Swine Flu original carrier traced back to NYC man

[gangreenman]

yeah.....it def sucks. but so far the onyl confirmed death in the US is a 2 year old mexican toddler. how weird is it that it seems, so far, only mexicans have died from this flu.

Only 1 person total, an infant has actually died from the flu itself. Most (if not all) of the young adult, middle age Mexicans that have died contracted another disease (ie pnemonia or some other potentially deadly if not treated disease) due to a weakened immune system and living in a not so healthy environment.

I agree the flu needs to be taken seriously and I think its understandable, in fact, suggested, that people take extra precautions to avoid contracting the virus...But the measures Bugg was talking about would be WAYY over the top. I understand school closings, I understand stopping contact sports, but not letting people leave the country and closing off all borders both ways, and quarantining all infected people is NOT necessary. As of now, all medical research shows that symptoms and gravity of this flu is no different from the normal human influenza disease. So, unless we are going to quarantine all of those people as well, I dont see a need to do it for Swine Flu carriers.

[gangreenman]

Hopefully those people were weak and that's why they are dead, but remember when AIDS only affected gays and drug users?

This could be deadly serious.

AIDS is a disease that kills everyone infected eventually. The Swine Flu is same as the regular flu, some people have died, some people are treated and make a full recovery, and some people dont get treated at all and still have a full recovery.

..And AIDS still does affect mostly gays and drug users. The rest of the people that die of AIDS made a choice and took the risk of not wearing appropriate protection...

[neckdemon]

Hopefully those people were weak and that's why they are dead, but remember when AIDS only affected gays and drug users?

This could be deadly serious.

i didn't mean it that way. i just thought it was odd that so far only mexicans have died....even the one death in america was a mexican. mexico doesn't have such great healthcare.

[victorjets]

Among the swine flu mysteries: Why only deaths in Mexico?

By Arthur Brice

CNN

(CNN) -- It's a confounding question on the lips of disease detectives: Why have the only deaths from the swine flu outbreak happened in Mexico?

Investigators also want to know why the disease has killed young adults, who should have the greatest resistance.

"They're good questions that we're asking, too," said Von Roebuck, spokesman for the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention. "We're still young in this investigation and we're still trying to understand exposure in this country as well as exposure in Mexico."

Mexico has reported 152 fatalities in flu-like cases in recent days, seven of which have been confirmed as swine flu. Another 19 patients have been confirmed as having swine flu but surviving. About 2,000 people have been hospitalized with symptoms.

By contrast, the United States has had 64 confirmed cases, five hospitalizations and no deaths.

"The difference in seriousness between the known U.S. cases and the Mexican cases is the question that everyone wants to answer," said Maryn McKenna, author of "Beating Back the Devil," a 2004 book on the history of the CDC, and the forthcoming "Superbug," about drug-resistant staph.

There are no hard answers, but a consensus is emerging: The disease in Mexico has likely been around longer and infected more people than investigators can confirm.

"Do we really know all of the cases that existed in Mexico or is this just the tip of the iceberg?" asked Louis Sullivan, a physician and former head of Health and Human Services under President George H.W. Bush.

McKenna said it's possible "there is much more flu in Mexico than we know because it hasn't been counted. That would mean that there are mild cases there as well, but that you have to get to a certain number of cases before, statistically, you start to see the very serious ones, and the U.S. hasn't had that many cases yet."

It's a view shared on the streets of Mexico City, the hardest-hit area.

"My intuition is that as the medical community starts looking around and at what has happened they may find that swine flu was there and they just didn't catch it," said Ana Maria Salazar, a radio talk show host and political blogger who lives in Mexico City. "Nobody was looking for this. We were all looking for this in Asia."

The new virus has genes from North American swine influenza, avian influenza, human influenza and a form of swine influenza normally found in Asia and Europe, said Nancy Cox, chief of the CDC's Influenza Division.

Influenza is basically an extreme upper respiratory infection, and, by itself, is rarely fatal. But it can lead to deadly complications, such as pneumonia. About 36,000 Americans die from flu complications every year.

Swine flu is caused by a virus similar to the type of flu virus that, in various forms, infects people every year, but is a strain typically found only in pigs -- or in people who have direct contact with pigs.

