And you thought Idzik's picks were done making news

[detectivekimble]

5 hours ago, T0mShane said:

 

Included in that "19 picks" are 7 picks taken in the sixth and seventh rounds. Jace Amaro had 53 catches as a rookie, or 43 more than Devin Smith has had in two seasons. Smith and Lorenzo Mauldin are likely cuts this year, and if they draft a QB, Petty will be gone too. Darron Lee was getting replaced by Julian Stanford and Bruce Carter at times last year and looked like the overmatched gimp strong safety we all knew he'd be even before he had the crippling soft-tissue injury that most 180-pound dudes get when they take steroids to get up to 220 lbs. Brandon Shell showed so much promise that they gave Jags castoff Kelvin Beachum $11 mil to replace him. Let's leave Hackenberg out of this conversation as a small mercy to you. We can hope they improve, but it's blind optimism to suggest that Maccagnan is light years better than anyone, even someone like Idzik, yet.

First of all, Amaro doesn't even have 53 receptions for his entire career.  Second of all, Devin Smith has been hurt and the timing of his injuries have been awful.  He hasn't even had a training camp or played in a preseason game.  He'll be fully healthy and ready to go this year.  

Shell was drafted to be a RT and it looks like he'll be starting there. 

Maccagnan is absolutely better than Idzik.  He's done a nice job in the lower rounds and with UDFAs.  He understands that you need a QB in this league to win and tried to get Mariota and Goff.  He also understands that you need to have some stars on the team.  Idzik was looking for bargain FAs.  Sometimes you need to go out there and get a Brandon Marshall.

[AFJF]

5 hours ago, T0mShane said:

 

Included in that "19 picks" are 7 picks taken in the sixth and seventh rounds. Jace Amaro had 53 catches as a rookie, or 43 more than Devin Smith has had in two seasons. Smith and Lorenzo Mauldin are likely cuts this year, and if they draft a QB, Petty will be gone too. Darron Lee was getting replaced by Julian Stanford and Bruce Carter at times last year and looked like the overmatched gimp strong safety we all knew he'd be even before he had the crippling soft-tissue injury that most 180-pound dudes get when they take steroids to get up to 220 lbs. Brandon Shell showed so much promise that they gave Jags castoff Kelvin Beachum $11 mil to replace him. Let's leave Hackenberg out of this conversation as a small mercy to you. We can hope they improve, but it's blind optimism to suggest that Maccagnan is light years better than anyone, even someone like Idzik, yet.

Oh, I didn't realize late round picks didn't count as picks.  

[thadude]

8 hours ago, AFJF said:

So hard to figure out which one was worse when you look at this.....

						Misc					Passing					Rushing			Receiving
Year	Rnd		Pick	Pos	To	AP1	PB	St	CarAV	G	Cmp	Att	Yds	TD	Int	Att	Yds	TD	Rec	Yds	TD	Int	Sk	College/Univ
2016	1	Darron Lee	20	OLB	2016	0	0	1	4	13													1.0	Ohio St.
2016	2	Christian Hackenberg	51	QB		0	0	0																Penn St.
2016	3	Jordan Jenkins	83	OLB	2016	0	0	1	5	14													2.5	Georgia
2016	4	Juston Burris	118	CB	2016	0	0	0	1	16												1		North Carolina St.
2016	5	Brandon Shell	158	T	2016	0	0	0	2	8														South Carolina
2016	7	Lac Edwards	235	P	2016	0	0	1	0	16						1	0	0						Sam Houston St.
2016	7	Charone Peake	241	WR	2016	0	0	0	1	15									19	186	0			Clemson
Year	Rnd	Player	Pick	Pos	To	AP1	PB	St	CarAV	G	Cmp	Att	Yds	TD	Int	Att	Yds	TD	Rec	Yds	TD	Int	Sk	College/Univ
2015	1	Leonard Williams	6	DE	2016	0	1	1	19	32													10.0	USC
2015	2	Devin Smith	37	WR	2016	0	0	0	1	14									10	135	1			Ohio St.
2015	3	Lorenzo Mauldin	82	OLB	2016	0	0	0	4	26												1	6.5	Louisville
2015	4	Bryce Petty	103	QB	2016	0	0	0	2	6	75	133	809	3	7	5	19	0						Baylor
2015	5	Jarvis Harrison	152	G		0	0	0																Texas A&M
2015	7	Deon Simon	223	NT	2016	0	0	0	2	16													1.5	NW State (LA)

 

Vs This....

