Jets GM says he's 'excited to see' what Geno Smith can do if he's starting QB

[Sperm Edwards]

15 minutes ago, RutgersJetFan said:

He got knocked the **** out by a teammate in training camp.

Lol clearly I was referring to the practice field itself, not the locker room. 

His handling of a paltry amount in dispute with IK was inexcusable and indefensible. He cost himself the starting job because he is (or at least was) an immature douchebag devoid of any leadership attributes.

I'm not coming to a girlfriend's rescue. I'm saying the 2014 team and 2015 team weren't remotely the same situations to play under, from the differences in coaches, surrounding personnel, and opponents. None of that makes a bad QB a good QB, but it can make a bad/meh QB look much better than he actually is in normal - let alone in bad - circumstances.

[drdetroit]

28 minutes ago, Big Blocker said:

As someone else mentioned, Marshall had a career year for himself, too.  Is that all on him?  No credit to Fitzpatrick?

Marshall has been one of the best receivers in the NFL in the past decade.  Adding him to any offense, let alone the jets, is going to affect everyone 

[Sperm Edwards]

5 minutes ago, JetBlue said:

If they are equal in camp I would still consider starting Geno. Training camp is not the real thing and I want this kid to play for the next 15 years for us and I don't feel the need to rush him.  We are not winning a superbowl next year so yes, I can start Geno for the first few games and f he has problems I can then go to Hack, cut Geno and sign a vet QB off the street to back up along with Petty.   I don't see it as an issue at all. 

You didn't say if they were equal. You said if Hackenberg blows Geno away in camp you'd still start Geno. 

If it's close...I'd still lean towards Hackenberg, but it depends on what is keeping him from winning outright. Were they both similarly bad (like Sanchez/Geno) or did both look very good? If the latter I'd lean towards Hackenberg. That said, if it was that close I wouldn't get bent out of shape if we instead sent Geno out there to get smushed by those early opponents. Would take a lot of pressure off Hackenberg once Geno is finally given the hook in October at the latest.

[JetBlue]

11 minutes ago, Big Blocker said:

I want to focus on your first two points since the rest involve speculation, but for the last point no I do not think Smith would have done near as well as Fitzpatrick last season, but as I say an opinion.

The problem with your first point is it implies Smith's problems to date have been due to an insufficient level of motivation.  Being in a contract year is no doubt an added motivation.  But it is not the difference between having motivation and having none.  Should it not have been enough that Smith was given the chance to start two seasons on a row?  Was a vet presence in the locker room last camp?  In short I don't think lack of motivation has been high on the list of Smith's problems, but if it has been that says nothing good about Smith.

Second I disagree that Smith played considerably better in the second half of 14's season.  He first of all was on the bench the first 10 quarters.  You are not playing better when you are on the bench, and he was there for an excellent reason.  In the 11th game of the season he came into the Buffalo game and played against a prevent defense with Buff ahead and led the team to zero points scored.  Zero.

Next week he led the team to a loss against Miami, with a 35.7 rating, one td against two ints. 

So it was not the second half of the season you are talking about, but the fourth quarter, the last four games, and yes his stats improved.  Still the Jets lost two of those four games, and Smith's one great game was the last one against a Miami team in total disarray chomping at the bit to get to their golf games.

So he played well in four games half of which the Jets lost and either didn't play for good reason or sucked before that.  in the third quarter of the season.  I don't cal that playing well in the second half.

You can say he played better down the stretch.  Yeah, that was his thing, after the Jets are already out of the playoffs due to his inept previous play.  No thanks.

lol, you are a trip. So did he play better after his benching or not? I did not say the TEAM played better, I said He played better.   Also, you talk about how the team still lost two of those last few games like it was just on Geno.  So I guess you also give him credit as a raw rookie for helping the team win 8 games?  

