Practice Report: Busy Day For Sanchez

[Bleedin Green]

Mark Sanchez is 37-31 including playoff games.  Here's the source: http://www.footballdb.com/qb-records.html

 

I bring up the stat because there is no such thing as net wins or net points. I could say 6 net wins but it's a made up stat. Jets fans are making up Net points for the purposes of making it seem like Geno is actually tied with Mark. 

 

And I'm not gonna quote your other post but Geno was running with the 1's against DET. Going against their 2's actually. 

 

Should I just copy and paste my post that you had quoted for you here?  Your statement is still inaccurate, for the same reasons I've already stated, as nothing you said even attempted to dispute any of it.  The entire Jets team has that record with Mark at QB; that still says absolutely nothing about his individual performance, especially when you consider that they also have a better record during that same time period without Mark than they do with him.  We've already gone over the reality that you don't get to randomly assign team wins to different individual players as you see fit and have that qualify as a valid argument.  A player's individual statistics, however, are very much tied to their own performances.  Either way, your point still could not possibly have any less relevance to last Friday's game.

 

This whole debate about your apparent major issue with the concept of any sort of net statistics is simply you splitting hairs over nothing.  The bottom line is no matter how anyone wants to word it or how you try to distort it, the 100%, undeniable, indisputable fact is that Mark Sanchez contributed exactly the same number of points to the opposing team as he did his own team.  This is absolutely not acceptable, as it is ultimately contributing nothing to his team, and in no way can be construed to be a positive outcome.  And yes, whether or not you care to admit it, it absolutely unequivocally has the same ultimate impact on a game as an offense scoring 0 points and not giving up a turnover for a TD, as either way the defense and special teams are still required to outscore the opposition entirely on their own in order to secure a victory.  There is no benefit provided by a QB performing in this manner, and try as you might, it is literally impossible for you to make a valid argument that states otherwise.

 

I'm still curious to see all of the similar posts you made last preseason regarding Sanchez's inability to lead the Jets to one single TD over the course of 4 preseason games.  After all, if the few drives they each had in one preseason game is as of such vast importance as you make it out to be, then surely you must have been making this same case against Sanchez this time last year, but to an even more extreme extent given the much larger sample size.

[BroadwayJoe12]

I didn't say it clearly but Geno's college stats are NOT relevant. Neither are Mark's 34th ranking from 2012.  WE could bring them up but it's not relevant. It's 2013 and neither of those facts shed light on who should be starting QB today. If you want to talk about Mark's 2012 we could also talk about Geno's 2012. They kinda cancel each other out. Taking 2 safeties on xmas eve and national tv is similar to the buttfumble on thanksgiving. Both are atrocious football situations. 

 

I see.  So exactly what is the ratio of Shcrute Bucks to Stanley Nickels.

[dbatesman]

I didn't say it clearly but Geno's college stats are NOT relevant. Neither are Mark's 34th ranking from 2012. WE could bring them up but it's not relevant. It's 2013 and neither of those facts shed light on who should be starting QB today. If you want to talk about Mark's 2012 we could also talk about Geno's 2012. They kinda cancel each other out. Taking 2 safeties on xmas eve and national tv is similar to the buttfumble on thanksgiving. Both are atrocious football situations.

ahahahahah

[T0mShane]

I had to lie down.

[Greenseed4]

I see.  So exactly what is the ratio of Shcrute Bucks to Stanley Nickels.

 

Isn't it the exact same ratio of Unicorns to Leprechauns?

[Lupz27]

the question is do you want player A who offers explosive plays and mind numbing mistakes or player B who offers neither (right now). Gotta take the points. Geno has potential but he's not putting up points. 

 

The Jets QB meter is pegged at "headband" 

 

 

I think the real question is how long does Geno need to have his potential start translating on the field. 8 games, 12, full season, 2 years, or never?  If the coaches think it is 8 games, then you have to start Geno, because if he is a better QB than any Sanchez that suits up after 8 NFL games then you still could have a shot at the playoffs, if it is more than that IN THE COACHES OPINION, than let Sanchez show he can't do it, and then put Geno in.

[artemusclyde]

Mark Sanchez is 37-31 including playoff games.  Here's the source: http://www.footballdb.com/qb-records.html

 

I bring up the stat because there is no such thing as net wins or net points. I could say 6 net wins but it's a made up stat. Jets fans are making up Net points for the purposes of making it seem like Geno is actually tied with Mark. 