 

2014	1	Calvin Pryor	18	DB	2016	0	0	3	14	44												2	0.5	Louisville
2014	2	Jace Amaro	49	TE	2016	0	0	0	4	17									41	404	2			Texas Tech
2014	3	Dexter McDougle	80	DB	2016	0	0	0	1	20														Maryland
2014	4	Jalen Saunders	104	WR	2014	0	0	0	0	15									1	7	0			Oklahoma
2014	4	Shaquelle Evans	115	WR		0	0	0																UCLA
2014	4	Dakota Dozier	137	OL	2016	0	0	0	1	17														Furman
2014	5	Jeremiah George	154	LB	2015	0	0	0	1	21														Iowa St.
2014	6	Brandon Dixon	195	DB	2014	0	0	0	1	14												1		NW Missouri St.
2014	6	Quincy Enunwa	209	WR	2016	0	0	1	9	29						1	12	0	80	1172	4			Nebraska
2014	6	IK Enemkpali	210	DT	2015	0	0	0	1	17														Louisiana Tech
2014	6	Tajh Boyd	213	QB		0	0	0																Clemson
2014	7	Trevor Reilly	233	LB	2016	0	0	0	2	31													1.0	Utah
Year	Rnd	Player	Pick	Pos	To	AP1	PB	St	CarAV	G	Cmp	Att	Yds	TD	Int	Att	Yds	TD	Rec	Yds	TD	Int	Sk	College/Univ
2013	1	Dee Milliner	9	DB	2015	0	0	1	6	21												3		Alabama
2013	1	Sheldon Richardson	13	DT	2016	0	1	2	26	58						4	4	2					18.0	Missouri
2013	2	Geno Smith	39	QB	2016	0	0	2	14	33	501	866	5962	28	36	135	647	7	1	13	0			West Virginia
2013	3	Brian Winters	72	G	2016	0	0	3	15	51														Kent St.
2013	5	Oday Aboushi	141	T	2016	0	0	1	7	26														Virginia
2013	6	William Campbell	178	OL		0	0	0																Michigan
2013	7	Tommy Bohanon	215	RB	2015	0	0	1	1	36						20	67	0	17	155	0			Wake Forest

 

Idzik needed 19 picks to find  5 NFL players who are JAG or better (Pryor, Enunwa, Sheldon, Winters, Dozier) and thats' being generous as Dozier only has a couple of starts.

Mac has at least 8 guys who have shown they may be able to play in the NFL with 13 picks.  5 out of 19 or 8 out of 13...the similarity is uncanny..

As we always say, you need three years to grade a draft, Mac's first class is about to enter their third season, so saying they're great or terrible at this point is early.  What we can say is that they've shown signs of being capable NFL players at the very least...far more than roughly 13 of Idzik's 19 picks.

Yeah I do t see how Mac has actually been better so far

[RutgersJetFan]

you guys think idzik would have had the stones or personnel knowledge to draft a redshirt quarterback in the face of this fanbase? no? well their you have it

[thadude]

22 minutes ago, detectivekimble said:

First of all, Amaro doesn't even have 53 receptions for his entire career.  Second of all, Devin Smith has been hurt and the timing of his injuries have been awful.  He hasn't even had a training camp or played in a preseason game.  He'll be fully healthy and ready to go this year.  

Shell was drafted to be a RT and it looks like he'll be starting there. 