Listen, there really is no need to go back and forth because you will not change my mind and nor I yours.  You are convinced he sucks, period with no qualifications. I think he has seriously struggled but has had some moments over the last few years where he looked pretty good.  I also was interested as to how he would have performed in year three if he hadn't got sucker punched.   Bottom line is, this is his LAST YEAR AS A JET.  The future and possibly present belong to Hackenburg. I personally don't what to rush the kid so if that means Geno Smith winning the starting job if Fitz  does not resign, I am not going to jump off a bridge over it.  If Fitz is resigned and Geno is cut so be it.  As I said, Mac is just doing what any intelligent GM would do; only fans have knee jerk reactions about players they don't like. 

[JustInFudge]

If you extrapolate Geno's only action last year, he goes for:

4,240 yards, 32 TD's, 12 INT's and a 63% completion percentage.

Which is better than Fitz and maybe enough to make the playoffs instead of choking in a fashion that only 20% of league has done over the past 15 years. 

[JetBlue]

7 minutes ago, drdetroit said:

Marshall has been one of the best receivers in the NFL in the past decade.  Adding him to any offense, let alone the jets, is going to affect everyone 

It is like some people think Marshall was some scrub the Fitz lifted to new heights and not the other way around lol. 

[Matt39]

QB's competitions dont exist in camp anymore. With the practice schedules its virtually impossible.

[JetBlue]

5 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

You didn't say if they were equal. You said if Hackenberg blows Geno away in camp you'd still start Geno. 

If it's close...I'd still lean towards Hackenberg, but it depends on what is keeping him from winning outright. Were they both similarly bad (like Sanchez/Geno) or did both look very good? If the latter I'd lean towards Hackenberg. That said, if it was that close I wouldn't get bent out of shape if we instead sent Geno out there to get smushed by those early opponents. Would take a lot of pressure off Hackenberg once Geno is finally given the hook in October at the latest.

No I said that that was the only way I would start him or at least that is what I meant to say.... 

[The Crusher]

3 minutes ago, JiF said:

If you extrapolate Geno's only action last year, he goes for:

4,240 yards, 32 TD's, 12 INT's and a 63% completion percentage.

Which is better than Fitz and maybe enough to make the playoffs instead of choking in a fashion that only 20% of league has done over the past 15 years. 

LOL

[The Crusher]

3 minutes ago, JetBlue said:

It is like some people think Marshall was some scrub the Fitz lifted to new heights and not the other way around lol. 

It's absurd.  Marshall and Decker are the equivalent of making the backstop part of the strike zone in baseball.  

[Villain The Foe]

5 minutes ago, JiF said:

If you extrapolate Geno's only action last year, he goes for:

4,240 yards, 32 TD's, 12 INT's and a 63% completion percentage.

Which is better than Fitz and maybe enough to make the playoffs instead of choking in a fashion that only 20% of league has done over the past 15 years. 

Complete ownage! 

[Big Blocker]

17 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

What happened to firing Ryan was addition by subtraction? And I can definitely claim Ryan didn't want Smith in the first place, and resented him being there over Sanchez. Right to the point where he committed one of the more spiteful acts we've witnessed in recent coaching in the first Miami game, where he made the game a joke out of running on every play until our last drive.

The introduction of Gailey as OC had an instant, positive impact on every single QB he's ever worked with, without one exception, going back 20 years.

This alternate idea - solely being thrown out there now for this one argument - is that after the 2014 season ended, the Jets didn't need to make any coaching changes, didn't need to bring in a different/better offensive in general, and didn't need to bring in any borderline HOF free agent WRs. All that was needed was journeyman Ryan Fitzpatrick, who was benched halfway through the prior season.

Gailey was out of football for two years, and from what I recall of reports at the time only Bowles contacted him about coming out of "retirement".  It is pure speculation on your part that Smith would have done much better with Gailey.

Marty has also had some nice situations with Qb's.  He got a great season out of Nick Foles, and helped turn the run oriented Michael Vick into a much more effective and complete Qb.  Marty was a significant reason Vick came to the Jets in 14.