 

And I'm not gonna quote your other post but Geno was running with the 1's against DET. Going against their 2's actually. 

 

And your point is, Mark Sanchez only had a successful drive when he was against detroit's 2's.

[JoeKlecko]

the sooner you accept that Sanchez will start and that Smith isn't ready, and that the Jets will be, at best, decent, the less disappointed you'll be.

 

Exactly.  IMO those who are thinking this is a playoff team are only fooling themselves and in for a lot of disappointment and heartache.  Further, making all kinds of moves that will have an impact on the cap beyond this year, in order to try to increase/improve the chances of making the playoffs this year are not in the best interests of the team going forward.  I see all kinds of angst and panic in some posters.  They're just setting themselves up for frustration, high blood pressure, and a bigger liquor bill.

[dbatesman]

I had to lie down.

It's like seeing the Sistine Chapel. Mere words can't do it justice.

[BurnleyJet]

I'm not surprised, Sanchez is playing better, abit still being Sanchez.

The start to the season is very tough. Geno is still raw although learning.

I see a Alex Smith, Colin Kaepernick, situation going down, start Sanchez, hopefully he plays OK. Then phase Smith in round week 6.

[The Crusher]

It was over before it started

 

 

2013-2014 season in a nutshell.  

[The Crusher]

the sooner you accept that Sanchez will start and that Smith isn't ready, and that the Jets will be, at best, decent, the less disappointed you'll be.

 

 

True.  It's like jets football has become some crazy Ground Hog Day version of purgatory with Sanchez.  You turn the game on see the same miserable thing over and over and over and over again.  

[jack48]

 This is all silliness.  People are projecting outward from a 4 series performance in a game. What do we really know?   If Geno had continued at his extremely accurate 6 for 7 pace for an entire game and the line stopped taking dumb penalties, I daresay he would have put up points.  And it its at least conceivable he would have had zero INTs.  Over a full game Mark might have thrown a few more INTs.  And even if he threw another TD or two, what coach would start a QB who throws 3 INTs a game?  Ridiculous to conjecture like that. But I am just saying that you cannot assume Geno cannot score after a penalty laden 4 series performance.  You can conjecture that Mark is still INT prone.  And nearly throwing 2 pick 6's in a 4 series stint would scare the hell out of me if I was a coach.

[bitonti]

And your point is, Mark Sanchez only had a successful drive when he was against detroit's 2's.

 

the other dude brought up Geno, and which offense he was running with. It wasn't accurate. 

[bitonti]

 

I'm still curious to see all of the similar posts you made last preseason regarding Sanchez's inability to lead the Jets to one single TD over the course of 4 preseason games.  After all, if the few drives they each had in one preseason game is as of such vast importance as you make it out to be, then surely you must have been making this same case against Sanchez this time last year, but to an even more extreme extent given the much larger sample size.

 

WHy is last year relevant? He has a fu manchu this year. A FU MANCHU! 

[slats]

It's okay if Sanchez does well in practice. Even if you hate the guy, if you're a fan of the team, you really should prefer that the team's QBs are showing signs of improvement. I'd rather Geno Smith win the job over an improved Sanchez, than be handed it by default (like Sanchez was).

And if Sanchez starts this weekend, I think it's safe to assume that he's going to be the regular season starter. And that's okay, too. This isn't a Super Bowl year. Let the OL settle into itself for a few weeks, let a guy like Spadola get acclimated to the NFL, let the rest of the offense work out the kinks of a new system, let Geno Smith take the time to continue to practice, learn, and prepare, and then throw him onto the starting lineup. That will be much, much better for him than rushing him out there opening day. And what's better for Geno is potentially a lot better for the Jets.

[BroadwayJoe12]

True.  It's like jets football has become some crazy Ground Hog Day version of purgatory with Sanchez.  You turn the game on see the same miserable thing over and over and over and over again.  

 

Except I haven't learned to play the piano, let a woodchuck chauffeur me or f*ck andie macdowell.  

[Jetsfan80]

My response to all of Bitonti's posts:

 

 

[bitonti]

My response to all of Bitonti's posts:

 

 

 

Geno Smith threw 4 picks in practice today. Most of which were against the scout team. 

 

You can tell me I was right later. No need to do it now.  YOu are probably very busy. Looking up funny pictures and what not. 