Maccagnan is absolutely better than Idzik.  He's done a nice job in the lower rounds and with UDFAs.  He understands that you need a QB in this league to win and tried to get Mariota and Goff.  He also understands that you need to have some stars on the team.  Idzik was looking for bargain FAs.  Sometimes you need to go out there and get a Brandon Marshall.

Smith is trash and Hack is even worse.  Mac's contracts have been a horror show so far(Revis, Mo, Skrine, Forte, Fitz)

 

How anyone can argue Mac is "absolutely better" than Idzik is nonsensical

[thadude]

1 minute ago, RutgersJetFan said:

you guys think idzik would have had the stones or personnel knowledge to draft a redshirt quarterback in the face of this fanbase? no? well their you have it

Lolz

[thadude]

5 hours ago, Jetster said:

Are u f*cking kidding me? So he took a flyer on Hackenberg with a 2nd rounder. I'd rather fail picking a QB at 2, then pick Stephen Hill, Vlad Ducasse, and all the rest that have failed since David Harris was taken in the 2nd round. 

You guys expect too much too soon out of draft picks. My god, every WR Macc took late or picked up as UDFAs is better than all of Idziks picks except Quincy Enunwa who most of you boobs called a bust too. Robbie Anderson might turn out to be better than Quincy when it's all said & done at being a wide receiver. Quincy is a bit of a hybrid who still is working on his hands, though he gets better every year.

Ive said this before, a blind folded monkey throwing darts would have probably done a better job than Idzik. I still don't get the Macc hate yet? No GM is gonna draft at 100% success rate. We picked at f*cking 20 last year, who would you have taken over Lee there? Macc is trying to add speed to every level of the defense. If he comes away with Adams in this draft Lee, Adams could be similar to Wagner/Thomas combo in Seattle. Until we get a QB he's gotta find starters & he's doing that.

 Idzik didn't draft Hill and Vlad skippy

 

And as far as Robbie Anderson being this huge victory for Macc -- Rich Kotite discovered Wayne Chrebet wanna give him a GM job too?

 

I don't hate Mac I just think he's done a totally crappy job so far 

[AFJF]

Why doesn't Mac only draft teh pro-bowlers in every round? GMing iz easy n stuff.

[AFJF]

1 hour ago, detectivekimble said:

First of all, Amaro doesn't even have 53 receptions for his entire career.  Second of all, Devin Smith has been hurt and the timing of his injuries have been awful.  He hasn't even had a training camp or played in a preseason game.  He'll be fully healthy and ready to go this year.  

Shell was drafted to be a RT and it looks like he'll be starting there. 

Maccagnan is absolutely better than Idzik.  He's done a nice job in the lower rounds and with UDFAs.  He understands that you need a QB in this league to win and tried to get Mariota and Goff.  He also understands that you need to have some stars on the team.  Idzik was looking for bargain FAs.  Sometimes you need to go out there and get a Brandon Marshall.

Stop it with this.  Errybuddy nose that if a player isn't in the pro-bowl in year one, he's a bust.

[NoBowles]

I'm waiting for Shane and Batesman to convince us on how passing on Carr, Garapollo and Bridgewater, because he already had the immortal Geno Smith, was actually a brilliant move, and had Jets fans not put up a sign we would have profited from that brilliance.

[AFJF]

11 minutes ago, NoBowles said:

I'm waiting for Shane and Batesman to convince us on how passing on Carr, Garapollo and Bridgewater, because he already had the immortal Geno Smith, was actually a brilliant move, and had Jets fans not put up a sign we would have profited from that brilliance.

Don't forget what a great move it was to pass on all of those first and second round scrub receivers in favor of 5' 3'' Jalen Saunders...these are the moves that build championships.

[AFJF]

1 hour ago, detectivekimble said:

First of all, Amaro doesn't even have 53 receptions for his entire career.  Second of all, Devin Smith has been hurt and the timing of his injuries have been awful.  He hasn't even had a training camp or played in a preseason game.  He'll be fully healthy and ready to go this year.  

Shell was drafted to be a RT and it looks like he'll be starting there. 