As for HC Ryan, no doubt he soured on SMith as 14 went on.  You didn't???   But the Jets started 14 with Smith over Vick, and essentially kept him there until Smith threw 3 interceptions in the first quarter against Buffalo.  That Vick was not prepared to step in hardly means that Ryan didn't give Smith a chance in 14.  You can claim whatever you want, and I concede it may have been  a complex decision to start Smith the first half of the season.  But I would HARDLY say Ryan stood in Smith's way in 14.  Do you really think he did?

[Warfish]

19 minutes ago, Villain The Foe said:

No Fitz supporter will touch this fact. 

Shouldn't you be on Bucs Nation.com now that Glennon to the Jets is never going to happen?

I'm happy to touch it, I don't but it.  Reports of "Geno is so awesome" is typical camp fodder bullsh*t, frankly.  Sanchez was "so awesome" too, as was Pennington, every offseason before they sh*t the bed in the regular season.

Coaches talk up their starter, and Geno was the starter till he got his ass beat down.  So the coaches talked him up.  And the usual media talking heads, given an actual source, ate it up.

Has to relation to reality in the regular season.  and projecting Geno as some all-pro in 15 if only we gave him a fair chance is fantasy talk, utterly unverifiable. 

What we know is Geno sucked, horribly, his two years as a starter, and no one has shown anything real that would lead us to believe he's changed.

[ylekram]

1 minute ago, j4jets said:

Fitz was 100% in mini camp in 5 on 7s n Geno pretty much owned him everyday. The one day Geno didn't own him, he literally got sucker punched. And that was just a few days before the first pre season game. N I don't need to be at the camps to know all this. There were dozens of reports everyday suggesting the way Geno loses his job would be a 5 pick practice (or a sucker punch), cuz Fitz isn't taking anyone's starting role with his arm or legs (which are as dumb as Geno's but most people around here call it bravado for some reason). 

no truth to the bolded. whatsoever. there were days were these expert beat reporters said that geno owned the day. but that wasn't everyday. and there were a few where they said fitz owned the day and a few ties. and then there were conflicting reports. you keep reading these tweets as gospel and I will read them for what they are. opinions by amatuers

[Warfish]

11 minutes ago, JiF said:

If you extrapolate Geno's only action last year, he goes for:

4,240 yards, 32 TD's, 12 INT's and a 63% completion percentage.

Which is better than Fitz and maybe enough to make the playoffs instead of choking in a fashion that only 20% of league has done over the past 15 years. 

And if you extrapolate my senior year in high school to a full season, I'd have batted .556, hit 45 HR's and 180 RBI's in 30 games.

Maybe someone should have given me a fair chance too.  People are just so unfair!  Leave Brittney, er, Geno alone!!!!

/chuckle

[ylekram]

1 hour ago, drdetroit said:

Marshall is a huge exception.  He was top 5 in both receptions and yards.  Plus we had a way easier schedule.

seems only Fitzpatrick gets credit for the easy schedule and soft defenses. gailey and marshal do not

[Big Blocker]

15 minutes ago, JetBlue said:

lol, you are a trip. So did he play better after his benching or not? I did not say the TEAM played better, I said He played better.   Also, you talk about how the team still lost two of those last few games like it was just on Geno.  So I guess you also give him credit as a raw rookie for helping the team win 8 games?  

Listen, there really is no need to go back and forth because you will not change my mind and nor I yours.  You are convinced he sucks, period with no qualifications. I think he has seriously struggled but has had some moments over the last few years where he looked pretty good.  I also was interested as to how he would have performed in year three if he hadn't got sucker punched.   Bottom line is, this is his LAST YEAR AS A JET.  The future and possibly present belong to Hackenburg. I personally don't what to rush the kid so if that means Geno Smith winning the starting job if Fitz  does not resign, I am not going to jump off a bridge over it.  If Fitz is resigned and Geno is cut so be it.  As I said, Mac is just doing what any intelligent GM would do; only fans have knee jerk reactions about players they don't like. 