[Jetsfan80]

Geno Smith threw 4 picks in practice today. Most of which were against the scout team. 

 

You can tell me I was right later. No need to do it now.  YOu are probably very busy. Looking up funny pictures and what not. 

 

What are you going to be "right" about, exactly?  You change your flawed logic arguments every 5 minutes I can't tell.

[JoeKlecko]

Geno Smith threw 4 picks in practice today. Most of which were against the scout team. 

 

You can tell me I was right later. No need to do it now.  YOu are probably very busy. Looking up funny pictures and what not. 

 

I haven't seen a practice report for today, so don't know the details, but I have to assume that you wouldn't lie about the 4 picks.  In your opinion, what does that tell you about Geno?  That he's not ready yet?  That he's a bust?  Somewhere in between?

 

In my opinion it's a clear indication that he's not ready yet.  He still has a lot to learn.  He may never be the guy, but imo they need to give him some time before they throw him to the wolves to see if he can be the guy or not.  Regardless of how well he plays this season (when he does finally start), I think the Jets need to draft another QB next year.  How high that QB will be selected will depend upon how well Geno plays and what kind of upside/promise he still shows at the end of the season.  The bottom line is that the Jets will need 3 QBs next year.  Hopefully, Sanchez will be gone.  Most Jets fans think McElroy is not a capable NFL QB.  If they do draft another QB high, I don't think the Jets will sign a veteran QB.  What would be the point?  They'd have Bridgewater (or whomever), and Geno, so all they'd need is a QB to hold the clipboard.  If they select a QB high in the first round, he would probably be the de facto starter, or there would be a competition between Geno and he.  If they draft a QB in the lower rounds, then I think they would sign a veteran to compete with Geno and the loser would be the backup.  The lower round QB would be a developmental prospect and clipboard holder.

[ZachEY]

One QB is horrendous, and one QB is not ready to start in this league, and likely would be horrendous if he did.

 

The 2013 New York Jets, my friends.

[bitonti]

I haven't seen a practice report for today, so don't know the details, but I have to assume that you wouldn't lie about the 4 picks.  In your opinion, what does that tell you about Geno?  That he's not ready yet?  That he's a bust?  Somewhere in between?

 

In my opinion it's a clear indication that he's not ready yet.  He still has a lot to learn.  

 

my opinion from the beginning is that he's not ready. We agree on that. I said if he was a day 1 starter he'd have gone much earlier in the draft. that comment was ripped apart by the usual suspects but I stand by it. Teams need QB's and Geno's fall was for a reason. Geno could be a very good NFL QB but the amount of stuff he has to learn, coming out of that Air Raid offense, is immense. He didn't even take a snap from center for 4 years. TO throw him in there, week 2 at NE on National TV could be a career-ruiner. HE needs to learn. It could take 10 weeks and hes ready after the bye it could take years. But if they don't ruin him they could have a fine QB on their hands. The fact that Mark sucks doesn't change the readiness of Geno Smith.

 

People will laugh at this comment but Sanchez coming out of Carroll's offense at USC was way more prepared than Geno coming out of WVU. it's the same system that produced Pat White. 

 

and either way they will draft another QB next year. Marty Morningwheg learned his craft from Bill Walsh and that means a QB every year. 

[bitonti]

What are you going to be "right" about, exactly?  You change your flawed logic arguments every 5 minutes I can't tell.

 

I don't think you actually read my posts. You see that the posts start with my name and get all angry about hypocrisy or Drob or something. Read this thread if you want a refresher. Or just post pictures. Whatever works. 

[ZachEY]

I don't think you actually read my posts. You see that the posts start with my name and get all angry about hypocrisy or Drob or something. Read this thread if you want a refresher. Or just post pictures. Whatever works. 

 

It's really not that you're right or wrong, but the absolutely insane and often hypocritical logic you use to reach your conclusions that people jump on you for.

[T0mShane]

Geno Smith threw 4 picks in practice today. Most of which were against the scout team.

You can tell me I was right later. No need to do it now. YOu are probably very busy. Looking up funny pictures and what not.

It doesn't matter what Geno does today. It only matters what he'll do tomorrow. Sanchez too.

