Jets GM says he's 'excited to see' what Geno Smith can do if he's starting QB

[The Crusher]

Just now, bitonti said:

Jets fans convincing themselves that Geno will be good is like Pats fans convincing themselves that their team doesn't actually cheat. 

It's a blind spot. There's a huge difference between what we want to be true and what's actually true. 

Not even closely related . 

[ylekram]

18 minutes ago, JetBlue said:

Yet he went 8-8 as a rookie.... Fitz played 9 years before he won more than 6 games. 

lighten up there, jet blue. it was meant to be funny

[joewilly12]

1 minute ago, ylekram said:

lighten up there, jet blue. it was meant to be funny

JetBlue was factually funny.

[Sperm Edwards]

25 minutes ago, Big Blocker said:

Gailey was out of football for two years, and from what I recall of reports at the time only Bowles contacted him about coming out of "retirement".  It is pure speculation on your part that Smith would have done much better with Gailey.

Marty has also had some nice situations with Qb's.  He got a great season out of Nick Foles, and helped turn the run oriented Michael Vick into a much more effective and complete Qb.  Marty was a significant reason Vick came to the Jets in 14.

As for HC Ryan, no doubt he soured on SMith as 14 went on.  You didn't???   But the Jets started 14 with Smith over Vick, and essentially kept him there until Smith threw 3 interceptions in the first quarter against Buffalo.  That Vick was not prepared to step in hardly means that Ryan didn't give Smith a chance in 14.  You can claim whatever you want, and I concede it may have been  a complex decision to start Smith the first half of the season.  But I would HARDLY say Ryan stood in Smith's way in 14.  Do you really think he did?

It's a bit more than just speculation. Fitzpatrick was outright benched the year before.

Foles? Nobody actually believes that Mornhinweg was running that offense (like with Reid before him, where he was also mostly the OC in name only). And lots of bad QBs will - and did - look better when they line up without a huddle so the eye in the sky can survey the defense & talk to the QB after they're lined up. 

I'm not trying to defend Smith as a good QB, so I don't know why you're arguing as thought that's the case. I'm saying the situations were totally different. And if you want to bring up Vick, he's a great example. He looked worse in 2014 than in his entire career. They (appropriately) benched Smith after those picks against Buffalo, but on balance Vick didn't look any better than Smith did that season, and finished with worse numbers. Ironically it was the next game against Buffalo that Vick had to be benched in favor of Geno. What seems to have happened the next week - or this is my guess, anyway - is that Idzik wanted Geno in there over Vick, and Rex obliged, but in doing so he spitefully did nothing but run the ball between the first drive and the final 2-minute drive. 

Smith sucked in 2014 and will never be a top-notch QB. Never. That said, while wepponz never makes a bad QB a good QB, it can make a bad QB look a whole lot less bad. Whether it's the full group of receivers he had after Vick was benched, the receivers Fitz had, or the night & day difference with Sanchez before them. Sanchez as well is not and will never be a good QB (even if he is capable of having some good games). But while receivers don't make him a good QB, you'd have to be blind to not see the difference after the receiving corps was down to only Kerley, Gates, Cumberland, Schilens, and Hill. He still sucks, but he's not 4 TDs:11 INTs, sub-60 QBR sucky, which were his #s in the 2nd half of 2012. Same thing with the first half of 2014 compared to the last month-plus, where he still wasn't a good QB, but he was a lot better than after Decker's injury in Green Bay.

Just saying a top surrounding cast, along with other ideal circumstances, can hide a lot of yuck. 

[Sperm Edwards]

26 minutes ago, JetBlue said:

I went back and read my post and I said UNLESS Hack blew away in Geno in comp, I would still start Geno. 

I don't read your posts carefully, tittyavatarman.

[Sperm Edwards]

21 minutes ago, bostonmajet said:

Actually, I was just commenting on what was Macc supposed to say; It was not meant as a comment on other posters comments, or even in reality what Macc thinks of Geno (as I have no idea really)

Wasn't actually commenting on Geno's performance or ability to come play QB for the Jets, simply, Macc's comments shouldn't be over analyzed as he is talking in GM speak.

He could be trying to motivate Geno, trying to make Fitz believe Macc doesn't need him, or just blowing smoke up fans ....; I have no idea.