No, very simply you said Smith was much better after Decker was healthy, in the last half of the 14 season.  I pointed out that it was not the last half.  It was the last four games.  After the Jets were out of the playoffs.

My take on Smith is that he tends to force it when the games count.  That doesn't mean he consistently sucks until the games don't count.  But it is a huge factor.  His best games both seasons were the last ones.  That tells us something, even if you don't want to acknowledge it.

The Jets do not play their regular season games primarily as tryouts for Geno Smith.  Last year was a much more enjoyable season compared to, well going back to 10.   I am virtually certain the Jets would have performed worse with Smith, and it would have been a worse season.  So I am okay with the trade off of not seeing what he would have done.  I have seen enough of him already.  His current contract status is immaterial in that regard.  He is quite simply very unlikely to ever improve enough to become a quality NFL Qb.

[Beerfish]

21 minutes ago, JiF said:

If you extrapolate Geno's only action last year, he goes for:

4,240 yards, 32 TD's, 12 INT's and a 63% completion percentage.

Which is better than Fitz and maybe enough to make the playoffs instead of choking in a fashion that only 20% of league has done over the past 15 years. 

You forgot to extrapolate his 2.5 heinous sacks a game at the worst time at the worst place for no reason at all, thus he would have 48 heinous sacks at critical times for no reason.  At least be consistent eh?

[Beerfish]

23 minutes ago, JetBlue said:

It is like some people think Marshall was some scrub the Fitz lifted to new heights and not the other way around lol. 

Not one person ever said that.  Brandon Marshall had the best year of his career last year, that's the fact Jack.

[ylekram]

40 minutes ago, JetBlue said:

Dude again you with the let him earn it comments?  OF COURSE HE HAS TO EARN OKAY??  I really have no idea why you keep thinking the job will be handed to him....  He will compete in camp with Hack, Petty and Fitz, assuming he comes back.  As it stands now, with no Fitz, he is probably the odds on favorite to win the job by virtue of his experience.  He still has to go out and perform.  If Fitz is resigned than HE IS THE ODDS ON FAVORITE by virtue of his performance last season but guess what?  HE STILL HAS TO GO OUT AND PERFORM TOO.  Can we now move on from this whole earning the job thing? 

plenty of people on this board, hell this thread don't want to sign fitz, basicall7y gifting the job to geno, again. he hasn't earned this 1st 3 starting gigs. yet, its what some people here want

[Mike135]

18 minutes ago, ylekram said:

seems only Fitzpatrick gets credit for the easy schedule and soft defenses. gailey and marshal do not

Huh?  The whole team gets credit  (or lack thereof) for the easy schedule.  Spending huge on a career backup who has NEVER MADE THE PLAYOFFS, based on stats from the easy schedule is insanity though.

Fans not seeing that is one thing.  The Jets' FO potentially not seeing that though is scary.

[ylekram]

41 minutes ago, Villain The Foe said:

No Fitz supporter will touch this fact. 

if it was a fact. you would probably be right. but its not

[Mike135]

12 minutes ago, Big Blocker said:

No, very simply you said Smith was much better after Decker was healthy, in the last half of the 14 season.  I pointed out that it was not the last half.  It was the last four games.  After the Jets were out of the playoffs.

My take on Smith is that he tends to force it when the games count.  That doesn't mean he consistently sucks until the games don't count.  But it is a huge factor.  His best games both seasons were the last ones.  That tells us something, even if you don't want to acknowledge it.

The Jets do not play their regular season games primarily as tryouts for Geno Smith.  Last year was a much more enjoyable season compared to, well going back to 10.   I am virtually certain the Jets would have performed worse with Smith, and it would have been a worse season.  So I am okay with the trade off of not seeing what he would have done.  I have seen enough of him already.  His current contract status is immaterial in that regard.  He is quite simply very unlikely to ever improve enough to become a quality NFL Qb.

