pre-FA, which obviously matters a lot. An elite quarterback has a much longer shelf life than an elite defense.

It's not a false comparison if the Jets defense RIGHT NOW is elite. I believe it is. I don't believe Cutler is elite right now. Thus, the Jets defense, with Harris is already an elite unit, but we have to wait for Cutler to become elite.

I'll spot you Harris is elite and Cutler isn't and it's still a false comparison because Harris is 9% of a defense and Cutler is 100% of a quarterback.

LOL. The reason goes to the above. The Jets defense is elite IMO and that unit is stripped of a starter in the hopes of getting a QB who may or may not become elite in the future.

Id.

I believe it's overspending because I don't believe any other team is giving up a starter. We've gone over this before. The Broncos are not negotiating from a position of strength.

When Bowlen went public yesterday that was like blood in the water for a bunch of sharks rather than the start of a Sotheby auction.

They're negotiating from such a position of strength they can't screw it up despite what appear to be their best efforts to do so.

[Blackout]

just heard this on Fox sports radio!

it's not April 1st anymore so I doubt it's a joke