Actually I was responding to someone else .

Personally, I think he's trying to sell the fans on the idea that if we end up with Geno starting the season it's because they like the idea, rather than this is just being how things ended up. They can sell me on not putting everything into 2016, but I don't buy tickets anymore so it's an easier sell to me. Also I don't expect them to be winners with or without Fitzpatrick, since it doesn't look like we'll have ~14 bullsh*t opponents in lovely weather on this year's schedule.  

I think he wants to trot Geno out there if needed for up to a month, let him take the beatings, and then insert Hackenberg so there isn't a voice left in the NYMA calling to put Geno in when Hackenberg meets the eventual rookie hardships. 

Still very possible they bring Fitzpatrick back, but for a team that isn't budging on their offer, they're doing a lot of "we want Fitz back" PR so no one gets the idea Maccagnan didn't want him back in the first place. I think he is aware how fortunate the team was with him last year, and that he's in take the money & run mode on Fitzpatrick's Jets career.

Now watch us officially re-sign him tonight for 2/$24M lol.

[ylekram]

12 minutes ago, slats said:

Marshall and Gailey are under contract, Fitz would cost the team $7-8M (or more) in cap space and a potential 2017 comp pick if anyone else was willing to sign him. The Jets currently don't have enough money to sign their draft picks, one of which they'd like to see starting at QB by next season. 

My thing is that I don't think Geno would be terrible under the team's current circumstances, certainly not much (if any) worse than Fitz. And even if he is, I don't care all that much because I expect both of them to be off the team by next year - even if Fitz is brought back. So comp picks the next two years, $7-8M+ in cap savings. That's fine with me. 

I think fitz fits well in this jets system and I, for 1, am not scared of this alleged brutal schedule. call me a homer, but I think the jets can be very competitive this season. as far as geno goes, I somewhat agree that he would play better than in 2013-2014, given more experience and the improved roster. but I wouldn't go as far as to say he would play at fitz's level or better. fitz isn't a stud qb, but he is a qb that plays mostly well. what we have experienced with geno is a qb who plays mostly bad.. with what looks like no other suiters out there, doesn't look like fitz has much of a choice but to sign what the jets are offering. imo, not signing fitz or any other legit competition for geno is gifting geno the starting qb position again. for 4 straight years. not the way to go. whats the worst case scenario? you sign fitz to 8m, 2-3 year contract making him cuttable after this year. if geno beats him out, you spent twice as much for a vet backup for 1 year. but now the jets are getting better qb play. who can complain about that? if geno cant beat him out, you got fitz playing atleast competently till a better option comes along. as far as the money goes, mac as of yesterday, said he still wants Fitzpatrick so I am sure he can come up with the dough

[bitonti]

15 minutes ago, The Crusher said:

Not even closely related . 

they aren't related they are analogous. 

i'll say it again just because we want Geno to be good (and likely will spend the next 6 months convincing ourselves he has a chance) that doesn't mean it's true. 

[Sperm Edwards]

Just now, ylekram said:

I think fitz fits well in this jets system and I, for 1, am not scared of this alleged brutal schedule. call me a homer, but I think the jets can be very competitive this season. as far as geno goes, I somewhat agree that he would play better than in 2013-2014, given more experience and the improved roster. but I wouldn't go as far as to say he would play at fitz's level or better. fitz isn't a stud qb, but he is a qb that plays mostly well. what we have experienced with geno is a qb who plays mostly bad.. with what looks like no other suiters out there, doesn't look like fitz has much of a choice but to sign what the jets are offering. imo, not signing fitz or any other legit competition for geno is gifting geno the starting qb position again. for 4 straight years. not the way to go. whats the worst case scenario? you sign fitz to 8m, 2-3 year contract making him cuttable after this year. if geno beats him out, you spent twice as much for a vet backup for 1 year. but now the jets are getting better qb play. who can complain about that? if geno cant beat him out, you got fitz playing atleast competently till a better option comes along. as far as the money goes, mac as of yesterday, said he still wants Fitzpatrick so I am sure he can come up with the dough

 

[The Crusher]

Just now, bitonti said:

they aren't related they are analogous. 

i'll say it again just because we want Geno to be good (and likely will spend the next 6 months convincing ourselves he has a chance) that doesn't mean it's true. 