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but Decker wasn't really healthy until the last quarter of the season right?  He may have suited up, but was basically a decoy for much of it.  I remember seeing him run half-assed routes, pulling up short and constantly heading to the sideline for multiple plays at a time.

Kerley was our #1 for 75% of 2014.

[JetBlue]

1 minute ago, Big Blocker said:

No, very simply you said Smith was much better after Decker was healthy, in the last half of the 14 season.  I pointed out that it was not the last half.  It was the last four games.  After the Jets were out of the playoffs.

My take on Smith is that he tends to force it when the games count.  That doesn't mean he consistently sucks until the games don't count.  But it is a huge factor.  His best games both seasons were the last ones.  That tells us something, even if you don't want to acknowledge it.

The Jets do not play their regular season games primarily as tryouts for Geno Smith.  Last year was a much more enjoyable season compared to, well going back to 10.   I am virtually certain the Jets would have performed worse with Smith, and it would have been a worse season.  So I am okay with the trade off of not seeing what he would have done.  I have seen enough of him already.  His current contract status is immaterial in that regard.  He is quite simply very unlikely to ever improve enough to become a quality NFL Qb.

Really what does it tell you?  That he plays well when the pressure is off or something?  Maybe so, but he played pretty well his rookie season on Monday night in Atlanta when they were considered a playoff team.  Like said, why is it important for to try to convince me of your line of thinking? I get it, believe me I do.  You have made it very clear you don't think he will ever become a quality NFL qb and that is fine, it really is.  I don't know that he won't at some point in the future for some other team.   The NFL is full players who didn't reach their potential on one team and did so on another.   His Jet days are numbered, I think we all know that but I would not be surprised if he is under center come September.  

I have no idea what you are talking about regarding tryouts for Geno but okay.  

2 years to me, is not enough time to make that definitive evaluation for the quarterback position. Especially when he should never have started his first season and would have been better served watching like Petty did last year.   But as I said, CAN WE JUST AGREE TO DISAGREE?  I truly respect your position; not sure if you can respect mine. 

[ylekram]

31 minutes ago, JiF said:

If you extrapolate Geno's only action last year, he goes for:

4,240 yards, 32 TD's, 12 INT's and a 63% completion percentage.

Which is better than Fitz and maybe enough to make the playoffs instead of choking in a fashion that only 20% of league has done over the past 15 years. 

if you extrapolate genos win %, I think it comes to 0-16. which, I think is slightly worse than fitz

[JetBlue]

2 minutes ago, Mike135 said:

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but Decker wasn't really healthy until the last quarter of the season right?  He may have suited up, but was basically a decoy for much of it.  I remember seeing him run half-assed routes, pulling up short and constantly heading to the sideline for multiple plays at a time.

Kelley was our #1 for 75% of 2014.

That is correct. 

[JetBlue]

38 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

You didn't say if they were equal. You said if Hackenberg blows Geno away in camp you'd still start Geno. 

If it's close...I'd still lean towards Hackenberg, but it depends on what is keeping him from winning outright. Were they both similarly bad (like Sanchez/Geno) or did both look very good? If the latter I'd lean towards Hackenberg. That said, if it was that close I wouldn't get bent out of shape if we instead sent Geno out there to get smushed by those early opponents. Would take a lot of pressure off Hackenberg once Geno is finally given the hook in October at the latest.

I went back and read my post and I said UNLESS Hack blew away in Geno in comp, I would still start Geno. 

[Mike135]

2 minutes ago, JetBlue said:

That is correct. 

Except for "Kelley".  Supposed to be "Kerley".  New phone with untrained auto-correct.