A couple of factors could be causing the greater death toll in Mexico, said Howard Markel, a physician and director of the Center for the History of Medicine at the University of Michigan.

"They may have had cases for several months now and probably have a greater number of people who have the disease, probably tens of thousands," he said. "There may indeed be more cases in the United States. The snapshot we're seeing in the United States may be an incomplete snapshot."

Also, he said, the people who have died in Mexico could have had what he called "another co-factor," such as taking medicine or having pre-existing infections that would make them more vulnerable. It's also possible, he said, that those who died had an underlying genetic predisposition or condition.

Sullivan also pointed to possible "complicating factors," such as malnutrition, poor housing or crowded conditions.

Markel noted that "flu was classically called a crowding disease in the 19th century."

Disease investigators also are concerned by the fact that the outbreak has killed people in the prime of their lives, when they should have peak resistance.

"It is certainly a red flag," Markel said.

Health authorities have pointed out that this swine flu strain has never been seen. That may have a lot to do with the deaths, Markel said.

"It's a fairly novel strain," he said, "and the deaths could be from healthy people who have a healthy, robust immune system that overreacts."

That could result in a "cytokine storm" in which the body secretes too many chemicals as it tries to kill offending microorganisms.

The hyper-response can lead to accumulation of fluid in the lungs and a condition called "acute respiratory distress syndrome."

Julio Frenk, former health minister of Mexico and now dean of the Harvard School of Public Health, holds an opposing view: The disease could be killing people who are not healthy because of their living conditions.

"There could also be some elements in the host," he said. "These are poor people. Maybe their immune response is not as efficient. So we're going to have to just keep trying to understand why this difference and whether that continues as the epidemic unfolds."

He also noted that antiviral medications need to be taken within hours of the onset of symptoms, but people in Mexico may not have sought treatment immediately, if at all.

As the outbreak continues to unfold, so will the investigation.

"We're making every effort to truly understand this virus," said CDC's Roebuck. "But some of the reasons for what's happening we may never figure out."

[Bugg]

Only 1 person total, an infant has actually died from the flu itself. Most (if not all) of the young adult, middle age Mexicans that have died contracted another disease (ie pnemonia or some other potentially deadly if not treated disease) due to a weakened immune system and living in a not so healthy environment.

I agree the flu needs to be taken seriously and I think its understandable, in fact, suggested, that people take extra precautions to avoid contracting the virus.But the measures Bugg was talking about would be WAYY over the top. I understand school closings, I understand stopping contact sports, but not letting people leave the country and closing off all borders both ways, and quarantining all infected people is NOT necessary. As of now, all medical research shows that symptoms and gravity of this flu is no different from the normal human influenza disease. So, unless we are going to quarantine all of those people as well, I dont see a need to do it for Swine Flu carriers.

I acknowledge those measures may seem way over the top. However the one person who died was an infant who traveled with family to be treated in TExas. The locus of the disease is in Mexico.

Suspect that with adequate treatment here almost everyone who contracts the flu would recover with minimal problems. But the concern is our health care system being overwhelmed with transitory infected people The government only has 50 million doses of tamiflu stocked up. If they find themselves releasing more of them to hospitals on our southern border to meet the demand for Mexicans coming here, it will quickly dissipate the stockpile.And those Mexicans will expand the infection rate.

And the reason the border is not being secured, really, is because if we can do it, there will be no reason it couldn't be done all the time. PC issues are winning out over public safety. We should do everything we can to help the Mexican people, but we should be doing it in Mexico, not here.

[gangreenman]

I acknowledge those measures may seem way over the top. However the one person who died was an infant who traveled with family to be treated in TExas. The locus of the disease is in Mexico.

Suspect that with adequate treatment here almost everyone who contracts the flu would recover with minimal problems. But the concern is our health care system being overwhelmed with transitory infected people The government only has 50 million doses of tamiflu stocked up. If they find themselves releasing more of them to hospitals on our southern border to meet the demand for Mexicans coming here, it will quickly dissipate the stockpile.And those Mexicans will expand the infection rate.

And the reason the border is not being secured, really, is because if we can do it, there will be no reason it couldn't be done all the time. PC issues are winning out over public safety. We should do everything we can to help the Mexican people, but we should be doing it in Mexico, not here.