Pats cheat and Geno sucks.

[ylekram]

3 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

3 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

 

 

remember this come December when the jets are in the playoff hunt

and I will beat you guys to the punch. you can save the fitz will melt down and blow the playoffs,blah,blah,blah

[Sperm Edwards]

Just now, ylekram said:

remember this come December when the jets are in the playoff hunt

I will delete the topic, of course.

[ylekram]

2 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

I will delete the topic, of course.

nope. I think you would be too happy to remember

[Sperm Edwards]

Just now, ylekram said:

nope. I think you would be too happy to remember

You really think Genoberg is taking this team to the playoffs? I admire your optimism, sir.

[ylekram]

Just now, Sperm Edwards said:

You really think Genoberg is taking this team to the playoffs? I admire your optimism, sir.

come on. you know fitz aint retiring

[Sperm Edwards]

Just now, ylekram said:

come on. you know fitz aint retiring

I also know he ain't getting $16M+/year on a multi-year deal either.

[Dupe]

Non story and in fact it's wrong to a large degree. I heard the interview.  That was a pretty clear and loud 'if' there.  It's GM speak and what I "heard" was that Fitz will be signed eventually. 

 

[JetBlue]

32 minutes ago, ylekram said:

lighten up there, jet blue. it was meant to be funny

Okay

[RutgersJetFan]

1 hour ago, Sperm Edwards said:

You didn't say if they were equal. You said if Hackenberg blows Geno away in camp you'd still start Geno. 

If it's close...I'd still lean towards Hackenberg, but it depends on what is keeping him from winning outright. Were they both similarly bad (like Sanchez/Geno) or did both look very good? If the latter I'd lean towards Hackenberg. That said, if it was that close I wouldn't get bent out of shape if we instead sent Geno out there to get smushed by those early opponents. Would take a lot of pressure off Hackenberg once Geno is finally given the hook in October at the latest.

End of the day a toolbag is a toolbag. That's not personality trait that you just rid yourself of in under a year. It's like when the UCONN Mac n' Cheese kid apologized. And screw that guy.

[cant wait]

17 minutes ago, ylekram said:

remember this come December when the jets are in the playoff hunt

and I will beat you guys to the punch. you can save the fitz will melt down and blow the playoffs,blah,blah,blah

So you're saying fitz won't melt down and blow the team's chances for the playoffs this time?

[ylekram]

10 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

I also know he ain't getting $16M+/year on a multi-year deal either.

nope. he might get a multi year deal, but for what the jets are offering. what Fitzpatrick wants? who cares. that ship has sailed

[ylekram]

11 minutes ago, Dupe said:

Non story and in fact it's wrong to a large degree. I heard the interview.  That was a pretty clear and loud 'if' there.  It's GM speak and what I "heard" was that Fitz will be signed eventually. 

 

yea, he was pretty adamant about getting fitz under contract

[RutgersJetFan]

Also worth noting that the thing Conor Cook got knocked for, not being named a captain by his teammates, went down with Geno times infinity. The starting quarterback of this football team got punched into oblivion by a teammate, and when the Jets played that teammate's new team later in the year on a national stage, several Jets went over and hugged the guy. 

 

[Big Blocker]

1 hour ago, JetBlue said:

Really what does it tell you?  That he plays well when the pressure is off or something?  Maybe so, but he played pretty well his rookie season on Monday night in Atlanta when they were considered a playoff team.  Like said, why is it important for to try to convince me of your line of thinking? I get it, believe me I do.  You have made it very clear you don't think he will ever become a quality NFL qb and that is fine, it really is.  I don't know that he won't at some point in the future for some other team.   The NFL is full players who didn't reach their potential on one team and did so on another.   His Jet days are numbered, I think we all know that but I would not be surprised if he is under center come September.  

I have no idea what you are talking about regarding tryouts for Geno but okay.  

2 years to me, is not enough time to make that definitive evaluation for the quarterback position. Especially when he should never have started his first season and would have been better served watching like Petty did last year.   But as I said, CAN WE JUST AGREE TO DISAGREE?  I truly respect your position; not sure if you can respect mine. 