[ylekram]

32 minutes ago, JetBlue said:

It is like some people think Marshall was some scrub the Fitz lifted to new heights and not the other way around lol. 

not at all. some want to say that fitz only succeeded due to marshal, gailey, weather, schedule, etc. but in their eyes, weather(lol) and the schedule only benefitted fitz. not marshal or gailey. others have said look how great Fitzpatrick is. teams are lining up to sign him.chuckle.chuckle. using that same logic, why then was marshal available for a 5th and gailey wasn't pulled in bt some mastermind? the truth is they all work well together and compliment each other and all benefitted by the schedule. but some still insist that its all gailey and marshal and fitz is fools gold

[JetBlue]

6 minutes ago, ylekram said:

if you extrapolate genos win %, I think it comes to 0-16. which, I think is slightly worse than fitz

Yet he went 8-8 as a rookie.... Fitz played 9 years before he won more than 6 games. 

[bostonmajet]

50 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Lol clearly I was referring to the practice field itself, not the locker room. 

His handling of a paltry amount in dispute with IK was inexcusable and indefensible. He cost himself the starting job because he is (or at least was) an immature douchebag devoid of any leadership attributes.

I'm not coming to a girlfriend's rescue. I'm saying the 2014 team and 2015 team weren't remotely the same situations to play under, from the differences in coaches, surrounding personnel, and opponents. None of that makes a bad QB a good QB, but it can make a bad/meh QB look much better than he actually is in normal - let alone in bad - circumstances.

Actually, I was just commenting on what was Macc supposed to say; It was not meant as a comment on other posters comments, or even in reality what Macc thinks of Geno (as I have no idea really)

Wasn't actually commenting on Geno's performance or ability to come play QB for the Jets, simply, Macc's comments shouldn't be over analyzed as he is talking in GM speak.

He could be trying to motivate Geno, trying to make Fitz believe Macc doesn't need him, or just blowing smoke up fans ....; I have no idea.

[slats]

1 minute ago, ylekram said:

not at all. some want to say that fitz only succeeded due to marshal, gailey, weather, schedule, etc. but in their eyes, weather(lol) and the schedule only benefitted fitz. not marshal or gailey. others have said look how great Fitzpatrick is. teams are lining up to sign him.chuckle.chuckle. using that same logic, why then was marshal available for a 5th and gailey wasn't pulled in bt some mastermind? the truth is they all work well together and compliment each other and all benefitted by the schedule. but some still insist that its all gailey and marshal and fitz is fools gold

Marshall and Gailey are under contract, Fitz would cost the team $7-8M (or more) in cap space and a potential 2017 comp pick if anyone else was willing to sign him. The Jets currently don't have enough money to sign their draft picks, one of which they'd like to see starting at QB by next season. 

My thing is that I don't think Geno would be terrible under the team's current circumstances, certainly not much (if any) worse than Fitz. And even if he is, I don't care all that much because I expect both of them to be off the team by next year - even if Fitz is brought back. So comp picks the next two years, $7-8M+ in cap savings. That's fine with me. 

[ylekram]

16 minutes ago, Mike135 said:

Huh?  The whole team gets credit  (or lack thereof) for the easy schedule.  Spending huge on a career backup who has NEVER MADE THE PLAYOFFS, based on stats from the easy schedule is insanity though.

Fans not seeing that is one thing.  The Jets' FO potentially not seeing that though is scary.

spending huge? based on stats? if he was being paid strictly on stats, I don't think the 7-8m range would be enough for a 4000 yd, 33 td season

[joewilly12]

10 minutes ago, JetBlue said:

Yet he went 8-8 as a rookie.... Fitz played 9 years before he won more than 6 games. 

Exactly and has still not ever made the playoffs. 

Jets fans need to take off the blinders.

[bitonti]

Jets fans convincing themselves that Geno will be good is like Pats fans convincing themselves that their team doesn't actually cheat. 

It's a blind spot. There's a huge difference between what we want to be true and what's actually true.