So what do you suggest Bugg? Send our entire national guard to ensure the Mexican border is locked down? Other then hurt business and cost taxpayers money, what exactly would that accomplish? The disease is already in the states...

The key word in that paragraph about the one dead person, INFANT. ONE INFANT has died from this disease. More infants die from viruses such as the common cold every year than have died TOTAL from Swine Flu.

And we do not just hand out vaccinations to anybody. The people receiving the vaccination either have to be insured or can pay for it separately.

[The Crusher]

So what do you suggest Bugg? Send our entire national guard to ensure the Mexican border is locked down? Other then hurt business and cost taxpayers money, what exactly would that accomplish? The disease is already in the states...

The key word in that paragraph about the one dead person, INFANT. ONE INFANT has died from this disease. More infants die from viruses such as the common cold every year than have died TOTAL from Swine Flu.

And we do not just hand out vaccinations to anybody. The people receiving the vaccination either have to be insured or can pay for it separately.

Maybe not Bugg, but snake thinks this is the perfect idea.

[Bugg]

So what do you suggest Bugg? Send our entire national guard to ensure the Mexican border is locked down? Other then hurt business and cost taxpayers money, what exactly would that accomplish? The disease is already in the states...

The key word in that paragraph about the one dead person, INFANT. ONE INFANT has died from this disease. More infants die from viruses such as the common cold every year than have died TOTAL from Swine Flu.

And we do not just hand out vaccinations to anybody. The people receiving the vaccination either have to be insured or can pay for it separately.

You sure about that? That's the crux of the problem; that's been the crux of the immigration issue for YEARS. Our hospitals on the southern border ERs have been used as the GP by Mexicans forever. It doesn't figure to change in a health emergency, in fact, quite the contrary. And do you expect desperate sick people to get turned away and just leave quietly? I don't.

[PatriotReign37]

I think they are very concerend that the virus will become immune to drugs currently being used to treat its symptoms.

[gangreenman]

You sure about that? That's the crux of the problem; that's been the crux of the immigration issue for YEARS. Our hospitals on the southern border ERs have been used as the GP by Mexicans forever. It doesn't figure to change in a health emergency, in fact, quite the contrary. And do you expect desperate sick people to get turned away and just leave quietly? I don't.

Well if thats true then why are we only shutting down the border in medical emergencies? And its funny. I was doing some research today, the disease has been most prevalently diagnosed in New York. If this really was such a problem, wouldnt the number of cases in Texas be more than half of what they are in New York?

[PatriotReign37]

And we do not just hand out vaccinations to anybody. The people receiving the vaccination either have to be insured or can pay for it separately.

There is no vaccine for Swine Flu

[gangreenman]

I think they are very concerend that the virus will become immune to drugs currently being used to treat its symptoms.

Unlikely. The disease would have to be around for years and have been treated on many occasions in order for such a mutation to take place. The fact that humans have been treated with these drugs is evidence that the Swine Flu does not carry this mutation from the regular influenza.

[gangreenman]

There is no vaccine for Swine Flu

Wrong. Antiretroviral vaccinations have been used to treat Swine Flu. Ill supply a link shortly.

Ok...Sorry, no vaccination...And I meant antivirals, not antiretrovirals.... The medicine recommended to cure Swine Flu has the same effect as the vaccination for the regular flu though...

Per CDC:

Are there medicines to treat swine flu?

Yes. CDC recommends the use of oseltamivir or zanamivir for the treatment and/or prevention of infection with these swine influenza viruses. Antiviral drugs are prescription medicines (pills, liquid or an inhaler) that fight against the flu by keeping flu viruses from reproducing in your body. If you get sick, antiviral drugs can make your illness milder and make you feel better faster. They may also prevent serious flu complications. For treatment, antiviral drugs work best if started soon after getting sick (within 2 days of symptoms).

[PatriotReign37]

Unlikely. The disease would have to be around for years and have been treated on many occasions in order for such a mutation to take place. The fact that humans have been treated with these drugs is evidence that the Swine Flu does not carry this mutation from the regular influenza.

This disease has been around for years.

Check it out. http://www.cdc.gov/swineflu/key_facts.htm

[rillo]

[PatriotReign37]

Wrong. Antiretroviral vaccinations have been used to treat Swine Flu. Ill supply a link shortly.