I will say much of the difference in perceptions involves some level of subjectivity.  I like to think mine is based to at least some extent extrapolating the subject under analysis with similar ones, which lends an element of objectivity.  Seeing correlations and attempting to identify causation is an essential element of reasoned thinking.  But I do not pretend that that kind of analysis is equivalent to facts beyond any doubt.  To be sure I do not say it is IMPOSSIBLE that Smith could succeed. I merely think the odds of success are so low it is not worth turning the team over to him yet again.  Which goes to my point about tryouts.  The point is the main thing the Jets are doing in games that counts is trying to win them, not merely give Smith yet another chance to succeed.

And on THAT point there are plenty of examples of Qb's who have already shown by year 3 that they will not succeed.  Smith is one I think belongs on that list for the reasons I have stated.  I understand you disagree.

[joewilly12]

13 minutes ago, RutgersJetFan said:

Also worth noting that the thing Conor Cook got knocked for, not being named a captain by his teammates, went down with Geno times infinity. The starting quarterback of this football team got punched into oblivion by a teammate, and when the Jets played that teammate's new team later in the year on a national stage, several Jets went over and hugged the guy. 

 

When did Jets teammates ever vote on Geno Smith being Captain?  Are you really comparing what happens in college football to what happens in pro football. 

Do you have a link or proof that teammates werent apologetic to Geno Smith after the incident. 

How is IK's career going is he leading the Buffalo defense or did the clown Rex just sign him for the publicity. 

How many teams has Ryan Fitzpatrick been with in 11 years answer 6. 

No one has signed him to a longterm deal ever. 

32 NFL teams have passed on him as of today. 

[NJ]

1 minute ago, joewilly12 said:

When did Jets teammates ever vote on Geno Smith being Captain?

Wont happen - you can't raise your hand to vote when you're holding your belly from laughing too hard...

[joewilly12]

Just now, NJ said:

Wont happen - you can't raise your hand to vote when you're holding your belly from laughing too hard...

Yes because they would prefer Ryan journeyman Fitpatrick who has never ever made the playoffs and cant throw the long ball. 

[ylekram]

6 minutes ago, joewilly12 said:

Yes because they would prefer Ryan journeyman Fitpatrick who has never ever made the playoffs and cant throw the long ball. 

neither can geno

[RutgersJetFan]

12 minutes ago, joewilly12 said:

When did Jets teammates ever vote on Geno Smith being Captain?  Are you really comparing what happens in college football to what happens in pro football. 

Do you have a link or proof that teammates werent apologetic to Geno Smith after the incident. 

How is IK's career going is he leading the Buffalo defense or did the clown Rex just sign him for the publicity. 

How many teams has Ryan Fitzpatrick been with in 11 years answer 6. 

No one has signed him to a longterm deal ever. 

32 NFL teams have passed on him as of today. 

Oh Brick. My sweet Brick. 

[joewilly12]

1 minute ago, RutgersJetFan said:

Oh Brick. My sweet Brick. 

D-Brick?  Who retired abruptly after being asked to a pay cut. That Brick? 

[joewilly12]

3 minutes ago, RutgersJetFan said:

Oh Brick. My sweet Brick. 

7 Rutgers football players were arrested is that more than were drafted. 

[RutgersJetFan]

4 minutes ago, joewilly12 said:

7 Rutgers football players were arrested is that more than were drafted. 

Come give me a hug Brick, you know you want to.

[joewilly12]

2 minutes ago, RutgersJetFan said:

Come give me a hug Brick, you know you want to.

Who is Brick? 

Do you go to Rutgers games where they blow off the cannon if and when they score? 

Rutgers = Bush League Big 10 

Come to Rutgers get your degree or parole hearing or both. 

[Sperm Edwards]

53 minutes ago, RutgersJetFan said:

End of the day a toolbag is a toolbag. That's not personality trait that you just rid yourself of in under a year. It's like when the UCONN Mac n' Cheese kid apologized. And screw that guy.

Hey, I was rude and overbearing in my early 20s but just look at me now! 

[Colgateman]

To be honest, I am just hoping that one of Geno, Hack, or Petty work out so we don't have to hear this quarterback talk every offseason for the next 10 years. Please god, just this once..