Maccagnan is absolutely better than Idzik.  He's done a nice job in the lower rounds and with UDFAs.  He understands that you need a QB in this league to win and tried to get Mariota and Goff.  He also understands that you need to have some stars on the team.  Idzik was looking for bargain FAs.  Sometimes you need to go out there and get a Brandon Marshall.

You tryin' to tell me Dimitri Patterson as a number one CB wasn't a good free agent signing?  

[NoBowles]

10 minutes ago, AFJF said:

Don't forget what a great move it was to pass on all of those first and second round scrub receivers in favor of 5' 3'' Jalen Saunders...these are the moves that build championships.

Its called innovation, pretty sure th Browns were all over that move if Idzik didn't pull the trigger first.

[T0mShane]

50 minutes ago, NoBowles said:

I'm waiting for Shane and Batesman to convince us on how passing on Carr, Garapollo and Bridgewater, because he already had the immortal Geno Smith, was actually a brilliant move, and had Jets fans not put up a sign we would have profited from that brilliance.

We're not arguing that Idzik was any good. Simply pointing out that Maccagnan took over a clean slate roster two years ago and made it worse despite spending ludicrous amounts of money. 

[Jet9]

Jets fans are the worst.

[Jetster]

1 hour ago, thadude said:

 Idzik didn't draft Hill and Vlad skippy

 

And as far as Robbie Anderson being this huge victory for Macc -- Rich Kotite discovered Wayne Chrebet wanna give him a GM job too?

 

I don't hate Mac I just think he's done a totally crappy job so far 

Where did I say that Idzik drafted Hill & Ducasse? I was making a point about using a 2nd on Hackenberg. And my name isn't Skippy schmuck. Give me a break, Chrebet practiced & played so well Kotite couldn't ignore him. Kotite didn't discover Chrebet, Chrebet played at Hofstra & was a walk on UDFA. Chrebet found the Jets across the parking lot.

[SickJetFan]

27 minutes ago, dbatesman said:

Just did some reearch on this, and the answer? Never. Literally never in NFL history. BIGG. *******. MACC.

 

6 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

We're not arguing that Idzik was any good. Simply pointing out that Maccagnan took over a clean slate roster two years ago and made it worse despite spending ludicrous amounts of money. 

Actually he took the disaster idziot created and took it to s winning season 1 game away from playoffs

Unfortunately jets suffered the injury bug and poor coaching from woody other hire

But team is still better than idziot 2014 team by record alone and younger...

[dbatesman]

1 hour ago, NoBowles said:

I'm waiting for Shane and Batesman to convince us on how passing on Carr, Garapollo and Bridgewater, because he already had the immortal Geno Smith, was actually a brilliant move, and had Jets fans not put up a sign we would have profited from that brilliance.

dude if you really wanna read all this again you can just PM me

 

On 9/24/2014 at 9:06 PM, dbatesman said:

I know the focus is on Saunders and McDougle (and I like Geno more than most), but I honestly believe that passing on Bridgewater is the decision that's going to get Idzik fired.

 

On 11/25/2015 at 11:08 AM, dbatesman said:

I think Idzik's biggest mistake was not going after Bridgewater or Carr in 2014, even though Geno had done absolutely nothing to make anyone think he was the guy long-term; I think this would be a similar mistake. The track record for QBs taken where Petty was taken is abysmal, so regardless of how they feel about Petty, if they get a shot at another guy, I think they absolutely have to take it.

 

On 11/25/2015 at 3:06 PM, dbatesman said:

Pretty much. The primary benefit of taking Petty in the 4th (or Geno in the 2nd, for that matter) is that it doesn't preclude you from taking another QB the next season, which is precisely why passing on Bridgewater/Carr was such a disaster.

 

On 4/30/2016 at 10:28 AM, dbatesman said:

Point of clarification: he was dead to me the second he passed on Bridgewater, but I did (and still do) think his plan was a good one, and he rid us of Rex, so I'll always have a little soft spot for him.