[Sperm Edwards]

my opinion from the beginning is that he's not ready. I said if he was a day 1 starter he'd have gone much earlier in the draft. that comment was ripped apart by the usual suspects but I stand by it. Geno could be a very good NFL QB but the amount of stuff he has to learn, coming out of that Air Raid offense, is immense. He didn't even take a snap from center for 4 years. TO throw him in there, week 2 at NE on National TV could be a career-ruiner. HE needs to learn. It could take 10 weeks and hes ready after the bye it could take years. But if they don't ruin him they could have a fine QB on their hands. 

 

It was ripped apart because it was both incorrect and made no sense.

 

Go look at the list of 1st round QBs taken in the past 10 years and then add up how many were day 1 starters.

 

Remember that stud QB draft of Eli-Rivers-Roethlisberger (including Eli as the #1 overall pick)?

 

None of them were day 1 starters.

 

#1 overall Vick? Not a day 1 starter

 

#1 overall Palmer? Not a day 1 starter

 

#5 overall Sanchez? Everyone knows he wasn't ready to be a day 1 starter. That happened because the Jets just gave him a job he hadn't earned (and it was still a nail-biter for him to beat out Kellen Clemens).  The guy taken after him, Freeman, was considered raw and by no means a lock to be a day 1 starter.

 

You want me to go on?

 

 

There are a bunch of reasons he dropped.  Identifying him as not being a sure-thing day 1 starter, though, is listing the one reason that was not the reason for him dropping to the top of round 2.

[bitonti]

It doesn't matter what Geno does today. It only matters what he'll do tomorrow. Sanchez too.

 

this competition is over. Mark is wearing a headband and a Fu manchu. He gives zero f--ks. 

[dbatesman]

this competition is over. Mark is wearing a headband and a Fu manchu. He gives zero f--ks.

So excited for the off-Broadway revival of Just Because Sanchez Is Bad Doesn't Mean Geno Is Good, or, Nothing Anyone Does Should Ever Have Consequences. O/U is halftime of Week 1.

[bitonti]

It was ripped apart because it was both incorrect and made no sense.

 

Go look at the list of 1st round QBs taken in the past 10 years and then add up how many were day 1 starters.

 

 

10 years? How about the last 3 years?

 

Rd 1 instant starters

2013- EJ Manuel

2012 - Andrew Luck, RG3, Ryan Tannehill, Brandon Weeden

2011 - Cam Newton, Blaine Gabbert, Christian Ponder 

 

rd 1 - not instant starters

2011 - Jake Locker 

 

so just to review in the last 3 years there were 9 QBs taken in rd 1 and only 1 Jake Locker didn't start game 1. 

 

The days when Aaron Rodgers can sit for 3 years behind Brett Favre are over. Which is a shame, cause Geno probably needs that kind of development. These days rookie QB's who can start go high. THose that need time go after round 1. Bringing up Mike Vick you might as well bring up Johnny Unitas. 

[Matt39]

my opinion from the beginning is that he's not ready. We agree on that. I said if he was a day 1 starter he'd have gone much earlier in the draft. that comment was ripped apart by the usual suspects but I stand by it. Teams need QB's and Geno's fall was for a reason. Geno could be a very good NFL QB but the amount of stuff he has to learn, coming out of that Air Raid offense, is immense. He didn't even take a snap from center for 4 years. TO throw him in there, week 2 at NE on National TV could be a career-ruiner. HE needs to learn. It could take 10 weeks and hes ready after the bye it could take years. But if they don't ruin him they could have a fine QB on their hands. The fact that Mark sucks doesn't change the readiness of Geno Smith.

 

People will laugh at this comment but Sanchez coming out of Carroll's offense at USC was way more prepared than Geno coming out of WVU. it's the same system that produced Pat White. 

 

and either way they will draft another QB next year. Marty Morningwheg learned his craft from Bill Walsh and that means a QB every year. 

 

That's actually not true.

[bitonti]

So excited for the off-Broadway revival of Just Because Sanchez Is Bad Doesn't Mean Geno Is Good, or, Nothing Anyone Does Should Ever Have Consequences. O/U is halftime of Week 1.

 

I can't wait to see the comments if Sanchez is actually good this year. It's not impossible ya know. 

[bitonti]

That's actually not true.

 

fair enough but it was the vast majority. over 98% or something. 

[T0mShane]

I can't wait to see the comments if Sanchez is actually good this year. It's not impossible ya know.

He will not be good, bit.

[bitonti]

He will not be good, bit.

 

Probably not... but he's rocking a fu manchu. That gives me hope.