Vaccines are used as a preventive measure.

[gangreenman]

This disease has been around for years.

Check it out. http://www.cdc.gov/swineflu/key_facts.htm

Its been around in pigs. My point is people have been and are being treated with these drugs now...Thus suggesting the mutation which allowed for the disease to easily spread from human-to-human did not also mutate to block against the anti-virals

[PatriotReign37]

Its been around in pigs. My point is people have been and are being treated with these drugs now...Thus suggesting the mutation which allowed for the disease to easily spread from human-to-human did not also mutate to block against the anti-virals

The disease in humans was discovered 33 years ago in NJ - 1976.

There are four different antiviral drugs that are licensed for use in the US for the treatment of influenza: amantadine, rimantadine, oseltamivir and zanamivir. While most swine influenza viruses have been susceptible to all four drugs, the most recent swine influenza viruses isolated from humans are resistant to amantadine and rimantadine. At this time, CDC recommends the use of oseltamivir or zanamivir for the treatment and/or prevention of infection with swine influenza viruses.

This implies that the virus became resistant to 2 of the 4 drugs used for treatment.

[afosomf]

Vincent: Want some bacon?

Jules: No man, I don't eat pork.

Vincent: Are you Jewish?

Jules: Nah, I ain't Jewish, I just don't dig on swine, that's all.

Vincent: Why not?

Jules: Pigs are filthy animals. I don't eat filthy animals.

Vincent: Bacon tastes gooood. Pork chops taste gooood.

Jules: Hey, sewer rat may taste like pumpkin pie, but I'd never know 'cause I wouldn't eat the filthy mother****er. Pigs sleep and root in ****. That's a filthy animal. I ain't eat nothin' that ain't got enough sense enough to disregard its own feces.

Vincent: How about a dog? Dogs eats its own feces.

Jules: I don't eat dog either.

Vincent: Yeah, but do you consider a dog to be a filthy animal?

Jules: I wouldn't go so far as to call a dog filthy but they're definitely dirty. But, a dog's got personality. Personality goes a long way.

Vincent: Ah, so by that rationale, if a pig had a better personality, he would cease to be a filthy animal. Is that true?

Jules: Well we'd have to be talkin' about one charming mother****in' pig. I mean he'd have to be ten times more charmin' than that Arnold on Green Acres, you know what I'm sayin'?

[neckdemon]

The disease in humans was discovered 33 years ago in NJ - 1976.

There are four different antiviral drugs that are licensed for use in the US for the treatment of influenza: amantadine, rimantadine, oseltamivir and zanamivir. While most swine influenza viruses have been susceptible to all four drugs, the most recent swine influenza viruses isolated from humans are resistant to amantadine and rimantadine. At this time, CDC recommends the use of oseltamivir or zanamivir for the treatment and/or prevention of infection with swine influenza viruses.

This implies that the virus became resistant to 2 of the 4 drugs used for treatment.

yeah but i don't think they can make an effective vaccine from a strain that was around 33 years ago. when i was reading about it i read somewhere that they make vaccines from current flu strains and they decide which ones to use based on what they think will be going around. influenza viruses have an ability to shift and change and can render even a current vaccine useless. at least that's the way i understood what i was reading. either way, as long as this one continues to appear relatively mild then we probably won't be seeing anything like the black death pandemic......

[victorjets]

AIDS is a disease that kills everyone infected eventually. The Swine Flu is same as the regular flu, some people have died, some people are treated and make a full recovery, and some people dont get treated at all and still have a full recovery.

..And AIDS still does affect mostly gays and drug users. The rest of the people that die of AIDS made a choice and took the risk of not wearing appropriate protection...

C'mon, I know that. I was just pointing out a virus that was not taken seriously enough at the time it was first discovered.

Neckdemon, I understand what you were saying, and according to that article I posted, you are right.

[Lil Bit Special]

I was at a ball game tonight (NH Fishercats- AA Bluejays)

Woman behind me asked her husband if the gas tank was full and if there was plenty of money because she wanted to go shopping and stock up on food for 2 weeks in case the swine flu gets out of control and she's stuck in the house.

I honestly dont know why everyone's getting so worked up over this. If this was called Mexican Flu nobody would give a sh!t.