 

On 5/2/2016 at 10:22 AM, dbatesman said:

Indirectly he did. He took Geno and then passed on Bridgewater and Carr the next year, even though Geno had shown nothing whatsoever to indicate he was a franchise player. If Hackenberg really is Maccagnan's "guy," like all of you keep saying, it's pretty easy to see history repeating itself, especially considering Hackenberg likely won't get the chance to sh*t his pants this year and force the issue the way Geno did in 2013.

 

On 5/2/2016 at 0:05 PM, dbatesman said:

It's because of Geno insofar as he didn't take another QB. If he'd drafted Bridgewater or Carr in 2014, he'd still be here.

 

On 3/9/2017 at 4:56 PM, dbatesman said:

It has nothing to do with development. He said the team would be "quarterback obsessed," watched Geno bumble through a disaster of a rookie season, then sat on his hands while Teddy Bridgewater and Derek Carr were scooped up by teams that know their ass from a hole in the ground. 

 

[Integrity28]

I can't believe NoBowles got Butts to bump 3 years of old Idzik posts. 

lol

[RutgersJetFan]

Well this thread just got all sorts of delicious. 

[artemusclyde]

We'll see how Mac does this year.  He hasn't been drafting well and our team is terrible.  I imagine if we end up with the #1 pick next year, he's fired. And with our qb situation that seems like a good chance of happening. 

[NoBowles]

4 hours ago, dbatesman said:

dude if you really wanna read all this again you can just PM me

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

4 hours ago, Integrity28 said:

I can't believe NoBowles got Butts to bump 3 years of old Idzik posts. 

lol

 

[peebag]

Man does this fan base love to wallow in the mire....

[RoadFan]

On 04/21/2017 at 5:44 PM, Rangers9 said:

Basically the average NFL career for guys who make rosters is something like 3 plus years. So some of these players are almost ancient history because it's like 4 years since Idzik's first draft. Even guys like Sammy Watkins who were top picks are on the bubble at least with their original teams. The NFL landscape of players is changing drastically every 3 years. 

What exactly is your purpose with this post?  Idziot was in charge of one of the worst drafts in NFL history. 

And you offer some kind of a roundabout, soft defense of the guy with  "most guys are outta the league after 3 years anyway?"

Do you also want to defend Chris Kreider's neverending slew of committing brain dead penalties in the offensive zone?  How about "he is just 'aggressively' forechecking?"

[thadude]

17 hours ago, Jetster said:

Where did I say that Idzik drafted Hill & Ducasse? I was making a point about using a 2nd on Hackenberg. And my name isn't Skippy schmuck. Give me a break, Chrebet practiced & played so well Kotite couldn't ignore him. Kotite didn't discover Chrebet, Chrebet played at Hofstra & was a walk on UDFA. Chrebet found the Jets across the parking lot.

Mac hasn't been better than Idzik so far

[Rangers9]

10 hours ago, RoadFan said:

What exactly is your purpose with this post?  Idziot was in charge of one of the worst drafts in NFL history. 

And you offer some kind of a roundabout, soft defense of the guy with  "most guys are outta the league after 3 years anyway?"

Do you also want to defend Chris Kreider's neverending slew of committing brain dead penalties in the offensive zone?  How about "he is just 'aggressively' forechecking?"

Your expectations for a draft are unrealistic. Esp for 2014 when the Jets had a bunch of supplemental picks (which are untradeable). I agree that Idzik should have traded some of those regular picks and got future picks because no way that many guys were going to make the team. It did give flexibility to draft for needs like with Jalen Saunders who was a good return guy in college and we needed someone who could potentially break one badly. So I don't rip him for that esp when he got a good Wr later in the draft. If you draft 3 Wrs and one turns out like Quincy you haven't drafted poorly. But when you are evaluating success in a draft and talking mostly about 5th or 6rh round players it's true their average longevity is only about 3 years. After that many are out of the NFL and most did not play regularly with one team. They bounced around on practice squads and if on active rosters didn't play much.