[jetophile]

I heard annual flu deaths are closer to 35,000 per year. Obviously I'm not gonna purposely hold a dirty rag infested with influenza germs over my nose and mouth for shiggles, but people seem to be freaking out disproportionately. We're all gonna die, am I riggggggght.

Today was 6 years to the day that I lapsed into a coma, not expected to live, and not only did I do so (no-one can explain it), but I didn't emerge blind, deaf, and irreversibly fukking retarded (no-one can explain that, either), which is almost the bigger miracle between the two. Not completely unaffected, but minor in the grand scheme of things. It wound up having some positive effects, too, so it all balances out, no puns intended. I'll take it.

The last thing I was thinking about sprinting through the woods after work today was Swine Flu. Sorry to the families of the people who perished, but death is a fact of life. When your number ain't up, it ain't up. When it is, vaya con Dios.

[joebabyny]

Hopefully those people were weak and that's why they are dead, but remember when AIDS only affected gays and drug users?

This could be deadly serious.

THAT'S IT, NOBODY HAVE SEX WITH THE MEXICANS!!

lol

[joebabyny]

I honestly dont know why everyone's getting so worked up over this. If this was called Mexican Flu nobody would give a sh!t.

The mexican flu hits hardest on may 6th and any monday, lol

[afosomf]

I was at a ball game tonight (NH Fishercats- AA Bluejays)

Woman behind me asked her husband if the gas tank was full and if there was plenty of money because she wanted to go shopping and stock up on food for 2 weeks in case the swine flu gets out of control and she's stuck in the house.

I honestly dont know why everyone's getting so worked up over this. If this was called Mexican Flu nobody would give a sh!t.

maybe they should change name to Mumbles Flu

[Borgoguy]

I saw something on the news yesterday that is really at the heart of any epidemic: The stupidity of most people in our society. The piece showed two volunteers in NYC, dressed in lab coats, handing out information on swine flu and ways to prevent its spread by washing hands, etc. So help me, the male volunteer was licking his finger each time he grabbed a handout to give to a passerby. Now, if this f**king POS moron was infected or incubating the virus, he just passed it to hundreds of others who would, in turn, give it to thousands more. Next time you're in a deli, restaurant, or in mass transit, notice how many people touch their mouths, eyes or noses. Or cough or sneeze into their hand rather than into the crook of the arm, or right into the air without covering up. Now, everything they touch has the potential to make you sick. Forget prevention, as we are at the mercy of idiots who have no concept of how you live in a civilized society.

[neckdemon]

I heard annual flu deaths are closer to 35,000 per year. Obviously I'm not gonna purposely hold a dirty rag infested with influenza germs over my nose and mouth for shiggles, but people seem to be freaking out disproportionately. We're all gonna die, am I riggggggght.

Today was 6 years to the day that I lapsed into a coma, not expected to live, and not only did I do so (no-one can explain it), but I didn't emerge blind, deaf, and irreversibly fukking retarded (no-one can explain that, either), which is almost the bigger miracle between the two. Not completely unaffected, but minor in the grand scheme of things. It wound up having some positive effects, too, so it all balances out, no puns intended. I'll take it.

The last thing I was thinking about sprinting through the woods after work today was Swine Flu. Sorry to the families of the people who perished, but death is a fact of life. When your number ain't up, it ain't up. When it is, vaya con Dios.

wow.....not to be nosy but what caused you to lapse into a coma?

[Ranger]

THAT'S IT, NOBODY HAVE SEX WITH THE MEXICANS!!

lol

WOAH! WOAH! WOAH! Lets not go to drastic measures now.

[afosomf]

wow.....not to be nosy but what caused you to lapse into a coma?

seeing max Naked:D

[Green DNA]

The mexican flu hits hardest on may 6th and any monday, lol

Or after too many tacos and black beans

[JerryK]

WOAH! WOAH! WOAH! Lets not go to drastic measures now.

Those two arent' mexican. They're made by Dow Chemical here in Michigan.

[NJ]

Can you catch swine flu from eating a Boars Head hotdog?

Only with kraut on it.

[The Gun Of Bavaria]

The Swine Flu is nothing more than a vast communist conspiracy, to sap and impurify, all of our precious bodily fluids.

[rillo]